Boomer Shooter/New Blood Interactive discussion thread

[Shmooply]

Probably.
Still not gonna forgive them for changing Ion Fury's name.

 

[rawXDglomp]

Humble Bundle has like > 1/2 the notable 'boomer' shooters in a bundle for fairly cheap currently if you ain't seen it yet. 'Boomer shooters' bundle.

 

[Armorchompy]

That's pretty good, even the discount coupons are a bit tacky. Still.

 

[Armorchompy]

feeling quirky, might make Amid Evil profiles

 

[Shmooply]

i knew u were gonna do that when i saw u playing amid evil on dickchord
I'd say to wait for the prequel to come out, but considering we don't know the official release date of it, go and knock yourself out. I'll try out that new ULTRAKILL update next weekend and finally make that damn CRT.

 

[Armorchompy]

DUSK is probably the more optimal one to make but that one actually requires calculations beyond "just time how long it takes the sun boss to reach the arena for easy FTL rating"

 

[Shmooply]

The game still has good FTL stuff besides the sun boss. The Champion can summon black holes and somehow not be dragged into them, which could be either a resistance, or him having FTL travel speed.

 

[Armorchompy]

Eh black holes are kinda wonk, I wouldn't consider the Amid Evil one "real"

 

[rawXDglomp]

Yea those are just called black holes, in the same way he's not shooting planets/suns he can actually scale to regular characters unless he's a giant (which he may be, I didn't pay attention to the story)

 

[Armorchompy]

The planets/suns are actual planets/suns, just shrunk down by the Celestial Claw, it's explained in the codex.

 

[Shmooply]

in the same way he's not shooting planets/suns

The Celestial Claw's lore straight up says that it plucks out planets and stars and makes them small. The game even plays sounds of humans screaming in pain and congratulates you on killing innocent people if you decide to shoot the Earth itself at an enemy.

Created by the Archmage of Chaos; it pulls random planets from their position in time and space, then shrinks them down to a size so that they can be launched at foes. A truly deadly weapon.

> When enough souls have been gathered their power enables the claw enough might to fire even a sun.

 

[rawXDglomp]

Shows how little ***** I give about the story in boomer shooters lol

 

[Armorchompy]

There's some gems, I think DUSK has a few neat moments and ULTRAKILL lore is pretty fun. Generally not the genre to look for complex narrative though

 

[Armorchompy]

How's it looking?

 

[rawXDglomp]

Some weird stuff

• Weapon mastery: Nearly nothing you said in that has anything to do with weapon mastery at all. Did he use that axe in that trial? If he didn't, then its not a weapon feat. Him succeeding in his quest is a combo of all his feats, not specifically a weapon feat.
• Him pulling with the axe isn't magnetism. Just pulling something with an invisible force isn't magnetism.
• What's the extrasensory perception from? An item? If so it should be with the other items near the bottom of his power list for consistency, and say so.
• Do you mean the axe brings itself AND its user back to the source location on death, or just the axe? It says just axe. If its just the axe doing that, that's not a feat of the character at all, that's a feat something that used to be his equipment is doing post-death. And even if it is, is it stated to be making portals to do, rather than just teleporting? I'm not getting the portal creation bit here. Dimensional travel is kind of misleading, too, if he can literally only travel via already made portals in set locations. Its like saying a guy who can walk through a door has 'door travel'. Even if he has to use the axe as a key.
• Wasn't it literally you like 3 posts ago who said those black holes are clearly not actually black holes, but just a hyperbolic description for a much smaller but vaguely thematically similar object that also sucks?
• Corruption: All types is a massive no limit fallacy with very little basis. The amount of ways a character can be corrupted in fiction is far beyond what he deals with in that game, even with the pics you supply to add the lore bits to it.
• Not sure what power it would be but non-physical interaction should be paired with or replaced specifically with the ability to interact with souls, assuming we have such a power, which we should

-The justification for solar level is very slim. 'Seemingly' isn't really good enough. And getting power from the sun doesn't make you solar system level. Are solar powered chars solar system level?

• The actual weapon is hard to really get a feel on. Technically he's ripping planets and such, but at the same time his attacks themselves, using those planets, are nowhere near that level because he shrinks them. So its like solar system level, but not applicable
• "Magic in Amid Evil runs on a mana system, which is drained to perform attacks and other magical feats, with even Evil itself using it for its various attacks" What does this have to do with attack potency? Explain it elsewhere

Speed seems fine.
Weapon explanations blackhole aside seem fine.
LS seems fine.
Dura ties into attack potency above.
Stamina seems above superhuman since he literally never gets tired ever

Weakness could mention he actually loses the ability all non-powered versions of his weapons in sould mode; most notably aetwhatever becomes risky to use, water staff doesn't home and I think axe doesn't pull. Also should make it clearly just how little time soul mode lasts for, and mention that he relies on weak enemies to kill to even be able to use it, so its worthless 1 v 1.

