Saint Seiya Discussion Thread (IV)

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

I just watched Episode 3 of Knight of the Zodiac and can say that it was a good chapter, even the additions to the story were really good, for example the fight between Daidalos and Aphro.

It was interesting that they took into account Taizen's description for Daidalos' abilities, since in this chapter we can see that he is a very complete Saint when it comes to fighting and a master in skills that the Saints use, since his fight against Aphro uses illusions to trick the opponent (he uses a substitution jutsu), creates a zone of darkness so that Aprho could not find him and attack him by surprise (although Aphro overcomes it without problems), and fights with melee combat using different styles. His special technique creates a giant energy hammer to hit the opponent, which Aphro stops with a rose. At the end of the fight, Aphro uses the Royal Demon Rose to kill Daidalos.

The rest of the chapter does not bring anything new in terms of power levels or abilities of the Saints, since we only have some scenes with June and Marin, and also adapts the path of the Bronze Saints through the Gemini Temple and the first part of the fight against the Gemini Saint, there is not much to add and I can only say that it was a good adaptation of this part of the story.

Is it my imagination or is the Royal Demon Rose becoming more and more impressive with each new series (in the original manga I always considered it a useless and easy to resist technique, but now I guess the plot armor of the protagonists saved them), unlike Another Dimension which is becoming more and more useless.

In Next Dimension it is mentioned that Shijima and Cardinale might have died from the poison of the Royal Demon Rose in the air (even after Cardinale took off the roses on the way), even Shijima fell unconscious from the poison when arriving at the Aquarius Temple. In Saintia Sho, the Saintias, Saori (weakened) and Mayura's students fell unconscious because of these roses, we could even see how Shoko was affected, even though she has a special resistance to the poisons or toxins used by the dryades, and then Marin explains that Aphro did not use the true power of the Royal Demon Rose against her. And now we can see how the Royal Demon Rose easily killed Daidalos.

The fact that Cardinale is affected by the poison of these roses confirms that this nonsense about the poison in the blood of the Pisces Saints and their immunity to the poison of these roses was just an invention of Shiori for TLC, because in the canon only Aphro is immune to the poison of these roses and only he can use this technique, because Cardinale is not immune and never uses this technique in Next Dimension. Is it my imagination or does Kurumada take a morbid pleasure in eliminating all the nonsense invented in the spin-offs for his universe.

 

[StekFence]

this nonsense about the poison in the blood of the Pisces Saints and their immunity to the poison of these roses was just an invention of Shiori for TLC

Always was. The only reason Albafica is immune, is that he shared poisonous blood with his teacher, thus building up a resistance, somehow. We never get an implication that any one else other then him and his master do this, so I always thought it’s just some special trait of his, although, SoG Aphrodite, aka Toei version(I think) does say he’s immune to all plant based toxin. Which again, is something I assumed only applies to him

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

Always was. The only reason Albafica is immune, is that he shared poisonous blood with his teacher, thus building up a resistance, somehow. We never get an implication that any one else other then him and his master do this, so I always thought it’s just some special trait of his, although, SoG Aphrodite, aka Toei version(I think) does say he’s immune to all plant based toxin. Which again, is something I assumed only applies to him

It is mentioned that it is an ancient ritual that Pisces Saints do, it is not something exclusive to Albafica and his master Lugonis, that is why Lugonis' brother sought to cure his brother of this, and this detail was introduced much later in the story, when Shiori realized that she had been wrong with her nonsense that she made up for this story (although well, Kuramada also created a new contradiction with this new idea, since he confirmed that there are no intermediate generations of Saints between the holy wars against Hades and new generations only appear every 200 years when this war is about to start, so the only active Saints between the holy war of the 18th century and the 20th century were Shion and Dohko, survivors of the ancient battle). Although well, this whole story makes no sense, why would a Saint need to get poisoned blood, when he can only train and become stronger with his own abilities.

 

[StekFence]

i see. thanks For the clarification

 

[StekFence]

It is mentioned that it is an ancient ritual that Pisces Saints do, it is not something exclusive to Albafica and his master Lugonis, that is why Lugonis' brother sought to cure his brother of this, and this detail was introduced much later in the story, when Shiori realized that she had been wrong with her nonsense that she made up for this story (although well, Kuramada also created a new contradiction with this new idea, since he confirmed that there are no intermediate generations of Saints between the holy wars against Hades and new generations only appear every 200 years when this war is about to start, so the only active Saints between the holy war of the 18th century and the 20th century were Shion and Dohko, survivors of the ancient battle). Although well, this whole story makes no sense, why would a Saint need to get poisoned blood, when he can only train and become stronger with his own abilities.

Yo so this isn’t really related at all, but what’s ur opinion on this thread https://vsbattles.com/threads/big-m...ff-and-perhaps-some-other-stuff.130775/page-2

 

[AlexZiggy]

So the rating for G Cronus/Kronos here (2-A) is based on a somewhat dubious statement. But Zeus has similar statements in GA. Do you think those could be used to support the tier? I know Unshakable agrees with the idea

 

[Hasty12345]

Just thought I’d give everyone a heads up. I plan on making a CRT removing low godly regen and resurrection from the 8th sense as I no longer feel like any 8th sense user has showed these abilities. Should get around to it when I’m not so busy

 

[Galaxi789]

who is called mangaka dark wing

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

So the rating for G Cronus/Kronos here (2-A) is based on a somewhat dubious statement. But Zeus has similar statements in GA. Do you think those could be used to support the tier? I know Unshakable agrees with the idea

Nothing is ever mentioned that places that version of Zeus as 2-A, he doesn't even have any really impressive feats in that story and his best feat is having killed all the motals (with the exception of Aiolos and Saga) on the world/planet of Aiolos. The 2-A level for Saint Seiya characters has no support and is simply a misinterpretation of a scene, probably the franchise will have to focus on 3-A or 2-C which are basically the best feats that exist for a manga in this franchise.

