The gang fights a Zombie (Kinda)

[Fezzih_007]

Dio is walking to a museum, and finds Theresia body on the ground, and decides to send her against the Team.
The team just existed a restaurant, which they explode after fighting a stand user, and noticed Theresia on front them. They think she cames to kill them all, and prepares for the battle.


Theresia Ressurected is being used
Speed equal
They start 10 meters away
The Jojo gang are in a jeep
They fight in egypt
Jotaro don't have time stop

Votes:
They crash a car on her:
The corpse makes more corpses:
Inco:

 

[AThe1412]

I have zero knowledge about Re:Zero so I'll wait for other people's inputs. For now though, does Jotaro have time stop?

 

[Fezzih_007]

Yes

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

1. Theresia's aura will make them all feel like their skin is burning
2. She can cut up all of their stands or them as soon as she closes the distance
3. Danmaku wont work on her so hierphant green is useless
4. star platinum and Silver chariot get outskilled
5. And well. Joseph cant really do aything here
6. Theresia also has the AP and Dura advantage
7. King crimsons heat would be pretty ineffective against Theresia due to her resistance
Theresia should take this pretty comfortably

 

[Zabazab]

7. King crimsons heat would be pretty ineffective against Theresia due to her resistance

Ah yes, Avdol's King Crimson.

The main issue I see with this match is that Theresia outpowers and outskills, while the only real offensive hax that the Crusader's got is Magician's Red which is resisted. This is arguably a stomp even with a 6v1 tbh.

Post-Gluttony Crusch might make for a good match against a Stand User due to her closer AP & her Blessing.

 

[Fezzih_007]

1. Theresia's aura will make them all feel like their skin is burning

Which gonna do nothing

2. She can cut up all of their stands or them as soon as she closes the distance

She can't.

• Intangibility, Incorporeality (Stands are the incorporeal manifestations of one's vital energy, and can only be harmed by other Stands),

3. Danmaku wont work on her so hierphant green is useless

The Danmaku that is invisible, she can't block, and can come from all directions. Hierophant Green also can posses her.
She can dodge invisible attacks, so i give her that.

4. star platinum and Silver chariot get outskilled

5. And well. Joseph cant really do aything here

Hamom.

• Vibration & Energy Manipulation (Through a unique breathing technique, Hamon users can draw out vibrations from their blood flow and create energy waves with the properties of sunlight, capable of transferring it towards objects and people. This can be used to harm any opponent weak to sunlight through contact with any living or non-living thing charged with Hamon), Durability Negation (via Hamon)

6. Theresia also has the AP and Dura advantage

True.

7. King crimsons heat would be pretty ineffective against Theresia due to her resistance

King Crimsom wow

True.

Theresia should take this pretty comfortably

Meh.

Post-Gluttony Crusch might make for a good match against a Stand User due to her closer AP & her Blessing.

I can't exactly find a compatible match for her with a stand user, unfortunelly.

 

[Chariot190]

1. Theresia's aura will make them all feel like their skin is burning

Several of the people here have literally been set on fire and shrugged it off. Half the people have utterly insane willpower. One of them even managed to get away after having his arms and legs blown off, his torso punched out, and his eye gouged ou and split open.

2. She can cut up all of their stands or them as soon as she closes the distance

Does she have enough layers for NPI?

3. Danmaku wont work on her so hierphant green is useless

Can she even see the Stands? Need layered ESP for that. Also the danmaku can be omnidirecional. Not withstanding the Stand in question can also enter bodies and physically control them via possession.

4. star platinum and Silver chariot get outskilled

And she gets blitzed 10,000x over. Like, even speed equal, stands are lowered relative to the user.

6. Theresia also has the AP and Dura advantage

But not the LS advantage against someone who can easily put her in a lock. Even HG, with his nigh-unlimited range can restrict her.

7. King crimsons heat would be pretty ineffective against Theresia due to her resistance

You should probably stop talking....

Theresia should take this pretty comfortably

The main issue is her stat advantage, but a few of the dudes here have duraneg or methods to incap, which should be exceptionally easy to pull off if they work as a team when factoring in their Stands' speed.

 

[AThe1412]

Which gonna do nothing

She can't.

