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DEATH BATTLE! Discussion Thread (All-time Death Battle Spoilers Alert)

AcidSilver said:
Does this ever actually happen? There's plenty of time that the opponent says that they had a challenging fight but of course it was hard for them since they lost. Pokemon has never taken into account how hard of a challenge the player actually had when it comes to dialogue.
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True, I think most of dialogue end with atleast "wow, what amazing Battle" so Is either them being Nice, or the protagonist didn't one-shot them with one pokémon, and they had actual battle. Most people choose not to bother and dowscale the characters to It.

I think there's dialogue If the protagonist of Sun and Moon loses on the Battle tree. Like, the NPC Braga that they won or smth. I think? I almost never touch Battle tree, I prefer to just catch legendary.
 
Megahax said:
1. Saying that Prime's strength isn't comparable to Hulk at his strongest states is just bad faith. All Father Thor can hit instantenous speeds, potentially even faster. I'm sick and tired of this argument with Molecule Man being "weakened" because you leave out the context that Owen being not in the right state of mind is him weakened when he's been in mentally unstable states before ike his fight with Kosmos; it's not known who's stronger than the other but both are within the same ballpark of power regardless.

2. I'm talking about Prime's soul being directly targeted, manipulated, and controlled which Sentry/Void can very much do. Prime overwhelming a Black Lantern Ring one time isn't enough to prove that he can just overpower Nekron. Plus, Prime's solar armor feeding him sunlight is just one big weakpoint for Sentry to take advantage of in destroying; it doesn't help that Sentry can passively take in ambient energy from anywhere in existence from the Negative Zone to the Microverse, or even from stars billions of lightyears away. He can even sap the energy off of other beings as well which Prime has been very vulnerable to multiple times before in Legion of 3 Worlds.

3. Okay this one's just blatantly out of context. The Darkest Knight never used any powers to manipulate Prime into giving him what he wants; that's a blatant misreading of the Death Metal Secret Origin comic. He was literally just telling him straight-up that he could have what he wants, the scene where we see him flying around in this idyllic world is just him fantasizing what he would have if he accepted the Darkest Knight's offer. Even if he was actually trying to manipulate him, it's arguable if the Darkest Knight was full-on trying in the first place when he very well has the power to control him outright.

4. Sentry scales to Hulk in general; Death Battle will just give him the Hulk comparisons regardless since they've done it before when they compared Kratos' and Asura's speeds.

5. Prime breaking out of the Speed Force does not imply he has infinite speed from that feat lmao. There's a better argument to be made that either the Speed Force spat him back out because he wasn't a speedster or that he punched his way out so unless he's explicitly stated that he ran/flew so fast that the Speed Force couldn't contain him, then I'll believe it. Either way, he'll still get the infinte speed argument due to being a Pre-Crisis version of Superman but that doesn't make him faster than Sentry when he can fly so fast that he makes Thor dizzy from it. They're just in the same league.

6. Wonder Man and Moonstone have made it very clear that Sentry losing control of himself is considered to be objectively worse than the Scarlet Witch's warping of Marvel's omniverse and continuity during House of M. Sure, he and the Void barely survived, but that doesn't mean that they were fully gone and that doesn't mean that if you were to kill him now in this diminished form that he'd be gone for good.

Also, what the hell are you talking about magic having plot manipulation. Sentry doesn't even use nor does he need magic to be this powerful and nowhere in my statements on this topic thus far have I ever mentioned this at all lmao.

