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The commoners thread: Discussing Ultima's "On the Many, Many Incoherences of the Tiering System"

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Me, I was downgraded from two uncountably infinite levels above Tier 0 to one uncountably infinite level above Tier 0. Ultima!!!
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jesse-pinkman-aaron-paul-cant-keep-getting-away-with-this-breaking-bad.gif
 
I can't actually think of a math verse that could be downgraded. Like, SRE also has R>F stuff (the math is more about how many r>f stuff there are), and I don't remember other 1A and above math verse.
 
Oh, I thought that The Goddess of Manifold got downgraded. Yeah, the verse might get downgraded if Ultima's thread passes.
 
"Strong objections" is a bit funny. I mean they disagree hugely, but the actual arguments they make don't seem well supported or great enough to hold back the proposal tbh.

DT has been clobbered multiple times now, and Agnaa's post was pretty low-effort imo.

The current staff vote is hugely in Ultima's favor, with many administrators on that side.
 
Phoenks said:
"Strong objections" is a bit funny.

DT has been clobbered multiple times now, and Agnaa's post was pretty low-effort imo.
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What I mean by "strong objections" is "strong disagreement," and DT in particular holds far too much authority as a bureaucrat to be overruled merely by being outvoted.
 
BasedNecoScaler69 said:
antvasima thought ultimas proposal seemed fine, so it evens out. (probably). best case scenario this gets stonewalled for another 6 months and applied after that
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Bureaucrats are not permitted to cancel each other's vetoes.
 
Phoenks said:
He has been outvoted and overruled by a liege of staff members before.

Big example being the infamous SCP Foundation upgrade. He was the only one who opposed it out of a huge group of staff, and so it was concluded that he simply couldn't hold back the entire upgrade by himself.
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The veto only applies to wiki policy revisions, not verse upgrades, so DT couldn't have vetoed that, anyhow. The only time I know that DT's vote on a staff thread was overruled was when Fuji changed Transduality to Nonduality, and in that case, it was only because he refused to respond to defend himself for months on end, which definitely won't happen here.
 
IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
The veto only applies to wiki policy revisions, not verse upgrades, so DT couldn't have vetoed that, anyhow. The only time I know that DT's vote on a staff thread was overruled was when Fuji changed Transduality to Nonduality, and in that case, it was only because he refused to respond to defend himself for months on end, which definitely won't happen here.
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vsbattles.com

THAT SCP Revision (Yes, it's High 1-A)

Well if he is busy he doesn't need to make a complete response. He can at least just come and tell whether he will make another response later or not.
vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
 
Yo ultima, (Ik you arent really advocating for a change but still keeping op title as this because i mean what did you think would happen)

So overall I think all points made are great, however an issue that I am having is where you would rank further hierarchical dimensions as weve currently defined them

So from what ive seen, it seems you are proposing a tier below 11c to account for qualitatively inferior layers, and that 1A and above would change from talk of higher infinity dimensions to qualitatively superior layers, and that all higher infinity dimensions would be a sort of "high 1b+.

However i dont think that what effectively acts as all of low 1a, 1a, high 1a, and 0 currently to be shoved into high 1b+. What i think should happen is these sorts of higher levels of infinities with regards to dimensions and such, like inaccessible as described with high 1a (and basically the whole range of either high 1b through 0 or low 1a through 0) to be its own tier.

I think that this topic has been delved into quite heavily in many fictional verses as we see with the many characters in this tiering range (even though many characters should be in different spots due to the issues you mentioned in your post. Not all of them change).

So i basically think there should be 14 tier ranges instead of the 12 now. A range below 11 as you said, all of the current ones, transfinite dimensional tier range (which is what the current low 1a to 0 is), and then the qualitatively superior range above this that you refer to in your post. Then 0 of course. Or maybe not its own entire section but you get the gist

Thoughts on this?
 
demonwarrior2266 said:
Yo ultima, (Ik you arent really advocating for a change but still keeping op title as this because i mean what did you think would happen)

So overall I think all points made are great, however an issue that I am having is where you would rank further hierarchical dimensions as weve currently defined them

So from what ive seen, it seems you are proposing a tier below 11c to account for qualitatively inferior layers, and that 1A and above would change from talk of higher infinity dimensions to qualitatively superior layers, and that all higher infinity dimensions would be a sort of "high 1b+.

However i dont think that what effectively acts as all of low 1a, 1a, high 1a, and 0 currently to be shoved into high 1b+. What i think should happen is these sorts of higher levels of infinities with regards to dimensions and such, like inaccessible as described with high 1a (and basically the whole range of either high 1b through 0 or low 1a through 0) to be its own tier.

I think that this topic has been delved into quite heavily in many fictional verses as we see with the many characters in this tiering range (even though many characters should be in different spots due to the issues you mentioned in your post. Not all of them change).

So i basically think there should be 14 tier ranges instead of the 12 now. A range below 11 as you said, all of the current ones, transfinite dimensional tier range (which is what the current low 1a to 0 is), and then the qualitatively superior range above this that you refer to in your post. Then 0 of course. Or maybe not its own entire section but you get the gist

Thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
The amount of verses we have that use actual cardinality as a way to get to 1-A instead of metaphysical transcendence is countable on two hands. Shoving all of them into High 1-B+ is eminently reasonable, and an entire tier section for them is utterly superflous.
 
IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
As I said, that isn't even a staff thread.
Click to expand...
And? That was big enough to be a staff thread, it simply wasn't. There isn't much of a difference anyway, since threads regardless require staff input to be passed.

A Bureaucrat (at the time) confirming that DT can't just wall a verse revision means that likely applies to any thread. As it SHOULD.

It would be incredibly bad standard if DT's position allows him to halt whatever he doesn't agree with on his own.
 
Phoenks said:
And? That was big enough to be a staff thread, it simply wasn't. There isn't much of a difference anyway, since threads regardless require staff input to be passed.

A Bureaucrat (at the time) confirming that DT can't just wall a verse revision means that likely applies to any thread. As it SHOULD.

It would be incredibly bad standard if DT's position allows him to halt whatever he doesn't agree with on his own.
Click to expand...
Bureaucrats are only allowed to veto staff threads about wiki policy, not merely big, controversial CRTs that were placed in the staff forum to better moderate them.
 
I do agree with Phoenks though. Regardless of veto power and all of that, DT shouldn't be able to stonewall a revision where virtually he is the only opposing force (He isn't, Agnaa is another which is why I said virtually the only opposing force). There is putting him to a higher approving standard as Bureaucrat, and then there is that crap which would potentially cause the entire revision to be delayed for months even with virtually every other staff being in agreement with it.
 
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