• Intangibility, Incorporeality (Stands are the incorporeal manifestations of one's vital energy, and can only be harmed by other Stands),

The Danmaku that is invisible, she can't block, and can come from all directions. Hierophant Green also can posses her.
She can dodge invisible attacks, so i give her that.



Hamom.

• Vibration & Energy Manipulation (Through a unique breathing technique, Hamon users can draw out vibrations from their blood flow and create energy waves with the properties of sunlight, capable of transferring it towards objects and people. This can be used to harm any opponent weak to sunlight through contact with any living or non-living thing charged with Hamon), Durability Negation (via Hamon)

True.

King Crimsom wow

True.

Meh.

I can't exactly find a compatible match for her with a stand user, unfortunelly.

Also, now that you gave Jotaro time stop, what's stopping him from disarming and restraining her with Star Platinum's far higher Lifting Strength?

 

[Zabazab]

She has the aprecog to know everything the Stands will do by watching the users.

And she gets blitzed 10,000x over. Like, even speed equal, stands are lowered relative to the user.

Are the stands not equalized to her speed, rather than her equalized to the user's speed? If so, lol. lmao, even.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

But not the LS advantage against someone who can easily put her in a lock. Even HG, with his nigh-unlimited range can restrict her.

And Avdol's Red Bind, right?

 

[Chariot190]

She has the aprecog to know everything the Stands will do by watching the users.

Uh
No?
The **** is watching the users gonna do? They don't have any tells at all that would implicate what the stands doing besides Joseph half the time. Especially for Those like Star Platinum who do their own thing half the time.

Are the stands not equalized to her speed, rather than equalized to the user's speed? If so, lol. lmao, even.

They are, but it's relative, so say Kakyin gets reduced 1000x to be equal to her speed, and HG is 20x faster than Kak. HG is still getting reduced by 1000x, but he still holds that 20x discrepancy to Kak. goes in reverse too, Hermit Purple is actually slower than everyone here.

 

[Chariot190]

And Avdol's Red Bind, right?

Forgot about that but yeah, it could restrain Judgement who has like a Class 50 throwing feat.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

She has the aprecog to know everything the Stands will do by watching the users.

Wouldn't she just see the group STANDing there? Because I don't think precog on its own will allow her to see the stands.

 

[Zabazab]

Uh
No?
The **** is watching the users gonna do? They don't have any tells at all that would implicate what the stands doing besides Joseph half the time. Especially for Those like Star Platinum who do their own thing half the time.

She can predict invisible, unsensable, intangible attacks by watching the attacker. Among the Crusaders they absolutely fully control what their Stand does aside from the occasional life-or-death instinctive action like with Star Platinum.

I should clarify too that if the Stand's speeds are unchanged then Theresia can't really do nothin'.

 

[Chariot190]

She can predict invisible, unsensable, intangible attacks by watching the attacker. Among the Crusaders they absolutely fully control what their Stand does aside from the occasional life-or-death instinctive action like with Star Platinum.

I read that, and that's not at all the same. Read what it actually says, she was able to dodge the invisible attacks, because she could feel "their aim" or their movements or where their eyes were looking while aiming, etc, all tells that the group here lack.
None of the Crusaders do that, it's literally as simple as "I will my Stand to this", and the Stand does, it's thought-based and often sub-conscious too, a command the Stand will carry out. Jotaro doesn't look at the foe and think "i want plat to punch their arm, then leg, then grab their back and-" while aiming, he just thinks "plat, kick their ass". He can interject for more detailed commands but it's still something controlled entirely by his fighting will. And Plat acts on its own half the time anyway, Jotaro actually has to reign him in.

The example here, and how all but one of the crusaders fight, are not comparable.

The best she has is she can sense bloodlust, but be real, they arent going to have that much bloodlust, they're just gonna want to incap her and get her to **** off, and that's presuming she could sense the bloodlust of a stand.
and it wouldnt matter, speed discrepancy go brrr

 

[Zabazab]

I read that, and that's not at all the same. Read what it actually says, she was able to dodge the invisible attacks, because she could feel "their aim" or their movements or where their eyes were looking while aiming, etc, all tells that the group here lack.

