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Why no one in Dragon Ball is 2-C
- Thread starter Frey6678
- Start date
- Status
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You have failed to prove that they aren't space-times, tho. Your examples don't attack that issue, so the argument is hilariously circular in nature.
No it wasn't, that's not at all what was said.
It doesn't debunk anything, tho. The time ring makes a new timeline. This wouldn't debunk each universe having it's own time and space if the timeline is larger than them in nature.
Yes, and they can be space-time continuums, but that doesn't go against the nature of the 12 universes at all.
Bruh, you're repeating an argument that doesn't work. The World of Void is never treated as being part of the 12 universes, so obviously they'd experience it the same, as it's completely disconnected from them. Also, it's possible to have multiple 4D continuums within another one. That's something set theory allows. It wouldn't make the overarching timeline 5D, but it would allow there to be 4D spaces within another 4D space.
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He doesn't, tho. He calls the "thing" that he used to get there a space-time thing. Again, you haven't offered any kind of anti-feat that goes directly against each universe in the timeline having their own form of time.
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- Thread starter
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You have failed to prove that they aren't space-times
I already have.
Sidra and Quitela talking to each other and seeing the events of the universe 7 taking place
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqx4EhtaIeA
And the "12 universes" being affected by tournament of power
I still have yet to see proof they are space-time continuums, when Goku Black and Whis themselves contradict you.
No it wasn't
Path in space-time that trunks went through, since time machines can travel through different space-time continuums.
I haven't seen proof of the "12 universes" being separate space-times as of now
Yes, and they can be space-time continuums, but that doesn't go against the nature of the 12 universes at all.
It does, since there is no mention of space-time regarding the "12 universes". Only the timelines, Goku going to said timeline aka going through a path in space-time, using the button and calling an alternate Zeno.
The World of Void is never treated as being part of the 12 universes
Neither is Zeno's palace, yet it still exist in the same space-time continuum. Not being treated as part of the "12 universes"=/=outside space-time. Even the angel realm isn't part of it.
it's possible to have multiple 4D continuums within another one.
I don't remember "universes" 6 and 7 being different timelines though, nor them being mentioned as different space-times. All I remember is them existing and perceiving past, present and future events as the same.
That's something set theory allows. It wouldn't make the overarching timeline 5D
That's cool and all but you would have to prove "universes" 6 and 7 are space-time continuums and have their own timelines first.
Hasty12345
Username Only- 5,176
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I agree with the downgrade
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Again, already debunked both of them, so this doesn't work.
I have given an example. If you want further proof, you can probably find it in one of the other threads we have.
I already gave an example, proof can be found in another thread, this debunks literally nothing.
That literally doesn't support your point whatsoever lmao. Again, your examples are almost completely unrelated with the issue of the 12 universes each being separate space-times.
Lmao, you're literally supporting my argument. The fact is, the 12 universes are able to all interpret the WoV events the same is because it's disconnected from the entire thing. I never said that the timeline doesn't embody everything, hence why I'm not arguing that Zeno is Low 1C or whatever.
I already gave an example, further proof is something I'm too lazy to look for.
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Wdym by events across different universes? Events that happen in the world of void or whatever aren't a sufficient debunk due to the world of void literally being outside the 12 universes.
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I agree. But you have to understand that these arguments are getting pretty stale at this point. How many 3-A DB Universe or 2-C DB universe threads have been made at this point? And all of them have been repeatedly rejected by the mods of this site. At this point, mods don't even give their input in DB cosmology related threads anymore. Why? Because they are sick to death of these same recycled arguments. And i absolutely agree with them.
And regarding "Accuracy", i doubt toriyama even gives a shit about "muh 3-A" or "muh low 2-C". So what is accurate is just left to assumption.
The only credible evidence we have is that DB "timelines" are multiverses/worlds comprising of a collection of 12-18 universes. Each universe is assumed to have a space time.
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If all arguments have been seen and rejected, then wouldn't it be better to get this thread closed now?
I doubt any real author will actually care about the power of his verse, as in stuff like 3A and Low 2C. No true author gives 2 ***** about that stuff.
I think this is currently attacking that second aspect of it, with each of them having their own form of time.
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Ok I Don't really care if DB universes are one space time but explain one thing. Why did infinite zamasu choose to merge with the present U7 after he finished merging with future U7? He could have decided to merge with the other 11 future universes since they are all supposedly in the same space-time. But he didn't. Instead he travelled to a completely different point in time and started merging with present U7.
Logically, merging with all the future universes would have been far easier.
Another thing, By "space-time" black could be referring strictly to U7.
And i do agree that the universes have never been referred to as "space-time". Credit when it is due.
