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STRONGEST One-Punch Man Discussion Thread!

@Entity
Click to expand...

I am responding in order:

my point isnt about that it could be finite. When i am saying squared, im reffering to an infinity being multiplied by itself.

i am not talking about his speed without the hax. Its his overall power level to be able to teleport then subsequently hold infinity multiplied by itself; holding back the resulting explosion of energy of serious punch squared suspended above earth. It implies that blast is strong enough to hold back saitama's full power at that moment, multiplied by itself.

The implication of speed came from the idea that to survive an attack with infinite power, you require infinite durability. And seeing as how garou can copy and did just that, why not infinite speed? He needs to dodge attacks with infinity behind them after all. So why does this imply that blast can scale? Because without invalidating every detail by claiming its a gag while suspiciously validating one singular detail to fit your interpretation, a saitama who is trying to stop garou in a life or death situation (for everyone else) even with 'normal' attacks is portrayed to be exerting more effort than what you claim to be an infinite level knock. Normal punches that garou copied and all the implications that came with it, and whom which blast scales to because he fought him.

No need to comment on the last one.

(There is so many evidence that either goes against your interpretation or supports mine at the same time already: blast scaling issue + ff and sonic scaling issue, seeing as how they are not immobile in the face of a MOVING 'not trying' void who apparently moves at infinite speed, implying they move at a finite number below infinite, which starts off at universal. They now feasiably scale to an unknown MFTL amount that is a percentage of infinity + no feat of actual infinite level power without dimensional manipulation as examples + portrayal of the knock being effortless + the concept of saitama attacking garou with normal punches in a life or death situation should be him logically putting more effort + saitama's exponential growth adding strength + the fight with garou where saitama grows while the latter copies, portraying them to be performing higher and higher feats of strength, that not once showed 1% of infinity, so based on your interpretation aren't actually showcasing anything meaningful. Just a meaningless series of events showing infinitely weaker feats of strength + consistent portrayal of saitama's strength to be below infinity + no correlation of the increase of strength to the ability to manipulate higher dimensions + other already established explanation that allows dimensional manipulation that could be similar to blast/void abilities + and most importantly, saitama shown to control his matter at a molecular level and go outside the flow of time, a feat outside the realm of muscle power physics, showcasing the capability for esoteric ability. Are you telling me that in the face of all this, your theory is the one that is most likely???)
 
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Next chapter is not gonna answer anything most likely.

Prediction is...

Some talking.

Flashback involving Blast and Void relationship with the wife figure that lasts half the chapter. Probably Void's sister. He's upset because Blast couldn't protect her and she died somehow. Made him internally dislike Blast and so he took God's hand.

They come back and talk some more. Blast shocked as to why Void would do this because of that. Void realizes he's been in the wrong/has been doing things for dumb reasons, and Blast makes the effort to have Void join him.

But before his words can reach him, Void escapes into the Hyperspace.

End of chapter.
 
Jirenoffical said:
I've read multiple texts about the first DS having more than 2 slashes, which "should be impossible" because Void has 2 swords. But thinked about it, it is just a feat that proves Infinity or Immesuarable speed is more acceptable than others. Because Hyperspace is out of the causalty of the universe, it also is out of the time flow. Hyperspace must exists in its own space-time, and is above the one of 4d dimensions, the universes. And the reason Void could do more than 2 slashes is simply because time doesn't matter to him when he's outside the universe, he could do 7 slashes, which would take time for him, but would happen in an instant in the universe.
At least thats what i got from analyzing the first Dimensional Slash.
Click to expand...
It says distance, size, and energy are irrelevant, tho. It says nothing about time.
 
