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Zelda 4-C upgrades (Or downgrades now)

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Been saying that for so long. ovo

He also potentially have a feat similar to Ganon's, with the Stone Tower flipping via Light Arrows.

He at the least scales to 1/4th of Majora's moon bust with at least the Giant's Mask and Light Arrows anyway (both are used against Twin Mold, who can withstand attacks from Giant Link, who outright uses the power of the giants).
 
The same magic Ganon uses to make an endless night must be the same that he attacks with for it to scale to his conventional AP attacks.

If it's just an "endless night" spell, I would be hard pressed to agree with it scaling to his other magical attacks.

Not to mention the exact mechanics behind it seem vague at best, almost like we're assuming he's stopping the planets rotation for the sake of wank. If he really did, why is Hyrule not suffering hurricane forces as a result? Why can't it just be magic that makes the sky black?
 
Isolated water spouts is not the same as global catastrophe. Stopping the earth entirely would mean wiping out most of the playable areas in Wind Waker.

Not to mention it only happens when Link approaches via boat... yeah seems like a magic spell specifically to black out the sky. No real evidence Ganon is suddenly shifting the earth/sun that fast other than it being a possible explanation, a high-end one.

Lack of concrete explanation + wank = these suggested upgrades
 
Oh if we're going by that, that's a usual case of fiction being well... fiction. Read the above comments on why applying rl logic into a fantasy setting just doesn't work.

What do you mean this only happens when Link approaches via boat? What relevance does this hold?
 
Yes, but if there are better explanations (aka mine of him just blackening out the sky) that don't raise major contradictions (aka the planet not being thrown into chaos whenever he supposedly does what you're suggesting) then you take it.

Link approaching via boat is significant because as he does it immediately turns to night. If we are expected to believe Ganon is shifting the planet that fast, everyone should be thrown off.
 
The answer to your claims is the same one I gave Konaguna.

This is fiction, and the effects of Physics hardly ever apply in fiction, saying something is impossible because "it isn't physically possible" is ridiculous because with that logic - no character can move faster than light because it would have "physical ramifications".

I do think him just casting a curse that darkness the sky does take less severe steps in logic than him physically stopping the planet's rotation, however.
 
@Warren Valion

Yes, but if there are better explanations (aka mine of him just blackening out the sky) that don't raise major contradictions (aka the planet not being thrown into chaos whenever he supposedly does what you're suggesting) then you take it.
 
Stone Tower Flip

For those interested in the feat, there it is. The Light Arrows are capable of flipping the tower, and potentially the planet, as the let's player discussed you could even see the moon is upside down if you came on the third day and do it (will try to find a video later).

Edit: The Let's player outright showed the moon upside down around the 10:50 mark.
 
LephyrTheRevanchist said:
Stone Tower Flip
For those interested in the feat, there it is. The Light Arrows are capable of flipping the tower, and potentially the planet, as the let's player discussed you could even see the moon is upside down if you came on the third day and do it (will try to find a video later).
Click to expand...
I think this should be moved to a different thread - derailing and all that.
 
@LephyrTheRevanchist

The effect is only ever achieved once Link hits that specific object, not when he uses them in general. That leads me to believe it's a specific interaction with the two, and not indicitive of AP.

Besides it's clearly just perception/spatial manipulation, the planet itself flipping is such a strech and a high-end assumption.
 
Let's stay on topic here, Majoras Mask Links tier can be discussed in another thread. For now let's focus on the forsaken fortress stuff and the ratings for our High 5-A characters.
 
I can't stay on forever but everyone here (admins included!) have some blatant issues with playing devils advocate and trying to find lower ends of feats given to them. I'd like to be informed of general consensus before anything goes through, if that's not too much to ask.

This feat alone is probably un-calculatable, but I will argue night and day that it is not the sun/earth/moon rotating as much as it is a magic spell.

The only way I think I can concede that it's true is if there is a direct statement as such, that Ganon is literally moving them with the same magic powers he attacks Link with.
 
Made it here.

Magic in Zelda scales. Ganon cana tank his own magic and vice versa. That's why most spells are generally scaled around. In terms of "blackening the sky" I honestly have no idea why we'd even consider that. They call it an endless night and you can still outright see that there's a storm over the sky, not that the sky itself has blackened. No the storm is not causing the blackening even the biggest rain storms won't make it outright night time.
 
Now whether or not Ganon moved the sun/moon/planet or they move due to game mechcanics automatically making it night to set up a specific atmosphere is up for debate.
 
Anyway, will reiterate my position regarding this:

The endless night it's called specifically a curse in WW. This would make it not scale directly to Ganon's AP imo, but he would still have the tier, just not combat applicable (why would this specific spell/curse scale to his other stats?).

