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DC Heralds rescaling thread

Emirp sumitpo

Emirp sumitpo

VS Battles
Thread Moderator
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Forgive me that this has taken so long, but irl stuff has gotten in the way a lot, but that's all out of the way (for now), let's do it.

Sandbox ratings

Above is what the new ratings for the current characters should look like. You may notice that not everyone is listed, and the reasoning for so is that due to the sheer amount of characters there are, and the fact not all of us are fully knowledgeable on each of them, this thread is made to discuss what their ratings should be.

However, we have mainly done the ratings for Kryptonians, Lanterns, Speedsters, and New Gods as they are the main scaling point for most of the heralds. And thus, should be the reference point.

I should also point out what should be the standards for whether or not a character should scale to someone or not:
  • Scale to someone who doesn't hold back or don't have a Varies gimmick
  • Scale to their own feats
  • Scale to whatever feat they were performing during the fight (Say, character A fights Superman and Superman performs a 7-B feat in that fight, character A would scale to 7-B)
  • Require proof the Variable character is going all out or evidence that they are comparable to the variable character's high end peak, whether it be via feats or statements.
Click to expand...

I'd appreciate any help with scaling the characters that are still blanked.

Also any irrelevant posts will be deleted, so not to clutter this thread.
 
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@Marvel_Champion_07 @Planck69 @Theglassman12 @UchihaSlayer96 @LephyrTheRevanchist @LordTracer @DemonGodMitchAubin @KingTempest @Lonkitt @Dereck03 @Armorchompy @Qawsedf234 @Firestorm808 @Elizhaa @Maverick_Zero_X @DarkGrath @Just_a_Random_Butler @LordGriffin1000 @DarkDragonMedeus @ByAsura @Sir_Ovens

transformers-optimus-prime.gif
 
KLOL506 said:
@Marvel_Champion_07 @Planck69 @Theglassman12 @UchihaSlayer96 @LephyrTheRevanchist @LordTracer @DemonGodMitchAubin @KingTempest @Lonkitt @Dereck03 @Armorchompy @Qawsedf234 @Firestorm808 @Elizhaa @Maverick_Zero_X @DarkGrath @Just_a_Random_Butler @LordGriffin1000 @DarkDragonMedeus @ByAsura @Sir_Ovens

transformers-optimus-prime.gif
Click to expand...
I didn't get a notification lol!

As for the thread itself I'm obviously fine the the updates for those who have their own feats and solid scaling, and as mentioned in the OP those who don't have proof regarding if the variable characters they fought went all out won't scale. Now I'm unfamiliar with most comic stuff, only really know some Green Lantern (and other Lantern stuff) so I can't really say if something was our of context so I'll leave that to more knowledgeable members but I'm fine with the overall premise.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
We may want to put how deep into 2-C they scale to. Like Gove normal Wally 2+ universes and 52+ with the speed force or something.

Other than the missing characters in play with it.
Click to expand...
Fair enough ig, but wouldn't it be more convenient if we like, list that on the verse page.

Also FYI, the 2-C heralds all generally scale to 52 universes, to maybe hundreds but that one is pretty unclear
 
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That was a very large sandbox, skimmed to see if there were any errors in the format but everything seems fine apart from the blanks sections, I'm not so sure about the scale as I don't have much knowledge but the OP makes a lot of sense so agree too.
Emirp sumitpo said:
I should also point out what should be the standards for whether or not a character should scale to someone or not:
Click to expand...
This seems also fine.

Overall, thread seems fine.
 
I'm not going to make arguments and starting to become more mixed now. But Antvasima will show up and no need to ping him. But someone like Deagon might have some things to say.
 
So, I disagree with scaling characters off Supergirl's 3-C. If this is a lower end for characters that cannot match "true" heralds' power, then scaling them off one of said "true heralds" is pretty silly to me. Additionally, the feat seems to have taken quite a toll on Supergirl- she has her eyes closed, possibly (not necessarily) indicating brief unconsciousness, and the narration even acknowledges that the attacks are "powerful enough to down Supergirl", which implies tanking this isn't exactly a casual feat. I would ask for a feat that is either clearly casual or ideally done by people that aren't 2-C at all.

I'll give the proper scaling a deeper look later.
 
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Armorchompy said:
I'll give the proper scaling a deeper look later.
Click to expand...
Alright, I'll note things I'm unsure about.
  • Superman (E2) - I don't see a reason for him to be 2-C "at peak", either he has the same mechanics as PC Supes, in which case they share their tiers, or he's just 2-C off his showings.
  • Superboy-Prime - I think it's kind of weird- that he's both 3-C and 2-C by scaling to essentially the same people, Kryptonians/Lanterns, who I would presume are going all-out in all situations listed.
  • I'm not 100% sure about some Krypto's 2-C feats but the rating is probably fine
  • I notice N52 Orion is 4-B, what's that from? I thought the Alan and Orion feats were from Post-Crisis and Rebirth respectively.
Rest seems fine, very thorough work, I would be curious to see how other JL mainstays (WW, MMH, Aquaman) scale though.
 