NikolaTesura said:
Why is it that the aftermath we see has to be of a perfect perception of how the slashes occured? What I mean is, if the slashes are way faster than our perception of them (which in this case I believe they are, but sometimes we can see the slash incoming, and that's imo all done for visual flair. That's why it seems inconsitent), then there's nothing wrong here. If a civillian saw the aftermath of the slashes, they would all seem to be happening at the same time, since they can't perceive such speed. Just like how....
Click to expand...
prince-window.gif
 
NikolaTesura said:
Why is it that the aftermath we see has to be of a perfect perception of how the slashes occured? What I mean is, if the slashes are way faster than our perception of them (which in this case I believe they are, but sometimes we can see the slash incoming, and that's imo all done for visual flair. That's why it seems inconsitent), then there's nothing wrong here. If a civillian saw the aftermath of the slashes, they would all seem to be happening at the same time, since they can't perceive such speed. Just like how Fubuki couldn't see Genos and Sonic fighting. Or how one of the heavenly ninjas realized that Flashy was so fast in comparison to him, that all he could perceive were several afterimages connecting, as if Flashy was in multiple places at the same time. This clearly is very analogous to the scenario you are saying is inconsistent.

Saitama was the only one to perceive it. The fact that we see it as "twinkling star" means almost nothing. It could have been done for visual flair. You cannot know for sure. And I find it very strange that you say that it comes "from the level Void sees from his perspective". We have no evidence it spawned in the air. Literally none.

Yeah...? Or are you saying that he pulled space like a blanket over himself, completely disappeared, and STILL managed to be heard by anyone there(in this case, Blast)? Don't you agree that it makes more sense that he was heard afterwards if it was indeed more like a magic trick in order to disappear (so, he didn't teleport, just became invisible), instead of he actually folding space like that? He is a ninja, it makes perfect sense to use tricks like an illusionist, in order to deceive the opponent. And we know for a fact that he does use genjutsus, as he also managed to clone Flashy Flash's appearance in order to deceive Sonic.

So when Team Rocket from Pokémon disappear into the sky, the twinkle that goes after is not just visual flair to represent an object going far away/coming from far away, but instead, the twinkle actually happens? You might be the only person to interpret this type of visual trope like that.

Also, it's very clear how Flashy and Blast can sense the DS. It has been touched upon multiple times that it relates to sensing God's power, and I am very confused by you not knowing this. Some of us in this thread have also been subscribing to the idea that Blast is actually capable of dilating time when charging his teleportation, yes. It seems he can activate it faster than anyone else can do anything, as he was shown to do so in order to react to Serious Punch². I find it funny you used the above example to lowball his speed while completely forgetting he was faster than Saitama's Serious Punch. Not only that, Blast activated his teleport and caught Void mid-teleportation as well, and also managed to react to DS after it landed, activating his teleportation and still getting out of the way.

Blast doesn't need to teleport instantaneously, he only needs to activate his teleport instantaneously, as he seems to become intangible while in the process of teleporting (the DS seemed to phase through him instead of him dodging it).


"Why wouldn't we assume Void's powers match the being he got it from?" Meanwhile in the same page you linked, Blast goes on to say "As to what extent it ignores them..." and continues in the next page: "...depends on the capabilities of the subject"

The page you linked clearly provides evidence that God's subjects cannot use their powers to their full extent, as in the same panel, it shows God, implying only he has full capability. And yes, the action matters. You are talking about completely different actions, done by different beings. The fact that they draw from the same type of power means almost nothing. God is a being that seems to naturally belong to a higher dimension, while Void is simply accessing one. God may not even need to "look in a bubble", it may be something completely natural to him. And that's a type of ominiscience that would make sense for a God to have.

Void needs to use specific hand signals and other very specific abilities (such as the DS) in order to properly interact from/with a higher dimension, while God may be able to do all of this naturally, without relying on any gimmick. You have no way of knowing this, and assuming both of them interact in the same manner makes a lot less sense and is clearly a very risky assumption.

And weird that you said I'm the one comparing God walking and Void attacking, while.. you were the one who did that? You seem to be backtracking while writing, so you change your beliefs while you go and try and paint me as the one who proposed what you were defending earlier. No way you haven't noticed that you are doing this, right?

