- 2,459
- 1,189
Speed Equalized.
SBA.
6D keys.
Chaos:
Yang Qi:
Incon:
Last edited:
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Chaos (Fate) VS Yang Qi (Sage Monarch)
- Thread starter Muchacho_mrm
- Start date
Speed Equalized.
SBA.
6D keys.
Chaos:
Yang Qi:
Incon:
- 2,459
- 1,189
- Thread starter
- #2
Well, we first have to determine if Chaos can interact with NEP (Type 2) and Transduality (Type 2).
Going through the profile, I found that Chaos only resists Conceptual Manipulation, not even a type being listed. So that is something else that needs to be clarified.
Going through the profile, I found that Chaos only resists Conceptual Manipulation, not even a type being listed. So that is something else that needs to be clarified.
- 40,531
- 35,023
Definitely can interact with NEP2, not sure about transduality but the Concept manip is type 1 and Chaos is infinitely above baseline 6-D in Stats as well.
- 10,674
- 4,741
fate characters can interact with Kama who is NEP type 2
- 2,459
- 1,189
- Thread starter
- #5
Any CRT accepting type 1 or if they scale to another user, any profile with type 1?
Could you elaborate on the stats as well. As in potency and range.
- 2,459
- 1,189
- Thread starter
- #6
New standards or old?
- 40,531
- 35,023
All I know is that they're type 1 and qualify for such lol
Again with Authority, there's an infinite scaling chain so we have infinite AP/Dura
- 2,459
- 1,189
- Thread starter
- #8
Nevermind. The profile was never updated to type 1. So Chaos can't interact with Yang Qi.
LMAO. Well then, I will wait for more supporters to clarify.
I am willing to accept infinite authority = infinite AP/Dura. Range is another matter.
- 9,856
- 3,645
cant they interact with the root which is td type 3
TheGreatJedi13
Username Only- 5,014
- 3,189
TD2 would only make you immune to stuff that is a duality in your verse
and since NEP Type 2 is deemed equivalent if not superior to TD2 of Existence and nonexistence
someone with NEP Type 2 NPI can interact with Yang Qi but only on existence and nonexistence.
best to list down all that is under TD2 for Yang Qi so we can start comparing haxes that will not work on Yang Qi even with infinite layer
and since NEP Type 2 is deemed equivalent if not superior to TD2 of Existence and nonexistence
someone with NEP Type 2 NPI can interact with Yang Qi but only on existence and nonexistence.
best to list down all that is under TD2 for Yang Qi so we can start comparing haxes that will not work on Yang Qi even with infinite layer
Last edited:
- 2,459
- 1,189
- Thread starter
- #11
Where is this notion coming from, because I can't find it on the TD page. TD2 is within your scope of reality and covers all dual systems. Exactly every conceivable variation, for example DT's notion of all things having opposites. You could create a TD2 CRT and try to list a billion dualities but it would still fail, should you fail to actually show it applies to all dual systems. Also I mentioned DT because of this.TD2 would only make you immune to stuff that is a duality in your verse
and since NEP Type 2 is deemed equivalent if not superior to TD2 of Existence and nonexistence
someone with NEP Type 2 NPI can interact with Yang Qi but only on existence and nonexistence.
best to list down all that is under TD2 for Yang Qi so we can start comparing haxes that will not work on Yang Qi even with infinite layer
So no, I don't have eternity to list them all.
As for NEP 2, Kama didn't qualify and the supporters failed to update her profile. Additionally, interacting with NEP (Type 2) is pointless if you've never interacted with the nonexistent aspects of their aspects.
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 14,752
- 10,610
Not anymore her profile is outdated. After revision it's considered as Type 1.
Fate supporters not applied the changes that's all.
Georredannea15
He/Him- 4,192
- 2,721
Kama is a Type 1 NEP, not a Type 2 NEP + if he can interact with kama, then Chaos is a smurf.
Georredannea15
He/Him- 4,192
- 2,721
I don't want to see any more defences from Nasuverse supporters like "servants can interact with kama, they can interact with root so they can affect hax like Aca5, NEP2, TD2 and 3..." because none of it is written in the profiles, and even if it were so, those characters would all be smurf.
Please defend what is written in the profiles and I can't see any NEP or TD interaction in chaos' profile.
Please defend what is written in the profiles and I can't see any NEP or TD interaction in chaos' profile.
TheGreatJedi13
Username Only- 5,014
- 3,189
this was changed in the part 3 of tierring revision
if we are going with the notion of all things having opposite then it could apply to everything in the verse
but each notion should be specified on what levels of reality each notion is because something existing in 3D and having Duality cannon be assumed to exist in 4D or more unless said things are also shown to exist in that higher reality.
as the revision stated the context of the verse are necessary to determine what are the scope and what levels of reality are each affected by said scope.
like the idea of information type 2 may exist in 4D or 5D but may or may not exist in 6D thus it wouldn't be used to somehow also include 6D information type 2 in comparison to other verse that has it at that level or has hax or system on such level of reality above within the scope of what is shown in verse
Last edited:
Vietthai96
He/Him- 9,234
- 12,284
tbf, many profile are outdated, because fate supporters are all lazy
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 14,752
- 10,610
Someone should update Kama NEP changes it's left unchecked. Most of the profile lacks scans I don't know how TF Abilities are in the profile.
.
- 2,459
- 1,189
- Thread starter
- #18
You linked an entire thread. If you meant specifically OP, they do actually agree with my point of all variations, considering they mention all binary distinction within that level of reality.
