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Bleach high godly and concept hax

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Marshadow29 said:
"In most works of fiction, the fourth wall is intact, that is, the characters do not acknowledge the existence of an audience or that they themselves are part of a fictional work. " literally on the page
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...

Goku literally broke the 4th wall without even thinking there is an audience. You are 100% sure aware that what you are talking about is 4th wall awareness, and not breaking?
 
ImmortalDread said:
...

Goku literally broke the 4th wall without even thinking there is an audience. You are 100% sure aware that what you are talking about is 4th wall awareness, and not breaking?
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the two are usually interchangeable. also the speech bubble argument got debunked since it exists in the anime as well
 
However, some fictions employ the literary technique of Breaking the Fourth Wall. This includes talking to the audience, affecting the "real world", rewriting speech bubbles, acknowledging that they are part of a fictional world, and even leaving the fictional work itself and entering the "real world" (represented, obviously, by a fictionalized version of the real world).

taken straight from the vsbw desc btw
 
@Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye Soul King has information manipulation type 2 for the same reason as the characters who have high-godly have it, if this is accepted to not be info hax then Soul King's info hax type 2 by default gets removed.

@KingogKings777 the imgur link doesn't remotely explain that the zanpakuto's individual names govern all of reality, just their own concepts.

@Reio35 his body being made of imagination doesn't tell me anything about him reforming his literal data/information on his existence. Those are two completely different things that have no connection to one another unless you can provide the evidence that imaginations lose their information completely.
 
Marshadow29 said:
However, some fictions employ the literary technique of Breaking the Fourth Wall. This includes talking to the audience, affecting the "real world", rewriting speech bubbles, acknowledging that they are part of a fictional world, and even leaving the fictional work itself and entering the "real world" (represented, obviously, by a fictionalized version of the real world).
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You already said it, “it includes talking to the audience…ect", those are examples, and not the “requirements”.

"Rewriting speed bubbles" is the reason I gave him and Deceived agreed on it.
Marshadow29 said:
taken straight from the vsbw desc btw
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At least read it correctly, since quoting it won't help the matter.
 
Theglassman12 said:
@Reio35 his body being made of imagination doesn't tell me anything about him reforming his literal data/information on his existence. Those are two completely different things that have no connection to one another unless you can provide the evidence that imaginations lose their information completely.
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Agreed. It's even noted in the scan that his regeneration works via absorbing Reishi and using that to replace his imagined body.
 
Have any new arguments been provided, or are we still using just the two provided in the OP itself? just wanna know for more context when i address everything.
 
Theglassman12 said:
@KingogKings777 the imgur link doesn't remotely explain that the zanpakuto's individual names govern all of reality, just their own concepts.
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Have been trying to say it for ages.
Theglassman12 said:
@Reio35 his body being made of imagination doesn't tell me anything about him reforming his literal data/information on his existence. Those are two completely different things that have no connection to one another unless you can provide the evidence that imaginations lose their information completely.
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Although I may not agree with this statement if it pertains to Shaz and the other character, I will defer to @Deceived3596 for a comprehensive explanation as they have access to all relevant scans and have initiated the accepted upgrade thread.
 
@Deceived3596 aside from bringing some extra statements with the concept hax stuff like controlling the concept of black (though for some reason people are claiming controlling individual zanpakuto names means type 2 concept and not type 3), and the 4th wall breaking stuff which I don't know why this is even in this thread, nothing else, just respond to the OP.
 
The use of 4th wall breaking should have been implemented, but it's unclear why Deceived has not done so yet. The issue at hand is that the users who disagree is utilizing the panel as a means of conveying "plot/text/CM/DM," despite it being intended solely for 4th wall breaking purposes (although it's presented differently in anime).
 
Theglassman12 said:
@Deceived3596 aside from bringing some extra statements with the concept hax stuff like controlling the concept of black (though for some reason people are claiming controlling individual zanpakuto names means type 2 concept and not type 3), and the 4th wall breaking stuff which I don't know why this is even in this thread, nothing else, just respond to the OP.
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You should actually read my arguments of how i explained that it's clear cut CM2 by going off the standards and examples shown on the CM page.

Nobody said that controlling individual zanpakuto names is CM2.
 
ImmortalDread said:
The use of 4th wall breaking should have been implemented, but it's unclear why Deceived has not done so yet. The issue at hand is that the users who disagree is utilizing the panel as a means of conveying "plot/text/CM/DM," despite it being intended solely for 4th wall breaking purposes (although it's presented differently in anime).
Click to expand...
  1. I didn't add the profiles, Arcker did.
  2. Ichibe has Breaking the Fourth Wall on his profile, re-check it again.
 