Sure, just saying something is irrelevant while it clearly relates to the subject obviously does make it irrelevant! Going by how you immediately assumed the twinkles were representations of physical objects instead of the easier to assume visual flair, and how you - and I still can't believe you really said this, but we'll get there - really did try to say that Void should've "power-slammed" the whole universe while landing after Saitama pulled him... I think it's very clear why I felt like I had to explain the purpose of that panel. At that moment, God was still sealed, so clearly that's not his full power being showcased, but at the same time, the seal was weakened. So it was a way to show how more powerful he was becoming.

Using that panel to try and judge how God interacts with reality makes no sense. We have no reason to assume that's the best he can do, or that it's the only way he can interact. Or even, that it has any relation to how Void does it. Yes, Void's powers derive from God, but God is a higher dimension being and Void isn't. They are intrinsically different, and it stands to reason that they would interact differently with reality.




The change in size happens because once Void isn't in a higher dimension, he becomes unable to use powers that ignore "energy, distance and size". That much is obvious. This is exactly why I was saying that he was not using such powers when pulling space over himself. It is consistent that he loses that ability while outside of the higher dimension, afterall Blast stated, in the page you linked earlier, that interference from the higher dimension where God is located ignores distance, size and energy. This means that unless Void is in a higher dimension, he cannot do such things.

And like I said, it was obviously meant to just be funny. You should not believe that Saitama has spatial manipulation because Void didn't destroy everything while landing. He didn't do that because it wasn't meant to. Like I said, if things were as you are proposing, Saitama would need to state that he was "Making sure he doesn't destroy everything while landing" or something like that. Makes no sense. Trying to give Saitama credit for every gag is the same as trying to remove credit for every gag. If you do this here, then you'll have to propose that the mosquito in the House of Evolution arc was faster than post-training Saitama.

Void wasn't meant to destroy everything while landing, nothing like this was taken into account. If Saitama does posess spatial manipulation, which I can actually indeed get behind, it is NOT because of this single instance of Void not destroying everything.


I want to understand your take on this - do you actually believe Saitama is a gag character? If you do, then you are being consistent, this is fine. If you don't believe he is a gag character and that he merely has some moments that are absurd and meant to be taken as a joke (like when he broke the fourth wall), then what I said still stands, because you would be contradicting yourself.

I myself do not believe Saitama is a gag character. I just think that, sometimes, he can do whatever he wants, in order to be funny. Since there's this whole narrative involving God, and that Saitama is "The abominable fist that turned against God", he is not a gag character and his powers are serious, as he needs this level of power in order to fight God.

There simply wouldn't be all this effort to justify his level of power, putting up God as an opponent that's capable of also manipulating reality, if Saitama was just meant to be an invincible gag character. Yes, Saitama is pretty much invincible in my eyes, but still not really a gag character.

There's plenty of other powerful, serious characters that have gag moments, like Whis from Dragon Ball or Goku, specially when he was a kid. Those moments do not necessarily reflect their actual abilities, but may be used to represent how much more powerful they are in a funny and absurd way, or as a way to poke fun at their seriousness. In fact, these two scenarios are usually what happen to Saitama. He's either made fun of (like not being able to catch the mosquito) or his absurd levels of power are showcased in a funny and ridiculous way (like the fart, or him entering phoenix man's dimension because he thought someone was talking about him being bald). He can definitely achieve many of the feats that are showcased in gag form, but not necessarily all of them. I definitely do not believe he actually has fourth wall awareness, for example.

If he had such awareness, we'd be hearing a lot more of this, and it would be a lot more central to his character.


Yeah, sure, I will concede on this. I shouldn't have said no one was arguing for this, as I do not represent everyone nor am I here long enough to judge how much people argued for immeasurable speed.



