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Yu-Gi-Oh! General Discussion

Zencha9 said:
@PsychoSSF2 that reminds me a made a valon draft and like it's like done the only stuff that he needs is the standard monster powers
(which are probably gonna take a while since i would need to explain the cosmology and how spirit energy works all the way from Ba and shadow games to duel energy and ener-D)
Click to expand...
Your link to your valon draft seems to be a link to an image of a BetterTTV emote.
 
Zencha9 said:
@PsychoSSF2 that reminds me a made a valon draft and like it's like done the only stuff that he needs is the standard monster powers
(which are probably gonna take a while since i would need to explain the cosmology and how spirit energy works all the way from Ba and shadow games to duel energy and ener-D)
Click to expand...
Aromor Deck
Click to expand...

At first, I wonder if it might be some weird localization or maybe a pun on romance or something, lol.

Also, Anime Yugioh humans should be 9-B because:

1. Yugi-less Pharoah survived falling off that bridge & that was a 9-B feat.
2. Joey was able to punch Yugi-less Pharoah to the ground, so he scales.
3. After Serenity's eye operation, we see at the beach that Tristan is able to launch Joey with a punch, so he scales. (Plus they do a lot of stuff together.)
4. It's more of LS, but Kaiba, IIRC, can hold back Joey bare-handed.
5. Kemo survives being thrown by Tristan, & knocks him to the ground with a kick.
6. Kaiba knocks out Kemo with an elbow jab to the stomach.

The only ambiguity is if Kemo is above Joey, but Joey & Tristan are usually on par, & Kemo being superior kinda makes sense since being a trained bodyguard, being tough is his job.

Meaning: Kaiba>Kemo>Tristan
Tristan~Joey
Joey>Yugi-less Pharoah in Yugi's body (9-B)

So in my opinion, Anime Yugioh has several of the humans at 9-B, if we accept all that like that.
 
Oh, & Valon himself is probably way higher than the other humans.

Back in a flashback to the Orichalcos War, an Orichalcos Soldier defeats a Luster Dragon with a single strike, & visually, it appears to shatter.
Card lore can be seen, legibly, in the anime, to be seen as the same as IRL, & Rebecca does play Luster Dragon IRL. & Pegasus based the cards on the tablet, plus monster spirits, so it's safe to assume Luster Dragon's card lore is applicable. (Not to mention it's kinda visually obvious.)

Why is the card lore relevant? Luster Dragon is covered in scales made of SAPPHIRE.

Meaning if the Orichalcos Soldier shattered it's WHOLE BODY, that's easily like, 9-B, maybe 9-A.

Valon later one-shots an Orichalcos Soldier with an attack from behind before revealing himself to Joey & friends. They were scared of said Solider, usually run from them, & don't fight them without monsters.
So I would assume the main cast are below Orichalcos Soldiers physically, but not Valon, given the implications of how they only fight Orichalcos Soldiers with monsters, not kill them themselves like Valon can.

So yeah, I'd say unless Joey has any feats on that level, Valon is above Joey physically; IIRC, Joey never took hits from nor traded blows with Valon EXCEPT when Joey had Armor on; Meaning Valon's base stats can't scale if the only times Valon was hitting them was when Joey or both Joey & Valon were amped.

Interestingly, Celtic Guardian can beat Orichalcos Soldiers, IIRC, so that's... "fun" for scaling.
 
@DigiAnymore probably end of series atem if we seprate the manga from the anime
Otherwise it's complicated and not as straightforward i would say yuma due to chaos and it's lore

Starting yugioh can be tricky since the manga and anime vary alot but i recommend you start with the yugioh manga followed by yugioh duelist

@Imaginym interesting i'll keep that in mind
 
Oh, & some other stuff from the Orichalcos Arc, all coincidentally from the trip to Kaiba Corp USA, IIRC.

1. I don't have scans, but outside the building, some monsters make a big explosion. It covers at least a couple of windows, meaning it may have a diameter of a storey or two in terms of height. An explosion several meters in size may be a good feat for fodder monsters.
Based on which monsters the Yugioh Wiki lists as appearing that episode, it seems like the most likely identified monster associated with that explosion feat is Reaper of the Cards. Maybe? Would be good to check the episode again.

