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Yes she would
Unfortunately other people dont think so because reasons
Unfortunately other people dont think so because reasons
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Weiss, the Rat Exterminator
- Thread starter Ecstasy_Amphetamine
- Start date
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>Let's get this out the way since it was already brought up before. SBA clarifies both characters know their opponents, but they don't use their abilities unless "prior knowledge" is added.
This is an excerpt from the SBA page:
Knowledge of the other character/verse: The fighters will have absolutely no prior knowledge of each other.
No, they do not know each other. Weiss doesn't know what a stand is and does not know what's going to kill her. Read the page again, if me explaining it to you isn't enough. No prior knowledge means that she doesn't know and recognize Bug-Eate either. That's a disadvantage, since this stand user utilizes stealth, so there will be no face-to-face encounters.
>However, Bug-Eaten isn't doing any those weakness due to its Stand and not firing a rifle. Thus, Weiss 4 main advantages are out with counter-sniping tactics. This leaves the final and primary location tracker for Weiss.
5. Backtracking the bullet upon being hit.
Good luck backtracking an invisible dart son. I already brought up the properties of a stand as they have Invisibility. Invisibility ensures Weiss doesn't know where the dart came from. There is no trail left behind and thus she cannot backtrack it. She merely feels the dart, she can't see it.
>This is the most lethal and life threating tactic because it involves a person getting hit by the bullet in order to backtrack the trajectory of its fire. However, Weiss is in luck because with her forcefields she won't only being in danger of being killed upon the first hit, but she will be able to feel the impact of the dart hit her forcefield. Experienced soldiers in real life that manage to survive getting hit by a bullet in real life and instantly backtrack its location to find the target, what happens when you put an experienced huntress with loads of ability?
Again, she cannot backtrack it. It's invisible. She'll set up her defenses, but it's not enough since Bug-Eaten will flank her if she puts up a forcefield glyph.
This is an excerpt from the SBA page:
Knowledge of the other character/verse: The fighters will have absolutely no prior knowledge of each other.
No, they do not know each other. Weiss doesn't know what a stand is and does not know what's going to kill her. Read the page again, if me explaining it to you isn't enough. No prior knowledge means that she doesn't know and recognize Bug-Eate either. That's a disadvantage, since this stand user utilizes stealth, so there will be no face-to-face encounters.
>However, Bug-Eaten isn't doing any those weakness due to its Stand and not firing a rifle. Thus, Weiss 4 main advantages are out with counter-sniping tactics. This leaves the final and primary location tracker for Weiss.
5. Backtracking the bullet upon being hit.
Good luck backtracking an invisible dart son. I already brought up the properties of a stand as they have Invisibility. Invisibility ensures Weiss doesn't know where the dart came from. There is no trail left behind and thus she cannot backtrack it. She merely feels the dart, she can't see it.
>This is the most lethal and life threating tactic because it involves a person getting hit by the bullet in order to backtrack the trajectory of its fire. However, Weiss is in luck because with her forcefields she won't only being in danger of being killed upon the first hit, but she will be able to feel the impact of the dart hit her forcefield. Experienced soldiers in real life that manage to survive getting hit by a bullet in real life and instantly backtrack its location to find the target, what happens when you put an experienced huntress with loads of ability?
Again, she cannot backtrack it. It's invisible. She'll set up her defenses, but it's not enough since Bug-Eaten will flank her if she puts up a forcefield glyph.
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Taken from the SBA page
"Knowledge of the other character/verse: The fighters will have absolutely no prior knowledge of each other."
So no Weiss doesn't know anything about ratt unless specified otherwise.
Ratt moves after shooting so aiming a ranged attack at Ratt's former position is pointless. She would need to be able to track Ratt after the shot was fired, except she can't see Ratt and I don't know if Ratt actually makes sounds when he moves to different location so tracking is out. This is especially true given that Ratt isn't on the edge of the arena he has a whole extra 20 meters around Weiss to work with.
The only way I see Weiss being able to hit ratt is by firing an AoE attack in a large circle around her. Now I don't remember her ever doing that, but I'll give here the benefit of the doubt and say yes she can freeze a large circle around her location; which is why i asked earlier if her Aoe was above 60 meters which as stated above it doens't.
Voting for Ratt
stop make Jojo vs RWBY match plz
"Knowledge of the other character/verse: The fighters will have absolutely no prior knowledge of each other."