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Armorchompy said:
Alright, I'll note things I'm unsure about.
  • Superman (E2) - I don't see a reason for him to be 2-C "at peak", either he has the same mechanics as PC Supes, in which case they share their tiers, or he's just 2-C off his showings.
  • Superboy-Prime - I think it's kind of weird- that he's both 3-C and 2-C by scaling to essentially the same people, Kryptonians/Lanterns, who I would presume are going all-out in all situations listed.
  • I'm not 100% sure about some Krypto's 2-C feats but the rating is probably fine
  • I notice N52 Orion is 4-B, what's that from? I thought the Alan and Orion feats were from Post-Crisis and Rebirth respectively.
Rest seems fine, very thorough work, I would be curious to see how other JL mainstays (WW, MMH, Aquaman) scale though.
Click to expand...
I think OP is trying to say that he scales due to PC Supes, and the showings in the fight are for consistency. So probably (Varies, usually 5-C, 2-C at his peak)
 
Armorchompy said:
Alright, I'll note things I'm unsure about.
  • Superman (E2) - I don't see a reason for him to be 2-C "at peak", either he has the same mechanics as PC Supes, in which case they share their tiers, or he's just 2-C off his showings.
Click to expand...
Ah nice catch. I forgot to remove it while editing, I'll touch that up soon.
Armorchompy said:
  • Superboy-Prime - I think it's kind of weird- that he's both 3-C and 2-C by scaling to essentially the same people, Kryptonians/Lanterns, who I would presume are going all-out in all situations listed.
Click to expand...
Well, it's not so much of a deal of "are they holding back or not", but if they're able to reach the peak of their variable rating. The 2-C key also has scaling to an Ion-amped Lantern, which is obviously quite different from normal ones, as well as his own feats and Captain Atom scaling, so I think the reasoning is distinct enough.
Armorchompy said:
  • I notice N52 Orion is 4-B, what's that from? I thought the Alan and Orion feats were from Post-Crisis and Rebirth respectively.
Click to expand...
Mogo lights up the Universe at the very end of New 52, which has been calculated as 4-B. You could probably question how valid it is to base a whole batch of ratings on one feat, but that's a topic for a whole different thread.
Armorchompy said:
Rest seems fine, very thorough work, I would be curious to see how other JL mainstays (WW, MMH, Aquaman) scale though.
Click to expand...
With that bunch, it very much depends on how the discourse on this thread goes. Personally, I'm fine with Post-Clayface or Rebirth Wonder Woman being flat-out 2-C, but I have some issues with Pre-Clayface Diana's scaling that I have talked a bit about in private, where "At least Low 2-C, possibly 2-C" seemed to be favored. I still have some disagreements with that tbh, but it'd probably be unfair to post them until after arguments are posted.

Manhunter is very much the same case, I have many issues with arguments typically used to scale him, though he at least should scale to Pre-Clayface Wonder Woman. I wish I knew where to even start with Aquaman, for most of Post-Crisis he's really lacking in feats but I've heard he apparently gets a massive amp becoming the Waterbearer at some point, though I've heard arguments on if it's a temporary amp or not.

For the Supergirl thing, originally it was intended for a "Varies, up to 3-C usually, 2-C at peak" sort of rating, but I'm unsure on if she should even have a Varies rating, so my opinion on that is kind of up in the air for the moment.
 
Armorchompy said:
So, I disagree with scaling characters off Supergirl's 3-C. If this is a lower end for characters that cannot match "true" heralds' power, then scaling them off one of said "true heralds" is pretty silly to me. Additionally, the feat seems to have taken quite a toll on Supergirl- she has her eyes closed, possibly (not necessarily) indicating brief unconsciousness, and the narration even acknowledges that the attacks are "powerful enough to down Supergirl", which implies tanking this isn't exactly a casual feat. I would ask for a feat that is either clearly casual or ideally done by people that aren't 2-C at all.

I'll give the proper scaling a deeper look later.
Click to expand...
I'm fairly sure said barrage was not actually something that brought her to that condition, as the narration implies
 
I think that this seems perfectly fine. Good job everyone who were involved. 🙏🙂
 
Ehnkr2beboh said:
Ah nice catch. I forgot to remove it while editing, I'll touch that up soon.

Well, it's not so much of a deal of "are they holding back or not", but if they're able to reach the peak of their variable rating. The 2-C key also has scaling to an Ion-amped Lantern, which is obviously quite different from normal ones, as well as his own feats and Captain Atom scaling, so I think the reasoning is distinct enough.

Mogo lights up the Universe at the very end of New 52, which has been calculated as 4-B. You could probably question how valid it is to base a whole batch of ratings on one feat, but that's a topic for a whole different thread.
Click to expand...
All fair
 
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