2. Ocubeam does this:


IIRC, the episode also contains a shot showing Yugi & Kaiba peering into the hole in the wall Ocubeam made, which may be helpful for guestimating the thickness of the material Ocubeam went through. (GIF barely contains it, so it might be tough to get the shot unless you seek out the episode yourself. I think it's like, 163 or something? Maybe?)

3. I also did a calc of another monster feat from that. https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...ser_Dragon_Bashes_Through_Some_Elevator_Doors
Gets about 1% of Maximum Wall Level. (Which is like, 16 times baseline Wall Level, if my rough maths is accurate.) Lesser Dragon is pretty weak, so nice feat for it.


Of course, all those feats involve monsters seemingly amped by the Seal of Orichalcos, & IDK if we can treat the SoO's power boost as quantifiable, so the monsters doing those feats may be higher than normal by an Unknown Amount.


Reminds me that I'm still wondering if we can assume monsters made real by the SoO are as powerful as their Monster Spirit counterparts? Different power source, right? Plus, what incentive would Dartz have to let his enemies' monsters go full power against his Orichalcos Soldiers? Is it the Legendary Dragons' power letting the other monsters manifest or something?
 
Theendzero13 said:
Yuma/astral
I reccomend you just watch the animes in releasing order
If not just read each of their synopses and pick the one you like the most
Click to expand...
I thought Yuma was equal to Goku (both are Low 2-C)?

From what the wiki shows, the strongest Yu-Gi-Oh! characters include Yugi/Atem, Jaden Yuki, Elemental HERO Neos, Yubel, the Three Sacred Beasts, Yusei Fudo, Jack Atlas, and Yuya Sakaki (all 2-C). If there's higher ones, correct me if I'm wrong.
 
Imaginym said:
Reminds me that I'm still wondering if we can assume monsters made real by the SoO are as powerful as their Monster Spirit counterparts? Different power source, right? Plus, what incentive would Dartz have to let his enemies' monsters go full power against his Orichalcos Soldiers? Is it the Legendary Dragons' power letting the other monsters manifest or something?
Click to expand...
i think we treat the monsters as being as strong as the spirits althoguh i'm sure we can scale them off goblins since they are one of the weakest monsters
i don't think dartz cares that much about how much power his army is using as long as he gets souls for his god also the monsters manifest through a weird arora that's not explained iirc
 
Zencha9 said:
i think we treat the monsters as being as strong as the spirits althoguh i'm sure we can scale them off goblins since they are one of the weakest monsters
Click to expand...
"Goblins"?
Like, Goblin Attack Force from the TCG who kinda lacks a basis for scaling in the anime?
I'm talking about Anime continuity monsters.
Zencha9 said:
i don't think dartz cares that much about how much power his army is using as long as he gets souls for his god also the monsters manifest through a weird arora that's not explained iirc
Click to expand...
Any idea what episode the aura/arora or such shows up in?
 
I'm listening to the X-Men Children of the Atom OST to try and cheer myself up.

RIP Kazuki Takahashi. You were a great man.
 
gonna try and finish the anime cosmology blog i started should probably be done this week at worst
 
Zencha9 said:
gonna try and finish the anime cosmology blog i started should probably be done this week at worst
Click to expand...
Good luck with that! Also think you'll do a "duel monster spirit physiology" page kinda like the Heartless Physiology or the Nobody Physiology pages?

Also I think it might be a good opportunity for me to do a new CRT thread about Yubel like we talked about here (there are several comments so it's not just the first one). Anyway good luck to you! Want me to recap some of Yubel's missing powers that were accepted in the old CRT while I'm at it?
 
Nehz_XZX said:
A Duel Monster Spirit Physiology sounds interesting to me. What sort of powers would it have?
Click to expand...
They should have several forms of immortality, also if someone plays their cards it brings them back to life even after they have been killed. Indeed in episode 134 Judai killed a character named Zure, Knight of Dark World by winning a duel against him (duels are lethal in the dark world and actually it's not just physical death: it's as if you were hakaied by Beerus because just physical death is no big deal for duel monster spirits). So Zure isn't just a monster that was played and killed during a duel by being destroyed by battle: he's a real character who was also a duelist. Later in episode 136, Judai is dueling Brron, Mad King of Dark World (a character who duels, not a monster summoned during a duel). During the duel, Brron summons Zure which resurrects him. Judai clearly recognizes that's the same Zure, and as soon as Zure arrives he has Dreadful aura that shows his extreme desire fore revenge (he hsouldn't feel that way if that was another Zure). In addition to that, Brron precises once more it's the same zure Judai killed and that he can have his revenge. Which shows that as long as long as their cards exist, whenever someone calls them, monsters can be brought back. This immortality type 8 (they cannot be fully defeated as long as their cards exist) isn't just physical: even the soul and mind will come back.

