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Secco vs Yang Xiao Long

Hot damn, you're like a broken record ignoring every single piece of context, narrative progression, rules, outside evidence and more.

Doppio had nothing to do with my statement, I was giving the context of the situation (which funnily enough, you're constantly ignoring, the fact you just did it again for something you actually asked for is ironic), what he is or was didn't matter. The point was the only time he was in contact with a Stand while actively trying to melt something, he succesfully melted the Stand in question, that being his own. Can't viably argue? Don't know what to tell you Weekly, but that's exactly what I'm doing, you going nah that dont count aint gonna change that, in fact multiple users seem to agree with me, so yeah, I'd say it's viable. Regardless, stop acting like your utter refusal to use common sense and read context or situations means that you're absolutely right. Hell the fact you fail to respond to 90% of my points I find odd, like, you don't find it odd how every Stand that can't effect something, especially other Stands, is always brought up? Including with a Stand that's in he same chapters as Secco, but Secco there's no mention of anything like that?
 
WeeklyBattles said:
Occams razor. If there is no evidence to say that he CAN, you cannot assume that he can.
Click to expand...
Uh, how about the Stand rules and guidelines ƒñö

Actually, Occams Razer would suggest the very opposite of what you're saying within the verse's context.
 
You have not provided any outside evidence, ive been asking you to but you have yet to do so. One scan is all it would take for me to agree with you but you refuse to provide any
 
In theory, Secco should be capable of doing the same thing againts other Stands, since it seems nonsensical that a Stand can't affect other Stand with their ability, but he has never done so, so it's complicated.
 
In theory yes but with no evidence to back it up we cant say for sure that he can or would
 
Idk, I'm looking at the guides like JoJoveller and I dont see any mention of such a weakness mate. Actually, ya know what, if it's outside evidence ya want, pretty sure the mud can induce a status on Stands in ASB in the same way it does to anyone else, given the Stand actually gets hit by it.

Anyway, find it funny how once again, you're cherry picking on what you actually reply to, ever try and stop being so blissfully blind?

>links a blog of some dude.

Ah yes, my favorite piece of material from a reliable source like the manga, araki, or the guides or even the games, a blog that is to be taken as gospel even though I can think of several informat sheets that arent even mentioned on it. Idk man, ever like, try paying attention to the source material? Because it's always the case unless otherwise specified, hell it's a plot point in some fights even that Stands can effect other Stands, that's like, literally the rule, and is the rule in Parts where there's Stands that don't even have a physical form, hell why even specify in every known instance but this one? Dude get off your imaginary throne, whether or not you like it, Secco has effected a Stand and nothing implies in anything that his Stand is magically more vulnerable than other Stands. And every instance where he fights a Stand, he wasnt actively trying to melt it thus isnt a counterpoint.

But let me guess? Ya gonna pull the no u card again?

His mud powers have shown to work on a Stand regardless of its origin, no such limitation is mentioned in any known material, not even the EOH glossary if you wanna get ultra obscure, context and narrative progression justifies why SF didnt melt, Stands as a general rule can effect other Stands with their abilities and if not it's noted, the Stands that have been shown to work on themselves have always worked on other stands as well (to counter your one point), I could go on. Also >refuse to provide any

Actually got me to chuckle a bit, good one.
 
WeeklyBattles said:
In theory yes but with no evidence to back it up we cant say for sure that he can or would
Click to expand...
>no evidence

The very fact his mud powers straight up melted through his own Stand when directly applied to it is evidence, stop acting like it isn't.

Hell, the exact opposite is true in your claims, there's no concrete proof he can't, there's actually more evidence suggesting he can then he can't, especially given the context of it all and the verse as a whole. Which is like, yeah fine, it's why originally I was fine with everyone having their own opinions, till you decided to act like your word is gospel at least.
 
And Hitchen Razor would dictate that, due to what Chariot is saying, Oasis not being able to affect other stands is something that can be dismissed
 
No because Stands consistently have powers that are able to affect themselves but not others. Empress can turn into metal but cant turn into a mechanical stand like Chariot for example

Also the fact that Stands like Metallica exist which have no capacity to affect other Stands
 
WeeklyBattles said:
No because Stands consistently have powers that are able to affect themselves but not others. Empress can turn into metal but cant turn into a mechanical stand like Chariot for example
Also the fact that Stands like Metallica exist which have no capacity to affect other Stands
Click to expand...
Occams razor. If there is no evidence to say that Oasis is only able to affect itself, you cannot assume that he is limited to only affecting himself.

That is Association Fallacy, that holds true because it's been shown for those specific stands. Just because that rule applies to them doesn't mean it applies to Oasis.
 
No actually it would be the opposite, youre making the assumption that he can when not only is there no evidence to support this, but there is evidence to the contrary of him actively attacking Stands without melting them. Remember that Sticky Fingers manifested in the ground as Bruno was melting and it didnt start to melt.

Okay then, show where he melted an enemy stand.
 
