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Well, I guess I'm close to disagreeing with that, what about immeasurable speed?
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(Complete Saint Seiya verse Overhaul Part 1) - Perhaps one of the top 10 most ambitious overhauls to a verse in vswiki history?
- Thread starter TheUnshakableOne
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Georredannea15
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So, obviously the revision is very messy and being 5D doesn't mean it's Immeasurable speed. You have to be faster than a linear time or exceed the concept of time.
Sorry but it doesn't have 5D or any R>F features and it won't be immeasurable speed even if you are 5D this way. Apart from that, having the causality of time and being independent of this time is definitely not Type 5 Causality. At best, Type 4 and NEP2 are just NEP1. Transduality is controversial.
I can explain in more detail if you want.
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Seems fair to me, I came across some links mentioned and it talks about higher dimension (mathematics)So, obviously the revision is very messy and being 5D doesn't mean it's Immeasurable speed. You have to be faster than a linear time or exceed the concept of time.
Sorry but it doesn't have 5D or any R>F features and it won't be immeasurable speed even if you are 5D this way. Apart from that, having the causality of time and being independent of this time is definitely not Type 5 Causality. At best, Type 4 and NEP2 are just NEP1. Transduality is controversial.
I can explain in more detail if you want.
I know absolutely nothing about Tier 1, but I also think that Saint Seiya doesn't get Tier 1 either, I really agree with you
Hasty12345
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All the blogs have heaps of scans for me?
idk about any of the 8th sense stuff, but none of it is on any profile and there’s heaps of scans in the blogs and in the crt writing itself.
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It's almost as if the blog is part of the justification of the proposed revisions
But fr, if the links are broken we should let OP know.
In any case, the OP proposes that Hero of Heroes is canon, in which case yes, we do have a case of R>F although scans for the manga should be listed in the OP.
Georredannea15
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So can you explain that to me with scans? Because the OP is so confused and I don't think you're going to get a 5D with these statements. Also even if it was 5D it still wouldn't be Immeasurable. (Btw, I'm not a hater. I am extremely objective and neutral towards this verse.)It's almost as if the blog is part of the justification of the proposed revisions
But fr, if the links are broken we should let OP know.
In any case, the OP proposes that Hero of Heroes is canon, in which case yes, we do have a case of R>F although scans for the manga should be listed in the OP.
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holy ....
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I'm not defending immeasurable as I don't know enough about it to comment, but the scans for Karma and the 5D stuff are there so it might be a problem on your end. I do think the HoH scans are missing though so we need to wait for OP to add them or format the CRT accordingly.
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Pretty much this is how I see it, the Golds all seemingly have the 8th sense but the regen part is very wonky depending on how you see it, so it giving them immortality instead of resurrection + regen would fit.
Georredannea15
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I see, it's okay. But I'm sorry that according to the statements in the OP it should definitely be NEP1 and Acausality Type 4, not NEP2 and Type 5(I'll read it again to be sure) Other than that, I did not find the 5D contexts sufficient. But if you have more context feel free to write it to the OP.
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Why Acausality type 4 and NEP 1?
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I'll respond in detail to things later.
At work atm
At work atm
Georredannea15
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I will explain.
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The reason for Tier is because "The Universe" is encased in a higher dimensional membrane.
The Soul and Mind both are ascended into a different state of dimensionality when the 8th stage of consciousness is awakened.
This allows both the mind and soul to escape the membrane of "The Universe," the character then gains Cosmic Awareness where they know everything because their Soul and Mind Transcended space as well as time.
This higher dimensional perspective with their mind allows them to see the multiverse, and existences within in it.
Something to take note of is that "Time" is also transcended with the mind, and because of that. The character gained Cosmic awareness. Not only are they percieving the multiverse, but their perceiving the causality continuum of every Universe in the muiltiverse that includes past, present, and future and all the infinite branches. This is elaborated by the oracle delphi.
In conclusion because their minds was elevated to a new dimensional axis they can now see the whole multiverse and everything within it.
Acausality Type 5 is explained here. By achieving the 8th stage of consciousness the Soul and Mind has achieved a state of Unchangness. Which is literally what Acausality Type 5 is about see these links [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]
As for NEP 2, i was reading the definetion for it
I was looking at the 2 bolded parts there for it. This is because the 8th sense is the "Framework" that makes up an invididual person. It contains their Karma, History, narrative in the plot, Life force, Essence, Soul, mind, etc etc etc.
But that would also include "Dunamis." Which is a primordial Nothingness that precedes creation, and all worlds is made of this stuff. This ties into the concept of Sunyata which is mentioned in LC, and WoG. Quoting myself from the blog i made. Thus, my train of thought was a state of nothingness beyond an already established primordial nothingness that precedes creation was achieved.
What was the other issues here? I just got home and i will be busy soon.
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- #95
Are you able to view any scans btw?
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Obviously agree with op on this. But i do think the discussion about 8th sense regeneration ability should be selective and given to shaka since he has an immense mastery over said sense.
Hasty12345
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where's that coming from though? Kanon and Dohko arguably have greater mastery given they could also go to the UW without the need of a death wish, they kind of make Shaka look like an idiot.
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- #98
He hasn't reappeared as a fully living body in ND. I disagree with it.
