Another CRT that Bites the Dust (High 3-A Yoshikage Kira + extras)

[StrymULTRA]

Essentially, I don't think that Yoshikage Kira's being 3-A is really accurate, but he should be High 3-A instead.

His justification is basically this:

Universe level Environmental Destruction with Bites the Dust (Killer's Queen final bomb which blows away time;[33] Blows up approximately one hour of time itself alongside its victims[20][21])

My problem here is that while it indeed ***** up a hour of the timeline to essentially travel back in time, it being assumed to be only 3-A essentially says that if Kira is in an infinite universe, he wouldn't be able to use it because of the place being too big for the ability being used. However, if we look at the Tiering FAQ, we know that:

• Higher dimensions can hold infinitely many slices of the lower ones within themselves due to them being an extra axis which repeats within itself infinite times the lower dimensional one.
• Temporal dimensions work like that as well.

Aka Kira shouldn't be just Universal, but High Universal due to his ability affecting a chunk of a higher dimension (that being time), which would include infinitely many universes within itself.

This is also supported from Araki claiming that time abilities affect all the space thanks to their range being essentially irrelevant due to them affecting all the world, supporting the notion of them being capable of affecting whatever size the spatial axis of the universe is, as long as they can affect time.

This obviosuly affects his range which also becomes High Universal, but also of the following ones other than Kira:

• Dio
• Jotaro
• Diavolo
• AU Diego
• Ringo Roadagain
• Dio Brando (JORGE JOESTAR)
• Kars (JORGE JOESTAR)
• Jotaro Kujo (Eyes of Heaven)
• Heaven Ascension DIO
• OVA Jotaro

 

[Chariot190]

I was gonna do this when i dropped Jodio (so in like 3 days), so yeah cool ok.

Or well, I get Diavolo because no shit, Kars and Ult Dio too (his BTD is actually Multi, affected at least 3 universes (technically at least 5), his profile dogshit tho). Ringo ig, etc.

I agree with all this except Time Stop having H-Uni range, like i get BTD and King Crimson, they **** with portions of time and thus infinite snapshots of it, but time stop is only a literal moment, but that might just be due to our time standards being fucky so ill let others figure that out and will remain neutral if Time Stop counts for H-Uni.

 

[StrymULTRA]

I agree with all this except Time Stop having Uni+ range, like i get BTD and King Crimson, they **** with portions of time and thus infinite snapshots of it, but time stop is only a literal moment, but that might just be due to our time standards being fucky so ill let others figure that out and will remain neutral if Time Stop counts for Uni+.

Uni+ is only if all the timeline is affected, we're talking about finite parts of it, so High Uni here for one.

Second I've already explained on Discord. Basically the ability is using a higher dimensional axis to affect all the other ones, meaning that whatever size the 3D part of the universe is, the time stop would still affect it due to it not affecting just the 3D section, but does it through manipulating the higher dimensional one, not to mention that the time abilities are generally put under the same range from Araki himself twice, thus saying King Crimson can affect an infinite universe but The World not is just ridiculous, no offense.

 

[Chariot190]

Uni+, High Uni, same thing, ya know what i mean. High 3-A.

And yes, but, wiki standards fucky, it is what it is, whatever gets decided for time stop im fine with, i just dont have an opinion either way.

 

[BoastJr]

I do agree with the notion that destroying time = Infinite snapshot of 3rd dimensional Reality.

I'll wait for others to comment but put me on agree for now

 

[Swordsaint456]

Wouldn't it be uni+ as he's blowing away/destroying time? Besides that agree

 

[StrymULTRA]

Wouldn't it be uni+ as he's blowing away/destroying time? Besides that agree

Uni+ is affecting all of the timeline, not just a little fraction of it. Don't ask me, standards do be like that.

 

[PlozAlcachaz]

This seems pretty straightforward under the current tiering system.

 

[Deidalius]

This seems reasonable, I agree.

 

[Swordsaint456]

Uni+ is affecting all of the timeline, not just a little fraction of it. Don't ask me, standards do be like that.

Kinda wack, but aight ig

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Kinda surprised this is actually given a tier. Not that I disagree I guess since it IS a time-related ability and does affect everything on the scale and effect it works on.

I agree.

 

[Shiraito983]

i agree

 

[KLOL506]

Agree with High 3-A, neutral with Time Stop, as the ability in general gives you Universal+ range unless proven otherwise and so far I'm not seeing any anti-feats against the Time Stop feats having that kind of limited range.

 

[StrymULTRA]

as the ability in general gives you Universal+ range unless proven otherwise

Huuuh? This from where comes from though?

