What Power Is This???

[Lancer45Man]

Let's say there are two beings named X and Y. Both of these beings are Immortal beings that are not bound by Life and Death. X has a physical body which cannot die and will easily Heal and Regen itself in case of wounds and damages and has no soul at all but instead it uses A Powerful Logic as a soul. Y on the other hand is Physically Non-Existent and has no Body or Soul at all and described as a Void but instead exists as A Powerful Logic. Now assume there is a character named Z who can easily kill both these beings just by attacking physically and using A Logic Higher than both of their levels and also has the option to erase them.

So my question is as to what Powers did Z display to kill both X and Y???


My Guesses are Conceptual Manipulation (Type 4), Power Nullification, Existence Erasure, Reality Warping.


And for the people who are interested, this is from GetBackers which Lordgriffin, Firephoenixearl, and I are reading through.

 

[Wokistan]

Probably power null, don't see anything suggesting concept manip or reality warping.

 

[Wokistan]

It could also just be really potent existence Erasure.

 

[Wokistan]

Of course, I could be wrong as I don't know the verse. Know where I can find the fill context?

 

[Lancer45Man]

They were stated to have a powerful Logic acting as a soul for X, and Y existed as the Logic itself and was Non-Existent. Yet Z was stated and implied heavily to kill Y completely and he did destroy Y too.

IMO Logic would fall under a Type 4 Concept and as such, Any Logic user would have Type 4 Concept Manip.


And the context is Chapter 246-252 of the GetBackers Manga.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Logic is definately not a type 4 concept it definitely defines reality

 

[Lancer45Man]

Logic in that context was defined as something Metaphysical which acts as a soul

 

[Agnaa]

Something can be metaphysical and still govern reality.

 

[Assaltwaffle]

I mean it seems kinda ridiculous to say "more powerful logic". Like what does that even mean? If anything it is just a higher alignment to "logic" (logic is in quotations because "a powerful logic" is just a stupid statement) and thus allows that character to overwhelm the others. Basically just being better at whatever the other two use.

 

[Lancer45Man]

Keep reading from this Chapter 244 to Chapter 252 for the Full Context

 

[Lancer45Man]

I think it might fall under Logic Manipulation

 

[QuasiYuri]

Logic Manipulation isn't a form of Law Manipulation?

 

[Lancer45Man]

It could be but dunno. Metaphysics Manipulation isn't far fetched too.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Imma follow for now

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Wait so the final verdict on this is which of the following?

MetaPhysics Manipulation

Conceptual Manipulation type 4 or 3

Mathematics Manipulation (Logic Manipulation) (I do agree with this to some extent since the world is just a virtual world so manipulating the mathematics or algoritms of that world to manipulate the logic seems pretty good to me, especially since when V (Someone other than Z who beat X and Y is the same way) deconstructed them and got them back to the system as mere data)

Law Manipulation (though this feels a bit like a result)

Power Nullification, Existence Erasure would be excluded since they are results not mechanics. Reality Warping would fit but it's a bit TOO vague.

 

[Lancer45Man]

I feel it's Metaphysics Manipulation since Logic here is depicted as an abstract which can be used to act as souls for Soulless beings as well as Physically Non-Existent Beings and moreover, it can also result in Power Null, Reality Warp, Law Manip,etc.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Well rather than logic manip i'd stick to Mathematics Manipulation since we can use the data/algoritms of the world as a basis for a being (a soul). V turned the beings back into a mathematic's based system, so it being constructed soley on mathematics would actually make sense which would also apply to the other powers:

Divine Providence= Uncertanity Principle in quantum mechanics which still boils down to a mathematical concept.

Power Null= By creating a mathematical impossibility.

Resistance= By mathematical comparison (Example, i own a "logic" of 3 > 2 > 1 so my logic is stronger than the other ones and therefore unaffected by them)

Creation and Summoning= As i've stated using algoritms and mathematical information to create beings.

Physics Manip = is just a sub-class of mathematics

Law Manip and Concept Manip = By manipulating abstract mathematics to create laws (same as 1+1=2, creating other mathematical laws which either force or negate something

Along with it being Logic Manipulation in verse, i'd say this is our best summerization.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

information manipulation would be better since they are not really manipulating numbers.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

While Information Manipulation would fit, i'd still stick to Mathematics due to manipulating logic and the mathematicals impossibility and other powers do tend to give a mathematic principles vibe.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

information manipulating can allow for logic manipulation.the others give info manipulation vibe than maths manipulation vibe.Maths manipulation is a lesser form of info manipulation.

 

[Lancer45Man]

They aren't really manipulating mathematics or stated to control algorithms. So mathematics Manip is highly unlikely

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Well Information Manipulation is like Reality Warping where it can accomplish virtually anything. While the entire virtual world is purely information, the information is put together through Mathematical Concepts. So i do agree on information manipulation, shouldn't mathematics manipulation also be there to specify it?

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Well Information Manipulation is like Reality Warping where it can accomplish virtually anything. While the entire virtual world is purely information, the information is put together through Mathematical Concepts. So i do agree on information manipulation, shouldn't mathematics manipulation also be there to specify it?

they are not really controlling numbers.It is just info manipulation since these powers have nothing to do with numbers

 

[Lancer45Man]

Where does it state that the Virtual World is put together through Mathematical Concepts??? The most we get are statements that includes how the world is made up of data and information and the only statement about mathematics we got was regarding the creation of the Archiver when the Brain trust members were able to program him and stuff iirc.

Regardless, math manip is unlikely IMHO

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Well Information Manipulation is like Reality Warping where it can accomplish virtually anything. While the entire virtual world is purely information, the information is put together through Mathematical Concepts. So i do agree on information manipulation, shouldn't mathematics manipulation also be there to specify it?

they are not really controlling numbers.It is just info manipulation since these powers have nothing to do with numbers

What about Divine Providnce then where it states that it's based off of mathematical concepts? (uncertanity principle) Or shall we treat it differently from the casual Hojutsu?

 

[Lancer45Man]

Uncertainty Principle is Quantum Physics stuff. Basically what he perceives becomes a reality due to wave function collapse that was explained in Masaki vs Akabane fight. Hence why we have given him Quantum Manipulation

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Ok then. If we gonna treat DP differently i agree with Information Manipulation

 

[Firephoenixearl]

So it's decided on Information Manipulation then?

 

[Lancer45Man]

Ye

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Ok then i'll add it to the profiles and descriptions later.

 

[Lancer45Man]

It's already in their profiles

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Information Manip? I know it's on ban through "begone spirit" (also needs a bit of fixing), but i don't think Akabane Kuroudo has it and i know Der Kaiser doesn't have it (yes i did finish the Der Kaiser profile and am gonn work on Maria Noches later today)

 

[Lancer45Man]

They don't have it. Just add it and explain about it.