Improving contents of Powers & Abilities pages

[Antvasima]

Eficiente:

Is that the blog post that I browsed through earlier, in which you argued for getting rid of several important powers and abilities pages? If so, I think that it would be a massive effort for negative gain, so I am against it.

 

[Antoniofer]

Ant, few of these issues are valid and making the appropiated adjustments could improve few things; we can't just ignore potential issues for reasons like "people wouldn't like it". The least we can do is discuss about it.

 

[Eficiente]

Is that the blog post that I browsed through earlier, in which you argued for getting rid of several important powers and abilities pages? If so, I think that it would be a massive effort for negative gain, so I am against it.

Just 3, and there's also the fact that if they do need to be removed then the faster that happens the less work it would take.

 

[Antoniofer]

We can start revising type 2 Acausality, it does not really have sense or is extremely specific; for the only example, is not like Alin X doesn't exist in the past or future, is just like, if there's two or more Ben in the same timeline, Alien X can only be used one at the time, to confirm it actually doesn't exist in neither past or present someone have to time travel (someone that isn't Ben) and then Ben being unable to use Alien X.

 

[Antvasima]

I meant that I think that I read a sandbox post in which Eficiente argued for deleting several powers and abilities pages. Perhaps I am misremembering or mixing things up though.

 

[Antvasima]

Just 3, and there's also the fact that if they do need to be removed then the faster that happens the less work it would take.

Definition improvements are one thing, but removing the reactive power level page entirely, for example, seems like a massive unnecessary effort for negative gain, at a time when we are already unable to finish other important wiki revision tasks.

 

[Bobsican]

Well, it's clear that Efi won't do all of them at once, so each one can just be done at a proper time. They also wouldn't be counterproductive as these changes would help keep pages accurate and easier to understand.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, it is just the deletion of important pages that I am against.

 

[SamanPatou]

I didn't read the entire sandbox, but what I saw is at least reasonable, although each argument would require its own thread, none of those things can't be handled nor discussed here.

Btw, I have applied the new image to sense manipulation.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Thank you for helping out.

 

[Antoniofer]

Shouldn't Heat Manipulation be named Thermal Manipulation? Heat is generally definied a elevated hotness, high temperature, intensity of warmth, etc, and the very page writes "the ability to manipulate the thermal energy", that would be both heat and cold.

 

[Bobsican]

Shouldn't Heat Manipulation be named Thermal Manipulation? Heat is generally definied a elevated hotness, high temperature, intensity of warmth, etc, and the very page writes "the ability to manipulate the thermal energy", that would be both heat and cold.

I agree on this.

 

[Antvasima]

That is probably fine, yes, but a large part of out visitors might not know what Thermal means, and in addition, it would preferably require renaming the links to it from several hundred pages, so it does not seem worth the trouble, given the very limited payoff.

 

[Antoniofer]

I'm pretty sure that most people are familiar with the term temperature, and it shouldn't be difficult to associate with thermal.

Plus, isn't there a command used to change this kind of things? Like, replace the word heat with thermal?

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I suppose that it could likely be handled via the MassEdit program in the bot accounts of @AKM sama @Elizhaa or @Promestein , but I have already asked Promestein for help with another important mass-editing task, and Elizhaa and AKM have been helping out a lot lately, so I do not want to overtax them.

 

[Bobsican]

Well, it doesn't take that much time to replace the name from "[[Heat Manipulation]]" to "[[Thermal Manipulation]]" with a bot, I could even do it in five minutes if I had a bot in this wiki and all.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, let's wait and see if the people I notified are interested in helping out.

 

[Starter_Pack]

That is probably fine, yes, but a large part of out visitors might not know what Thermal means, and in addition, it would preferably require renaming the links to it from several hundred pages, so it does not seem worth the trouble, given the very limited payoff.

I have a good compromise. I do think Thermal Manipulation is a better name overall, we can still refer to it as Heat Manipulation in the beginning of the profile. In essence, simply write:

Thermal Manipulation (also known as Heat Manipulation) is...

Does this seem acceptable?

 

[Elizhaa]

The suggestion looks acceptable, Starter Pack.

If the page is rename, I can help to apply the change with my bot.

 

[Bobsican]

I have a good compromise. I do think Thermal Manipulation is a better name overall, we can still refer to it as Heat Manipulation in the beginning of the profile. In essence, simply write:


Does this seem acceptable?

