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In short, I'm talking about the fact that both of them should be tier 0 because of their complete unity with the force.
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Star Wars Legends Cosmology Revision (Episode II: Attack of the 1-A God-Tiers)
- Thread starter StoneKillerz12
- Start date
Epyriel
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I mean, debatably at the moment of their amp, but not as Force ghosts.
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- Thread starter
- #243
Also FYI, Type 2 Beyond-Dimensional Existence and Type 9 immortality should be added for GM Luke, Abeloth, and The Ones.
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Yes, I absolutely agree, I was going to mention this, but I was thinking that this is not the subject of crt, and you had Acausality type 5 in your sandbox profile.
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There is the Non Canonical Star Force Unleash DlC where Starkiller actively fights against a Ghost Obi Wan.
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just realized something for the Force Ghost.
We see in Return of the Jedi later edition.
Obi Wan sitting down on a Tree since the Original Trilogy is canonical to Legends and Disney Canon.
youtube.com
We see in Return of the Jedi later edition.
Obi Wan sitting down on a Tree since the Original Trilogy is canonical to Legends and Disney Canon.
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Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.
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Epyriel
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Right, there is a reason that isn’t canonical.
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So this isn’t true especially since we see Obi Wan sitting down while talking to Luke regarding his father.
The fact we see him sitting down and as such, I don’t think Force Ghosts has that limitation.
However, in the case of Qui Gon and those who manage to reach Force Ghost status, they can’t linger forever and will eventually return to the Force if memories serve me right
Epyriel
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I mean, I’m not sure sitting down really proves anything aside perhaps the barest tangibility.
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It can when you sitting down on a physical object and not a ghostly object in this case.
Also apparently in one specific case, a True Force Ghost was able to actually manage to touch someone.
“I was able to touch you because we are connected by the Force. I drew on your link with the Force to become more solid, just as I draw on it now to become visible to you.”
THE GHOST OF AIDAN BOK TO TASH ARRANDA
Galaxy of Fear: Ghost of the Jedi
Galaxy of Fear: Ghost of the Jedi is the fifth book in the young readers Star Wars: Galaxy of Fear series. ISBN 0553484540; July 7, 1997, Bantam Skylark, 144-page paperback ISBN 0553506560; November 1997, Bantam Spectra, 149-page paperback Tash, Zak, and their uncle Hoole are on the run from...
starwars.fandom.com
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Unfortunately I don’t have the book in question, but assuming the quote is legitimate, then that is the case of a light side Force Ghost able to interact with the physical world in Legends.
Epyriel
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In the most marginal sense of the word ‘interact’.
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Again, apparently this Aidan was talking to a living person when he was interacting with Tash who apparently is the MC of the novel and isn’t dead
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I don’t see any reason to keep dragging this on especially if we have a Legend novel that specifically mentions a Jedi Force Ghost being capable of interacting with the physical world if they are able to touch someone and is outright stated to being “more solid” due to a link to the Force making it stronger too.
Edit: In additional to that, I do disagree with Tier 0 Force Ghost though
Edit: In additional to that, I do disagree with Tier 0 Force Ghost though
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Agree & Following. VSBW treating Star Wars better than Disney.
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so where do you think it should scale?
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Tbh, probably Unknown since Force Ghost don’t really have any actual AP feats despite being capable of interacting with the physical world and all
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- #258
Personally, I feel that Force Ghosts are High 1-A+/0 when in the Netherworld of The Force, Variable while projecting into reality
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There are many writings suggesting that Force Ghosts merge with the Force, so I agree with Mr. Stonkillerz.
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Idk if that contradicts how tier 0 works.
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I did some research, and Force Ghosts unite with the Living Force, not the true Force, so they should be lower than 0.
Aren’t Force Ghosts appearing as avatars? How is this considered an anti-feat?
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Or I’ll remain neutral about Force Ghosts for now.
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- #263
It doesn't really. High 1-A+ makes the most sense given it's meant to be a vessel in which Tier 0 characters' power acts throughout, which is what Oneness, at least in Jacen's case is.
The Force cannot be separated by differing qualities and ontologies between realms and realities (I.E the difference between Beyond Shadows and the physical world having no distinction between what the Force is), it has no duality nor distinct parts other than itself, and all things in reality are one in the same, with differentiation not existing and the Force being all that truly exists, and the Force being perfect, self-sufficient, and dependent on none. All of these are the key criteria for Tier 0:
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- #264
Given that Force Ghosts would be avatars of The Froce itself, High 1-A+ makes much more sense than 0, as they are manifestations of a Tier 0 force acting throughout reality.
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Or there’s a second option: their forms appearing as spirits could be High 1-A+, while their true selves might be at 0. I actually think it’s confirmed that merging with God is at 0 because Ultima opened a CRT about Shiki's connection to the Root, suggesting it would grant a 0 rating. So, I’m sure Ultima agrees that merging with God is at 0. I’ll provide panels about Force Ghosts soon. Their manifestations as spirits might be separate from their true selves, or they could be the same and rated either High 1-A+ or 0.
TegamiBachi25
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Curious, how many layers of the Force will there be for mindhax, soul hax via Force Drain, and other Force abilities? I've heard long ago that there were layers to SW mindhax. Will that be discussed in the next CRT once this one gets accepted?
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After the cursed cosmology CRT is finished, I’ll undertake a massive hax revision, but this will happen only if Mr. Stonkillerz doesn’t proceed with his own hax revision. However, I don’t think everyone will receive layered abilities; I remember there are certain characters involved. Still, it’s possible—yes, I need to check.
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Bump
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Bump
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I mean unless the other CRT where there can somehow be multiple profiles with tier 0 by virtue of them being the same entity as tier 0 "source", I don't really agree with 0, but maybe High 1-A+. Is there really that much that speaks about their nature?
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"True" Oneness (I.E what Jacen and debatably Luke were able to achieve in the Yuuzhang Vong War) involves the user dissolving fully into the Force, and in the process abandoning any and all forms of individuality and material essence (which as Beyond Shadows establishes do not truly exist) and become a conduit and vessel of the Force's will. (the only thing that truly exists with there being nothing distinct or separate from it, completely ineffable and beyond duality).
I do agree that High 1-A+ feels more sensible, as "true" Oneness involves the user being everywhere and nowhere simultaneously and also turns them into a vessel of the Force (a Tier 0 entity/concept)'s will. Being the "will" or "vessel" of a Tier 0 entity is established by Ultima as High 1-A+. God/The Magician from SiTM's profile demonstrates this.
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Wasn't that same luke still fighting with the vong. So I don't think that would count as tier 0
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That was Luke's physical avatar. His true self was acting as a vessel for a Tier 0 entity, thus being High 1-A+. His physical avatar is 1-A.
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