7. Actually, Prime can very much possibly die and has come close to it before. He was depowered and at the mercy of Superman and Power Girl during the ending of the Sinestro Corps War and at the end of Dark Knights Death Metal: The Secret Origin where he (and I'm being generous with my interpretation here) barely survived fighting against the Darkest Knight and it was revealed that the Time Trapper had him whisked away to a pocket reality that superficially resembles Earth Prime.
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1. Come on man, flash literally says they couldn't hold him on the speed force. Speed force and flash scaling>Thor speed

2. Never said that, im saying that sentry has not fought the strongest hulk, he stalemated world breaker hulk who is not superboy prime level, that shouldn't be crazy to say. Fractured son and infernal are but not WB. Also it's important because MM (just like sentry) has a power that varies greatly on his mental state. The MM that fought sentry was not the same level as the time he fought the beyonder. Also good luck destroying the armor that tanks hits from the darkest knight and darkseids legion who gave current superman and time trapper problems.

3. My guy, we literally see prime shatter that false reality as he punches the darkest knight. Unless we are gonna argue and say for some reason it was a metaphorical showing.

4. Thats not how it works, he hasn't fought hulk post 2020 when he's gotten these crazy feats lol. Are we saying world breaker is comparable to fractured son?

5. Great, a statement that holds no weight because we never SEE how bad that apparently is. It's like the "stalemating Galactus" statement, no idea if he was fully fed or not. Also still affected by house of M which is the main point, he has capable of being affected by retcons

6. Barely survived? The darkest knight himself said they were equals and couldn't destroy each other, prime confirmed that he self sacrificed himself. Also in that first scenario, he would've ended up back on earth prime





2b37a2af-8f14-4c4a-8551-2126405a5ec9.png
 
Megahax said:
That still doesn't make Nekron's control over Roy total. He was still passively resisting it as much as he was being possessed. It's capricious to make the claim that Prime would scale to literally Nekron based off of him overpowering a Black Lantern Ring when those rings have been overpowered before by singular emotions like Kilowog wiping out the Black Lantern Airwave with one focused blast of his will. Hell, Hal Jordan was able to control Nekron while he was a Black Lantern and used him to take out Volthoom who embodied the entire emotional spectrum.
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Considering prime is above nekron, Its pretty safe to say it's valid.

If we are using this logic, how often does sentry instantly whip out the soul manipulation at the start of a fight or at all
 
Rozeyroze said:
1. Come on man, flash literally says they couldn't hold him on the speed force. Speed force and flash scaling>Thor speed

2. Never said that, im saying that sentry has not fought the strongest hulk, he stalemated world breaker hulk who is not superboy prime level, that shouldn't be crazy to say. Fractured son and infernal are but not WB. Also it's important because MM (just like sentry) has a power that varies greatly on his mental state. The MM that fought sentry was not the same level as the time he fought the beyonder. Also good luck destroying the armor that tanks hits from the darkest knight and darkseids legion who gave current superman and time trapper problems.

3. My guy, we literally see prime shatter that false reality as he punches the darkest knight. Unless we are gonna argue and say for some reason it was a metaphorical showing.

4. Thats not how it works, he hasn't fought hulk post 2020 when he's gotten these crazy feats lol. Are we saying world breaker is comparable to fractured son?

5. Great, a statement that holds no weight because we never SEE how bad that apparently is. It's like the "stalemating Galactus" statement, no idea if he was fully fed or not. Also still affected by house of M which is the main point, he has capable of being affected by retcons

6. Barely survived? The darkest knight himself said they were equals and couldn't destroy each other, prime confirmed that he self sacrificed himself. Also in that first scenario, he would've ended up back on earth prime





2b37a2af-8f14-4c4a-8551-2126405a5ec9.png
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1. By this logic, Batman should be faster than the Speed Force because he tied a line to Barry while he was using the cosmic treadmill and he was talking and interrupting him the whole time when they were going to the Flashpoint universe.

2. Hulk already had ludicrous strength from his shockwaves traveling through an infinite dimension. Sentry's battle with Genis-Vell lit up the whole Microverse to the point you could see it with the naked eye. They are in the same league. This is getting pointlessly granular for an episode of Death Battle.

Also, Prime's armor has been wrecked from mainline Superman or even the Teen Titans and the Legion before, Sentry can easily wreck it.