WeeklyBattles said:
No actually it would be the opposite, youre making the assumption that he can when not only is there no evidence to support this, but there is evidence to the contrary of him actively attacking Stands without melting them. Remember that Sticky Fingers manifested in the ground as Bruno was melting and it didnt start to melt.
Okay then, show where he melted an enemy stand.
Click to expand...
It's already been stated by Chariot that Oasis was not attempting to melt SF, so there is no evidence to contradict that Oasis can melt stands, however, there is evidence of him melting a stand: he was able to melt himself. There is also no evidence that this only applies to himself

He melted himself, ergo he can melt stands. Unless there is an instance in which it's shown that he can't melt enemy stands, he's already shown to melt stands through himself
 
>Also the fact that Stands like Metallica exist which have no capacity to affect other Stands

Actually, that isn't true. It can effect any Stand that has iron in it. That's a limitation of it's base power not the fact that it cant.

>No because Stands consistently have powers that are able to affect themselves but not others. Empress can turn into metal but cant turn into a mechanical stand like Chariot for example.

Uh, not the same thing at all weekly, that's a hilariously bad false analogy, Chariot isnt made of metal, it's made of energy, which is actually outright said with Chariot as the example even that it's made out of pure energy (when Chariot and HG shrunk down to enter Joseph, Chariot may look mechanical but he aint made of metal, it's just a visualization), Empress' power isnt turning into energy, it's metals and minerals, of which Chariot aint either. A better example would be something like Killer Queen, Kiss, or especially White Album as they all have powers like Secco. You're naming off Stands that actually ca effect other Stands but their powers, dont, not because they cant but because Stands dont apply to the power in question. Secco's power has literally no reason like the things you are trying to use as a excuse as to why it wont work.
 
What about the man on the mirror? It can affect othe stands, same with the world and its Za Warudo, echos affects killer queen, etc
 
Not to be that guy and I'm not choosing sides, but MiH's Time Acceleration didn't work on stands I'm pretty sure, they're non organisms. Also why are we arguing about this aspect Secco's ability again? We've already mostly agreed he can't get Yang into the ground since she has way higher lifting strength nor beat her in hth either. Stop clogging this damn thread honestly, if you think he can melt stands or you think he can't, just make a thread.
 
What? Stands are organisms though, they're alive, they arent biological organisms but they are organisms and are alive. Which is what MIH says cant keep up, it's actually a case of a Stand specifying what it doesnt effect, not the opposite.

And really? That ain't how MIH works, according to the Bio, MIH speeds up the universe itself via gravity and Pucci can just move freely in it. It's no different then how Dio can stop time and move freely in it and how Diavolo can erase time and move freely in it, given that's how it's explained in the stat sheet. Which makes little sense but that's what it says. Also >implying universal reality powers are the same as the hth stand powers. Fortunately MIH actually details it and explains in detail but even if it didnt, that's kinda scrapping the bottom of the barrel for examples dont ya think? No offense of course.

>stop clogging this thread.

It wasnt me who decided to bring it back up, and make a thread? Tbh there's no need, it aint even contradictory to his profile. It's an opinionated subject when it really comes down to it, unfortunately subjective opinions on things that arent here or there arent allowed here apparently.
 
Eh, it's just that Secco's melting ability affecting stands doesn't do a lot to change this battle outcome in my opinion so it just all seems a little pointless. Which reminds me, you still haven't voted carrot69
 
It's being argued because I believe Secco wins via melting Yang's aura and her while avoiding her by moving underground
 
That's a possible wincon. But he'd either need to physically leave the ground to grab her and melt her or try and force her underground. But given her class K lifting strength, pseudo flight, superior ap and dura I don't really see him winning more times than she does. Yang probably takes this 7/10 times
 
To be honest, He doesnt have to actually grab her, he can melt the area within like 10-20 meters of him at least (I checked), she'd probably just, fall into the ground because it's like, you can't exactly stand on liquids. So unless she stays away from that aoe or is always in the air, he doesnt need to overpower to drag into the ground. Now he may or may not do that, he did with Bruno, but not right away after all.
 
I've never seen rooby but id assume that if she noticed the ground being liquefied shed probably be like "shit that's weird" and just pflight up higher off the ground.
 
That and she's fought and beaten opponents who spam burrowing in the ground and trying to attack from beneath or attack from blind spots
 
Right, but she can only fly until she runs out of dust, right? At which point the melting begins, Secco just has to burrow until then
 
Yang doesnt use Dust, her gauntlets fire condensed charges of kinetic energy generated as a result of her throwing her punches
 
WeeklyBattles said:
Yang doesnt use Dust, her gauntlets fire condensed charges of kinetic energy generated as a result of her throwing her punches
Click to expand...
So it would be an issue of stamina?
 
Wouldnt that be a case of everybody just sits there then, Secco tends to piss off the moment he gets even slightly injured or surprised (see when SF cut his lip and Bruno didnt mold, although he later was fine taking some damage after he knew he was stronger and faster then SF, but that aint exactly the case here). He'd wait in the ground, while she waits in the air, everybody kinda just waits for the other to make the first move.
 
I'm deadass leaning toward incon, because if Secco gets too close, he's as good as dead, but Yang can very easily avoid getting yeeted by Oasis, but the problem lies in actually being able to attack Secco
 
Alright, just to be sure, it's 3 incon votes right? Did anyone change their votes from yang to incon?
 
Assuming Carrot69 voted for an incon and so does ivory than yeah. Also, you're the op, go check yourself. I'm still voting for yang though
 
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