Bleach Revisions: Thousand Year Blood War

[The4Godlike]

@The4Godlike Kenpachi's restraints were no longer there towards the end in his fight with Unohana. Royd finessed restrained Kenpachi but he could possibly scale to High 6-A anyways.

Then does that mean Pre-training Unpatched Kenpachi is High 6-A ? But how ? Didn't those High 6-A scalings come from Meteor ?

 

[Amlad22]

Unohana shouldn't be scaled to Kenpachi. As soon as Kenpachi awakened his true power he dominated the fight and pretty much two shotted her. One slash and one stab before she died.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

• sighs

Are we sure we won't continue going around in circles like this?

We've agreed on everyone's Bankai scaling to Hitsugaya's. Let's try and make more progress.

I'm guessing the senior captains in Shikai will also scale?

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

Probably.

Gerard's Keys definitely need sorting, though. I suggest:

Base | Post-Auswhalen | God Size | Vollständig | Vollständig: Second Form

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Okay, but that should be after the ratings have been ascertained. They should affect Base / Post Auswahlen Gerard.

 

[Peter_"Quicksilver"_Maximoff]

Ok, who scales to Toshiro's feat?

 

[Amlad22]

Off the top of my head I'd say Shunsui, Urahara, Yamamoto (Shikai), Aizen (Base), Isshin, Unohana, Kenpachi (Base), Askin, Lille, Pernida, Rukia, Renji, Sajin (Human), Bambietta, Bazz-B, and possibly the other captains in Bankai and the sternritter. It's also worth discussing how the espada work in to all of this.

 

[Aizenishere]

Off the top of my head I'd say Shunsui, Urahara, Yamamoto (Shikai), Aizen (Base), Isshin, Unohana, Kenpachi (Base), Askin, Lille, Pernida, Rukia, Renji, Sajin (Human), Bambietta, Bazz-B, and possibly the other captains in Bankai and the sternritter. It's also worth discussing how the espada work in to all of this.

Wait.. I'm sorry but you mean 6-C Aizen in Base? I thought that's what chrysalis and transcendent scaled to.

 

[Amlad22]

Well yeah the other forms would scale as well, butterfly would most likely have a 'likely higher' part of the rating as well. But Base should also scale for sure. Aizen showed that he was more than a match for the senior captains like Shunsui and said only Yamamoto had a 'chance' of beating him with his shikai.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Off the top of my head I'd say Shunsui, Urahara, Yamamoto (Shikai), Aizen (Base), Isshin, Unohana, Kenpachi (Base), Askin, Lille, Pernida, Rukia, Renji, Sajin (Human), Bambietta, Bazz-B, and possibly the other captains in Bankai and the sternritter. It's also worth discussing how the espada work in to all of this.

I would like to add on to this:

We should remove the separate keys for Yamamoto, Unohana, Kyoraku, Ukitake. It's clear they didn't get stronger post time skip. Yamamoto may have actually gotten weaker over the past 1,000 years. We've discussed this time and time again. These four characters should have just one key.

However, younger captain levels like Urahara and Yoruichi having separate keys makes sense. They could have trained and gotten stronger. Zaraki, Byakuya, Toshiro obviously got stronger after the time skip. After his fight against Ichigo, Zaraki spoke to his sword and stated that he did want to improve, Byakuya obviously trains and keeps honing his skills, Hitsugaya trained like crazy.

How do the Espada work into all this? I don't know if the Espada other than Grimmjow (and that too only for post time skip) should be scaled from a post time skip Hitsugaya. Perhaps Resurreccion Starrk could be scaled from Kyoraku but I'm not sure about this. I'd like more input, but this thread is for post time skip changes only.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Wait.. I'm sorry but you mean 6-C Aizen in Base? I thought that's what chrysalis and transcendent scaled to.

Base Aizen being scaled from 6-C Hitsugaya seems okay. After all, he scales to the likes of Kyoraku and Unohana, and only Yamamoto was stated to be a challenge for him (Aizen's own words).

 

[Amlad22]

I've argued for those four to have the same key for ages now. I totally agree. They are scale to Toshiro. The thing is though, if Shunsui does scale, it would allow Starrk to scale, which in turn should allow Ulquiorra and Barragan to scale.