So no Weiss doesn't know anything about ratt unless specified otherwise.
Ratt moves after shooting so aiming a ranged attack at Ratt's former position is pointless. She would need to be able to track Ratt after the shot was fired, except she can't see Ratt and I don't know if Ratt actually makes sounds when he moves to different location so tracking is out. This is especially true given that Ratt isn't on the edge of the arena he has a whole extra 20 meters around Weiss to work with.
The only way I see Weiss being able to hit ratt is by firing an AoE attack in a large circle around her. Now I don't remember her ever doing that, but I'll give here the benefit of the doubt and say yes she can freeze a large circle around her location; which is why i asked earlier if her Aoe was above 60 meters which as stated above it doens't.
Voting for Ratt
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Can we get an accurate vote count?
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So we assume Weiss knows nothing about BE but for some reason BE knows everything about Weiss?
what kind of backwards logic is that?
what kind of backwards logic is that?
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BE knows nothing about Weiss
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Deciding on this is difficult but I think people are really underestimating Ratt. Weiss doesn't really go for massive AoEs across large areas as often as she does other attacks, and Weiss won't realize just how strong and threatening these attacks are until one gets past her aura.
Also, speed equalized, which may hurt her speed amping a tad by giving her lower base speed.
Also, speed equalized, which may hurt her speed amping a tad by giving her lower base speed.
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The only person saying that is you, making another straw manWeeklyBattles said:
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@Desmond Apparently he does seeing as yall are arguing that he just randomly shoots first for no reason
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@Pixel Weiss spams AoE attacks even in melee combat regularly
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All they know is that something in the area is trying to kill them so while on guard they don't really know who they are trying to kill. While I assume central park is cleared of anyone else it doesn't take a genius to say the lady with the sword is the person trying to hurt me.
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@Desmond Central Park isnt cleared, civilians are present, this was actually established some time ago
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I mean if its cleared out of humans and not animals, thats an unfair advantage for BE
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Its not clear of anything
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ok how many people in central park carry weapons around with them much less a sword? I imagine zero not counting things like pocket knifes or small batons or hell even pepper spray.
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More than you'd think tbh
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Now that I think about it yeah there are probably some people wandering around with guns, not swords though. That would actually make it worse for Weiss since she's not going to know the sounds real life firearms make and may just assume one of the bystanders shot her.
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I won't say anything on the other points but backtracking an invisible projectile based on irl tactical reasoning is the textbook definition of "no freaking way." material.
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Again this is assuming Bug picks her out of the entire park's worth of people as well
Especially when Weiss has a lifetime of training dedicated to finding and fighting supernatural animal-esque monsters that are actively trying to kill her
Especially when Weiss has a lifetime of training dedicated to finding and fighting supernatural animal-esque monsters that are actively trying to kill her
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@Xtasyamphetamine As stated before by ProfessorLord and many other people. The dart will become visible after impact is made. Also, its not like the melting effects are invisible either. The melting effects will also become visible prior to the dart hitting the forcefield. Meaning backtracking is still in effect.ProfessorLord said:
Backtracking is used upon assuming the location of fire by taking into contact where you were hit on your body.
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I didn't say it will become visible, I said it can only be touched upon impact. You cannot see the dart just because it hit you?
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The problem is that to backtrack something you need to have an idea of its trajectory.
When the projectile itself is invisible, as far as the target is concerned it has simply "popped up" on their face - as if teleporting.
Same way you can't backtrack someone teleporting to their original position you can't backtrack a projectile that you have 0 idea about trajectory because as far as your senses are concerned there was no way of trajectory or even the origin where it was shot from to begin with.
When the projectile itself is invisible, as far as the target is concerned it has simply "popped up" on their face - as if teleporting.
Same way you can't backtrack someone teleporting to their original position you can't backtrack a projectile that you have 0 idea about trajectory because as far as your senses are concerned there was no way of trajectory or even the origin where it was shot from to begin with.
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Note that by this I'm not saying Rat wins - just that "backtracks an invisible projectile from an invisible source" sounds quite removed from reality, especially when the argument was also trying to apply real life experience with bullets.
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@ProfessorLord
I appreicate your clarification, so either way impact of the dart and melting effects still allow backtracking.
Weiss isn't seeing the dart flying in her direction. She will get hit by the dart, saved by her forcefield and assume the perjector the dart was fired depending on where she was hit on the body. If she has yet found the location she made need to get hit again.