Deceived3596 said:
  1. I didn't add the profiles, Arcker did.
  2. Ichibe has Breaking the Fourth Wall on his profile, re-check it again.
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If he did it, that's fine. Then, I am not sure why people are using the same accepted panel for other reasons. (I checked your thread, and it is not closed, this is why I thought they are not applied)
 
Neutral on Divine Regeneration, and completely disagree on conceptual manipulation.

I'm sure some people here have never read bleach or its novels
 
Is clearly stated that he also named all the phenomena and everything in soul society not just solely zanapkuto names.
 
@deonment the zanpakuto name itself doesn't govern reality though, it governs the specific items for the weapons.

@LordGinSama the concept of black sure, but giving specific weapons their names is type 3, it should be reworded to have the concept of black being controlled by ichibei instead of the zanpakuto names.

@Hellscream you haven't really explained how the zanpakuto names govern all of reality though.

@KingogKings777 does the concept of zanpakutos have control over reality itself or does it govern a specific object? Because ichibei gives names to the individual swords, the names aren't something that governs reality.
 
Theglassman12 said:
@deonment the zanpakuto name itself doesn't govern reality though, it governs the specific items for the weapons.
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That isn't what the statement is saying, it is saying he created the name Zanpakuto, to clarify, the name of Ichigo's zanpakuto is Zangetsu, but that isn't what Ichibe named, he created the word/name "Zanpakuto" in particular.
The name Zanpakuto is referring to the classification of all of the weapons that fall under the category Zanpakuto, this is different from each of those weapons' individual name, Ichibei created the former and can manipulate it, which is a type 2 as it is the "form" by which each individual zanpakuto is based, it is basically the difference between Natural Numbers as a classification and the numbers which actually fall under the classification of it
 
I don't think theglassman claims that the names of Zanpakuto governs the reality, he is claiming that even that concept does not govern the reality.
 
This back and forth feels a bit meaningless. Theglassman12 already agreed with it remaining Type 2 but changing the justification. Zanpaktous having their names manipulated would only work as proof is they have an explicit statement of existing across reality.

The High-Godly regeneration discourse is especially useless. "Imagination to reality" isn't manipulating information. If you want that to stay, post a scan that proves what he's doing is controlling information of reality, Reishi is information etc. If not then it would go.
 
Planck69 said:
explicit statement of existing across reality
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That isn't what reality in the concept manip page means however, reality there is referring to the phenomenon that the concept governs, the concept of fire for example does not control anything else but fire but that doesn't make it not type 2, we classify the concept types based upon their relationship to their governees rather than to the greater scope of reality
 
Planck69 said:
The High-Godly regeneration discourse is especially useless. "Imagination to reality" isn't manipulating information. If you want that to stay, post a scan that proves what he's doing is controlling information of reality, Reishi is information etc. If not then it would go.
Click to expand...
I disagree regarding the imagination to reality not alluding towards the manipulation of information, but that won't even be needed, as there's a plethora of evidence within Bleach that proves Reishi contains one's information within it, that people can control information through the manipulation of Reishi etc... Which would mean regenerating after having your entire Reishi body destroyed would still be High-Godly, regardless of your opinion on the Shaz scan.

My post will be out in a couple hours, I just need to build up the will to debate this topic, and collect evidence for my claims first, so i'll advise everyone to hold their votes until then.
 
Ichibei's Ink power doesn't erase existence/history/or memories in the world. More like a specific target. Yhwach's sword got ink. Yhwach forgot its name and its existence. Sword doesn't work. But as an example, if Jugram had know the name of that sword. He wouldn't have forgotten the name of it. Just how Ichibei Ink Yhwach's corpse and rename it the new "Reio" in the novels. Everyone still remembers Yhwach and what he did in the TYBW even when his corpse was ink and rename into "Reio".
 
I mean, you can argue that things created from pure imagination is information, because the act of imagining require informations to process, and information that can build something, is type 2 info. The only thing i don't believe is High Godly, from the scan look like the guy regen from ambient Reshi around, that mean there is still information around for him to regen, so he not reall regen from complete informational destruction, so it is Mid Godly

About CM i'm confused, what is the current result??, it gone, or it stay, or it down to type 3???
 
AppleLord said:
Ichibei's Ink power doesn't erase existence/history/or memories in the world. More like a specific target. Yhwach's sword got ink. Yhwach forgot its name and its existence. Sword doesn't work. But as an example, if Jugram had know the name of that sword. He wouldn't have forgotten the name of it. Just how Ichibei Ink Yhwach's corpse and rename it the new "Reio" in the novels. Everyone still remembers Yhwach and what he did in the TYBW even when his corpse was ink and rename into "Reio".
Click to expand...
Ikimoki couldn't remember or say his name after ichibei rewrote his existence
 
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