Soul Of Cinder (Dark Souls) Vs Saber (Fate)

[A_Hero_Long_Forgotten]

Soul Of cinder

Saber (Somebody find a picture that fits the screen)


Location: Kiln of the first flame (Soul Of Cinders boss room)

Saber is affected by basic dark souls laws such as poise.

Speed Equalized

Saber Will not use excaliblasts Right Away. (In guts vs Saber people said stuff like "Saber immediately uses excaliblast and wins")


Soul Of Cinder 0

Saber 2

Soul https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Soul_of_Cinder

Saber https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Saber

 

[ShinyMagicalGirl]

Hmm, much closer than I thought. However, you may want to speed equalize since SOC is only Supersonic.

His arsenal is pretty diverse, being a mage and many more. He's definitely plenty skilled too. Like, REALLY skilled. And even without Excaliblast, she's still City level, since Excaliblast is Mountain to small island.

Also, the only reason I said "Saber immediately uses excaliblast and wins" is because I doubt Guts would survive it... However this guy just might. But since you banned Excaliblast in early fight, this fight is very close. I might give it to Cinder, provided that this is speed equalized. He might be able to defeat Arturia before she gets a chance to Excaliblast him.

 

[Xmark12]

Which Saber are we talking about here? Fate/Zero, Fate/Stay Night, or UBW?

 

[A_Hero_Long_Forgotten]

Fate/Zero. She's at her strongest there right?

 

[ShinyMagicalGirl]

Fate/Zero. She's at her strongest there right?

Oh... Fate/Zero, huh? Actually, Fate/UBW has the strongest non-Excalibur stats, due to being 7-A physically. Fate/Zero is City level, meaning the gap in power between Saber and Cinder isn't too far (SoC is Small City, but is likely much higher while FZ Saber is around City level).

 

[A_Hero_Long_Forgotten]

Ok. UBW then.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Hmm, much closer than I thought. However, you may want to speed equalize since SOC is only Supersonic.
His arsenal is pretty diverse, being a mage and many more. He's definitely plenty skilled too. Like, REALLY skilled. And even without Excaliblast, she's still City level, since Excaliblast is Mountain to small island.

The OP didn't say that she can't use Excaliblast at all, just not right at the beggining. This doesn't change the fact that SoC Durability is lower than Saber's, his Stamina is practically zero compared to Saber's. Also his AP is considerably lower, Saber is Mountain level with physical strikes.

Not to mention the fact that Saber is completely immune to magic so his sorceries will not cut it against her. Also she has regen and Precog so I really doubt SoC has a good chance here.

Even if things turn sour, Saber will use Excaliblast even if she can't use it right away.

Saber takes this with low-mid difficulty.

 

[ShinyMagicalGirl]

Um, I said "But since you banned Excaliblast in early fight". Of course I knew about that.

Also, changing my vote since his magic skills will be weak towards Saber. His advantage over elemental magic is shielded by Saber's own magic resistance. Can't believe I missed that...

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Also, changing my vote since his magic skills will be weak towards Saber.

Can you do that? xD

Also OP seems to be in a swordfight craze lately: Guts, Zabuza, SoC, Saber, Arthas

 

[ShinyMagicalGirl]

Can you do that? xD

Also OP seems to be in a swordfight craze lately: Guts, Zabuza, SoC, Saber, Arthas

Hey, swordfights are cool by default. And yeah, you can shift your vote. So sorry, SoC.. It's just that Saber has crazy resistance to magic..

 

[A_Hero_Long_Forgotten]

But he rarely uses his magic as its his weakest form. They are Soul Sorceries anyway so I'm not sure they are useless. Instead he frequently uses his sword/spear/curved sword/great sword and faith. Keep in mind miracles are not magic. He uses them in almost every form. He throws sunlight spears (the most powerful miracle) and can make a large amount of lightning spear come from above.

Remember he is the culmination of EVERY lord of cinder. The abyss watchers who would topple kingdoms at the first sign of the abyss spreading. Yhorm the giant who would crush armies by himself (and has the highest health pool in the game. you require a gimmick to beat him). Gwyn the first lord of cinder who with his army of knights killed the ancient dragons. Holy prince Lothric who... Well he was a VERY tough boss... Aldrich the Devourer who ATE Gwyndolin, a God. And most of all The player character from the first game who beat Gwyn and everyone else from the first game. Actually. That means the player from the second game too.


Just something to think about.

 

[A_Hero_Long_Forgotten]

Woah. What happened to my post? It's so small...

