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Tower of God General Discussion Thread Part 5

EldemadeDityjon said:
Atleast inside tower everything needs Shishoo without shinsoo reality would get distorted like how 43rd floor went into ruin after enru killed the administrator. So you can argue for Shinsoo governing the reality of TOG.
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It was warped because no one held the illusion of a clear sky like admins did. No one held the laws of shinsu currents, like admins did. No one controlled the climate as admins did. Admins are in control of all those things regarding the floor.

They are the cause there is a climate and the reason of why stations change within the tower, they decide how hot and cold the floor will be. They are the ones that mantain the flow of shinsu(air), they mantained the blue sky illusion and even the lights itself as it is also shinsu.
 
ImNot4nUser said:
It was warped because no one held the illusion of a clear sky like admins did. No one held the laws of shinsu currents, like admins did. No one controlled the climate as admins did. Admins are in control of all those things regarding the floor.

They are the cause there is a climate and the reason of why stations change within the tower, they decide how hot and cold the floor will be. They are the ones that mantain the flow of shinsu(air), they mantained the blue sky illusion and even the lights itself as it is also shinsu.
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Yeah. That's still Qualifies
 
ImNot4nUser said:
It really doesn't, but go on
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Admins will get CM that's what I mean. Like Yuri couldn't use shinsoo because admin was dead on that floor. Also the fact if you want to create fire shinsoo is required same goes for all elements not to mention even the immortality is dependent on Shunsui.

You can just govern the concept of fire throughout the reality and get CM type 2 for that you don't need to govern concepts of sky or something else. I don't why you mentioned Illusions part. It's not really necessary.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Admins will get CM that's what I mean. Like Yuri couldn't use shinsoo because admin was dead on that floor. Also the fact if you want to create fire shinsoo is required same goes for all elements not to mention even the immortality is dependent on Shunsui.

You can just govern the concept of fire throughout the reality and get CM type 2 for that you don't need to govern concepts of sky or something else. I don't why you mentioned Illusions part. It's not really necessary.
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Dude stop wanking other verses.
:5958spidermanhmm:
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Admins will get CM that's what I mean. Like Yuri couldn't use shinsoo because admin was dead on that floor. Also the fact if you want to create fire shinsoo is required same goes for all elements not to mention even the immortality is dependent on Shunsui.
Click to expand...
They won't. She could use shinsoo above the body of the admin, the place she couldn't use shinsu was within the bloodstream of the admin because of its blood. You are misremembering and confusing. The bold part is a big ??? of what you are even trying to say.

And lastly, what does immortality has to do? Oh no, people can use shinsu to expand the lifespan of their cell to forever, such a metaphysical explanation instead of you know, shinsu being COMPLETELY a Physical: Vectorial and escalar source.

Unless you mean the contract immortality of the Family Heads and Zahard, which is in fact not dependent on shinsu and is instead reliant on the law manipulation of admins.
EldemadeDityjon said:
You can just govern the concept of fire throughout the reality and get CM type 2 for that you don't need to govern concepts of sky or something else. I don't why you mentioned Illusions part. It's not really necessary.
Click to expand...
I mentioned them, because it is really necessary, they are not governing anything in a metaphysical sense (aside of contracts/laws of the tower, which are indeed metaphysical), all they do is a total control over every single shinsu atom across a whole floor, with that they can control the climate, temperature, light, etc, of the floor.

Shinsu is not a concept, for something to be a concept it must be:
  • Abstract and entirely non physical. It can't be measured with scalar or vectorial values.
  • Individual, concrete, a whole that encompass all the physical manifestations which are bijections of itself or participating on itself.
Shinsu is literally something akin to atoms and molecules. It is a physical thing, it doesn't encompass something, it makes up something. You know, atoms should have CM1...
 
ImNot4nUser said:
They won't. She could use shinsoo above the body of the admin, the place she couldn't use shinsu was within the bloodstream of the admin because of its blood. You are misremembering and confusing. The bold part is a big ??? of what you are even trying to say.

