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So, a fair bit ago, this thread was made, in order to reupgrade Yggdrasil back to Low 1-C, after it had been downgraded down to 2-A in the wake of some discussion about whether it met the standards for Low 1-C
I didn't read through the former thread until after it had already been applied, but once I did that I noticed some justifications that I found... odd, to say the least. I was on the brink of reopening the thing and continuing the discussion there myself until I sat down to read Yggdrasil's profile and noticed some other things I found lacking in the reasoning, and which I'd want some clarification for. So, to start with:
There is this, which as evidenced by the name of the picture, is meant to be used as evidence for Yggdrasil perceiving all of the nine realms as infinitesimal points within itself. I don't think I need to explain what's wrong with this interpretation: Literally all this is saying is that Midgard is in the middle of the tree, and a quick overview of the common usage of the word "midpoint" in everyday vocabulary should tell you that it doesn't mean "This thing is a literal geometrical point that is located at the center of something."
With that out of the picture, we move on to the second batch of scans meant to support Low 1-C:
Which is equally without value. This is meant to fulfill this specific section of the Tiering System FAQ page, where it says that a higher-dimensional object is allowed to get an automatic high-tier if it holds some pre-established lower-dimensional realm as an infinitesimal part of itself:
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Tiering System FAQ
This doesn't apply here, though, because that'd only be applicable to cases where the container in question has already been established as a higher-dimensional object beforehand, which is not the case with Yggdrasil, especially with the previous scan suggesting no such thing. Something can obviously contain something else as a part of itself without being one dimension higher than it; in fact, when it comes to infinitely-large spaces, you can have two infinite things, one being a subset of the other, and still have them be the same size.
And that fact, for the matter, makes this scan pretty moot, as well:
All it tells us is that Yggdrasil itself is infinite. Not that it's infinitely larger than the Nine Realms themselves. To also quote part of the previously linked thread's OP:
Even if all of the above was valid evidence for what is being proposed, that still doesn't mean Freya's statement about Yggdrasil's strands "transcending time, transcending space" is suddenly validified as evidence for Tier 1. Devoid of additional context, it can still simply mean Yggdrasil is not bound by any particular era or location (Since it is omnipresent across all of creation) and thus "transcends time and space" on that basis. That turn of phrase doesn't and has never been automatically taken to mean anything suggestive of Low 1-C.
Now, moving on:
First oddity I've noticed is the presence of Nonexistent Physiology on the profile. As it stands, it seems like it comes from this scan:
vsbattles.fandom.com
That's pretty bare-bones as justification for NEP. All this says is that Yggdrasil has no physical form. I assume the ability was given because its physical state is described as "existing," which then would make its true state "non-existing." Issue with that line of thought, however, is that it still doesn't suggest anything outside of basic Incorporeality: If you lack a physical form, then that means it is, in fact, not existent, since it's something you don't have to begin with.
Then there are these two scans:
This is a point which I'm not necessarily opposed to, so much as one where I'd ask for clarification: How exactly is this anything outside of Clairvoyance and/or Precognition? I'm not quite sure how the scans suggest anything else.
And, finally, I'd like to tackle these two tidbits:
So, to make things clear: Inflicting damage on a Low 1-C entity, regardless of how minimal, is still Low 1-C. So, as far as I can discern, either this is a huge outlier for Thor and Jormungandr, or it's an anti-feat for Yggdrasil that goes against the notion that it actually transcends the Nine Realms. Either way, it should be adjusted somehow.
I didn't read through the former thread until after it had already been applied, but once I did that I noticed some justifications that I found... odd, to say the least. I was on the brink of reopening the thing and continuing the discussion there myself until I sat down to read Yggdrasil's profile and noticed some other things I found lacking in the reasoning, and which I'd want some clarification for. So, to start with:
There is this, which as evidenced by the name of the picture, is meant to be used as evidence for Yggdrasil perceiving all of the nine realms as infinitesimal points within itself. I don't think I need to explain what's wrong with this interpretation: Literally all this is saying is that Midgard is in the middle of the tree, and a quick overview of the common usage of the word "midpoint" in everyday vocabulary should tell you that it doesn't mean "This thing is a literal geometrical point that is located at the center of something."
With that out of the picture, we move on to the second batch of scans meant to support Low 1-C:
Which is equally without value. This is meant to fulfill this specific section of the Tiering System FAQ page, where it says that a higher-dimensional object is allowed to get an automatic high-tier if it holds some pre-established lower-dimensional realm as an infinitesimal part of itself:
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Tiering System FAQ
This doesn't apply here, though, because that'd only be applicable to cases where the container in question has already been established as a higher-dimensional object beforehand, which is not the case with Yggdrasil, especially with the previous scan suggesting no such thing. Something can obviously contain something else as a part of itself without being one dimension higher than it; in fact, when it comes to infinitely-large spaces, you can have two infinite things, one being a subset of the other, and still have them be the same size.
And that fact, for the matter, makes this scan pretty moot, as well:
All it tells us is that Yggdrasil itself is infinite. Not that it's infinitely larger than the Nine Realms themselves. To also quote part of the previously linked thread's OP:
Even if all of the above was valid evidence for what is being proposed, that still doesn't mean Freya's statement about Yggdrasil's strands "transcending time, transcending space" is suddenly validified as evidence for Tier 1. Devoid of additional context, it can still simply mean Yggdrasil is not bound by any particular era or location (Since it is omnipresent across all of creation) and thus "transcends time and space" on that basis. That turn of phrase doesn't and has never been automatically taken to mean anything suggestive of Low 1-C.
Now, moving on:
Profile Issues
First oddity I've noticed is the presence of Nonexistent Physiology on the profile. As it stands, it seems like it comes from this scan:
Yggdrasil (God of War)
The Yggdrasil, alternatively the World Tree or Tree of Life, is the force that appears to be responsible for all that there is in the Norse Realms of God of War. Directly interwoven into the grand tapestry that is reality, all of existence is part of Yggdrasil and all of existence eventually...
vsbattles.fandom.com
That's pretty bare-bones as justification for NEP. All this says is that Yggdrasil has no physical form. I assume the ability was given because its physical state is described as "existing," which then would make its true state "non-existing." Issue with that line of thought, however, is that it still doesn't suggest anything outside of basic Incorporeality: If you lack a physical form, then that means it is, in fact, not existent, since it's something you don't have to begin with.
Then there are these two scans:
This is a point which I'm not necessarily opposed to, so much as one where I'd ask for clarification: How exactly is this anything outside of Clairvoyance and/or Precognition? I'm not quite sure how the scans suggest anything else.
And, finally, I'd like to tackle these two tidbits:
So, to make things clear: Inflicting damage on a Low 1-C entity, regardless of how minimal, is still Low 1-C. So, as far as I can discern, either this is a huge outlier for Thor and Jormungandr, or it's an anti-feat for Yggdrasil that goes against the notion that it actually transcends the Nine Realms. Either way, it should be adjusted somehow.
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