Weakest character than can defeat Frisk with Max determination?

[Aurasuke]

So I was just wondering, what would the weakest possible character that is able to defeat Frisk when she's at max determination? That is without equalizing anything, or assuming she just stands there and does nothing, I meant a character with a 100% chance of wining like Elder God Demonbane or Kami Tenchi, only having the weakest character that can win with 100% certainty.


https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Frisk

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Probably almost any Low 1-C?

 

[Aurasuke]

^ You're saying no High 2-A can do it? Even though Frisk is 2-B?

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Do you even Undertale Aura...? Frisk effortlessly tanked attacks from High 2-A characters, even if his DC is only 2-B

 

[Aurasuke]

But what if that High 2-A being attacks 100 times? I mean you can be building level but after a certain number of attacks you kind of get less durable.

 

[Aurasuke]

Do you even Undertale Aura...? Frisk effortlessly tanked attacks from High 2-A characters, even if his DC is only 2-B

Also, I don't think effortless is the real word to use here, if I remember correctly from the playthrough you are left with like 0.000000001 Hp or something crazy like that lol.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Not really...Frisk can comes back from the dead.

Say Aura...did you played Undertale or nah?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

You asked which was the weakest character which with 100% certainty can beat Frisk, and I responded that most Low 1-Cs could probably do it, which is true.

 

[Aurasuke]

^ I only read the wikis walkthrough on how to beat Asriel. I don't really like playing games that have lower graphics equalities to the point where it's kind of 2 dimensional.

Most games I play are like skyrim, fallout 4, the wticher 3, dragon age inquisiton, games with high graphics, and probably cost millions to actually produce.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

If you haven't played the game, then it would be best that you inform yourself before getting into such debate with Undertale charaters, something that you do all the time.

 

[Aurasuke]

You asked which was the weakest character which with 100% certainty can beat Frisk, and I responded that most Low 1-Cs could probably do it, which is true.

Could Asriel kill Frisk if he kept pounding away indefinitely?

 

[Aurasuke]

If you haven't played the game, then it would be best that you inform yourself before getting into such debate with Undertale charaters, something that you do all the time.

I already quite informed after 300+ posts of undertale subjects even if I haven't played the game.

 

[The_Everlasting]

^ I only read the wikis walkthrough on how to beat Asriel. I don't really like playing games that have lower graphics equalities to the point where it's kind of 2 dimensional.

The difference is that Undertale is 2-dimensional, it's referencing games like Earthbound with its SNES-like graphics.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Even though you apparently think that Frisk is only 2-B.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Could Asriel kill Frisk if he kept pounding away indefinitely?

Unknown, hence why I answered who could do it with certainty.

 

[Aurasuke]

Even though you apparently think that Frisk is only 2-B

She is 2-B, only her durability is High 2-A due to scaling with Asriel.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Why is it you keep referring to Frisk as "she"? Frisk's gender is entirely left ambiguous for the game, as people only call them things like "human" or other things that aren't gender-specific.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Yeah, but you go to say that a 2-A character could beat Frisk easily, which, as proven by Asriel, isn't the case.

 

[Aurasuke]

But didn't Asriel give up because he felt guilty? ^

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

But didn't Asriel give up because he felt guilty? ^

Yes. Didn't stop him from attempting to absolutely brutalize Frisk, beforehand.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Yeah, he did, but only at the end. Before that he was just attacking Frisk.

Heck, his final attack, wich he used at full power (And even his base is infinitely stronger than God Flowey) still failed to kill Frisk, despite at that point he was going all-out.

 

[Macosten]

Logically anything six-dimensional or higher should be able to defeat Frisk, given that Frisk tanked attacks from Asriel (implied to be 5D) but couldn't hurt him back - implying that Frisk against most 2-As results in a stalemate of some sort.

Thus, low 1-C, in order to be higher-dimensional than Frisk (who at their max is immeasurable within 5 dimensions) while possibly being able to override their odd version of immortality.

The issue with going any lower than that is that Frisk's speed is Immeasurable. That's kinda tough to override. Were that not the case (and Frisk was just Relativistic+ at most) someone like Kirby could just walk up and BFR them in a rather lame fashion.

 

[Aurasuke]

implying that Frisk against most 2-As results in a stalemate of some sort.

So which High 2-A would she lose to then if most are stalemates? What kind of powers are required to beat her immortality while still being a tier 2?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

implying that Frisk against most 2-As results in a stalemate of some sort.
So which High 2-A would she lose to then if most are stalemates? What kind of powers are required to beat her immortality while still being a tier 2?

I don't know? Probably go on a case by case basis.

 

[Macosten]

I don't really know, I'm not that well versed in all of fiction. I just know a few things here and there... and decided to post a bit after being just a lurker for a little while.


I assume that, to defeat Frisk (for good), a High 2-A would need to find a way to override Frisk's de facto immortality without being dimensionally superior (because a High 2-A that's also higher-dimensional than Frisk at max DN would actually be a Low 1-C because they would be six-dimensional).

One would need to out-hax or out-dimension Frisk to beat them - and, oddly, it seems easier just to out-dimension them.

 

[Aurasuke]

What kind of reality warping ability would one need to out Hax Frisk? What if one were able to destroy/create infinite universes?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

What kind of reality warping ability would one need to out Hax Frisk? What if one were able to destroy/create infinite universes?