 

[Armorchompy]

Weapon mastery: Nearly nothing you said in that has anything to do with weapon mastery at all. Did he use that axe in that trial? If he didn't, then its not a weapon feat. Him succeeding in his quest is a combo of all his feats, not specifically a weapon feat.

It's a combat feat, he fights with weapons, so it's a weapons feat. Also judging by the prequel DLC trailer he uses various weapons to do it

Him pulling with the axe isn't magnetism. Just pulling something with an invisible force isn't magnetism.

TK is better maybe

What's the extrasensory perception from? An item? If so it should be with the other items near the bottom of his power list for consistency, and say so.

It's explained in the profile, the axe does it by sensing evil. And basically all P&A listed at this point and after is item-based.

Do you mean the axe brings itself AND its user back to the source location on death, or just the axe? It says just axe. If its just the axe doing that, that's not a feat of the character at all, that's a feat something that used to be his equipment is doing post-death. And even if it is, is it stated to be making portals to do, rather than just teleporting? I'm not getting the portal creation bit here. Dimensional travel is kind of misleading, too, if he can literally only travel via already made portals in set locations. Its like saying a guy who can walk through a door has 'door travel'. Even if he has to use the axe as a key.

It's not really clear how the portals work. Either way yeah just the axe does the dimensional travel, doesn't mean it's not P&A, and being the only thing that can create portals, even if it were specific locations only, is still a notable power if a useless one in combat.

Wasn't it literally you like 3 posts ago who said those black holes are clearly not actually black holes, but just a hyperbolic description for a much smaller but vaguely thematically similar object that also sucks?

Yeah, I'm not saying they're "real" black holes, ability is still given for fake ones.

Corruption: All types is a massive no limit fallacy with very little basis. The amount of ways a character can be corrupted in fiction is far beyond what he deals with in that game, even with the pics you supply to add the lore bits to it.

All Types simply refers to the Corruption power page splitting Corruption in two. There's two types as the wiki defines it, physical, which is covered by the shadowy stuff and parasite stuff that Evil does, and non-physical is covered by the rest. Obviously the Champion does not resist every kind of corruption hax in fiction, though he does have a pretty impressive resistance.

Not sure what power it would be but non-physical interaction should be paired with or replaced specifically with the ability to interact with souls, assuming we have such a power, which we should

Non-Physical Interaction covers it, page image is a ghost being stuck in a bottle even.

The justification for solar level is very slim. 'Seemingly' isn't really good enough. And getting power from the sun doesn't make you solar system level. Are solar powered chars solar system level?

Drawing power from the sun isn't solar system level, drawing so much power from the sun that you completely exhaust it is. As for 'seemingly', there aren't really any other explanations for it, I'm just putting that there because of a baseline level of uncertainty.

The actual weapon is hard to really get a feel on. Technically he's ripping planets and such, but at the same time his attacks themselves, using those planets, are nowhere near that level because he shrinks them. So its like solar system level, but not applicable

Star level. It applies to AP because of the following thing.

"Magic in Amid Evil runs on a mana system, which is drained to perform attacks and other magical feats, with even Evil itself using it for its various attacks" What does this have to do with attack potency? Explain it elsewhere

Universal Energy System, showing that all attacks are powered by similar things. Logic is if feat takes a finite amount of mana and other attacks do, they consume comparable amounts of energy, and as such should be roughly on the same level. Noteworthy here is that Evil appears to use orange mana for its final attack too, where it strikes you.

Stamina seems above superhuman since he literally never gets tired ever

Superhuman is the highest non-infinite stamina stat and there isn't enough evidence for infinite.

Weakness could mention he actually loses the ability all non-powered versions of his weapons in sould mode; most notably aetwhatever becomes risky to use, water staff doesn't home and I think axe doesn't pull. Also should make it clearly just how little time soul mode lasts for, and mention that he relies on weak enemies to kill to even be able to use it, so its worthless 1 v 1.

Unless he's made to start with it, regardless yeah I'll edit that a bit.

 

[Armorchompy]

Although I should say, an argument could be made for the Aeternum black holes being real. They duraneg, and they appear to distort light with their gravitational pull when they're shot. I don't really buy it personally but it could be the case.

 

[rawXDglomp]

It's a combat feat, he fights with weapons, so it's a weapons feat. Also judging by the prequel DLC trailer he uses various weapons to do it


Star level. It applies to AP because of the following thing.