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True, but they have been implied to being space-times. And besides, it would be really weird if Toriyama actually called them space-times, at least to me.
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Bump
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What do you mean if? Recently there were 2 thread made to downgrade db characters and cosmology by nullflowerblash, both were rejected. All 2-C macrocosm threads have been rejected. This 3-A dbu arguments have been brought up many times but every time they never lead to anything. I personally don't even disagree with 3-A DB. I do have doubts on the existence of a 3-A universe though.
There are some authors who have made comments about their character's power. Like GOW authors, ben 10 writers, dc writers, koyama(broly's creator), one of odin's writer, etc. But yeah toriyama has never made any statements on db characters powers. He likely doesn't really care about this tiering stuff.
Ok regarding the 2nd part. Like i mentioned above, toriyama doesn't give a flying **** about "3-A" or "low 2-C". So that's why he always refers to them as "universes" and not "space-times"
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not sure if you need to bump, seeing as you're supposed to have a 6-ish hour difference before bumping
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That isn't what I mean. The author can clarify stuff, but no author will just try to make their verse OP with namedrops (besides SCP). Even the top tiers in the wiki don't do stuff like that.
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I agree. That is the logical thing to do. I don't believe that a 3-A "universe" is even a thing. The only reason why i don't disagree with this thread is because of the vagueness of DB cosmology, which is because the DB writer doesn't really care whether his verse fits this tiering system or not.
The whole problem with this 3-A universes is that such universes would just be chucks of matter floating in a space-time/timeline. If that was true in DB's case, then bulma could have built a spaceship and flown to any of the other 11 universes, which according to this would also be just chunks of matter floating in a massive space-time.
But we can see this not being the case, there is no evidence that people can fly from U7 to U6. In fact, goku can't even use his instant transmission there, just like he can't instant transmission to the hyperbolic time chamber.
That's why, i am skeptical of the existence of 3-A "universes".
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There is a verse called "suggsverse". I am pretty sure you are aware of it. The author has purposefully made pretty much everyone omnipotent in it.
But i am sorry for not getting your point.
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,779
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it would be real nice if somebody summed up what the hell is going on here
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The same 3-A DBU thread
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So...... This is a 3-A downgrade or something?
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Yes it is. A gazillionth attempt.....
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,779
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i meant the evidence presented
Hasty12345
Username Only- 5,176
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The only reason DBS is above low 2-C is because DBS gets odd treatment on this site.
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Woah, pal, cool it with the forumphobic remarks.
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Listen, I'm all for downgrading DB, it's no secret I hate the verse, but said downgrade has to be right, and I don't think this is personally reading through the entire thread.
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You are a moron.
The reason why dbs is low 2-C is because universes by default are considered low 2-C on this site, as they should be. A 3-A "Universe" can't exist. The entire concept is complete bullshit. Do you even know what a 3-A "Universe" even imply? It means a "Universe" without space-time, which is complete and utter bullshit. A universe can't dxist without space-time. Space-time is an integral part of a universe. The first thing that happened when the big bang occurred was the expansion of space-time. Matter came much later. Only VS battle autists like you can make a ******** conceot like a 3-A "Universe".
If DB universe were all without space-time and just a chunk of matter floating in a "timeline/multiverse", then answer this:
1) Why can't one travel from U7 to other universe via a spaceship?
2) Why can't goku teleport to other universes?
3) Why can't goku and co sense fighters from other universes?
It is as if the universes are just like the HTC, which is a confirmed separate dimension from the universe, but on a universal scale(HTC is planetary).
And lastly, daizenshuu states that the universe is based on reality. And as far as I know, the real universe is not "3-A".
So I will recommend you to refrain from making such inflammatory statements against dragon ball again.
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Why are you quoting AND writing the quoted text in bold at the same time ?
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u good?
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He's not wrong.
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Yeah i am good. Just refuting that other guy who accused people here of being biased towards DB. You can buy your required meds though dude
- 3,954
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i agree
Hasty12345
Username Only- 5,176
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Wanna keep going?
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Also, I find it funny that the guy actually called himself an "autist" as well lol
Hasty12345
Username Only- 5,176
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..... The DB "multiverse" is shown time and time again to just be a big low 2-C structure, literally the universes are just big domes of matter with spacetime that's shared with the other domes.
It's the most blatant low 2-C cosmology ever.
The only tier that would change is Zeno's 2-C. Zamasu would still be low 2-C as he still reached a universal size as is required by the standards. He fits the non-trivial 4D structure requirement IMO.
It's the most blatant low 2-C cosmology ever.
The only tier that would change is Zeno's 2-C. Zamasu would still be low 2-C as he still reached a universal size as is required by the standards. He fits the non-trivial 4D structure requirement IMO.
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