Edit: Never Mind I fixed it.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Keep in mind miracles are not magic. He uses them in almost every form. He throws sunlight spears (the most powerful miracle) and can make a large amount of lightning spear come from above.

Taken from the Dark Souls Wikia:

Miracles are a type of Magic in Dark Souls 3. This type of Magic usually does Lightning Damage and scales primarily off the Faith stat. Miracles can only be cast by wielding Talismans or Chimes.

Pretty much useless.

Also

Remember he is the culmination of EVERY lord of cinder.

With respect but, this is reflected in his stats so I don't think quoting lore here is going to do anything. If you read the lore of Saber's Excalibur and Rhongomyniad(Saber's spear), you'll get the idea that those weapons hold the world together and act as literal pillars. Also Excalibur is the materialization of wishes and desires of all past, present and future warriors, essentially being infinite. Lore isn't the best of arguments when it comes to battle debates

 

[A_Hero_Long_Forgotten]

I said miracles aren't the same as magic because someone with a magic shield immune to all forms of magic can still be hurt by miracles. Of course it says it's a type of magic. What else would you classify it as? Even in other fantasy verses it's called holy magic. But in dark souls miracles aren't affected by any amount of magic defense. The wiki calls it magic. But the lore states it's something entirely different. That was my point.

You're right by the way. Lore isn't always the best of arguments. I just thought I'd mention all that.

 

[HikaroSena]

Well if he is the culmination of all the lords of cinder from ages long past, then the feats of previous lords of cinders have to be considered if that was the case. I mean, the statement itself means you need to do so at least right?

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

I vote for SoC. Miracles and pyromancies can still hurt Saber, as they are not affected by magic resistances, and considering they are "soul sorceries", SoC's sorceries would still be partially effective due to soul manipulation. Plus he can buff himself with Power Within and summon a independently and constantly reapplying Homing Soul Mass, which will create openings in Saber's guard in a sword fight, or at least force her to retreat

 

[ThunderClap448]

SoC for Monarch's reasoning.

 

[Lux_capacitor]

I feel that SoC wins and not just because of magic. As it is stated, he is the culmination of all Souls of Cinder, AKA EVERY undead that has relit the first flame. Considering that Saber has only lived a regular human's lifespan and losing her memories every resummoning, she is probably outclassed in pure skill and knowledge even when their fighting with just swords, as SoC is, as stated, the culmination of Souls of cinder. Hence why they are so proficient in many arts and this is mastered as its taking, not learning, the skills and knowledge of these souls. He after all used all of Gwyn's techniques and moves and even adding new ones, but lets just say that he's always known them.

Though I can understand that Excalibur can pretty much take him down, he would've been able to dodge the tip of the strike, which is the only part that will hurt them. I am not sure if they will be blinded by the light considering that we don't know if it even sees through normal means. Also, Saber requires both arms in their prime condition to work, which would be a possible way to beat her using Excalibur by cripping her before her even trying.

And he's probably got defense and support magics that will help in his fight against Saber if those are considered also part of him, which if so then he can also buff his stength, defense, stamina recovery, magic, and many more.

 

[Xmark12]

Uhhh, Saber doesn't loose her memories every resummoning though.

 

[Lux_capacitor]

Well I did say that if she did lose her memories, because I forgot about the quirks connected to her being a special case Heroic spirit, I still believe my points still stand. SoC has way more knowledge and skills in nearly if not every known martial arts and then some. They can find many ways to beat Saber and if you try to consider the kinds of strategies just a knight has when dealing with opponents, they would have some pretty dirty strategies that Saber may find a challenge fighting against especially when her fight with Lancer in Zero has anything to go by when she's up against an opponent with unknown abilities. And if she does find a counter to one of their skill sets, then they can just switch it up instantly and frequently. Not only that they can, again, keep themselves alive with empowerment magic and healing magic on top of their wide plethora of offensive magics.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Yeah, SoC wins via versatility and experience

 

[Lux_capacitor]

Let me also add that this is considering Kiritsugu as her master, as if it were to be Shirou she's pretty much ******.

 

[Hizack123]

SoC, win VIA

1:wait for enemy to attack

2arry.

3:riposte

4:if enemy (i repeat, enemy) try to runaway, use your arsenal of range weapon and magic to make them regret that decision.

5:repeat step above

6:win.

..........

Ok now real talk, SoC win due to experience and versatility.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Dark Souls I think is going under revision. Until then this is a stomp in favor of Saber since Cinder's stats are much lower. Closing this.