And lastly, what does immortality has to do? Oh no, people can use shinsu to expand the lifespan of their cell to forever, such a metaphysical explanation instead of you know, shinsu being COMPLETELY a Physical: Vectorial and escalar source.

Unless you mean the contract immortality of the Family Heads and Zahard, which is in fact not dependent on shinsu and is instead reliant on the law manipulation of admins.

I mentioned them, because it is really necessary, they are not governing anything in a metaphysical sense (aside of contracts/laws of the tower, which are indeed metaphysical), all they do is a total control over every single shinsu atom across a whole floor, with that they can control the climate, temperature, light, etc, of the floor.

Shinsu is not a concept, for something to be a concept it must be:
  • Abstract and entirely non physical. It can't be measured with scalar or vectorial values.
  • Individual, concrete, a whole that encompass all the physical manifestations which are bijections of itself or participating on itself.
Shinsu is literally something akin to atoms and molecules. It is a physical thing, it doesn't encompass something, it makes up something. You know, atoms should have CM1...
Click to expand...
I can see why you disagree with my interpretation now

But here are some of the things
  • Shinsoo is indeed abstract. White uses Shinsoo too absorb souls. I don't see atoms beings able to do that. I would like to see your explanation on that if you think it's different
Well I may be wrong in my interpretation but I would like to get how interacting with souls is not NPI. (remember the clone of white which formed due to countless souls)
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
I can see why you disagree with my interpretation now

But here are some of the things
  • Shinsoo is indeed abstract. White uses Shinsoo too absorb souls. I don't see atoms beings able to do that. I would like to see your explanation on that if you think it's different
Well I may be wrong in my interpretation but I would like to get how interacting with souls is not NPI. (remember the clone of white which formed due to countless souls)
Click to expand...
Interacting with souls is indeed NPI but it would only be available to those who can affect souls in the verse (White, Bam, fish and Admins) but at the same time it is definitely not enough for conceptual abstraction.
Additionally i think power of souls =/= shinsoo or at least i don't remember it being that way. I think it boosts the power of the user but it isn't necessarily shinsoo based, especially considering White uses it due to the spell that he used and spells, curses and magic are a different system from shinsoo.
 
Anyways i wanna ask two things

1. @ElajRuengies if you're here, could you tell me something? I think i asked at one point to check whether the translation for Traum nuking the nest was accurate or not. I kinda lost the post. Can you still check whether its right?
 
Arceus0x said:
Interacting with souls is indeed NPI but it would only be available to those who can affect souls in the verse (White, Bam, fish and Admins) but at the same time it is definitely not enough for conceptual abstraction.
Additionally i think power of souls =/= shinsoo or at least i don't remember it being that way. I think it boosts the power of the user but it isn't necessarily shinsoo based, especially considering White uses it due to the spell that he used and spells, curses and magic are a different system from shinsoo.
Click to expand...
Well I also forgot but Souls are converted into Shinsoo before White Absorbed them. Anyway I will check that later Forgot those things. I am not really sure.

Also tell me if this scaling chain is correct or not because this is what I understand.

Urek (💯) > Urek (1%) > Karaka(High Ranker ) > some Ranker just say ~ S02 end Baam with 2 thorns ~ Data Zahad ~ Data Urek (FTL+ 16c accepted by wiki )

Shouldn't this make Urek Mftl+?
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Well I also forgot but Souls are converted into Shinsoo before White Absorbed them. Anyway I will check that later Forgot those things. I am not really sure.

Also tell me if this scaling chain is correct or not because this is what I understand.

Urek (💯) > Urek (1%) > Karaka(High Ranker ) > some Ranker just say ~ S02 end Baam with 2 thorns ~ Data Zahad ~ Data Urek (FTL+ 16c accepted by wiki )

Shouldn't this make Urek Mftl+?
Click to expand...
we only use the multipliers for strength, not speed. they never stated to increase speed.
 
Arceus0x said:
we only use the multipliers for strength, not speed. they never stated to increase speed.
Click to expand...
They did though. ( but it was due to amping with Shinsoo ofcourse. ) Isn't that usable?