Hasty12345
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- 8th sense allows for low godly regen and resurrection
- all 12 Gold Saint go back in time to save baby Athena
- none of them resurrect to help the bronzes or Athena against the Odysseus threat
Ped2018
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Georredannea15
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The only thing that is clearly stated in the scan is that the higher dimension is beyond the and the souls of the deceased ascend here, but there is no mention of the membrane being higher dimensional. There's an HDE for souls here, but I don't think it's 5D because it doesn't talk about being higher dimensional for membrane, and souls in that case would just be 4D
I'm sorry but, without further context, this phrase "beyond space-time" seems to be used only in the context of being greater/superior than the Multiverse. So it's not dimensional .
What I can say for this here is that everything in the universe depends on a cause and effect. Yes, that's true, but you have to prove that "cause-effect" relationships in this universe include all cause-effect nature and the whole concept of causality.
Otherwise it would only be Acausality type 4. This is basically why it is so difficult to qualify for Acausality Type 5.
Here primordial nothingness is simply like "being-non-existence". So you have a existent but you are also a non-existence. That would be Type 1 only. Because I couldn't see anything like "going beyond non-existence". or "lack of dual existence" in the contexts shown. Just a primitive nothingness. Looks like Type 1 at best. (At least when I look at your browsing and contexts)
I have a few more things to write about Transduality. Other than that, I hope I don't look like a "hater" because I'm completely neutral towards this verse.
Hasty12345
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You’re the only one who seems to think you’re coming across as a hater bro relax 
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I disagree with FRA, Tier 1 has always been a warped idea of us fans, but given the arguments, this doesn't seem like 5D.
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I think the rest should be fine, like type 5 immortality for everyone who manipulates the 8th sense.
It is very difficult to qualify for Tier 1, you have to have a lot of information about it, but I think if the Ultima come here I think she can better evaluate this.You’re the only one who seems to think you’re coming across as a hater bro relax
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- #106
I asked Ultima earlier today for a review.
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Thankfully, let's wait for her, she has a lot of knowledge on this subject, I want this to pass and be as complete as possible.
Hasty12345
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Georredannea15
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Hehe. Thanks dude.You’re the only one who seems to think you’re coming across as a hater bro relax
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We need a lot of contribution, I think all help is needed.
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- #112
Imma update the op later theb message mire people
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The context would be the previous 8th sense scans, it’s the Same few chapters of the manga. Take all three scans together, you have the soul/mind transcending space and time, into a higher mathematical dimension. The scan below those three shows they can perceive the whole Multiverse, which is consistent with their mind/soul being above the whole thing.
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Okay then;
First of all, I'm a bit suspicious about L1-C. The statements seem to refer only to their cosmic awareness rather than a qualitative superiority in terms of AP (strength). Because it is mentioned that their transcendence of space-time allows them to know everything. You need to support that this is in terms of strength etc. Also, the statement of being higher dimensional than the membrane of the Universe does not say that the membrane is higher dimensional, but rather that the place they are in is higher dimensional than the membrane. And honestly, I didn't see anything about the dimensionality of the membrane in the scans- I would appreciate it if you could correct me if I'm wrong.
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What you are saying for Acausality Type 5 is simply Type 4. For Type 5 you need to be independent of any causal system that there is and can be. Just being independent of one is not enough for Type 5.
Other than that, I don't think there's anything I disagree with. And since I'm not very interested, I haven't looked carefully- And I am a bit lazy too ngl. So I apologize if I've missed anything.
First of all, I'm a bit suspicious about L1-C. The statements seem to refer only to their cosmic awareness rather than a qualitative superiority in terms of AP (strength). Because it is mentioned that their transcendence of space-time allows them to know everything. You need to support that this is in terms of strength etc. Also, the statement of being higher dimensional than the membrane of the Universe does not say that the membrane is higher dimensional, but rather that the place they are in is higher dimensional than the membrane. And honestly, I didn't see anything about the dimensionality of the membrane in the scans- I would appreciate it if you could correct me if I'm wrong.
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What you are saying for Acausality Type 5 is simply Type 4. For Type 5 you need to be independent of any causal system that there is and can be. Just being independent of one is not enough for Type 5.
Other than that, I don't think there's anything I disagree with. And since I'm not very interested, I haven't looked carefully- And I am a bit lazy too ngl. So I apologize if I've missed anything.
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the op isn’t trying to argue ap using the 8th sense. Inverse, the 8th sense gives a power boost, but it’s nothing Tier jumping. It’s their soul and Mind that would be 5D only.
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- #116
I'll respond to these once I got a moment
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I think what I have said will still apply to their souls and minds. There is nothing in the scans to support qualitative superiority.
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I believe, and the op can correct me if I’m wrong, but Dunamis is shown to be primordial nothingness. that would be erased and reduced to nothingness, when the 9th sense is achieved, along with the other things. Thus, it would be a nothingness beyond nothingness, because it erased primordial nothingness.
Georredannea15
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These space-time transcendents do not refer to any spatial or mathematical dimension other than statement. Only mathematically higher dimensional than the dice. I can easily say this.
Georredannea15
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I disagreed NEP2 as I couldn't see this in scans. Because it wasn't written when I read it.
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