We have already seen that Bug-Eaten fires rapidly when opponents move closer to his location as seen the battle with Jotaro and Josuke. Weiss is going to know she is getting closer upon the second hit. She will result to ice barriers and firing her own projecticles in return.
I appreicate your clarification, so either way impact of the dart and melting effects still allow backtracking.
Weiss isn't seeing the dart flying in her direction. She will get hit by the dart, saved by her forcefield and assume the perjector the dart was fired depending on where she was hit on the body. If she has yet found the location she made need to get hit again.
We have already seen that Bug-Eaten fires rapidly when opponents move closer to his location as seen the battle with Jotaro and Josuke. Weiss is going to know she is getting closer upon the second hit. She will result to ice barriers and firing her own projecticles in return.
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Also want to point out Weiss can potentially reflect the darts with a gravity glyph as well
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@FateAlbane
The process of elimination is still displayed. This is greatly advantaged for Weiss with her own firing projectiles. If you get hit in your chest. You already know the impact didn't come from the back. The projectile had to come from a forward visual, whether it be from the trees or bushes in front of you.
However, I'll make this much easier for you to show how Weiss can use it to her advantage.
Find the sniper
don't you dare use google >.> haha
The process of elimination is still displayed. This is greatly advantaged for Weiss with her own firing projectiles. If you get hit in your chest. You already know the impact didn't come from the back. The projectile had to come from a forward visual, whether it be from the trees or bushes in front of you.
However, I'll make this much easier for you to show how Weiss can use it to her advantage.
Find the sniper
don't you dare use google >.> haha
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The question is can Ratt hit her at least two times in the same general area without getting killed?
In a forest enviornment? Are you kidding me? What is Weiss going to do after she gets hit in the chest, look around in the direction where she got hit? Then she might start running and scouting out the area but she still has no idea where BE is.
I say Ratt tags her at least six times before she catches wind. Keep in mind Ratt shoots 2-3 darts at a time. I think he can get one barrage off on her to drop the aura within that area, he realizes she might have a Stand shield or whatever so he decides to shoot her in the same spot again.
Making sure everyone knows, nothing in SBA says they instantly have each others location. This was discussed in Composite Human vs Thunder IIRC, it's the whole reason CH won. They're in character and ready to kill an opponent they don't know.
In a forest enviornment? Are you kidding me? What is Weiss going to do after she gets hit in the chest, look around in the direction where she got hit? Then she might start running and scouting out the area but she still has no idea where BE is.
I say Ratt tags her at least six times before she catches wind. Keep in mind Ratt shoots 2-3 darts at a time. I think he can get one barrage off on her to drop the aura within that area, he realizes she might have a Stand shield or whatever so he decides to shoot her in the same spot again.
Making sure everyone knows, nothing in SBA says they instantly have each others location. This was discussed in Composite Human vs Thunder IIRC, it's the whole reason CH won. They're in character and ready to kill an opponent they don't know.
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you forgot that the sniper and his projectiles are invisible and he's a literal Rat siting 60 meters away in any direction not just infront of her, you still haven't explain how exacly she can backtrack an invisilbe projectile at best sh would be able to guess the general direction of the dart based on where it hit her, but her AoE doesn't actually reach BE so that's not good enough.
Apparenly central park still has people in it and Weiss knows nothing about her opponent other then that it exists and might be 80 meters away in any direction making figuring out who actually hit her even more of a nightmare then it already was.
BE on the other hand just needs to find her and like I said earlier it doesn't take a genius to say the lady with the fancy sword surronded by normal people not ready to stab something is probably his target.
Apparenly central park still has people in it and Weiss knows nothing about her opponent other then that it exists and might be 80 meters away in any direction making figuring out who actually hit her even more of a nightmare then it already was.
BE on the other hand just needs to find her and like I said earlier it doesn't take a genius to say the lady with the fancy sword surronded by normal people not ready to stab something is probably his target.
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@Professor Once again, it is not possible to drop a wielder's aura in one specific area of their body. Either you break all their aura at once or you dont, there is no in-between. Shooting her in the same spot multiple times wont do what you say its doing.
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@Desmond253
you forgot that the sniper and his projectiles are invisible and he's a literal Rat 'siting' 60 meters away in any direction not just 'infront' of her, you still haven't 'explain' how 'exacly' she can backtrack an 'invisilbe' projectile at best 'sh' would be able to guess the general direction of the dart based on where it hit her, but her AoE doesn't actually reach BE so that's not good enough.