Also, spirits can possess (which btw also counts as immortality type 6) people to force them to play their cards (that happened in ep 14 of GX with Jinzo) even after they have been killed.

They can manifest themselves physically in the human world and killing their physical form doesn't stop them at all.

They're also incorporeal and invisible and can use their hax/powers even when they do not have physical forms (this was showed in more than one occasion).
Even while they're incorporeal they can interact with tangible people and objects to attack/hurt them.

They do not need food/water and can survive in the vacuum of space

They can live seemingly eternally because the Dark magicial girl (who also appears in GX not just in DM) didn't aged at all since Ancient Egypt 3000 years ago (yeah it's 5k years only in 4kids' version but 3k in the original dub)

They can fly

They have Supernatural awareness and can detect other spiritual entities and invisible beings. Also they can harm souls and other incorporeal beings.

And there are certainly more that I forgot ^^
 
Jeune_fou said:
They should have several forms of immortality, also if someone plays their cards it brings them back to life even after they have been killed. Indeed in episode 134 Judai killed a character named Zure, Knight of Dark World by winning a duel against him (duels are lethal in the dark world and actually it's not just physical death: it's as if you were hakaied by Beerus because just physical death is no big deal for duel monster spirits). So Zure isn't just a monster that was played and killed during a duel by being destroyed by battle: he's a real character who was also a duelist. Later in episode 136, Judai is dueling Brron, Mad King of Dark World (a character who duels, not a monster summoned during a duel). During the duel, Brron summons Zure which resurrects him. Judai clearly recognizes that's the same Zure, and as soon as Zure arrives he has Dreadful aura that shows his extreme desire fore revenge (he hsouldn't feel that way if that was another Zure). In addition to that, Brron precises once more it's the same zure Judai killed and that he can have his revenge. Which shows that as long as long as their cards exist, whenever someone calls them, monsters can be brought back. This immortality type 8 (they cannot be fully defeated as long as their cards exist) isn't just physical: even the soul and mind will come back.

Also, spirits can possess (which btw also counts as immortality type 6) people to force them to play their cards (that happened in ep 14 of GX with Jinzo) even after they have been killed.

They can manifest themselves physically in the human world and killing their physical form doesn't stop them at all.

They're also incorporeal and invisible and can use their hax/powers even when they do not have physical forms (this was showed in more than one occasion).
Even while they're incorporeal they can interact with tangible people and objects to attack/hurt them.

They do not need food/water and can survive in the vacuum of space

They can live seemingly eternally because the Dark magicial girl (who also appears in GX not just in DM) didn't aged at all since Ancient Egypt 3000 years ago (yeah it's 5k years only in 4kids' version but 3k in the original dub)

They can fly

They have Supernatural awareness and can detect other spiritual entities and invisible beings. Also they can harm souls and other incorporeal beings.

And there are certainly more that I forgot ^^
Click to expand...
Sounds interesting. I'm already aware of the differences in the 4kids version, so you don't need to tell me that. I'm mostly viewing Yu-Gi-Oh! with subtitles anyways these days.
 
Nehz_XZX said:
Sounds interesting. I'm already aware of the differences in the 4kids version, so you don't need to tell me that. I'm mostly viewing Yu-Gi-Oh! with subtitles anyways these days.
Click to expand...
Yeah we should always follow the subbed! There are many differences, for example in the subbed when Yubel who possessed a human one shot the 3 sacred beats (who have the same strength as Egyptian god) while she didn't even have 100% of his base form's strength, in the subbed the sacred beasts are at 100% and unsealed. But in 4kids' version somewhat they say they're still sealed and had only a fraction of their strength.