Universal Energy System, showing that all attacks are powered by similar things. Logic is if feat takes a finite amount of mana and other attacks do, they consume comparable amounts of energy, and as such should be roughly on the same level. Noteworthy here is that Evil appears to use orange mana for its final attack too, where it strikes you.

Superhuman is the highest non-infinite stamina stat and there isn't enough evidence for infinite.

Unless he's made to start with it, regardless yeah I'll edit that a bit.

Still seems weird to me to call that weapon mastery. Him being able to use all the weapons is weapon mastery. What you've listed is just what he's done overall then attributed that purely to weapon mastery. Its weird.

What following thing? The mana thing? I don't really understand what that has to do with anything.
You summon planets.
You shrink them.
You throw shrunken, incredibly weak in comparison planets.
Another guy using some unstated amount of the same energy to do his attacks doesn't make your or his attack solar system level in-combat.
Its only solar system level for the poor bastards on those planets.


Everything else seems fair.

Black holes is weird but that's an issue with the site mislabeling 'things that suck and clearly aren't black holes' as 'black holes'.

 

[Armorchompy]

Still seems weird to me to call that weapon mastery. Him being able to use all the weapons is weapon mastery. What you've listed is just what he's done overall then attributed that purely to weapon mastery. Its weird.

It's the best place to put combat feats. Like, how else do you suggest he beat all those tough enemies, in a calm, ethical debate?

What following thing? The mana thing? I don't really understand what that has to do with anything.
You summon planets.
You shrink them.
You throw shrunken, incredibly weak in comparison planets.
Another guy using some unstated amount of the same energy to do his attacks doesn't make your or his attack solar system level in-combat.
Its only solar system level for the poor bastards on those planets.

Star level. And if he can output star level energy on those planets by consuming a certain quantity of mana, consuming similar amounts to perform similar attacks would require similar energy which goes into the attacks.

At least that's the reasoning that's used for like, half our videogame profiles.

 

[rawXDglomp]

Just doesn't make sense at all in this case. He's not hitting with the energy of a planet. He's specifically using a weapon that goes out of its way to shrink them and not do that level of damage.
Same goes for the sun guy, too. He's absorbing a sun, he's not hitting you with 100% of that energy with every hit.

 

[Armorchompy]

Eh, you could argue maybe the mass is kept even when shrunk, otherwise there wouldn't be much point in using stars/planets instead of more conventional projectiles. But generally, it's not about hitting with that energy, look at any character who gets to tier 7 by summoning a storm and having that be scaled to their other attacks via similar logic. Were it the only reasoning I'd be sus on it but with the Solar Saint stuff, I think it's fine support.

 

[Armorchompy]

can i post the profile or would you like to debate further?

Also, I bought the Boomer Shooter Humble Bundle and played Project Warlock. Fun overall but the final boss sucked.

 

[rawXDglomp]

Just post it bro.
I was playing warlock yesterday. Way too fond of suddenly spawning a dozen enemies behind you and the magic is incredibly underwhelming for a game with 'warlock' in the name. Guns aren't satisfying either because the enemies don't really react in any noticeable way to being shot. Sound effects are fine, though.
Don't like its combo of constantly spawning enemies behind you + no ability to save mid-map, either. Upgrades are pretty weird, too. I can add lifesteal to axe, or mana steal. Maybe both? Doesn't say. Explains nothing. There's a passive that gives bonus stats for having 10 points, so it seems to want me to spend 10 levels not making my guy good at anything so he'll be better later. You don't even start out with a spell in a game about using magic with guns. Maybe I've missed all the magic so far, can't tell, the exits to each map look different so I've exited half the maps by accident.
So far not impressing me.

Its at least better than Hedon though; can't tell where I need to go in that game ever.
Amid Evil I need to bump difficulty on if it lets me without restarting. Too easy. I'm face-tanking the game and even v bosses that works with no issue because you nearly instantly kill them.

 

[Armorchompy]

I was playing warlock yesterday. Way too fond of suddenly spawning a dozen enemies behind you and the magic is incredibly underwhelming for a game with 'warlock' in the name.

Yeah magic's kinda ass, the lightning spell you get at the end of world 1 and the dynamite one are the only ok ones.

Guns aren't satisfying either because the enemies don't really react in any noticeable way to being shot.

Huh, I thought they were pretty satisfying.

Don't like its combo of constantly spawning enemies behind you + no ability to save mid-map, either.

How far in are you? Beyond one enemy that spawns other enemies in world 3, it doesn't do that much after the first world in my experience.

Upgrades are pretty weird, too. I can add lifesteal to axe, or mana steal. Maybe both? Doesn't say. Explains nothing.

