Solaris AP Revision.

[KurotheStrong]

I do not want an argument. Please be civil, I beg of you.

Solaris is not Multi-Universal, Timelines have nothing to do with a Multiverse as a whole. This has to do with branching paths of a decision similar to how the Legend of Zelda has three known timelines, or how there are "what ifs" in comics, yes they are "multiverses", but not in the sense that they are brand new worlds.

From my knowledge of timelines, this would effectively mean there are an infinite number of them, thus it would be considered a Multiversal Feat, am I correct? Eggman stated that "all existing timelines" would be affected. Not just "the past, the present and the future", Sonic, Shadow and Silver had to attack him in three places simultaneously, which ironically, would also give them feats of either Infinite or Immeasurable speed as effectively, they must attack a being that exists in three different existences simultaneously.

The main problem here is, Solaris would in fact be Multiversal.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Timeline = Space-Time Continuum.

Timeline being split into two = Space-Time Continuum becomes two.

So yes, it has everything to do with multiverse.

 

[KurotheStrong]

Then I do not understand the issue. All existing timelines means everything, even branching ones. Would he still not be Multiversal? It would make no sense if it was only "three" as the AP is implying.

 

[Assaltwaffle]

Is there any indication that the sonic verse has more than 1,000 universes/timelines? If Eggman is referring to anything less than 1,001 timelines then this is still 2-C.

Also unless explicitly stated we cannot assume that "all possibilities are different timelines" we cannot give him 2-B (this isn't even 2-A b/c even if you rearrange even 1 atom 1 Planck length away from its previous position that still wouldn't wind up being an infinite number of options/variations). Unless stated a character won't reach 2-A.

 

[KurotheStrong]

I don't understand what you're talking about. He's attacking all existing timelines, that makes him Multiversal. I don't know how to sum it up for you any better than that.

 

[The_Everlasting]

There needs to be over 1,000 timelines for Solaris to be 2-B/Multiversal.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

What they said.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

2 to 1000 timelines = Multi-Universal

1001 or more timelines = Multiversal

Even if he is attacking all of them, there would have to be more than 1001 timelines, or else it would still be Muti-Universal.

 

[KurotheStrong]

http://sonic.wikia.com/wiki/Maginaryworld

And even still all existing timelines would still be Multiversal, so I still don't get it.

 

[Dark649]

It's not implied if Solaris was affecting these words since 2-B Illumina rules them, also i have to downgrade Solaris and Time Eater speeds to match those that fought them.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Doesn't the Time Eater scale from 2-C Super Sonic? Just asking.

 

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

No ya don't.

Theur speed is fine. Its the weaker ones that don't scale due it being an outlier, not the stronger one getting scaled to them.

 

[KurotheStrong]

It's not implied if Solaris was affecting these words since 2-B Illumina rules them, also i have to downgrade Solaris and Time Eater speeds to match those that fought them.

Solaris' speed shouldn't be downgraded as he was still Nigh-Omnipotent, he existed in three places at once, so I don't know how that is going to pan out.

I understand Time Eater, though.

 

[KurotheStrong]

Doesn't the Time Eater scale from 2-C Super Sonic? Just asking.

The Time Eater destroyed and displaced Sonic's Canon Timeline, he's Universal.

 

[Dark649]

If they scale in Ap to Solaris, why it should be outlier for the speed, especially if they kept with him?. Time Eater to did not brought both Super Sonic to their full power, this is why it doesn't scale to Solaris nor the Eggwizard.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

But he fought Super Sonic, who is 2-C, or was it an outlier?

 

[Dark649]

But he fought Super Sonic, who is 2-C, or was it an outlier?

Super Sonic is 2-C at the true maxinum power and they both stomped Time Eater.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Ok then.

 

[KurotheStrong]

But he fought Super Sonic, who is 2-C, or was it an outlier?

The Time Eater before the battle was actually afraid of the Chaos Emeralds, showing that they were more powerful than him (one Emerald was enough to frighten him away). The reason why he has his attack potency is because of his time controlling and manipulation hax and the ability to fight two S. Sonics.

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

I'm pretty sure its Sonic who scales to Solaris thus being 2-C.

 

[KurotheStrong]

I'm pretty sure its Sonic who scales to Solaris thus being 2-C.

Super Sonic at his maximum, is the supposed manifestation of the Chaos Emeralds at their fullest potential, along with any other Super Form fighting against the strongest enemy they fought, potentially all Super Forms powered by the Chaos and Sol Emeralds have the ability to do what Sonic did, he's not that "special" he's just the most seen user of it.

The Chaos Emeralds obviously have a limit, we think that it's Multi-versal because that's what has been seen so far.

 

[Dark649]

Kuro is right.

 

[ED_INFINITUM]

What about all the other dimensions?Sol Zone,Chaotic inferno,Cyber Track,all the Emerald Dimensions which are different in each game which amount to 100+,shouldn't those scale Solaris to 100 or more times baseline 2-C at least?