3. Prime literally snapped out of the fantasy he was in and dealt one final blow on the Darkest Knight before either dying or getting knocked out; either way, he was at his weakest and most vulnerable here.

4. Him not fighting Hulk since then doesn't mean that one or the other suddenly diminished in power. I'm not even comparing either of Bruce's alters because that's not the point here.

5. It's ironic you say this when a lot of Prime's ability to withstand the Black Lantern Ring's control requires a lot of assumptions to make him stand out when Kilowog easily destroyed a Black Lantern with pure will alone or Hal Jordan straight-up commanding Nekron to do his bidding lmao

6. This is the funniest argument you could've made because you've practically put yourself into a corner here:

So if Prime sacrificed himself with one final blow to the Darkest Knight, why didn't it put an end to him then? How come he's still alive and Prime isn't despite the Darkest Knight claiming that they're both equal in power? It's more likely that he was talking out of his ass trying to convince him to give in and join his side because it's either they end in a stalemate or Prime isn't as powerful as you think he is if he had to put all of his strength and life just to hurt the Darkest Knight, not even kill him.
 
Megahax said:
1. By this logic, Batman should be faster than the Speed Force because he tied a line to Barry while he was using the cosmic treadmill and he was talking and interrupting him the whole time when they were going to the Flashpoint universe.

2. Hulk already had ludicrous strength from his shockwaves traveling through an infinite dimension. Sentry's battle with Genis-Vell lit up the whole Microverse to the point you could see it with the naked eye. They are in the same league. This is getting pointlessly granular for an episode of Death Battle.

Also, Prime's armor has been wrecked from mainline Superman or even the Teen Titans and the Legion before, Sentry can easily wreck it.

3. Prime literally snapped out of the fantasy he was in and dealt one final blow on the Darkest Knight before either dying or getting knocked out; either way, he was at his weakest and most vulnerable here.

4. Him not fighting Hulk since then doesn't mean that one or the other suddenly diminished in power. I'm not even comparing either of Bruce's alters because that's not the point here.

5. It's ironic you say this when a lot of Prime's ability to withstand the Black Lantern Ring's control requires a lot of assumptions to make him stand out when Kilowog easily destroyed a Black Lantern with pure will alone or Hal Jordan straight-up commanding Nekron to do his bidding lmao

6. This is the funniest argument you could've made because you've practically put yourself into a corner here:

So if Prime sacrificed himself with one final blow to the Darkest Knight, why didn't it put an end to him then? How come he's still alive and Prime isn't despite the Darkest Knight claiming that they're both equal in power? It's more likely that he was talking out of his ass trying to convince him to give in and join his side because it's either they end in a stalemate or Prime isn't as powerful as you think he is if he had to put all of his strength and life just to hurt the Darkest Knight, not even kill him.
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1. Not even the same thing and you know it, Bruce didn't have the flashes funnel the entire speed force into him just to CATCH UP to prime.

2. By this logic, we can scale prime to every darkseid and anti monitor feat considering he one tapped both in death metal.

3. Sure, the fantasy the darkest knight showed him but sure

4. I'm saying you scaling sentry to a 2024 hulk feat (eternity chain) makes no sense when sentry hasn't fought that specific hulk that performed that feat.

5. No, it's pretty simple. We see prime resisted and overpower the entire emotional spectrum of rings while also resisting death.

6. This sounds smart until u realize prime did that to destroy the dark multiverse that TDK created, yeah I'm sorry but prime isn't the character u get to pull the "maybe he's not that strong" card on, let's stop it because I can bring up knull VERY easily
 
At This point, it doesn't even matter if the two can overpower eachother, they are dead even in stats at This point that is not relevant at all,

The actual point is, who can survive the other wincons more easily or at least pull of better,
And we are ignoring the biggest wincon of the battle, who is more mentally estable and who can legit leave his rival stay dead in the battle,

In that case, This is why i Say prime could win This, the Retcon Punch can properly rewritten/manipulate and even purify the story of a character powered by the darkness like what happened against a Superman created by the darknest knight, rewrited his world of darkness intro a peaceful and joyful one, Even if TDK was weakened at the moment against Prime, he properly said he cannot kill him otherwise, and prime Even destroyed his multiverse of darkness, purifying them.
If Sentry gets affected by the Retcon Punch, and seeing his history have changed to have a peaceful and normal life, he would still fighting?