That's just the definition of High 2-A?

Like I said, it'd probably be a case by case basis, so I'd need to know what they were fighting.

 

[SomebodyData]

Hmm what about death inducement hax, or something like phazon (just curious)

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Hmm what about death inducement hax, or something like phazon (just curious)

On someone who is now beyond the concept of conventional time with immeasurable speed? Also, remember Frisk can just will themself back from death.

 

[SomebodyData]

On someone who is now beyond the concept of conventional time with immeasurable speed? Also, remember Frisk can just will themself back from death.

Yes for the first one, and without the ablity to will yourself back

 

[Macosten]

Though one of the verses I'm better-versed in is the MtG-verse. Through that, it's *possible* that Kozilek proper, or Emrakul Proper would be able to defeat them by virtue of warping reality (in the sense that their presence disorts the natural laws of the world a la Bill Cipher) - Emrakul and Kozilek cause insanity/warp reality in ways that *might* be able to override Frisk's Determination. Emrakul is the best bet, given that she is the most powerful. Ulamog really only destroys stuff so it's less likely that he would be able to perma-kill Frisk.

Prime Nicol Bolas may or may not be able to break Frisk's determination (with his mind-shattering touch). It might work, it might not. I'm personally unsure. Any other character I can think of (a theoretical Prime Ugin, Urza, Karn, Yawgmoth, or any others) probably can't permakill Frisk at Max-D. (Maybe Ugin or Karn because they're time travelers/warpers, but that ignores durability, and if Frisk can damage God Flowey...)


Then again, Kozilek and Ulamog "died" to Captain Planet- style bullshit so anything's possible, I guess. (I'm still personally holding out hope that they're not perma-dead and only physically dead, but it's too early to tell. I'm sure I'll discuss this somewhere else in more detail later, but for now...).


It's also possible that none of them can. I'm not sure.

 

[Aurasuke]

So why is it that if one is from a higher dimension they can automatically kill anyone regardless of their abilities of a lower dimension?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Then again, Kozilek and Ulamog "died" to Captain Planet- style bullshit so anything's possible, I guess. (I'm still personally holding out hope that they're not perma-dead and only physically dead, but it's too early to tell. I'm sure I'll discuss this somewhere else in more detail later, but for now...).

Dat hilarious Chandra wank, though.

Sincerely doubt they're perma-dead, though. What we saw on Zendikar was confirmed to be only their lower dimensional shadows, and I doubt fire can perma-kill something that lives in the Blind Eternities.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

So why is it that if one is from a higher dimension they can automatically kill anyone regardless of their abilities of a lower dimension?

Because the lower dimensional character can't actually affect the higher dimensional character. Technically neither can the higher dimensional character, but they can destroy the surface the lower dimensional character exists on.

 

[Macosten]

The fact that there was still a brood for Gideon to fight should be evident enough (if we go by Ugin's hand metaphor - it should tell us pretty handily that they weren't dragged all the way into the pond of Zendikar), but not even that can overcome bad writing.

That being said, yeah, maybe Emrakul or Kozilek. Less likely Ulamog, Prime Pre-Mending Bolas, Ugin at an equivalent point, or Pre-mending Karn (I did forget that Kar and Ugi are both somewhat skilled with Time magic; Teferi doesn't strike me as powerful enough to defeat Frisk so he's out of the question)


Ugin's should be more powerful since he kinda-sorta did it while he was dead and stuff.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Yeah, but hopefully they don't just...forget about something from the exact same block. Either way, I doubt we've seen the last of them.

Ugin and Karn could probably stand a chance. They're both tough cookies, and pre-mending Ugin and Bolas had an incredibly lengthy fight. Teferi's way too inexperienced and just not in the same league as the others.

 

[Macosten]

Ugin and Bolas, when they fought, were/are approximate equals. Bolas just happened to win their fight.

The more I think about it, the more I think Prime Bolas could stand a chance. It depends on how much Bolas's touch can do to Frisk.

Perhaps Phyrexia as a whole could defeat Frisk over time by corrupting him, but that doesn't seem likely - I just kinda get the feeling that his DN wold resist the Glistening Oil similar to how Karn's first Spark helped him resist it too (until he sacrificed it to seal the Time Rifts of Time Spiral, got corrupted, then got Liberated by Venser sacrificing himself to give him his spark and whatnot).

... So Phyrexia probably couldn't do it. Thus, Yawgmoth probably can't either.


Urza probably can't do it; neither can anyone lower than him (Liliana with the Veil, any other Planeswalker, the Pantheon of Theros). Marit Lage and Progenitus probably can't be defeated by Frisk but I doubt they could defeat Frisk either (if only because we don't know enough about them).


At least we might be seeing more of Emrakul soon... someone's gotta be that Shadow over Innsmouth- erm, Innistrad.

 

[Macosten]

I think we've reached somewhat of a conclusion.

Some High 2-As (given proper hax) and most 1-Cs should be able to perma-defeat Frisk with Max DN.

Any objections to that?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I think we've reached somewhat of a conclusion.
Some High 2-As (given proper hax) and most 1-Cs should be able to perma-defeat Frisk with Max DN.

Any objections to that?

Pretty much this.