I already went over the issue of the invisible projectile. Like I stated previously before upon impact of the dart and the melting effect are not invisible. Weiss process of elimination aka guessing is still possible to find her opponent. This is why ice barriers for cover and firing her own projectiles in possible locations she believes her opponent may be are highly active.
Apparenly central park still has people in it and Weiss knows nothing about her opponent other then that it exists and might be 80 meters away in any direction making figuring out who actually hit her even more of a nightmare then it already was.
ProfessorLord just said "Making sure everyone knows, nothing in SBA says they instantly have each others location. This was discussed in Composite Human vs Thunder IIRC, it's the whole reason CH won. They're in character and ready to kill an opponent they don't know."
So we can move on from this repeated circle.
you forgot that the sniper and his projectiles are invisible and he's a literal Rat 'siting' 60 meters away in any direction not just 'infront' of her, you still haven't 'explain' how 'exacly' she can backtrack an 'invisilbe' projectile at best 'sh' would be able to guess the general direction of the dart based on where it hit her, but her AoE doesn't actually reach BE so that's not good enough.
I already went over the issue of the invisible projectile. Like I stated previously before upon impact of the dart and the melting effect are not invisible. Weiss process of elimination aka guessing is still possible to find her opponent. This is why ice barriers for cover and firing her own projectiles in possible locations she believes her opponent may be are highly active.
Apparenly central park still has people in it and Weiss knows nothing about her opponent other then that it exists and might be 80 meters away in any direction making figuring out who actually hit her even more of a nightmare then it already was.
ProfessorLord just said "Making sure everyone knows, nothing in SBA says they instantly have each others location. This was discussed in Composite Human vs Thunder IIRC, it's the whole reason CH won. They're in character and ready to kill an opponent they don't know."
So we can move on from this repeated circle.
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Actually, there are a lot of different angles a sniper can shoot from to hit you in the chest or any point of your body, really. Not from your back of course, but definitely many, many, many, MANY different angles, heights and distances if their aim is good.Mr. Common Sense said:
And considering the projectile in question here has:
1. An invisible source. 2. Invisible trajectory so it will just sort of pop in her face like teleporting when it hits. 3. As far as Professor has said it remains invisible after it lands. 4. If it lands it will melt whatever...
There really doesn't seem to be any reasonable means to backtrack that.
Also I'm too lazy to stare at a pic to try and find a hiding sniper so I'll pass on that one.
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Even with hitmarkers I have no idea where my enemy shooter is in a game like Arma II... yet you're telling me that Weiss is gonna get poked in the butt and she'll know that BE is 54.3m away on a thick dense tree at approximately a 65* angle?
If I can't do that shit in a video game where I have all the time in the world, how is Weiss going to do it?
If I can't do that shit in a video game where I have all the time in the world, how is Weiss going to do it?
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Well for one if she gets hit with a dart its going to almost undoubtedly knock her over given the sheer force of the attack, which would instantly put her on guard as she has been hit by an attack she cant see, which would lead her to have defenses at the ready against an opponent who she believes is either using a telekinesis or invisibility semblance
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Also that Rat has enough of a good aim to make the bullets ricochet so it makes its projectiles even more elusive.
Seeing the fight now, he shoot Jotaro from the top of a hill, he dodged it but the rat's aim was so good that it ricocheted and made the bullet hit Jotaro's arm from behind when the original shot came from the front (!).
Seeing the fight now, he shoot Jotaro from the top of a hill, he dodged it but the rat's aim was so good that it ricocheted and made the bullet hit Jotaro's arm from behind when the original shot came from the front (!).
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@Common Sense Does Weiss has experience fighting characters using stealth? Does ANY type of grimm uses that kind of strategy? I don't want to undersell Weiss's intelligence, it's just that the argument "she's a trained huntress" is pretty poor. RWBY characters are superhuman, but we can't assume they will act like experienced soldier trained for war (and not monster killing), not when their fights are usually war more straightforward than that agains't monsters AND agains't humans. She will have a hard time finding the rat (even if she's not defenseless agains't his attack).
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@Wok She can make ice barriers, make dust forcefields, make glyph shields, and make reflective gravity glyphs. She has more than enough methods to protect herself
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@Daloka All grimm use stealth to an extent, some more than others