And This is not a superstition, it would be Even in character still, given this is what Sentry always wanted, not being a menace for his loved ones and Friends how surround him.

That's why(like i said) he doesn't come back instantly in the king in black event, as he was finally in peace and feeling completed in the after life in Valhalla.
 
Rozeyroze said:
1. Not even the same thing and you know it, Bruce didn't have the flashes funnel the entire speed force into him just to CATCH UP to prime.

2. By this logic, we can scale prime to every darkseid and anti monitor feat considering he one tapped both in death metal.

3. Sure, the fantasy the darkest knight showed him but sure

4. I'm saying you scaling sentry to a 2024 hulk feat (eternity chain) makes no sense when sentry hasn't fought that specific hulk that performed that feat.

5. No, it's pretty simple. We see prime resisted and overpower the entire emotional spectrum of rings while also resisting death.

6. This sounds smart until u realize prime did that to destroy the dark multiverse that TDK created, yeah I'm sorry but prime isn't the character u get to pull the "maybe he's not that strong" card on, let's stop it because I can bring up knull VERY easily
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1. Dawg, you are literally trying to argue that Prime escaping the Speed Force = Wally West outrunning it instead of just simply punching his way out.

2. Congratulations, you just broke down powerscaling arguments to its very bare essentials.

3. Good, we can agree on that.

4. Because Hulk's thunderclap traveling throughout an infinite dimension is just as close as his First Firmament feat; they're still in the same ballpark of ludicrously OP.

5. So that means Roy Harper is just as strong as Nekron because he was able to passively resist the influence of the Black Lantern Ring?

6. Prime doesn't even know what the hell he does half of the time he's in a comic until very recently. He didn't even know that he was affecting the Dark Multiverse with his punches, and it's not like the Darkest Knight couldn't recreate it again with a whim.

You're arguing that Prime was on the same scale as the Darkest Knight, yet it cost him his life to destroy the Dark Multiverse that the Darkest Knight easily created. If you wanna bring up Knull, a cosmic being whose very being is specifically tied to the nature of the Void itself, then by all means go ahead. That still didn't put an end to Sentry outright considering his soul still persisted in the Celestial afterlife and he just chose to stay dead for plot reasons.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Why are Pokemon/Digimon guys beefing again, did I miss something
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Someone made blog where Red beat Tai.

AcidSilver said:
The day the VS sphere collectively realizes that 99% of “this character lit up the sky” type statements are not intended to be genuinely measured to say that they’re emitting 219437 Shit-a-tons of TNT is the day we achieve world piece.

Unironically? Light based feats are no different from sound based ones where the writer accidentally says that something is so many decibels that it would destroy the universe because they don’t know how decibels work. The only difference is that its much easier to write a nonsensical level of sound than it is to do the same for light/brightness.
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Honestly, the fact is that the feat is off screen "Necrozma absorbed all light in Ultra Space". There is no guarantee it means destruction and fully scaling to AP :V

ZeNoviceArtist said:
What if I choose to believe DC comics is only 6D in cosmology size?
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Teeeeeeechnically true but 5D in DC Outerversal because imagination and whatnot.
 