Georredannea15
He/Him- 4,192
- 2,721
And nothing they say is written in the profiles. I don't even know where the type 1 CM comes from lolSomeone should update Kama NEP changes it's left unchecked. Most of the profile lacks scans I don't know how TF Abilities are in the profile.
Also you don't want to touch Nasuverse speed explanations in the profiles
Vietthai96
He/Him- 9,234
- 12,284
Someone should update Kama NEP changes it's left unchecked. Most of the profile lacks scans I don't know how TF Abilities are in the profile.
Also you don't want to touch Nasuverse speed explanations in the profiles
TheGreatJedi13
Username Only- 5,014
- 3,189
up to you to search all mentions of duality in that thread and see all comments pertaining to it as dropping someones statement without context would only increase confusion to an already confusing ability
Vietthai96
He/Him- 9,234
- 12,284
eh, actually, Nasuverse CM hax can't be typed in...at least vsbw system except Root, since Nasuverse establish its own concept system
EldemadeDityjon
He/Him- 14,752
- 10,610
Honestly instead of tdj and marsmellow guys trying to spam unnecessary H1A CRTs they should have atleast helped in replacing the scans in current profiles
- 10,088
- 8,219
If they use scans the verse would become weak
TheGreatJedi13
Username Only- 5,014
- 3,189
but if you're lazy then
EDIT: Also is Sage Monarch and Dragon Talisman be scaled to each other in terms of abilities?
since you mentioned DT
also i updated my comment because somehow it posted before i finished writing it
further more we don't assume all level of reality follows the same type of system unless stated to be so hence Acausality type 5 or TD2 can be negged by higher reality due to function way different from those at lower reality and still being bound by it
EDIT: Also is Sage Monarch and Dragon Talisman be scaled to each other in terms of abilities?
since you mentioned DT
- 2,459
- 1,189
- Thread starter
- #26
Not being lazy, it is just that you know, you linked an entire thread for me to read to understand your point...
This post talks about being unbound of duality on a certain scale but falling victim to a higher form. The transduality page already handles this.
This post proposes type 2 and 3 should be merged and how surpassing duality on a certain level doesn't mean you surpass all conceivable opposites but the poster doesn't actually push for it and it was never applied.
This post is in a reply to a duality question involving tiering. The reply equates it to omnipotence, essentially not giving it credence in terms of tiering.
I feel like this is just a random post you linked that vaguely has some relation.
The system is within that scope of reality. It doesn't matter whether or not another verse follows the same principles, it is negated at a higher infinity.
Last edited:
- 10,693
- 9,416
One of the biggest issues about Fate is there are so many pages and many of them are extremely outdated/lack scans and evidence.
I will say I have seen no definitive proof of NEP2 or TD2 in Fate.
But how exactly can Yang Qi interact with or kill Chaos
I will say I have seen no definitive proof of NEP2 or TD2 in Fate.
But how exactly can Yang Qi interact with or kill Chaos
- 9,856
- 3,645
chaos is the strongest Low 1-C in fate?
- 4,924
- 2,082
Chaos should be able to interact with NEP2, as I said on the non-smurf thread
Basically INS/Reverse Side of the Moon < Kama (Possibly)<Zero Musashi
Fate characters don't actually have the ability to **** with Transduality
Should be above infinite layers due to scaling far above Zeus who has infinite authority along with being the source of Zeus and the rest of the greece god's authority
Bro does not see the
On Chaos' profile huh
Georredannea15
He/Him- 4,192
- 2,721
I've never seen Nasuverse supporters advocate anything other than "Character X can interact with NEP2, character Y can affect Transduality". And Type 2 NEP has already been rejected by DT and most of what you say is not in profile.
- 10,693
- 9,416
As of right now, it is the strongest fate profile on VSBW as it is vastly superior to all of the Machine Gods.
ORT and arguably the Outer Gods may be superior, though.
(ORT is hugely outdated on here)
- 4,924
- 2,082
Because most of the "supporters" usually go off the profiles because they usually are only knowledgeable in one area of the verse, such as fate/extra, fate/grand order, Tsuki Hime, etc, or know other areas of the verse through what is essentially mitosis.
Because it seems that when regidan was submitting the characters to the thread they hadn't tried to do stuff related to Kama and Zero Musashi's NEP being less existent than INS, but even then even if you don't accept that Chaos can quite literally create a void that is less of a thing than INS anyways.
The stuff that I am posting is literally on the profiles, the only thing you could argue isn't on the profiles is the stuff about the NEP, but even then, still wouldn't change the outcome of the match as they can't interact with Transduality Type 2 while Yang Qi can't bypass their layers of resistances.
- 1,523
- 1,991
Georredannea15
He/Him- 4,192
- 2,721
1- I know Chaos scales down to the outer gods, and I have no idea how they scale to Type 2 NEP and TD2. Even the outer gods are dimensionally above them. Chaos will need to interact with 9-D first and if Chaos could interact with them, would have 9D hax layers, making him an 8D smurf, but Chaos is not smurf(in 1-C).
2-Yang Qi has infinite layers. I'm waiting for an explanation from you on how it can't scale through any layer.
Vietthai96
He/Him- 9,234
- 12,284
Infinite layers again??
- 9,856
- 3,645
every verse needs a hax layer crt ong frfr
TheGreatJedi13
Username Only- 5,014
- 3,189
Prove this one.
As states by agnaa being transdual to a duality in 4D universe wouldn't make that duality somehow extends to 5D just because you are also transdual to another duality in 5D since cases that a duality existing in lower may not exist in higher