 

[Lynieryz]

Agree FRA

 

[KLOL506]

Huuuh? This from where comes from though?

Couldn't understand the sentence. Could you rephrase that more clearly?

 

[StrymULTRA]

Couldn't understand the sentence. Could you rephrase that more clearly?

Since when Time Stop has Universal+ range by default? This is the 1st time I hear about that.

 

[KLOL506]

Since when Time Stop has Universal+ range by default? This is the 1st time I hear about that.

Oh, that. We had a CRT for Time-based abilities in general having Universal+ range about a year or so ago. Here.

Our Time Manipulation Page also states the following:

• In case of time stop sub-ability, unless users are shown or stated to have limits in terms of range, or that their ranges extend to areas beyond the universe, then they are assumed to be universal or higher by the virtue of affecting the very flow of time itself, thus all of time in the universe.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Oh, that. We had a CRT for Time-based abilities in general having Universal+ range about a year or so ago. Here.

Our Time Manipulation Page also states the following:

• In case of time stop sub-ability, unless users are shown or stated to have limits in terms of range, or that their ranges extend to areas beyond the universe, then they are assumed to be universal or higher by the virtue of affecting the very flow of time itself, thus all of time in the universe.

I don't see the + in your citation though bud, it only says that it's at least 3-A.

I am trying to argue for High 3-A here because of BtZ's stuff and Jojoverse's time abilities being comparable to it range-wise.

 

[Nierre]

Kinda surprised this is actually given a tier. Not that I disagree I guess since it IS a time-related ability and does affect everything on the scale and effect it works on.

I agree.

^ i was gonna say the same thing lol

i agree with the thread

 

[Lynieryz]

Agree FRA

Shouldn't Pucci be on the list?

 

[StrymULTRA]

Shouldn't Pucci be on the list?

He already has Universal+ range, meaning he is an exception here.

 

[Lynieryz]

He already has Universal+ range.

Is this range also accepted for C-Moon time manipulation?

 

[StrymULTRA]

Is this range also accepted for C-Moon time manipulation?

C-Moon very explicitly doesn't affect the whole universe but only 3 km in range, plus it never affected time unlike MiH.

 

[Lynieryz]

C-Moon very explicitly doesn't affect the whole universe but only 3 km in range, plus it never affected time unlike MiH.

minor Time Acceleration (Passively accelerates time in a localized area around him)

My problem here is that while it indeed ***** up a hour of the timeline to essentially travel back in time, it being assumed to be only 3-A essentially says that if Kira is in an infinite universe, he wouldn't be able to use it because of the place being too big for the ability being used. However, if we look at the Tiering FAQ, we know that:

• Higher dimensions can hold infinitely many slices of the lower ones within themselves due to them being an extra axis which repeats within itself infinite times the lower dimensional one.
• Temporal dimensions work like that as well.

Aka Kira shouldn't be just Universal, but High Universal due to his ability affecting a chunk of a higher dimension (that being time), which would include infinitely many universes within itself.

This is also supported from Araki claiming that time abilities affect all the space thanks to their range being essentially irrelevant due to them affecting all the world, supporting the notion of them being capable of affecting whatever size the spatial axis of the universe is, as long as they can affect time.

This obviosuly affects his range which also becomes High Universal, but also of the following ones other than Kira:

• Dio
• Jotaro
• Diavolo
• AU Diego
• Ringo Roadagain
• Dio Brando (JORGE JOESTAR)
• Kars (JORGE JOESTAR)
• Jotaro Kujo (Eyes of Heaven)
• Heaven Ascension DIO
• OVA Jotaro

According to your own arguments, C-Moon is affecting infinite versions of the area in which time was manipulated.

 

[StrymULTRA]

According to your own arguments, C-Moon is affecting infinite versions of the area in which time was manipulated.

C Moon isn't manipulating time, again.

 

[Lynieryz]

C Moon isn't manipulating time, again.

minor Time Acceleration (Passively accelerates time in a localized area around him)

 

[StrymULTRA]

Range in fact is only about "how far from the user it is", we don't see it affecting all the space around it unlike with the ones involved with the CRT, so C-Moon is excluded due to it being a clear exception that won't have the luxury.

 

[Lynieryz]

Range in fact is only about "how far from the user it is", we don't see it affecting all the space around it unlike with the ones involved with the CRT, so C-Moon is excluded due to it being a clear exception that won't have the luxury.

You are being contradictory to your own argument; This doesn't matter because through the higher dimension that is time, C-Moon is affecting infinite versions of the area that time was manipulated, If you disagree with this, give a valid reason and know that this supposed "valid reason", if it exists, will disqualify this crt entirely.

