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Oh I was unaware, although his attacks were still stated to be light speed and blitzed multiple units.IIRC, the speed of lightning is not set. It depends on many variables, not the least of which is wattage.
"Speed of light" is ambiguous and can mean literally any level of FTL or MFTL for being such a bloody big tier.Oh I was unaware, although his attacks were still stated to be light speed and blitzed multiple units.
This isn't the same as with Dypso. Kai stated the attack itself moved at the speed of light. It's pretty straight forward, and does not mean ftl or mftl."Speed of light" is ambiguous and can mean literally any level of FTL or MFTL for being such a bloody big tier.
Theres a reason why Dypso for instance isn't downgraded despite being the only character in DBS cited outright to move at the "speed of light".
And Dypso was stated himself to move at the speed of light. What difference is there between these?This isn't the same as with Dypso. Kai stated the attack itself moved at the speed of light. It's pretty straight forward, and does not mean ftl or mftl.
Dragon ball not only is irrelevant to what we're discussion, also has plenty of feats superior to ftl before he even stated that.And Dypso was stated himself to move at the speed of light. What difference is there between these?
And even if you can find one, we do not take speed of light as a means to counter something being at whatever high degree of FTL. The speed tier is hilariously huge and any degree of it falls under that.
It isn't. Its an example of a case where "Speed of light" isn't an argument at all for a downgrade.Dragon ball not only is irrelevant to what we're discussion,
And so is this with several universe crossing feats.also has plenty of feats superior to ftl before he even stated that.
It isn't straight forward. We don't use speed of light to downgrade speed here.The attack is stated to move at light speed. Its as straight forward as you can get.
Travel speedAnd so is this with several universe crossing feats.
It's not a downgrade, they have no reaction feats of that level to begin with.It isn't straight forward. We don't use speed of light to downgrade speed here.
Reactions are coming from the travel speed, which have reason(s) as said before to not slow. Either way, this isn't relevant. Speed of light isn't used to downgrade anything here, because "speed of light" isn't confined to just that.Travel speed
It's not a downgrade, they have no reaction feats of that level to begin with.
And this is why the downgrade was necessary, they don't have any reaction feats in battle to support an upgrade.Reactions are coming from the travel speed, which have reason(s) as said before to not slow. Either way, this isn't relevant. Speed of light isn't used to downgrade anything here, because "speed of light" isn't confined to just that.
Which is your headcanon for thinking the attacks have set speed. They don't.And this is why the downgrade was necessary, they don't have any reaction feats in battle to support an upgrade.
It isn't. Speed of light doesn't mean limited to light speed here.Speed of light is defined as that. I'm not sure where you're getting this misinformation. It's pretty straight forward.
Either way, it's not an anti feat since it was reacted against.Speed of light means speed of light. lol
Dyspo was said to be "faster than light" which can be any amount faster. But speed of light is one fixed value.
This was part of why the lightning feats aren't counter arguments at all. We don't take lightning as a fixed value, or else there'd be no characters on this site who wield lightning that would be higher than MHS speed.Also, currently the units have MHS+ attack speed for their lightning attacks, so if they don't have natural lightning, that needs to change as well.
By the way, I seem to remember being told earlier that speed statistics won't deviate between each other as long as calc stacking isn't attempted or the character isn't under any circumstance to use a different speed.Snip
What about the clip Quan showed where they couldn't react to it.Either way, it's not an anti feat since it was reacted against.
I am just unearthing an inconsistency in the pages. Because the page currently treats the lightning as real lightning. So if it is not, then that needs to be corrected accordingly.This was part of why the lightning feats aren't counter arguments at all.
I am not sure if I understand your statement correctly, but we do not use calc stacking because we don't generally assume that the character is using the same speed as they did in some other feat and also because it leads to inflation more often than not. If that doesn't answer your question, then I probably didn't understand your question correctly.By the way, I seem to remember being told earlier that speed statistics won't deviate between each other as long as calc stacking isn't attempted or the character isn't under any circumstance to use a different speed.
Well in that case then I agree with AKM. We should remove the lightning attack speed rating as well. Except for Kai's light speed lightning.Which is your headcanon for thinking the attacks have set speed. They don't.
Light speed is light speed. If it was faster he would have stated such.It isn't. Speed of light doesn't mean limited to light speed here.
Even then, Kamui's Units already show themselves reacting to it before it hits them as they put their arms up to cover, so it's still not an anti feat.
"Dont even flinch"In the scan I posted they don't even flinch. They're literally blitzed by the lightning.
Where.....did he ever say such a thing?Kai himself says the couldn't react. There's no feats in series proving they could.
Why would it matter if its from other units? It's still lightning. Lightning has a set speed in general.
1:02:30
Kai even states "Noone can stop an assault that strikes out at the speed of light"
If they're mftl in reaction then why would light speed be an issue for them? Let's not Ignore context here Kukui.
I checked, and he does. It's even more specific, if anything.Secondly, is that even what that kid says in the japanese version? Because if he says something else then it's pointless to argue they can't react to lightspeed.
That's ok, but it still doesn't change my other point that the monsters aren't going to dodge the attack because it's the games rules. It's like seeing to monsters in Yu-Gi-Oh battle and once the character declared an attack, the other monster started dodging and straight up avoids the attack. That's not how it works to my knowledge.I checked, and he does. It's even more specific, if anything.
Yes, that's a part of what I mean. They can activate blocks and such but it's all depending on the players. Due to game mechanics any attack can be blocked with enough defense. They're typically guarding before the attack starts though.Isn't it also based on (seemingly arbitrary) turns, though? Like, you have to activate an absorption technique preemptively instead of dodging.
In series, the player can use a card during an attack to block it. The same humans who can fight and react to the same units in person.Still seems like you can't possibly move a character to these attacks, only before and after.
There's a lot of variables that come into play tbh.So could many attacks simply be too powerful to block?
I agree, but the consistency of the speed in the verse is also relevant imo.I feel like taking the approach of "Are there anti-feats?" is less fruitful than the approach of "Does it meet our standards for scaling?"