Also would other captains like Shinji, Rose and Soifon scale? There's no way they would be multiple tiers below Toshiro.

 

[Amlad22]

Base Aizen being scaled from 6-C Hitsugaya seems okay. After all, he scales to the likes of Kyoraku and Unohana, and only Yamamoto was stated to be a challenge for him (Aizen's own words).

Basically a more sophisticated version of what I said but ok XD

 

[Aizenishere]

@Soldier,

Yea I understand that, it's just I was told that it was chrysalis and transcendent Aizen scaling so it threw me for a bit of a loop.

@Amlad

lol.

 

[Amlad22]

So are the admins responsible for the upgrades or can the rest of help out with making the changes?

 

[KuuIchigo]

I'm not sure what to do with Royd. His powers is not like his brother Loyd where he only copies memories and personality. He wasn't able to do much against Yamamoto in his bankai. We could probably scale him to this calc I found for Yamamoto's Bankai heat (which is continent I think) which Royd was able to resist. Loyd would scale to his brother of course.

Unohana does not scale to the meteor that is ridiculous. She fought a still restricted eyepatchless Kenpachi. That is it. She died as soon as Kenpachi was at his max and was not restricting himself anymore.

Everyone and their mothers scale to Hitsugaya's city stopping feat bankai or not which he did while being exhausted af.

If we are going the route of pre-timeskip getting involved. At max the only people that scales off the Hitsugaya's city stopping feat is: Base Aizen and all of his transformation up to monster, Yamamoto, Shunsui, Ukitake, Ulquiorra Segunda, h1/h2 Ichigo, Starrk, Isshin, Urahara, Yoruichi, Gin. Unohana.

Everyone else that is relevant scales to this.

I guess all that is left is the Ikkaku calc which would scale to all Lieutenants and anyone who did not scale to the cloud feat.

 

[Amlad22]

So can we start making changes or is more input required?

 

[LordAizenSama]

Let Kuu manage the editing of the profiles, easier to keep track of that way.

Im also fine with his suggestions

 

[Soldier_Blue]

I've argued for those four to have the same key for ages now. I totally agree. They are scale to Toshiro. The thing is though, if Shunsui does scale, it would allow Starrk to scale, which in turn should allow Ulquiorra and Barragan to scale.

Nope. Ulquiorra, Harribel, Baraggan should absolutely not scale to Starrk. He's the number 1 Espada and is well above them. It'd be better to scale Harribel and Baraggan from Ulquiorra's 7-B Cero Oscuras calc as well as Hitsugaya's 7-B calc.

That reminds me; we should just put Ulquiorra, Harribel, Baraggan at flat out 7-B in Resurreccion instead of sticking with the current ratings. They can harm characters who are capable of enduring a Cero Oscuras (which means City class striking strength) and since it's just a blast of their own reiatsu, it should scale to their own durability. However, we should retain the current treatment for Gran Rey Cero.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Gwyn did a calc of what kind of durability one would need to endure Yamamoto's 15 million degree heat from a distance of several metres. The result was higher end of High 6-C (Large Island level+). I think that'd be best since it really is sound.

I agree on Unohana. Should we scale her and Kyoraku from Hitsugaya's 6-C calc instead?

The Ikkaku calc looks good to me (though a calc group member should really evaluate it first).

 

[Amlad22]

I can see barragan not scaling but Ulquiorra should scale for scale in segunda etapa. He's well above characters like Halibel and shouldn't be below someone like Ukitake.

Shouldn't every espada above 7 scale to Toshiro's city feat since Toshiro fought evenly with Luppi? And then anyone who scales to the top espada would also become city level. So like Kenpachi scales to Nnoitra.

 

[KuuIchigo]

Yes but he didn't take into account the rest of the other stuff in the calc I posted which is also more recent and comes from Regicide who does most of the Bleach calcs on OBD.

Yes that is the plan if you wanted to remove the keys from the senior captains.

That too.

Also the cloud feat I posted got Large City level+.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Zommari fought against Byakuya. So he should scale to Byakuya. And Byakuya scales from Hitsugaya. Since Zommari scales, every Espada above him will scale.

 

[LordAizenSama]

@amlad this toshiro trained significantly post timeskip, so only the strongest pretimeskip can scale. Certainly not the foddespada.

