Serlock_Holmes
He/Him- 3,651
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Does this thread need more votes or is this okay for mag 6?Attack Potency =/= Destructive Capacity
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Does this thread need more votes or is this okay for mag 6?Attack Potency =/= Destructive Capacity
my friend, unless those walls were for some reason 7C in durablility that punch should have went straight trough them, that's how it works, those kilotons of energy output shoud have gone somewhere and it was definitenly not on the wallsAttack Potency =/= Destructive Capacity
This doesn’t actually address my point. This kinda thing is very common in fiction yet we don’t go downgrading everyone and their mother to Tier 9 as a result.my friend, unless those walls were for some reason 7C in durablility that punch should have went straight trough them, that's how it works, those kilotons of energy output shoud have gone somewhere and it was definitenly not on the walls
what now? a 5B character punching a regular wall with full strenght and failing to break it is no longer an anti feat?
because it seems that's what you're arguing for
Don't try I have linked it twice already.From the Attack Potency page:
“A character with a certain degree of attack potency does not necessarily need to cause destructive feats on that level, but can cause damage to characters that can withstand such forces. As such it isn't proof of a low attack potency, if a character's attacks only cause a small amount of destruction.”
In that case, this shouldn’t even be an argumentDon't try I have linked it twice already.
Well this is why this thread is now at 7 pages without reason. Have messaged Patou but no idea if he wants to participate in this. We need one more vote to conclusively end this and then the scaling can be discussed.In that case, this shouldn’t even be an argument
neither does this, what isn't common is a guy having one tier 7 feat then other consistent tier 9 and tier 8 feats yet somehow the only that counts is the tier 7 one?This doesn’t actually address my point. This kinda thing is very common in fiction yet we don’t go downgrading everyone and their mother to Tier 9 as a result.
We do not equate Attack Potency to Destructive Capacity. It’s that simple
That’s the thing though. This take is literally going against the standards of the site itself. Also, the Tier 7 calc is a feat for a reason. Feats, by definition, are impressive displays.neither does this, what isn't common is a guy having one tier 7 feat then other consistent tier 9 and tier 8 feats yet somehow the only that counts is the tier 7 one?
you also failed to address my point, if his attack potency was even remotely in kilotons range a regular wall should have been annihilated, that is the definition of an anti feat
if you think otherwise, please elaborate why, just stating that it is isn't exactly an argument
i'm also quite iffy on this AP and detructive capacity stuff, based on your statement, can anti feats even exist?
like, can someone have a tier 7 feat then miserably fail to even destroy regular walls the entire series but that wouldn't matter at all because
Attack Potency =/= Destructive Capacity?
how and when is that even applied?
What Rusty said basically. Thanks a lot for the support.I see nothing that suggest AOE is important in this case in the feat that is linked above.
He stop an earthquake with his own physical strength, the AOE of what he did to stop doesn't matter.
90%+ of the time AOE is ignored.
It's quite common at basically everything in fiction like the reason Superman doesn't regularly vaporize most of the city in each of his fights.i feel like my common sens is being quesitioned as we speak, a punch containing literal kilotons of energy output failing to even go trough a single regular wall really seems like a valid anti feat...
i have no idea at this point, i had the impression that only applies when something like a ki disk contains the same amount of energy as a ki ball that blew up a island, but thr ki saw only cuts, they're equal in energy but the ki ball is an AOE attack, or the energy is concentrated on single attack vs an energy made to be AOE
not quite literally a fist containing the same power as a nuke going full power but doing nothing to a wall kind of AP =/= DC
i don't know at this point, i will just let it go i guess
This was the image that was the crux of the issue. That since the character that did the feat with the earthquake avoided that punch the feat of the quake is invalid. The character that did the earthquake feat is the strongest bar none in the series and by a long distance and even in this fight once he actually got serious he was toying with the small one.An example of AOE being used to show that a calculation is wrong would be...
Character hits a wall at a certain speed that gives Tier 8 KE, but the impact doesn't even crack the wall.
In this case, this character stops an Earthquake that has a certain amount of energy. We aren't even calculating his punch, we're just scaling him to the Earthquake he stopped. Him not causing massive AOE damage from his attack doesn't make the feat invalid, it's just fiction being fiction.
The Earthquake existed and he stopped it with a punch.
The only reason to not use the feat is to argue if it's an outlier, which I can't say due to my limited knowledge.
as in fiction makes no sens so everything goes?, it's just fiction being fiction.
It isn't you just have to follow weird rules. Keep everything that makes sense, go along with the verse and throw away the really weird stuff meaning statements like omnipotent or infnite power which show strenght but not to the level they are claiming.as in fiction makes no sens so everything goes?
then why even try to scale it?
with that logic, sacling this is pointless
This all literally fixed by differentiating attack potency and destructive capabilityas in fiction makes no sens so everything goes?
then why even try to scale it?
with that logic, sacling this is pointless
the physically impossible stuff that defy the laws of physics?It isn't you just have to follow weird rules. Keep everything that makes sense, go along with the verse and throw away the really weird stuff meaning statements like omnipotent or infnite power which show strenght but not to the level they are claiming.
