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Top Five Strongest Characters For Every Tier

It says this, AND then goes on to list new powers he has. We don't have much reasons to do the same for a character with no new powers.
 
Ecetereis said:
It seperates 1 limiter missing and 2. It states that all powers but to a greater extent.
Click to expand...
Yes, this happens when characters have additional powers in another key. A new key's not going to be put in the powers and abilities section just to say "All powers but to a great extent" with no additional abilities.
 
No.

Lucifer's Morningstar Powers are 1-A, his powers don't work on a 1-A level when he is without his wings - the source of his powers.


The best feat I can think of off the top of my head for a wingless Lucifer is this feat when Lucifer makes a portal to the void and states that if The Presence tries closing the portal, he would unmake the rest of creation.

But that's like, an outlier at best or at worst - I am misremembering important context from that scene that changes the significance of Lucifer's words and actions.
 
I concede. Should Lucifer be added to Unknown tier since his depowered version was changed from a 2-C to an Unknown?
 
Ecetereis said:
I concede. Should Lucifer be added to Unknown tier since his depowered version was changed from a 2-C to an Unknown?
Click to expand...
No, there's a lot of Unknowns who'd reasonably be higher.
 
SCP-3125 is Unknow because its dimensionality is a previously unknown whole number between 5 and 6.

This means that it's infinitely above all High 2-As, but infinitely below all Low 1-Cs.
 
Technically, from what I've seen you can use a weaker form of a stronger entity such as Heaven Ascension Dio which is at 8-C but is on because of 2-A form. Lucifer at his best is 1-A which is an AP that can stomp 1-Cs.
 
Ecetereis said:
Technically, from what I've seen you can use a weaker form of a stronger entity such as Heaven Ascension Dio which is at 8-C but is on because of 2-A form. Lucifer at his best is 1-A which can stomp 1-Cs.
Click to expand...
No. They have to be part of the same key, I think?
 
That's not how it works. Lucifer can't suddenly return to 1-A at will in his Unknown key, unlike Dio, who can use his 2-A stand at will.

Nevermind the fact that some Cthulhu Mythos Unknowns are 1-A.
 
Heaven Ascension Dio is 8-C. He has a form of hax that is 2-A. If we count out the 2-A hax, Dio would probably not make this list.
 
Except we don't count out the hax. Because Dio can use said 2-A hax even in his 8-C self, because the 2-A stuff is just a different power from his physical stats.

The same is not true about Lucifer. He has nothing 1-A in his Unknown key. He can't switch to it at will and has no 1-A hax.
 
If we assume Eyes of Heaven Dio didn't have the World over Heaven. Dio can't get his hax at will. I think it was because of the Joestars' soul power.
 
Considering that we rate him as straight up MFTL+, I think it's fair to say that we do not consider him anywhere near 1-A in that key, so no.
 
We can't. There is an unknown section there, but I'm pretty sure there are other unknown outer God's and stuff that are higher.
 
That's not how it work. If we have nothing that says he could be 1-B, we don't assume it via a lack of proof of the contrary.
 
Saikou The Lewd King said:
That's not how it work. If we have nothing that says he could be 1-B, we don't assume it via a lack of proof of the contrary.
Click to expand...
I was saying how can you know that he's weaker or stronger than other unknowns?
 
Feats he has in that key.
 
Honestly it's why I think it's kinda dumb to rate Unknowns and Varies in "strongest" tier lists. But oh well.
 
Unknown can be done when they don't have any AP, but their hax has a tier.

@Ecetereis It looks like Lucifer's Unknown key might not even be universal, let alone 1-A.
 
Some unknowns are just like that because they don't have AP, like the Gorgon (Destiny). Since they do literally nothing except Existence Erasure they're unknown, but you can definitely compare their EE to other unknowns.
 
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