The aim of the opponent- where they intend to attack- is read through by watching breathing, eye movements, and hostility.

Do the Crusader's attack out of sync with their breathing and gaze? If so I'd like to see evidence.

I'd especially like to see evidence that they don't have hostility when they intend to harm someone.

 

[Chariot190]

The aim of the opponent- where they intend to attack- is read through by watching breathing, eye movements, and hostility.

Yes, none of which plays into how they attack, except Joseph, because hamon requires special breathing and channeling.
Everyone else is literally just telling someone else to attack basically. This would be like arguing you could figure out what an assassin is doing, by watching the employer while they're at home drinking.

Do the Crusader's attack out of sync with their breathing and gaze? If so I'd like to see evidence.

My dude, their attacks don't even come from them, they come from completely different entities.
The whole concept of a Stand is your evidence.
Half the time they're doing their own shit, like Akira playing guitar of all things while his Stand beats the shit out of others, or Angelo sitting in a tree eating some fast food while his Stand ***** around. Hell, they can even attack in conjunction with their Stand like Dio does.



Like does it look like Jotaro is actively aiming or looking wherever while Plat beats the shit out of everything including those behind him
Burden of proof ain't on me here brother.

I'd especially like to see evidence that they don't have hostility when they intend to harm someone.

Because they don't? "Bloodlust" and "man she's ******* annoying, knock her out and let's continue" aren't quite the same thing, notwithstanding she lacks the ESP to sense a Stand's hostility so...
Not that it matters, by the time she senses anything it'd have already happened.

 

[Fezzih_007]

I already equalized speed for both of them.

 

[Chariot190]

Then the match can't be added. You basically did the equilavent of equilzing a character's gun to their own speed, removing one of the guns' main gimmicks.
I don't think I should need to clarify, but the Stands being faster than the user is part of their abilities, especially that of Plat and Chariot. It'd be like taking away Astrea's sword.

 

[Zabazab]

My dude, their attacks don't even come from them, they come from completely different entities.
The whole concept of a Stand is your evidence.
Half the time they're doing their own shit, like Akira playing guitar of all things while his Stand beats the shit out of others, or Angelo sitting in a tree eating some fast food while his Stand ***** around. Hell, they can even attack in conjunction with their Stand like Dio does.

Polnareff has to be able see an opponent to aim with Silver Chariot, which was seen in the Ebony Devil fight. Joseph has to display the inside of his head on a TV so Ponareff and Kakyoin know what they're doing. Jotaro was blinded by DIO's blood and had to guess to match THE WORLD's kick. None of the Crusaders use automatic tracking stands, like Sheer Heart Attack, or Empress, or Doobie Wah.

The intention of an attack can be read from the minute changes in eye movement and breathing.

Because they don't? "Bloodlust" and "man she's ******* annoying, knock her out and let's continue" aren't quite the same thing, notwithstanding she lacks the ESP to sense a Stand's hostility so...

The Crusader's Stands aren't seperate individuals, they're extensions of themself. A Stand User attacking someone with their Stand is hostility. Trying to hit someone- fatally or not- is a hostile act.

Not that it matters, by the time she senses anything it'd have already happened.

I agree.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Then the match can't be added. You basically did the equilavent of equilzing a character's gun to their own speed, removing one of the guns' main gimmicks.
I don't think I should need to clarify, but the Stands being faster than the user is part of their abilities, especially that of Plat and Chariot. It'd be like taking away Astrea's sword.

Cool, ok then.

Is speed equal again then, and the stand users speedblitz now.

 

[Epiccheev]

They might strike a pose while attacking or smth at best

 

[Zabazab]

Cool, ok then.

Is speed equal again then, and the stand users speedblitz now.

The Crusaders now view her in hyper slow-motion and just Stand Rush her with SP until she's breaks. A 4-5x differences isn't enough to stand up to 1000s of attacks.

Speedblitz stomp!

 

[Fezzih_007]

Well, they do yell the stand names, so yeah.

 

[Chariot190]

Polnareff has to be able see an opponent to aim with Silver Chariot, which was seen in the Ebony Devil fight. Joseph has to display the inside of his head on a TV so Ponareff and Kakyoin know what they're doing. Jotaro was blinded by DIO's blood and had to guess to match THE WORLD's kick. None of the Crusaders use automatic tracking stands, like Sheer Heart Attack, or Empress, or Doobie Wah.