I was arguing about the slashing speed because I wanted to understand it better. At first I did not believe the slashing speed was infinite (and I still have many doubts, although some evidence was presented), but I became convinced Blast has some type of time dilation while charging his teleport, which makes it possible for him to teleport faster than pretty much anything or anyone. Because of this, the slashing speed is definitely faster than anyone else in the verse not named Saitama, and seems consistent with the thrusting speed.

(My reasoning is: Blast is faster than anyone else in the verse while charging his teleportation, and the only way for Blast to dodge the DS is by doing exactly that. Therefore, the slashing speed is faster than anyone else in the verse except for Saitama, but Blast managed to be faster than Saitama while charging his teleportation during the CFG fight. Therefore, this gives credence to the belief that the slashing speed may be infinite, and that the only reason Blast can dodge it, is because his charging speed is also infinite, and he may become intangible while teleporting. This also fits with the panel of the DS he dodged, in which it seems he charged faster, but didn't actually teleport faster than the slash, so it ended up phasing through him. This seems like the case because you can still see the initial point of his teleport in the middle of the slash, and he hasn't even reached his destination while the slash has already finished.

Therefore: Blast charging speed = DS slashing speed > Blast teleportation speed, however Blast becomes intangible while teleporting.

Blast is stated by Sitch to be able to manipulate space time, and his gloves generate gravitational force that has been calculated to equate to Stellar levels. Two stars colliding can dilate time, therefore when he smashes his fists together, the closer they are to colliding, the more time dilates.)

This becomes even clearer after Void states that Blast won't be able to dodge the DS anymore, since he can't teleport. This gives more credence to Blast's teleport speed being an outlier. Which makes sense considering how absurdly fast he reacted to the Serious Punch², as if he was orders of magnitude faster than both Saitama and Garou, which clearly wasn't true. If he was that fast, he could've bodied Garou easily, but he didn't.

Also, "projection sphere"? So you do not believe each sphere is a different universe? As if it's more like a crystal ball? If so, this page clearly contradicts this.
If you are just using that word because Void can see things on it, then ok. But it does sound like you're misrepresenting it a bit by calling it that.


In the end, he said it best. I should probably stop spending so much time trying to argue right now. There will be a lot more to argue later.

I find it very difficult to argue for something that seems obvious to me without being rude about it, but I am wrong in doing so. I apologize. Specially because I am not knowledgeable enough in order to justify acting like this. I tried to be more polite in this response.
Click to expand...
 
Phoenks said:
Next chapter is not gonna answer anything most likely.

Prediction is...

Some talking.

Flashback involving Blast and Void relationship with the wife figure that lasts half the chapter. Probably Void's sister. He's upset because Blast couldn't protect her and she died somehow. Made him internally dislike Blast and so he took God's hand.

They come back and talk some more. Blast shocked as to why Void would do this because of that. Void realizes he's been in the wrong/has been doing things for dumb reasons, and Blast makes the effort to have Void join him.

But before his words can reach him, Void escapes into the Hyperspace.

End of chapter.
Click to expand...
Unless........ Empty Void is angered enough so he- Oh who am I kidding, they might subdue him thanks to Saitama and it will be underwhelming.
 
Bump
ReusedOil said:
edit: I THINK I FIGURED IT OUT LET ME COOK

Wait, we might be looking at it the wrong way here. Instead of focusing on where the swords appeared or how fast it travells, lets instead consider what the sword's properties actually are. If we assume that the hyperverse dimension is outside the universe's causalty, and those swords carry over that ability instead of losing it once entering realspace... this means that any and all things that affect causalty, the swords simply ignore.

Time for example, affect causalty/a part of it. To say that time passed for the sword to travel, is to say that the causalty of the universe affected the swords.

Like yes we see the swords "moving", but we shouldn't think that for the sword, time is passing. Universe time doesn't apply to hyperspace. The swords are moving under their own "time". Like the swords could be moving at a snail's pace but from anyone elses perspective; real space; the swords move instantly.
Click to expand...
 