Anyway Yeah a duel monster physiology page would be very nice ^^
 
Nehz_XZX said:
A Duel Monster Spirit Physiology sounds interesting to me. What sort of powers would it have?
Click to expand...
AE for their astral forms since they're thoughts this would also give them type 1 immortality
invisibility
non phsyical interaction that would affect the mind soul and abstract ideas
empowerment and reactive power level due to human and monster amps via bonds and other means
aura since their true forms are just thoughts BA or spirit energy is what i call it
they would have limited size manip as monsters can grow a little bigger(sometimes alot) if they get amped
and most likely power null or some sorta resistance/ invulnerability as divine energy (the thing the egyptian gods use that makes them immune to everything in the game) is spiritual energy by nature and others have used spiritual energy to either protected themselves or nullify other powers

also all monsters would be a ble to initiate shadow games as shadow games by nature is just applying shadow energy to recreate what ancient egyptian magicians do for their ka battles meaning they use BA or again spirit energy for that so they would have soul manip steal power absorption mind hax EE some via law manip
there's probably alot that i missed but that's probably the most important stuff
also i'm planning to make spirit energy type 1 conceptual manip so that would probably buff monsters a bit
 
Last edited:
KLOL506 said:
A small news on Kazuki Takahashi's sudden passing:

He lost his life while aiding a US Army Officer in saving 3 riptide victims who had become stuck at a grotto near his place of death.

Literal definition of what heroes do.

www.animenewsnetwork.com

U.S. Army Officer: Yu-Gi-Oh Manga Creator Kazuki Takahashi Died Trying to Save Riptide Victims

Takahashi's body was discovered 2 days later on July 6
www.animenewsnetwork.com www.animenewsnetwork.com
Click to expand...
I had no idea it was because of that. I knew he had a diving accident but I was unaware of the whole context
 
Last edited:
image.png

image.png
image.png
Falsebound Kingdom takes place inside a computer game.

However, Moisture Creature is classified as a monster in the system, as he explains, hence his alliance with Kaiba to work towards exiting the computer program.
The other monsters, despite supposedly being part of a "primitive computer program"/game, can hurt Moisture Creature, a real monster, & he can harm them.

Could this be used to indicate that FBK monsters, if their feats were measured, could be used to measure the power they've have in the real world? Could it mean they could scale to theoretical real counterparts? (Although, I don't think we can scale anime to FBK.)

Also, do we have any Japanese language experts? Would be difficult to find, but MAY be useful to scrutinize the Japanese version of this scene.
 
YOOOO, a goated game

I'm pretty sure the Falsebound Kingdom and a few other games are actually a part of their own separate canon though, a good number of games are connected. I haven't played them all yet, but I'm pretty sure there's also lore that contradicts that of the anime and manga within them
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
YOOOO, a goated game

I'm pretty sure the Falsebound Kingdom and a few other games are actually a part of their own separate canon though, a good number of games are connected. I haven't played them all yet, but I'm pretty sure there's also lore that contradicts that of the anime and manga within them
Click to expand...
I could believe that. FBK reuses a lot of models from Duelists of the Roses, but I know nothing about the plot of that.
I wonder if any relation to Forbidden Memories.

I also calced a couple of fire feats from the game just today if you wanna see that.
 
i mean the game monsters are supposed to be accurate to their real life counterparts so i think it checks out
though thesefeats will only scale to FBK obviously
 
image.png

image.png

It should be noted that Gilfer Flame is HUGE, & may be worth calcing.

image.png

Hard to get footage that shows the full size of Gilfer Flame's pillar. Unfortunately, that doesn't, but it's perspective.
The white shape next to Beast of Gilfer is Dark Elf, which might be taller than an average woman because tall elves is a common thing, but who knows if that's a thing in Yu-Gi-Oh! so maybe she's just average lady height or not, IDK?
Oh, & the monster he's hitting, which is kinda leaned back, is Flame Swordsman.

Any thoughts, all?
 
Imaginym said:
image.png

image.png

It should be noted that Gilfer Flame is HUGE, & may be worth calcing.

image.png

Hard to get footage that shows the full size of Gilfer Flame's pillar. Unfortunately, that doesn't, but it's perspective.
The white shape next to Beast of Gilfer is Dark Elf, which might be taller than an average woman because tall elves is a common thing, but who knows if that's a thing in Yu-Gi-Oh! so maybe she's just average lady height or not, IDK?
Oh, & the monster he's hitting, which is kinda leaned back, is Flame Swordsman.

Any thoughts, all?
Click to expand...
can't you use the in game models? i'm pretty sure they were ported
also here's a clip of Gilfer Flame in the anime
 
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