Likely or Possible rating should work honestly Anak done that speed amping thing in S01 when she fought Endorsi. Forgot about others if I am correct Baam also done this. Same goes for Ran.
 
Arceus0x said:
where. All i saw was Urek using percentages of his 'power', not speed.
Click to expand...
What i am saying is not all needs to be stated his powers was reduced to 5% in Floor of death shouldn't that also mean his speed was reduced. If fodder characters can use shinsoo to amp their speed then if he Downgraded his power to 1 or 5% shouldn't his speed also get amped when he uses 💯 of his full power. If it's introduced that Shinsoo can be used to amp body Statistics based on speed also I don't see why we disregard it because there was no statement for speed in specific state.

Also that's why I am proposing likely or Possible rating. Also we don't have a particular multipliers except this feat and no one except Zahad and Family heads scales to it.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
What i am saying is not all needs to be stated his powers was reduced to 5% in Floor of death shouldn't that also mean his speed was reduced. If fodder characters can use shinsoo to amp their speed then if he Downgraded his power to 1 or 5% shouldn't his speed also get amped when he uses 💯 of his full power. If it's introduced that Shinsoo can be used to amp body Statistics based on speed also I don't see why we disregard it because there was no statement for speed in specific state.

Also that's why I am proposing likely or Possible rating. Also we don't have a particular multipliers except this feat and no one except Zahad and Family heads scales to it.
Click to expand...
kind of unsure about that. Additionally, i believe while it could make sense normally, on vsbw it is something that wouldn't get accepted due to strict multiplier restrictions
 
Arceus0x said:
kind of unsure about that. Additionally, i believe while it could make sense normally, on vsbw it is something that wouldn't get accepted due to strict multiplier restrictions
Click to expand...
Well BC has same type of multipliers for their characters and accepted in the wiki. I am not sure if TOG multipliers gets accepted or not. Though Urek multipliers doesn't have any anti feat.

Btw do we consider character from Floor of death to have immortality type 8 & Low godly regeneration? They can't be killed or erased unless if you cut off link from the soul and Yuri can destroy the existence of she want just like she did with Karaka but she also stated she couldn't completely kill them and need to use 13 series. I think it Qualifies for LGR and immortality type 8 what do you think
 
Arceus0x said:
It's not that it's "dead" it's moreso "asleep". We awaken to any vs fights and we work on revisions if we find any good ones. I've been thinking of starting to work on s1 profiles at some point. I wanna revisit a few old calcs and see if there's any faults in them.
Click to expand...
We so need S1 profiles or keys that are more than just “unknown”. It would help with making more matches. Besides anime only fans will be able to participate more.
 
Nico-v11 said:
We so need S1 profiles or keys that are more than just “unknown”. It would help with making more matches. Besides anime only fans will be able to participate more.
Click to expand...
What i am confused about is Anaak's rating. Should she be Low 7-C flat out or only Low 7-C with GA? Like yeah the KE was from the weapon hitting the ground but it was she who slammed it..
 
I don't disagree with your "interpretation" you are just flat out wrong. TOG stuff is not up to interpretation, SIU is explicit in all his explanations and distinctions he makes.
EldemadeDityjon said:
White uses Shinsoo too absorb souls. I don't see atoms beings able to do that.
Click to expand...
White uses a spell, spells are explicitly different of shinsu, as Zahard Family has prohibited them as a taboo. Spells use shinsu as a medium, see Levy soul corrupting spell taking the form of a shinsu fire cyclone and being able of being controlled by Baam Reverse Flow Control.

Just read these Respect Threads I have made [Hoaqin RT|White RT]
 
ImNot4nUser said:
I don't disagree with your "interpretation" you are just flat out wrong. TOG stuff is not up to interpretation, SIU is explicit in all his explanations and distinctions he makes.

White uses a spell, spells are explicitly different of shinsu, as Zahard Family has prohibited them as a taboo. Spells use shinsu as a medium, see Levy soul corrupting spell taking the form of a shinsu fire cyclone and being able of being controlled by Baam Reverse Flow Control.