Definitelynotbatman0110 said:
Speaking of Yujiro, his glazers on Twitter are disgusting, making **** jokes about Tifa since she ended up in SF instead of Tekken.
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Devs said Tifa deal was planned since 2023 and according to the interview Maximilian Dood got, they were asked by others beforehand for Tifa, they simply chosen Capcom

Which further explains why Clive was chosen, his game was like the most recent one back then, Noctis previously was a success, so why not try again basically, people really think deals arent done very far ahead of time and its very recent
 
AcidSilver said:
In a game like Pokemon it kind of does. Does the route 1 trainer I went back to fight woth my team full of 6 Arceus’ suddenly scale because I beat them? You can’t even use level based scaling because every post game has random ass no name trainers with Pokemon higher leveled than the E4 and some champion Pokemon.
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Games like these its different how scaling works and its done, which is far more difficult
 
Megahax said:
If 5D in DC embodies imagination, what does 6D represent?
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Beyond imagination? Iirc. Sth abstract like that.

Also its funny to see claim that SentryPrime are even in stats when one side vehemently argues that no, Sentry does not actually scale to that level and is weaker than Prime.
 
Megahax said:
1. Dawg, you are literally trying to argue that Prime escaping the Speed Force = Wally West outrunning it instead of just simply punching his way out.

2. Congratulations, you just broke down powerscaling arguments to its very bare essentials.

3. Good, we can agree on that.

4. Because Hulk's thunderclap traveling throughout an infinite dimension is just as close as his First Firmament feat; they're still in the same ballpark of ludicrously OP.

5. So that means Roy Harper is just as strong as Nekron because he was able to passively resist the influence of the Black Lantern Ring?

6. Prime doesn't even know what the hell he does half of the time he's in a comic until very recently. He didn't even know that he was affecting the Dark Multiverse with his punches, and it's not like the Darkest Knight couldn't recreate it again with a whim.

You're arguing that Prime was on the same scale as the Darkest Knight, yet it cost him his life to destroy the Dark Multiverse that the Darkest Knight easily created. If you wanna bring up Knull, a cosmic being whose very being is specifically tied to the nature of the Void itself, then by all means go ahead. That still didn't put an end to Sentry outright considering his soul still persisted in the Celestial afterlife and he just chose to stay dead for plot reasons.
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Sure, u can say sentry didn't die but he sure chose to stay dead and that's a pretty solid win con for prime.

Prime did know? That's why he did it in the first place. It cost him his life that he willingly gave up, he wasn't killed by TDK.

I mean I can, we all know knull negative diffed sentry and it's a anti feat so bad people constantly use the "writer said sorry" stuff despite there never actually being a solid source about that.
 
TMaakkonen said:
Beyond imagination? Iirc. Sth abstract like that.

Also its funny to see claim that SentryPrime are even in stats when one side vehemently argues that no, Sentry does not actually scale to that level and is weaker than Prime.
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Because he doesn't, you genuinely gotta do chainscaling of like 10 different characters to get sentry to where prime is pretty easily

Sentry is busted as hell, don't get me wrong. Definitely outer solidly but that's not enough against prime
 
TMaakkonen said:
Also its funny to see claim that SentryPrime are even in stats when one side vehemently argues that no, Sentry does not actually scale to that level and is weaker than Prime.
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Even ignoring the elephant in the room (the Darkest Knight), Prime's general portrayal against Herald tiers seems a lot more impressive scaling wise since he used to be a treated as a "team buster" villain able to solo whole groups of heroes (the Justice Society, Titans, Flash Family, Green Lantern Corps, Legion of Super-Heroes, ect). Sentry taking on Ultron and World War Hulk in 1v1s is impressive but I don't think it automatically equalizes the strength category.

Also Sentry supporters seem to forget it was stated Hulk was holding back during the whole World War Hulk event so using that to scale him to Hulk's Peakest Peaks seems kinda iffy
main-qimg-25ac77c175ef377e88c0f831dee1bfcb-lq
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:
Even ignoring the elephant in the room (the Darkest Knight), Prime's general portrayal against Herald tiers seems a lot more impressive scaling wise since he used to be a treated as a "team buster" villain able to solo whole groups of heroes (the Justice Society, Titans, Flash Family, Green Lantern Corps, Legion of Super-Heroes, ect). Sentry taking on Ultron and World War Hulk in 1v1s is impressive but I don't think it automatically equalizes the strength category.