 

[StrymULTRA]

You are being contradictory to your own argument;

Here we go again with your trolling.

This doesn't matter because through the higher dimension that is time, C-Moon is affecting infinite versions of the area that time was manipulated

• By default, the range of time manipulation is considered universal unless explicitly demonstrated or specified otherwise. In the case of time manipulation through gravity manipulation, it will be presumed to have a localized range instead of a universal one unless explicitly stated or demonstrated. Similarly, when utilizing pocket dimensions for time manipulation, it will not be presumed to possess a universal range unless explicitly indicated or shown.

Take the L.

If you disagree with this, give a valid reason and know that this supposed "valid reason", if it exists, will disqualify this crt entirely.

Because unlike King Crimson or the World, the whole universe is clearly not affected, and the range is limited to just 3 kms, so saying it has infinite range despite the verse says that normal time hax abilities have no range at all and it has a stated limit in range is asinine.

 

[StekFence]

I think time stop does need high 3-A. Otherwise, that would imply that in an infinite universe, you could be outside the range of time stopping.

 

[Lynieryz]

Here we go again with your trolling.

• By default, the range of time manipulation is considered universal unless explicitly demonstrated or specified otherwise. In the case of time manipulation through gravity manipulation, it will be presumed to have a localized range instead of a universal one unless explicitly stated or demonstrated. Similarly, when utilizing pocket dimensions for time manipulation, it will not be presumed to possess a universal range unless explicitly indicated or shown.

Take the L.

Because unlike King Crimson or the World, the whole universe is clearly not affected, and the range is limited to just 3 kms, so saying it has infinite range despite the verse says that normal time hax abilities have no range at all and it has a stated limit in range is asinine.

Again irrelevant, Time in Jojo is accepted as a higher dimension and your argument revolves around that, when time was accelerated by these 3 kms by your logic C-Moon affected infinite versions of these 3kms.

I'll put it in your own words:

"C-Moon affected a chunk of a higher dimension (that being time), which would include infinitely many versions of these 3kms within itself."

 

[StekFence]

Again irrelevant, Time in Jojo is accepted as a higher dimension and your argument revolves around that, when time was accelerated by these 3 kms by your logic C-Moon affected infinite versions of these 3kms.

I'll put it in your own words:

"C-Moon affected a chunk of a higher dimension (that being time), which would include infinitely many versions of these 3kms within itself."

I don’t think that’s the same. Affecting time on a universal scale like how most time stands do it, is treated differently from on a minor scale

 

[StrymULTRA]

Again irrelevant, Time in Jojo is accepted as a higher dimension and your argument revolves around that, when time was accelerated by these 3 kms by your logic C-Moon affected infinite versions of these 3kms.

I'll put it in your own words:

"C-Moon affected a chunk of a higher dimension (that being time), which would include infinitely many versions of these 3kms within itself."

Stonewalling? I see.

Well, too bad because space-times that are lesser than universal in size aren't qualifying for 3-A in size are not granting anything, ergo even if you're right, it wouldn't grant it anything. Plus your argument is paradoxical, you're claiming that he indeed has 3 km range yet at the same time you're saying he can literally affect an infinite universe, when in my argument I mention later that only the stands who have irrelevant range qualify for this.

 

[Lynieryz]

Stonewalling? I see.

Well, too bad because space-times that are lesser than universal in size aren't qualifying for 3-A in size are not granting anything, ergo even if you're right, it wouldn't grant it anything. Plus your argument is paradoxical, you're claiming that he indeed has 3 km range yet at the same time you're saying he can literally affect an infinite universe, when in my argument I mention later that only the stands who have irrelevant range qualify for this.

This is also supported from Araki claiming that time abilities affect all the space thanks to their range being essentially irrelevant due to them affecting all the world, supporting the notion of them being capable of affecting whatever size the spatial axis of the universe is, as long as they can affect time.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Apparently both of us were wrong as C-Moon's 3 kms are only about the gravity manipulation, that isn't stated for the Time hax instead.

Plus people like Star Platinum, King Crimson or MiH itself don't have infinite range either in their stats despite their time-related hax actually does. So, kek.

 

[Chariot190]

For C-Moon, it doesnt manipulate time, it just manipulates gravity, which has an adverse affect on time. Its gravity manip is extremely localized though and the time manip is just a accidental byproduct on direct contact due to his unstable Stand.

Technically the same applies to MIH, but in his case his grav manip extends the whole universe as stated like ten times, while C-Moon's grav manip is 3km max.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Well, looks like I was right again, and C-Moon is the exception here and won't get High Uni range then.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Bump

 

[Saqphire]

Agree FRA