What? Polnareff yes, because his Stand is actually blind, and he must direct it, that is a specific weakness to him. But at the same time, as long as Chariot knows where to go, its precision and abilities enable it to take some leeway.

Kak, no. Kak didn't need such help, as I'm sure you'd know by the numerous times throughout Kak could attack from wherever, while doing whatever.

Your TV example is bad, because they never once say they used a TV because they couldn't see, but rather, to locate where The Lovers was with him based on Joseph's initial dialogue.
It's actually quite ironic too as Kakyoin makes mention of his surroundings or what actions they're about to take based on the environment, while the TV is showing something completely different. Kakyoin does not have this unique weakness (In fact, Ebony Devil itself actually points out Chariot in particular is a Stand that can't fight while Pol cannot see! This isn't the standard).

Jotaro was blinded by blood and guess what happened? Not much.
Blinding Jotaro would blind Plat, and blinding Plat would blind Jotaro, but Plat doesn't need to see what Jotaro is seeing to attack, they still have their own sense of vision, like if Jotaro is looking one way and Plat another, they're obviously going to be looking at different shit.
I hope I don't need to explain how Stands and users are linked physically (Plat's eyes were closed due to the blood). Like yeah obviously if Jotaro becomes blind, Plat will become blind too, doesn't mean Plat requires Jotaro to be looking at the same thing as him to see thou.

Automatic tracking stands are an even worse example, but that doesn't change the fact that normal Stands are entirely thought-based, sentient, and can attack without the user needing to actively look at the thing being attacked.

The intention of an attack can be read from the minute changes in eye movement and breathing.

Do I need to systematically gather the literal thousands of times a Stand attacking while the user wasn't looking at what was being attacked or doing something else? Or was the blatant example I already gave no sufficient enough?

The Crusader's Stands aren't seperate individuals, they're extensions of themself. A Stand User attacking someone with their Stand is hostility. Trying to hit someone- fatally or not- is a hostile act.

They effectively are, HG and Plat are sentient for example, they have their own body, image, and will.
They might be extensions of the user, but there's a damn good reason why everyone here, give or take, has Multiple Selves Type 2.

Breathing? My dude Jotaro's popped some cigs before while Plat does whatever Plat does. Joseph needs special breathing, the most any other Stand needs is breathing based on the fact that suffocating tends to **** with one's ability to manifest a stand, but so does getting stabbed or shot in the head or any other type of harm.

 

[Fezzih_007]

The Crusaders now view her in hyper slow-motion and just Stand Rush her with SP until she's breaks. A 4-5x differences isn't enough to stand up to 1000s of attacks.

Speedblitz stomp!

Not really a stomp, because Theresia can win this by cutting them once.
She could achive this too, even with the speed diference.

 

[Chariot190]

Not really a stomp, because Theresia can win this by cutting them once.
She could achive this too, even with the speed diference.

I would agree, after all, everyone here has low range, just attack before they can make use of that speed stomp. But Hierophant Green, of all things, MVP's this. It has an insane range and is quite a bit above Kak. It should be able to restrain her with tendrils or just possess her before she ever gets a chance to do anything, unlike Plat or something that needs Jotaro to get close still, HG blitzes and doesn't need Kak to move an inch, while actually having a method or two of incap.
tbh if not for Kak they'd lose pretty hard at any notable distance unless Jotaro had time stop

 

[Fezzih_007]

Right.
Can i count you vote then?

 

[Chariot190]

this is a huge mismatch imo based on the rules
HG saves the day 10/10 times, she has no chance
But if HG is removed and she just swings once and stat stomps due to range because the only other win conditions would be OOC for Jotaro, require Hermit Purple & Hamon which doesn't have the funny speed bullshit due to Joseph's speed being just as high. Only chance they'd have is Red Bind but idk if Avdol would lead with that
Pol and Iggy useless tbh even if they got a chance to attack

 

[Fezzih_007]

Hm makes sense, alright i gonna ask to someone to close this.

I will make another match with them Against with another character.