Phoenks said:
They come back and talk some more. Blast shocked as to why Void would do this because of that. Void realizes he's been in the wrong/has been doing things for dumb reasons, and Blast makes the effort to have Void join him.

But before his words can reach him, Void escapes into the Hyperspace.
Click to expand...
That’s literally not possible if void disobeys god he gets killed right then and there if he doesn’t follow his will void also wouldn’t just have a casual conversation nor realize anything that fast the dude is boiling with rage and was talking about torturing blast own son and was just about to murder all 3 of them before saitama intervened he ain’t getting talked out of his ways in 1 single chapter
 
darkphantom9805 said:
That’s literally not possible if void disobeys god he gets killed right then and there if he doesn’t follow his will void also wouldn’t just have a casual conversation nor realize anything that fast the dude is boiling with rage and was talking about torturing blast own son and was just about to murder all 3 of them before saitama intervened he ain’t getting talked out of his ways in 1 single chapter
Click to expand...
It's true. This won't be resolved easily. The moment the big G.O.D. senses what they're up to it's over.
 
ReusedOil said:
Bump
Click to expand...
Void would be attacking from a different dimension outside our (and multiple other) universes. Being outside of causality means Void can generate any potential universe state. His attack effects could come before the swing, his sword would both swing and not swing, he slashes the Earth while not slashing the Earth, etc., without the need to perform these actions.

But ignoring size/distance/time is exactly why I say there's 0 distance between Void and his attack point on the projection sphere. It doesn't travel through space to get to where he aims, but once his sword enters the universe, it does have to travel to reach its target. In this case, the only way someone would scale is if Void's sphere was looking directly at a person's body, in which case there would be no distance between their body and where the sword comes from. He'd be spawn camping, essentially.

He's outside of causality as far as not being bound by the space and laws of our universe. But remember, Saitama went back in time to punch Garou, which the manga states was a reversal of causality and completely unavoidable. I would imagine being outside causality as a whole would make Void's attacks impossible to dodge, but that isn't the case. He'd have Type 4 acausality, with the potential for Type 2.
 
If void dimension slash appear base on how zoom in he is to the target then this slash should be smaller
images

And we know that's not the case
One-Punch-Man-Chapter-201-Page-14-768x546.jpg

unless you believe flash and sonic are tall as the mountain
 
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Redcated said:
If void dimension slash appear base on how zoom in he is to the target then this slash should be smaller
images

And we know that's not the case
One-Punch-Man-Chapter-201-Page-14-768x546.jpg

unless you believe flash and sonic are tall as the mountain
Click to expand...
Part of that is just the shockwave created from the slash.
 
ReusedOil said:
am not talking about his speed without the hax. Its his overall power level to be able to teleport then subsequently hold infinity multiplied by itself; holding back the resulting explosion of energy of serious punch squared suspended above earth. It implies that blast is strong enough to hold back saitama's full power at that moment, multiplied by itself.
Click to expand...
He is not, his powers are, he is said ti be able to manipulate space-time If I remember well, so 4D hax, 3D power level
ReusedOil said:
why not
Click to expand...
why not of course
ReusedOil said:
suspiciously
Click to expand...
frfr
ReusedOil said:
how they are not immobile
Click to expand...
They would be at mftl+ speed too, they do not look like statues only when both Void and Blast are immobile, when Void is pinned down by Blast and when Blast is impaled by Void
ReusedOil said:
theory is the one that is most likely???
Click to expand...
yes
 
Redcated said:
If void dimension slash appear base on how zoom in he is to the target then this slash should be smaller

unless you believe flash and sonic are tall as the mountain
Click to expand...
Fisheye lens view + you can clearly see the horizon outside the center of the fish eye lens (which is the point where objects appear closest) is near mountain height. Given that there's cities worth of distance between the mountains on either side, that tracks.
 