 

[KurotheStrong]

Special Zones are different dimensions but there is no confirmation of how large they are, however, things like the Sol Universe, Sonic Booms three different dimensions (Knuckles is competent, Mirror World from Where have all the Sonic's Gone, Eggman's "Brother" being from the Future), Ifrit's Parallel Dimension, the Fact that Sonic takes place in either two universes or two parallel earths possibly, I don't know what that means. Maginaryworld's infinite "dreams", etc.

 

[ED_INFINITUM]

what about Sega's mandates on Ian Flynn's infinite multiverse,Wouldn't they not allow him to write something that doesn't accurately reflect their cosmology,that leads me to believe the Segaverse is indeed infinite.

 

[KurotheStrong]

Alright, so I'm still not understanding how this works. How does one understand when a character is Multiversal and when not if they don't have have the devices to show a character as Multiversal. We already know that the "past" already existed, but the "present" and the "future" are infinite, because things happen in the present that can change what happens in the future.

You're saying with this, that there is a set present and future, correct? Thus, the Future represents its own universe, and so does the present and the past? How does that work exactly? Solaris affects ALL of time. Whether it's the past, the present or the future, doesn't matter. So it doesn't seem like Eggman was implying he only affects those three points of dimensions.

 

[KurotheStrong]

Sorry if I'm annoying you guys, but I'm trying to do this because it's the right thing in my opinion.

https://youtu.be/BSavm5JpCGo?t=14 - Eggman's explanation in mid battle.

https://youtu.be/_ui9F_M71_k?t=759 - Solaris had the power to also "change" history, meaning that its power would have also been able to create branches in time, meaning more possibilities of other universes unless stated that they don't do so in such a drastic way.

https://youtu.be/tLN812WawlA?t=383 - This implies that he's stronger than "multi-universal" as its stated by Eggman he can do this "casually". It's also stated that he is consuming ALL EXISTING timelines and "time itself will disappear into nothingness".

 

[Schnee_One]

So there's no proof that there's over 1000? Then yeah, he's not 2B.

 

[KurotheStrong]

You're not reading right. "time itself will disappear into nothingness", "all existing timelines will cease to exist". I don't even care if you just say "possibly Multiversal", it would make no sense that Solaris would only be Multi-Universal.

Also, Sonic CD has the Past and the Future which are possible branches and their own universes, which is why I'm saying that this makes no sense, remember the mechanic of the Time Stones?

http://sonic.wikia.com/wiki/Time_Warp_Plate

 

[Schnee_One]

All existing timelines.

How many are there?

Not 1000.

So yeah.

 

[KurotheStrong]

No that's an unknown quantity. That's why I said "possibly Multiversal", and I would like it if you stopped being so sarcastic. I'm treating you with respect, so please treat me with respect.

 

[AidenBrooks999]

If they scale in Ap to Solaris, why it should be outlier for the speed, especially if they kept with him?. Time Eater to did not brought both Super Sonic to their full power, this is why it doesn't scale to Solaris nor the Eggwizard.

They can be 4-A and FTL+ to 2-C and Inifinite at their peak

 

[Schnee_One]

It's a massive assumption based on no proof to assume there's more 1000 Universes.

Possibly 2B will not fly.

 

[KurotheStrong]

It's not a massive assumption. It's stated right there by Eggman, "all existing timelines will be consumed", "time will collapse into nothingness".

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Neither of those statements prove that there aremore then 1000 universes.

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

But you have to prove there are more than 1000 timelines if you want him to get upgraded to 2-B.

 

[Schnee_One]

It's not a massive assumption. It's stated right there by Eggman, "all existing timelines will be consumed", "time will collapse into nothingness".

You are missing the point entirely, not every series has a Multiverse, not every Multiverse has over 1000 universes.

Zeno has been stated to destroy "all" Universes in DB, since there's only 12, he's 2C.

Prove there's over 1000 or it's a massive assumption.

 

[KurotheStrong]

I said he can be "possibly 2B", he was going to consume ALL OF TIME guys. ALL OF IT. That means everything that exists in time, even FUTURE events would be consumed by Solaris, places like Maginaryworld, Sonic Boom, they would have CEASED TO EXIST, and it has been proven that Sonic Boom has multiple parallel worlds. There have been showings in this world that POSSIBLE FUTURES exist.

ALL EXISTING TIMELINES are in danger, ALL OF TIME WILL BE CONSUMED.

 

[Schnee_One]

You have literally one of the thickest skulls I think I've seen on this site.

How many existing timelines are there? No proof there's 1000.

Done.

Show us there's 1000 and I'll concede.

All existing timeless does not equal 1000 timelines, if we don't know 1000 timelines exist.

What is hard to understand?

 

[KurotheStrong]

It's not a massive assumption. It's stated right there by Eggman, "all existing timelines will be consumed", "time will collapse into nothingness".

You are missing the point entirely, not every series has a Multiverse, not every Multiverse has over 1000 universes.
Zeno has been stated to destroy "all" Universes in DB, since there's only 12, he's 2C.

Prove there's over 1000 or it's a massive assumption.

Except DB doesn't have a bunch of CANON universes. Don't use DB logic for a series, please. Akira Toriyama wanted 18 universes, that's on him.

But it was stated not only by her father but by the fact that Eggman stated that all existing timelines would be consumed or that time could be changed, which would create a branch in timelines.