No while legit supernatural hax are of course noted we also accept what the author wants. In Baki's case for example Yujiro straight up gets hit by lighting which you can't survive as an organism just due to the temperatures created. Or the fact that Yujiro can't get diseases or cancer. All those are impossible stuff that we take at face value. We also take at face value that he countered the power of the waves of an earthquake because the feat is quite clear.the physically impossible stuff that defy the laws of physics?
who decides what to throw away and what to keep?
fictional settings create worlds via world building and said worlds are made out of matter, it doesn't matter if the author has no knowledge on physical laws, whatever he makes on his verse, as long as it's made out matter. has to follow the properties and limitations of actual matter and can only alter it using supernatural abilities
that's just how it works,at least that's how i tought it works
appearently not
and we give him heat and electricity resistance, those are both supernatural abilitiesNo while legit supernatural hax are of course noted we also accept what the author wants. In Baki's case for example Yujiro straight up gets hit by lighting which you can't survive as an organism just due to the temperatures created.
You can survive lightning strikes, just not literally voring the entirety of the Lightning bolt for several seconds.No while legit supernatural hax are of course noted we also accept what the author wants. In Baki's case for example Yujiro straight up gets hit by lighting which you can't survive as an organism just due to the temperatures created.
Could you call Therefir and Damage35, please?An example of AOE being used to show that a calculation is wrong would be...
Character hits a wall at a certain speed that gives Tier 8 KE, but the impact doesn't even crack the wall.
In this case, this character stops an Earthquake that has a certain amount of energy. We aren't even calculating his punch, we're just scaling him to the Earthquake he stopped. Him not causing massive AOE damage from his attack doesn't make the feat invalid, it's just fiction being fiction.
The Earthquake existed and he stopped it with a punch.
The only reason to not use the feat is to argue if it's an outlier, which I can't say due to my limited knowledge.
Rubber has electricity resistance, and most metals have some form of heat resistanceand we give him heat and electricity resistance, those are both supernatural abilities
They are not exactly supernatural more like superhuman but yes. The point is he is a biological human in the end of the day. His proteins should have been broken down just due to the heat.and we give him heat and electricity resistance, those are both supernatural abilities
Yeah I mean most humans can survive it but don't they need some conductor nearby so the lighting doesn't just wreak their bodies? I don't think that's in any way survivable. Everything the fire touches is literally destroyed and is a fair bet if the person can regain total or even limited mobility. All it did for Yujiro was give him a new hairstyle.You can survive lightning strikes, just not literally voring the entirety of the Lightning bolt for several seconds.
Nah the truely supernatural thing here is that he for some reason when he got hit by the lightning he absorbed the whole entire yield of it (that's not at all how it works), but that's how it was outright stated on panel, so yeah.They are not exactly supernatural more like superhuman but yes. The point is he is a biological human in the end of the day. His proteins should have been broken down just due to the heat.
Uh, the ground. Anything your touching. Any soles. Clothes. Like Yujiro only has it cause he ate the bolt in it's entirety for several seconds lolYeah I mean most humans can survive it but don't they need some conductor nearby so the lighting doesn't just wreak their bodies? I don't think that's in any way survivable. Everything the fire touches is literally destroyed and is a fair bet if the person can regain total or even limited mobility. All it did for Yujiro was give him a new hairstyle.
Yujiro probably made lighting fall in love with him knowing the mangaka.Nah the truely supernatural thing here is that he for some reason when he got hit by the lightning he absorbed the whole entire yield of it (that's not at all how it works), but that's how it was outright stated on panel, so yeah.
Yeah yeah you are right.Uh, the ground. Anything your touching. Any soles. Clothes. Like Yujiro only has it cause he ate the bolt in it's entirety for several seconds lol
yes, those materials both have a form of resistance towards them, humans don'tRubber has electricity resistance, and most metals have some form of heat resistance
Yeah but to be honest it's not even that good anyways. Verse has plenty of M calcs.Probably would be better to deal with this in another thread considering how long this have become, but if the impossible part Yujiro stopping the earthquake (the fact that an earthquake can't be stopped with a punch and instead would get worse) is getting ignored, then shouldn't the same be done with the feat of turning coal in diamond? Previously was removed from the fact that it would be impossible to do that with pressure alone as heat is needed for such thing, but if we are ignoring the impossible part of the earthquake then the same should happen with the diamond feat.
the diamond one was discardedProbably would be better to deal with this in another thread considering how long this have become, but if the impossible part Yujiro stopping the earthquake (the fact that an earthquake can't be stopped with a punch and instead would get worse) is getting ignored, then shouldn't the same be done with the feat of turning coal in diamond? Previously was removed from the fact that it would be impossible to do that with pressure alone as heat is needed for such thing, but if we are ignoring the impossible part of the earthquake then the same should happen with the diamond feat.
The verse page only list a single Class M feat, which is the coal turning to diamond.Yeah but to be honest it's not even that good anyways. Verse has plenty of M calcs.
This is exactly the problem. We ignore logic and since one exception has now been made, then there are no boundariesProbably would be better to deal with this in another thread considering how long this have become, but if the impossible part Yujiro stopping the earthquake (the fact that an earthquake can't be stopped with a punch and instead would get worse) is getting ignored, then shouldn't the same be done with the feat of turning coal in diamond? Previously was removed from the fact that it would be impossible to do that with pressure alone as heat is needed for such thing, but if we are ignoring the impossible part of the earthquake then the same should happen with the diamond feat.
they have quite a bit of accepted class M clacs, they just need a CRT to implement themThe verse page only list a single Class M feat, which is the coal turning to diamond.