Just read these Respect Threads I have made [Hoaqin RT|White RT]
Click to expand...
So if I am understanding correctly Spells > shinsoo right? Btw I didn't read anything which SIU wrote. I am only sticking to manhwa.

Also I where did it was stated floor are on the size of North and South America or it is also stated by SIU. Kinda confused because only thing i found in manhwa is floor should probably has size to store a ocean and a possible continent
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
So if I am understanding correctly Spells > shinsoo right? Btw I didn't read anything which SIU wrote. I am only sticking to manhwa.

Also I where did it was stated floor are on the size of North and South America or it is also stated by SIU. Kinda confused because only thing i found in manhwa is floor should probably has size to store a ocean and a possible continent
Click to expand...
1. More like, Spells are external to shinsu power system, and use shinsu to propagate its effects: A soul corrupting spell uses shinsu in the form of fire, a paralysis spell of death use a snake poison, or unhealing spell uses a spiritual anima.
Likewise they can also be vectorless like Levy question mark spell.

2. Yes, SIU blogs state that
 
ImNot4nUser said:
1. More like, Spells are external to shinsu power system, and use shinsu to propagate its effects: A soul corrupting spell uses shinsu in the form of fire, a paralysis spell of death use a snake poison, or unhealing spell uses a spiritual anima.
Likewise they can also be vectorless like Levy question mark spell.
Click to expand...
Okay 👍
ImNot4nUser said:
2. Yes, SIU blogs state that
Click to expand...
Can I get the link for this.

Btw this
EldemadeDityjon said:
Btw do we consider character from Floor of death to have immortality type 8 & Low godly regeneration? They can't be killed or erased unless if you cut off link from the soul and Yuri can destroy the existence of she want just like she did with Karaka but she also stated she couldn't completely kill them and need to use 13 series. I think it Qualifies for LGR and immortality type 8 what do you think
Click to expand...
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Can I get the link for this.
Click to expand...
Link to the master blog translation (2012)
Btw do we consider character from Floor of death to have immortality type 8 & Low godly regeneration?
Click to expand...
It is Type 8 Immortality, yes. It isn't LGR, for LGR their soul need to be erased/destroyed, their souls are never in peril because of the spell basically storing them outside their body. It would be high regeneration.
Damn, the standard changed, didn't know, yes it should be Low Godly Regeneration.
Low-Godly: The ability to regenerate from the complete physical destruction of the user's body, instead restoring it from their disembodied consciousness, whether that be their soul, mind, some other non-physical aspect of themself, esoteric or metaphysical energy, or something else.
Click to expand...
What happens with Curse of 13 month is that it is the ultimate enchantment and basically ignores spells[Laws of spell. higher spell neutralize the lower, 13 month is the ultimate spell] and since their regen is reliant on the spell, once it is broken, they die.
 
ImNot4nUser said:
Link to the master blog translation (2012)
Click to expand...
Thanks I will check it out later
ImNot4nUser said:
It is Type 8 Immortality, yes.
Damn, the standard changed, didn't know, yes it should be Low Godly Regeneration.
Click to expand...
I was wondering why Baam don't have negation for this. I guess it needs a seperate thread then.
ImNot4nUser said:
What happens with Curse of 13 month is that it is the ultimate enchantment and basically ignores spells[Laws of spell. higher spell neutralize the lower, 13 month is the ultimate spell] and since their regen is reliant on the spell, once it is broken, they die.
Click to expand...
Yeah I get it.
 
yo, idk if i should post this here, anyways. im wondering why Khun Aguero only has Sub-Relativistic speed.
in the hidden floor he outsped the mirror by a big margin. the same mirror that is used for Urek's speed feat.
i'll post the panels: 1st . 2nd . 3rd . 4th . 5th . 6th . 7th .
the last one with the lines is just to show the distance his lighthouses had to travel in comparison to the light from the mirror, nothing serious.
is there anything wrong with this? i could be dumb idk.
 
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