The Forsaken Fortress stuff is just non sensical; the moment Link approaches, Ganon makes it instantly night time. Yet when Link for whatever reason leaves, he makes it day time again. This also happens in OoT for Castle Town. Even if we assume he is indeed rotating the Earth/Sun, etc, it wouldn't make sense to say he does it constantly, but instead casted a spell that makes it so that specific area of the map is shrouded in darkness.

However, the must likely explanation is that it is done to create a specific mood for the place from a videogame perspective, not disimilar to make it rain on a movie fight scene.

However, I'm not gonna push this from here. If it's decided that it would still be scalable, I support the "at least High 5-A, possibly 4-C".
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Anyway, Triforce brought more information about Calamity Ganon's feat so I still think 5-A is reasonable for those who scale from him. I'm more neutral on accepting Endless night as a 5-C, High 5-A, or 4-C feat, but I guess something like this. At least 5-A, possibly High 5-A to 4-C.
Click to expand...
I'm fine with this.

EDIT: "why would this specific spell/curse scale to his other stats?"

Because both have the same source of power, the Triforce of Power.
 
GiverOfThePeace said:
Made it here.
Magic in Zelda scales. Ganon cana tank his own magic and vice versa. That's why most spells are generally scaled around. In terms of "blackening the sky" I honestly have no idea why we'd even consider that. They call it an endless night and you can still outright see that there's a storm over the sky, not that the sky itself has blackened. No the storm is not causing the blackening even the biggest rain storms won't make it outright night time.
Click to expand...
If I blackened the sky, people around the world would call it an "endless night". This does not mean I moved the sun and earth.

In WW it honestly seems like game mechanics fast-forwarding time considering literally no character makes mention of it, unlike in BotW and the blood moon.
 
The endless night isn't done via moving the sun or earth, that's a different feat. This endless night is him halting the rotation of the planet.

Again, the endless night is mentioned, the feat you're thinking of is a different one.
 
Breath of the Wild merged all three timelines into one and technically takes place after every other Zelda game according to Hyrule Historia iirc.
 
I swear I thought Zelda scaling was easy but I feel that the feat should be inconclusive as we need more context to consider it a set in stone feat
 
Zelda has the full Triforce in BotW.

We discussed in a past thread that she did not had it.

Is it shown or stated that Calamity Ganon is weaker than TOP Ganondorf?

Calamity Ganon was stated to dangeruous due to his nature and able to threaten the world, there is a statement that says that he has given on reincarnation and became more powerful that the other Ganon's, but that was a minstranlation and in the original japonese version she says a completely different thing, and him lacking the triforce of power led to believe that he was weaker than ToP Ganondorf.

Why is Young Link High 6-C? Shouldn't be High 5-A for having the Triforce of Courage?

He never activated the ToC after he was send back in time nor during Majora Mask, he has it but its dormant in him.

Ganondorf should be 4-C with Zant's feat.

Zant feat is an illusion or he brought himself and Link in Sealed Hyrule Castle.

Note: The High 6-C's are supposed to be downgraded to 6-C sans the Majora Mask bosses since there is no correlation to them, there is no connection with Ganon and Majora strongest minions.
 
The Zant feat was shown to be a legitimate feat.I debunked this before as it's not BFR as Link's sword is still glowing which it only does when in the Twilight realm and it can't be an illusion as that would be very unlikely as the pots and items in them are all physical items which would make no sense if Zant made them all illusions.Its most likely RW as the size of Zant's throne room where you fight him doesn't equate the size of Hyrule Castle and fields.It was closed due to the outlier feat because of this thread and the other one on Ganondorf's feats were taking place
 
Creating a dimension with a sun is at least High 4-C, but Zant is no comparable to Majora nor Demise.
 
Well not really there's nothing that says Demise is above the TOP or has it ever been shown and with Majora we can't really determine as he doesn't have any feats other than his own
 
What's saying that Zant's feat isn't done casually as Zant seemed to give no effort when warping the realm as well he just moved his arms around both feats are comparable which would mean the TOP is similar to Demsie in power
 
Anyway that is deraling the thread, which is about giving a possibly 4-C to Ganondorf.
 
I didn't even say it wasn't done casually, I was just pointing out that High 4-C isn't the end all be all for Demise, it's just a stupidly casual feat he has so Zant wouldn't suddenly scale directly to Demise cause he wouldn't need to. (Let me note I agree with 4-C Zant, I think you think I wasn't)
 
GiverOfThePeace said:
I didn't even say it wasn't done casually, I was just pointing out that High 4-C isn't the end all be all for Demise, it's just a stupidly casual feat he has so Zant wouldn't suddenly scale directly to Demise cause he wouldn't need to. (Let me note I agree with 4-C Zant, I think you think I wasn't)
Click to expand...
Oh sorry,I get what you mean now
 
And on the topic of Zant's feat it could possibly lead to a 4-A feat if its not a complete outlier which I don't think it would as it scales to beings more powerful
 
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