Also Sentry supporters seem to forget it was stated Hulk was holding back during the whole World War Hulk event so using that to scale him to Hulk's Peakest Peaks seems kinda iffy
main-qimg-25ac77c175ef377e88c0f831dee1bfcb-lq
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To be fair, the original Jenkins miniseries had the entire superhero community (and some of the villains, too) team up to battle against the Void, given how powerful he was expected to be after Sentry’s return. Bendis also wrote the Void as Norman’s secret weapon who was going to destroy all Asgard, but Bob had enough control to let Thor kill him before the Void could totally take over and destroy everyone (the What-If issue published after the Siege event showed what would have happened if the Void totally took over; the entire universe would have been toast).
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:
Even ignoring the elephant in the room (the Darkest Knight), Prime's general portrayal against Herald tiers seems a lot more impressive scaling wise since he used to be a treated as a "team buster" villain able to solo whole groups of heroes (the Justice Society, Titans, Flash Family, Green Lantern Corps, Legion of Super-Heroes, ect). Sentry taking on Ultron and World War Hulk in 1v1s is impressive but I don't think it automatically equalizes the strength category.

Also Sentry supporters seem to forget it was stated Hulk was holding back during the whole World War Hulk event so using that to scale him to Hulk's Peakest Peaks seems kinda iffy
main-qimg-25ac77c175ef377e88c0f831dee1bfcb-lq
Click to expand...
I mean, I do generally agree with Prime's portrayal being on the higher end of things, but Hulk in WWH was pretty much a team buster even while holding back, and Void itself has been treated as that level of threat.
 
It annoys the **** outta me knowing they're probably gonna scale every JJK character to MHS+.

I think it's acceptable for Modulo Yuji, Gojo and Sukuna when they get to him ig.

I let it pass with Mahito because Shiggy landslides Mahito and I suppose they want to make it a little less stomp-ish. But now I know they'll absolutely do this for the inevitable Jotaro vs Yuta and it's just ugggghhhhh...
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
It annoys the **** outta me knowing they're probably gonna scale every JJK character to MHS+.

I think it's acceptable for Modulo Yuji, Gojo and Sukuna when they get to him ig.

I let it pass with Mahito because Shiggy landslides Mahito and I suppose they want to make it a little less stomp-ish. But now I know they'll absolutely do this for the inevitable Jotaro vs Yuta and it's just ugggghhhhh...
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Gege truly damned the verse when it came to speed
 
Ain't the Overvoid meant to be like the comic page everything in DC takes place on? And then Grant Morrison or whoever showed up in that Animal Man comic as a meta-writer being all smug and millennial. Sounds like everyone under him is flat 2D and below to me. I doubt Grant could throw hands much in 3D, either, he'd just be like, "Ouch, well, that just happened," and then make another sparkly spaghetti cosmology chart.
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:
Even ignoring the elephant in the room (the Darkest Knight), Prime's general portrayal against Herald tiers seems a lot more impressive scaling wise since he used to be a treated as a "team buster" villain able to solo whole groups of heroes (the Justice Society, Titans, Flash Family, Green Lantern Corps, Legion of Super-Heroes, ect). Sentry taking on Ultron and World War Hulk in 1v1s is impressive but I don't think it automatically equalizes the strength category.

Also Sentry supporters seem to forget it was stated Hulk was holding back during the whole World War Hulk event so using that to scale him to Hulk's Peakest Peaks seems kinda iffy
main-qimg-25ac77c175ef377e88c0f831dee1bfcb-lq
Click to expand...
Doctor Strange is almost making the Omni-Man "I think I miss my wife" face on this page.
 
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