Only one. It's actually a bit lame cuz you can't really tell how good they'll be in advance.

There's a passive that gives bonus stats for having 10 points, so it seems to want me to spend 10 levels not making my guy good at anything so he'll be better later.

No, it's 10 points added to your character's stats, you have to expend them. Oh also, I recommend purchasing the fast runner perk before the end of the game, final boss basically requires it.

You don't even start out with a spell in a game about using magic with guns. Maybe I've missed all the magic so far, can't tell, the exits to each map look different so I've exited half the maps by accident.

Beyond the first few maps almost all exits are guarded by a red skull door. Spells look like floating cards.

Its at least better than Hedon though; can't tell where I need to go in that game ever.

I'm playing Hedon now lol. I like a bit of exploration so we'll see.

Amid Evil I need to bump difficulty on if it lets me without restarting. Too easy. I'm face-tanking the game and even v bosses that works with no issue because you nearly instantly kill them.

Bosses are pretty weak yeah, especially with star of torment super.

 

[rawXDglomp]

Dunno where I'm up to on Warlock. Quite far in, I think.

Oh also, I recommend purchasing the fast runner perk before the end of the game, final boss basically requires it.

Mmm will do.
That boss must really suck to stand out as bad in an FPS though. There are very few FPS with good bosses.

 

[Armorchompy]

It's bad but not for the usual FPS reasons, it's actually got a pretty elaborate set of attacks, it just has way too much health and its attacks are basically impossible to dodge without the right perk.

And yeah most FPS have pretty bad bosses, I'd say ULTRAKILL and DUSK are the only real examples, if you extend it to third person shooters I'd add Vanquish to the pile. Maybe Killer7 but that's not really a conventional shooter

 

[JohnConquest1]

Its funny when obnoxious regular enemy placement is among a genres more notable and meme worthy boss encounters.

 

[Armorchompy]

I mean, most old videogame genres have kinda shitty bosses, typically, old platformers barely have bosses at all, RPGs are "press the fire spell button for five minutes" half the time, boomer shooters aren't that bad when you think about it that way

 

[Shmooply]

RPGs are "press the fire spell button for five minutes"

how nice of modern spellcasters in MMORPGs to continue this tradition

IMO, bullshit enemy placements are one of the more memorable parts of oldschool shooters. Half Life does this sort of thing well.

 

[Armorchompy]

how nice of modern spellcasters in MMORPGs to continue this tradition

Most modern RPGs also do that, to be fair

IMO, bullshit enemy placements are one of the more memorable parts of oldschool shooters. Half Life does this sort of thing well.

Yeah I agree, I love playing Blood, seeing a corner and going "yeah there's totally an ambush here" and throwing dynamite to take them out safely

 

[rawXDglomp]

how nice of modern spellcasters in MMORPGs to continue this tradition

IMO, bullshit enemy placements are one of the more memorable parts of oldschool shooters. Half Life does this sort of thing well.

Half life was just
oh shit a head crab in the vents
oh shit a headcrab near the vents
oh shit a headcrab out of the vents
oh shit headcrabs wooooow
Game needed more fights with the humans, there were the only fun ones to fight

 

[Armorchompy]

I have beaten Hedon Crystal Heart and in my opinion, it's really good, honestly one of the best boomer shooters out there

 

[Armorchompy]

I have decided I will be making profiles for it. Shockingly huge set of P&A actually

 

[Shmooply]

[wait nevermind thats apparently a no-no word now]
still looks good though

 

[Armorchompy]

Thanks. Still gotta play the second game mind you so this is a WIP still, technically there's a 4-A-ish feat already but i will ignore it

 

[rawXDglomp]

Is her using the big axe actually canon? Its from an alternate mode.

 

[Armorchompy]

It's kinda vague canon-wise in that they're at least trained with the Bearzerk mode weapons as indicated by some of the lore so I'm counting it, especially since I don't think anything really explicitly says Bearzerk is less canon than the "normal" set. So I'm just gonna have different tabbers for the bearzerk and normal weapons and point out in optional equipment that she can't have both.

 

[rawXDglomp]

It's kinda vague canon-wise in that they're at least trained with the Bearzerk mode weapons as indicated by some of the lore so I'm counting it, especially since I don't think anything really explicitly says Bearzerk is less canon than the "normal" set. So I'm just gonna have different tabbers for the bearzerk and normal weapons and point out in optional equipment that she can't have both.

Seems smart and if lore says its canon then it be.

 

[Armorchompy]

I have beaten Hedon Bloodrite and it was just as good if not better than Crystal Heart. nice

 

[First_Witch]

Soooo, anyone going to powerscale Nightmare Reaper with me?