Entity said:
He is not, his powers are, he is said ti be able to manipulate space-time If I remember well, so 4D hax, 3D power level

why not of course

frfr

They would be at mftl+ speed too, they do not look like statues only when both Void and Blast are immobile, when Void is pinned down by Blast and when Blast is impaled by Void

yes
Click to expand...
blast's powers that manipulate spacetime... that manage to contain inifities multiplied by itself, a previous smaller lesser version of said infinity able to already effortlessly casually manipulate higher dimensions. What is this logic

yes because a why not ofc is a sufficient rebbutal

Frfr? Really?

theres a panel of void jumping away before blast intercepted to fuse with him, wherein both ff and sonic are clearly moving. Let me guess, youre gonna move the goalpost and change your interpretation to fit your narrative?

Yes???

...I sent an essay long argument and you reply with a deliberately disengenious post that purposefully ignores half of what i said

Yup youre a troll. The hell why did nobody warn me???
 
AmongUsAboveUsBelow said:
Click to expand...

Thanks. Sometimes I just feel like I'm not writing in a very cohesive manner and I can't identify why, so I end up saying that "english is not my native language" to try and account for any mistakes I may not be aware of...

Eventually I will get a proper certificate. I have no idea what level of fluency I actually have. Maybe then I'll be a bit more confident that I'm not making any mistakes, haha.
 
AmongUsAboveUsBelow said:
It's true. This won't be resolved easily. The moment the big G.O.D. senses what they're up to it's over.
Click to expand...
Paging @darkphantom9805 too. That makes me wonder though; Blast thinks that Empty Void getting cured of his brainwashing could save him, so is it possible that he's possibly aware of God being able to turn his avatars into salt for disobeying? We are aware of the fact that Blast and his team have fought other avatars, as implied in Chapter 166, so I wonder if they have a strategy for that (Blast has been fighting God for two decades, so I'd imagine he's likely thought of this possibility too.)

In fact, given how God can already kill people from being unworthy of the cube's power transferal (which Blast already knows about because during the MA arc, he asked if Saitama and FF took the deal) then I'd imagine that Blast would also know that avatars could still die by God's hand in a different fashion.
 
darkphantom9805 said:
Nah we need to know what he is what are his motivations why he’s cares so much about saitama etc
Click to expand...
We know why he cares about Saitama in one aspect; in the Monster Association arc, Sage Centipede said that he and Evil Natural Ocean were summoned because of the "Abominable Fist that Counters God".

It's said earlier in the series/manga by Dr Genus (the guy who created the House of Evolution) that "God placed a limiter on every being", but we know that Saitama is the only person in the series who's broken it completely.

That's at least a baseline answer (Saitama broke God's limiter), but given how an infinite amount of parallel universes exist then there's a deeper reason for why God is keen on 'this particular Saitama'.
 
Naeem0304 said:
That's at least a baseline answer (Saitama broke God's limiter), but given how an infinite amount of parallel universes exist then there's a deeper reason for why God is keen on 'this particular Saitama'.
Click to expand...
I don’t think there’s multiple versions of saitama only 1 saitama can exist at any given time
 
NikolaTesura said:
Thanks. Sometimes I just feel like I'm not writing in a very cohesive manner and I can't identify why, so I end up saying that "english is not my native language" to try and account for any mistakes I may not be aware of...

Eventually I will get a proper certificate. I have no idea what level of fluency I actually have. Maybe then I'll be a bit more confident that I'm not making any mistakes, haha.
Click to expand...
Fret not. You wouldn't be the first non-native with a history of unwarranted performance anxiety. I've merely added two and two together leading me to think one such meme was in order and deserving of your attention. Now. Be that as it may, I do try to stay focused in spite of my, how should I put it... lack of strong disposition for someone else's inquisitions. Continued ego driven engagement and likewise overly unserious displays are not something I could take pride in.
 
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