Also to clarify since it can be a bit confusing.large city level+=Mountain level+.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

@amlad this toshiro trained significantly post timeskip, so only the strongest pretimeskip can scale. Certainly not the foddespada.

So that would be: Yamamoto (Shikai), Aizen (obviously), Isshin (for cleaving through Aizen), Kyoraku, Unohana (should not be weaker than Isshin and Kyoraku).

Who else?

 

[Amlad22]

I know that the fodder wouldn't scale. I would say Grimmjow, Nnoitra, Halibel and Barragan could scale to the cloud feat. And then Ulquiorra with segunda etapa and Starrk would scale to island level.

Honestly not sure where espada 9,8 and 7 would go though.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Honestly not sure where espada 9,8 and 7 would go though.

Espada 7 (Zommari) will scale to Byakuya as he fought against him. Espada below Zommari will scale to the Town level+ feat (if/when it's evaluated).

 

[Amlad22]

Zommari only fought Base Byakuya who is defiantly not scaled to Bankai Toshiro. Once Byakuya went Bankai the fight ended instantly. So no way is Zommari city level

 

[LordAizenSama]

@soldier everyone kuu mentioned above I think is fine. The "weakest" that should be scaled is Segunda Ulquiorra. And even then ive been talking to Kuu and agree that him and vasto lorde ichigo should get a likely 6c rating, as there is a bit of speculation but it should still be fine

Anyway whenever that toshiro bankai calc gets accepted everyone and their mother is comparable to him.. so just about every captain with their bankai.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Zommari only fought Base Byakuya who is defiantly not scaled to Bankai Toshiro. Once Byakuya went Bankai the fight ended instantly. So no way is Zommari city level

Resurreccion Zommari survived, albeit with injuries, a full on blast of Senbonzakura Kageyoshi's stronger techniques. So Resurreccion Zommari scales.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

Later on, Byakuya fought Yammy, Espada 0, so can you really scale Zommari to Byakuya?

That cloud calc needs to be evaluated before we use it.

Espada 10, 9, 8, 7, 6 and 5 should all be Large Town level while Sealed, scaling to SS Arc Komamura. Maybe higher if we can get a legitimate Tōshirō cloud making calc for his Shikai. For Resurrección, you could just multiply that by 5 or 10, (it's very clear how Resurrección works, I'll provide evidence if you want).

Nnoitra gets durability scaling to Top 3 Espada.

Scaling Pre-Skip guys to Post-Skip Tōshirō can get a bit messy.

Aizen, Gin and Tousen would probably scale, I don't know know about the Espada though.

H2 Ichigo has his own feat that would probably reach Mountain - Island level, so, I'm going to calc that.

Seniors and Elites would probably be High 6-C scaling from Renji anyways.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Why is Renji High 6-C exactly?

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

Basically, Kensei and Rose should scale to Tōshirō and Mask stomped both of them. He then hits Renji with a 10├ù Murder Punch, which Renji effortlessly catches, while still in Shikai. Then again, scaling people to Renji might not be ideal.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

I don't think we should scale Rose and Kensei from Hitsugaya since the little guy trained his ass off to get stronger. As LordAizenSama said, best to scale only the advanced captains (Yamamoto in Shikai, Kyoraku, Unohana, may be Ukitake) to Hitsugaya. The only "young" captains that should scale to Hitsugaya would have to be Zaraki, Byakuya, may be Urahara, and Yoruichi in her flash goddess form.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

Tōshirō did train but to suggest that Captains, (especially Vizard's who have more Reiryoku than normal), can't scale to the minimum durability of Tōshirō's ice while fatigued, doesn't make sense. Not all Captains are equal but the difference between them isn't that much, outside of Seniors.

 

[LordAizenSama]

This is getting a bit messy, does anyone disagree with the suggestions kuu has? We can cross them off and keep discussing whatever else

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

I agree with most things but Cloud calc needs evaluation and if Starrk scales, the Top 3 probably should as well.

 

[PaChi2]

I agree with Kuu.

 

[LordAizenSama]

Alright thanks for the input, kuu can fix it up when he gets the chance

 

[LordAizenSama]

@Piercer could you link the calc for toshiros storm please? Couldn't find it.