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Ben 10 Classic Series Revision Thread Part 1

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I’d like to note I find it trivial. The only thing stemming from this is WoG, the only thing he’s done similar to this is the Fusion Cuisine, and we don’t even know if he can weaponize this Sun Creation, meaning it’s useless unless against someone weak to Light, which also means it’s useless without both Preparation and Prior Knowledge and, if they’re not like Ghostfreak who just murders people and can actually hope to live on, Bloodlust since I doubt he’d just kill someone with a Sun using Prior Knowledge.
 
It doesn't matter whether the sun created is a weapon or not. It's only about the energy used.
 
Firestorm808 said:
For Atomix, can we settle with either of the following:

At least Dwarf Star level, higher with prep time.

or

At least Dwarf Star level, up to Star level with prep time.
Click to expand...
I mean I’m not sure if Dargoo agrees with the 10 minutes or not (which I think yields a higher result than Way Big’s feat) but I think he does: “Didn't we agree that, without a timeframe, this just something he can accomplish before the Omnitrix even times out with his given tier?”

So if you could calc baseline 4-C/600 real quick and compare it to Way Big’s feat then I guess Dwarf Star Level, up to Star Level with prep time is fine.

If Atomix ends up higher than Way Big then I guess we can use my aforementioned scaling going via Evil Way Big being the strongest being in the galaxy and thus scaling above Atomix’s species?
 
Greenshifter said:
I mean I’m not sure if Dargoo agrees with the 10 minutes or not (which I think yields a higher result than Way Big’s feat) but I think he does: “Didn't we agree that, without a timeframe, this just something he can accomplish before the Omnitrix even times out with his given tier?”
Click to expand...
Check out the thread
 
Daddybrawl said:
I’d like to note I find it trivial. The only thing stemming from this is WoG, the only thing he’s done similar to this is the Fusion Cuisine, and we don’t even know if he can weaponize this Sun Creation, meaning it’s useless unless against someone weak to Light, which also means it’s useless without both Preparation and Prior Knowledge and, if they’re not like Ghostfreak who just murders people and can actually hope to live on, Bloodlust since I doubt he’d just kill someone with a Sun using Prior Knowledge.
Click to expand...
I think he's thrown orbs at people before
 
It's not that the thread is dead. We just didn't get another admin's input on the Atomix proposal.
 
Yes I know. What I mean by that is that it’s ‘Taking a preposterous amount of time’ and there was something I wanted to discuss. I’ll happily not discuss it right now, though.
 
Regarding Black Hole Creation, he still did that when he recreated the universe and its previously existing black holes.
 
We know Ben didn’t get everything right when he recreated the Universe. We don’t actually know if he made a Black Hole, technically. And I think you need more evidence than ‘He remade the universe‘ to get certain powers- otherwise, we could technically give X every single power in B10 because he made everything in B10, or Antimatter Manipulation because the Universe has Antimatter in it.
 
Well, Black Hole Creation is just the creation of black holes. It's more reasonable that he created the Universe 1 to 1 sans a smoothie than creating one without a single black hole. Otherwise, astronomers would have been asking where their documented black holes went.
 
See, that opens a whole can of worms though. We don’t give characters Powers because they created the Universe, because they’ve never actually displayed the ability. We don’t give characters like Arceus or Super Shenron, who both can recreate their respective universe, Summoning or Black Hole Creation or the multiple Manipulations that making the Universe would give. And we do that because they haven’t actually displayed the ability, all they did was a vague feat of creating the universe.
If we don’t see Alien X make Black Holes, and we know he did not get everything 1:1 in the Universe (heck, WoG implies he even forgot to create Primus, that may be a DJW statement though I can’t recall), and therefore we can’t assume he has the ability to create Black Holes at will. And if they never displayed the ability to do so, it’d be unreasonable to put it on the Profile.
 
A good example of this for the exact same verse. I hope it doesn’t count as a Strawman, but it’s relevant when you look at it correctly.
NRG generates Radiation. Radiation can cause Cancer. Do we give NRG Disease Manipulation because Radiation, which he creates, causes Cancer? No.
Alien X creates a Universe. The Universe could include Black Holes. Do we give Alien X Black Hole Creation because The Universe, which he Creates (albeit Flawed) could contain Black Holes? We shouldn’t.
And what do both of them have in common? [Character] creates [Something] which could potentially [perform relevant action]. But we don’t give them the powers to do so, because they’ve never displayed the ability to do so, and it would be wrong to assume they can do so.

Does that make sense? I’m not sure if NRG was the best example, but I’m moreso concerned on getting my message across in a reasonable fashion.
 
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We're just talking about creation feats. It's either he made something or he didn't.

There is a supermassive black hole in the Milky Way and all other galaxies' center responsible for their rotation and evolution.
 
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Yes, I know. My problem is that he’s never shown or stated to do so. No one ever states ‘Hey look you made a Black Hole!’, he never creates one first-hand and his only ‘feat’ for it comes from recreating the universe (unless someone somehow says that the previous feat doesn’t break almost every rule in the book). Problem with that is Ben didn’t get everything correct, so we have no idea if he did or didn’t make a Black Hole. And if we don’t know whether he can or can’t create a Black Hole, why would we give him the ability on the profile?

I mean, Ben 10’s Milky Way is very, very different from ours. For example, the One Million, 900 thousand + Alien Species that live in nearby solar systems inside the same galaxy as Ben, and there are at least, like, 5 Solar Systems we clearly don’t have irl. Heck, Pluto was destroyed, Mars used to be populated and there are literal Cobwebs holding entire Solar Systems in place. That’s Science-Fiction for you, after all. In addition, we can see the Milky Way Galaxy during the GG and Alien X fight, as well as other times during the show. I don’t see a Black Hole in there, although that could just be via perspective.
 
We aren't talking about planets or solar systems. We're talking about the standard structure of a Galaxy, which includes its central supermassive black hole.
 
Well, Dargoo_Faust is going to be away until mid-December, so we'll have to contact another mod.
 
Firestorm808 said:
Well, Dargoo_Faust is going to be away until mid-December, so we'll have to contact another mod.
Click to expand...
Ah, I suggest Andytrenom and/or Crabwhale. Maybe Lordgriffin is willing to help out as well? DDM and SomebodyData have been involved in previous Ben 10 threads as well.
 
Lol I forgot about this thread. I'll have to talk about the original series characters and low tiers soon.
 
Yup, the weakest application of physics manipulation possible. Not joking btw. (Since XLR8 works by negating friction in another WoG)
 
I can agree with Limited Friction Manipulation for XLR8.
 
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Yeah, problem being that XLR8 fell when he ran on ice IIRC. And that has to do with friction right? There’s also him not having to continuously move that could be an anti-feat to this. Unless we say he can actually manipulate friction to start and stop running.
 
Does anyone object to the Omnitrix having Limited Status Effect Removal?
 
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