The rename is being done in the first place out of "Heat" not being a proper way of relating to thermal stuff, and the page already does a good enought job at detailing what it covers (which not only includes temperature, but heat as well, as the page describes), someone not knowning what "Thermal" means can just look it up, we're not Wikipedia to have an explanation for even this kind of vocabulary used, and this is like renaming Fire Manipulation to Smoke Manipulation then explain that the power covers Smoke Manipulation and Fire Manipulation, which is just unecessarily confusing and overall counterproductive to what this aims to do.
So it would be best to just keep it as Thermal Manipulation and nothing else.

 

[Antvasima]

There are almost 3000 pages that would need to have their links to the page updated, which seems like a massive amount of effort:

Pages that link to "Heat Manipulation" | VS Battles Wiki | Fandom

vsbattles.fandom.com

Perhaps Starter Pack's solution combined with a redirect link would be better in this case?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

This change seems like it'd help none and may even confuse some folks trying to add Heat Manipulation to their profiles, but overall I'm neutral.

 

[Antvasima]

Bambu makes a good point. It would be a massive revision for limited gain.

We could also simply create a redirect page from Thermal Manipulation, and state that both names are acceptable in the Heat Manipulation page.

 

[Antoniofer]

Ultimately the decision is up to you, but I consider more appropriated for a power's description to fit with its name's definition (aka, it manipulates x, then it should be named x manipulation).

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

The more universal definition would actually be Temperature Manipulation; Thermal and Temperature mean the same thing; though the former is more scientific while the latter is more simplistic. Calling something Thermal manipulation as opposed to Temperature manipulation would be similar to taking Water manipulation and renaming it to H2O manipulation.

But I actually think Temperature Manipulation is what actually fits best. Though Bambu does make points about a of edits with very few help.

 

[Antvasima]

Ultimately the decision is up to you, but I consider more appropriated for a power's description to fit with its name's definition (aka, it manipulates x, then it should be named x manipulation).

Yes, but the problem is just that it would take almost 3000 edits to fix this issue in the way that you want, and we have other more important unfinished revision projects that may need Elizhaa's help instead.

 

[Bobsican]

Yes, but the problem is just that it would take almost 3000 edits to fix this issue in the way that you want, and we have other more important unfinished revision projects that may need Elizhaa's help instead.

I'm sure an automated wiki bot edit could do it in a few minutes, there shouldn't be too many links that use fancier code like "|Heat Manipulation]] over "[[Heat Manipulation]], and it wouldn't requite too much time to find the pages to adjust as it can just be done by filtering with the "Heat Users" category.

 

[Antvasima]

I'm sure an automated wiki bot edit could do it in a few minutes, there shouldn't be too many links that use fancier code like "|Heat Manipulation]] over "[[Heat Manipulation]], and it wouldn't requite too much time to find the pages to adjust as it can just be done by filtering with the "Heat Users" category.

Is this correct @Elizhaa ?

 

[Antvasima]

It is likely more practical to copy parts of the list that I linked to above than use a category though.

 

[Bobsican]

Well, I'm assuming AutoWikiBrowser is being used.
You can also filter by what links to the "Heat Manipulation" page, if desired, BTW, and the app straight up makes the list for you to do the automated edits afterwards (in this case, replacing [[Heat Manipulation]] with [[Thermal Manipulation]]) by just clicking a button after configuring what to edit as said before.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I mentioned another suggestion above as a preferred rename than thermal manipulation.

 

[Bobsican]

Well, TBH I support more Temperature Manipulation as the rename to use, it's easier to understand and more direct.

 

[Antvasima]

Thermal Manipulation sounds more professional than Temperature Manipulation i.m.h.o.

 

[Shmooply]

While it does sound more professional, I think Temperature Manipulation is more fitting, as temperature is a pretty common word that everyone knows.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. What do other staff members here think?

 

[Promestein]

Temperature Manipulation sounds fine.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. We can go with that then.

 

[AKM sama]

I am also fine with temperature manipulation.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Bambu makes a good point. It would be a massive revision for limited gain.

We could also simply create a redirect page from Thermal Manipulation, and state that both names are acceptable in the Heat Manipulation page.

I like this take, honestly. If we're going to say "(Also known as Heat Manipulation)" anyways, I think the reverse can be done instead. Leave it as Heat Manip, and then say "(Also known as Temperature Manipulation)" and be done with it. The objective is achieved and the work is reduced to adding a small handful of words to the existing page, and doesn't cause any confusion for users trying to add abilities to their pages.

 

[Antvasima]

I like this take, honestly. If we're going to say "(Also known as Heat Manipulation)" anyways, I think the reverse can be done instead. Leave it as Heat Manip, and then say "(Also known as Temperature Manipulation)" and be done with it. The objective is achieved and the work is reduced to adding a small handful of words to the existing page, and doesn't cause any confusion for users trying to add abilities to their pages.

What do the rest of you think about this?