Although this also has a problem because Time Odyssey seems to place Hades as a god on a different level than the others and not even the Olympus God can interfere in his plans, that' s why Cronos and the Hours are secretly interfering in the plans of this god to prevent him from defeating Athena and covering the world with darkness (which will affect even the world of the gods or the place where the gods live in the heavens). This would indicate that any power-scaling of Hades' feats with another god (except Athena) is basically impossible.

who is called mangaka dark wing

The writer is Kenji Santo (サイトウケンジ) and the illustrator is Shinshu Ueda (上田信舟).

Just thought I’d give everyone a heads up. I plan on making a CRT removing low godly regen and resurrection from the 8th sense as I no longer feel like any 8th sense user has showed these abilities. Should get around to it when I’m not so busy

The 8th Sense provides immortality and regeneration in Kurumada's canon (in the other non-canon works this is different because they have a different interpretation of this sense), that's why even Athena survived a weapon that can kill gods with this sense, and Shaka and Asclepius/Odysseus have been shown to have come back from the dead, even Buddha is described to have overcome death. Although the gods will lose this type of low godly regeneration because they have never shown this level of regeneration in the manga. I also plan to remove the 9th sense from canon because it does not exist in the canon universe.

 

[Galaxi789]

Nothing is ever mentioned that places that version of Zeus as 2-A, he doesn't even have any really impressive feats in that story and his best feat is having killed all the motals (with the exception of Aiolos and Saga) on the world/planet of Aiolos. The 2-A level for Saint Seiya characters has no support and is simply a misinterpretation of a scene, probably the franchise will have to focus on 3-A or 2-C which are basically the best feats that exist for a manga in this franchise.

The writer is Kenji Santo (サイトウケンジ) and the illustrator is Shinshu Ueda (上田信舟).

The 8th Sense provides immortality and regeneration in Kurumada's canon (in the other non-canon works this is different because they have a different interpretation of this sense), that's why even Athena survived a weapon that can kill gods with this sense, and Shaka and Asclepius/Odysseus have been shown to have come back from the dead, even Buddha is described to have overcome death. Although the gods will lose this type of low divine regeneration because they have never shown this level of regeneration in the manga. I also plan to remove the 9th sense from canon because it does not exist in the canon universe.

Chronos Titan has multiversal feat I wasn't going to destroy all the eras

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

Chronos Titan has multiversal feat I wasn't going to destroy all the eras

Cronus never mentions that he would destroy anything of that level in that scene, he simply describes that the destruction of the clock (Adamas Psammos) will cause a distortion in time and space, and this will cause chaos in the world, because beasts from other eras will begin to appear in the world and attack humans, this is not a feat of destructive power and is simply just a hax by means of his clock that controls time and it is also clearly described that this only affects Earth and the land of the Titans in the Tartarus (which is different from the Tartarus of the canon universe), therefore it is far from being a multiversal hax and is only a simple planetary scale hax and is simply a life wiper, because it threatens to destroy life in the world and the structure of this, not destroy the whole world, even he himself mentions that he wished to return to an Earth where the sunlight shone.

The multiverse is something that the gods in this franchise cannot affect and simply focus on conquering their world or seek to destroy humanity in their world. Also, there are different gods in each of these worlds, so each world has its own version of Hades, Athena, Poseidon or any other god, even Dark Wing mentions the existence of a god like the Demiurge that has never been mentioned in any other manga, so each universe has its own version of gods that wish to destroy humanity in some way and its own version of Athena protecting that world.

 

[Hasty12345]

Nothing is ever mentioned that places that version of Zeus as 2-A, he doesn't even have any really impressive feats in that story and his best feat is having killed all the motals (with the exception of Aiolos and Saga) on the world/planet of Aiolos. The 2-A level for Saint Seiya characters has no support and is simply a misinterpretation of a scene, probably the franchise will have to focus on 3-A or 2-C which are basically the best feats that exist for a manga in this franchise.

Although this also has a problem because Time Odyssey seems to place Hades as a god on a different level than the others and not even the Olympus God can interfere in his plans, that' s why Cronos and the Hours are secretly interfering in the plans of this god to prevent him from defeating Athena and covering the world with darkness (which will affect even the world of the gods or the place where the gods live in the heavens). This would indicate that any power-scaling of Hades' feats with another god (except Athena) is basically impossible.

The writer is Kenji Santo (サイトウケンジ) and the illustrator is Shinshu Ueda (上田信舟).

The 8th Sense provides immortality and regeneration in Kurumada's canon (in the other non-canon works this is different because they have a different interpretation of this sense), that's why even Athena survived a weapon that can kill gods with this sense, and Shaka and Asclepius/Odysseus have been shown to have come back from the dead, even Buddha is described to have overcome death. Although the gods will lose this type of low godly regeneration because they have never shown this level of regeneration in the manga. I also plan to remove the 9th sense from canon because it does not exist in the canon universe.

This 8th sense stuff you keep talking about is not something that happens in any manga of this franchise. The 8th sense does not give any kind of regeneration, this comes from a very bad misinterpretation of events and leaves nothing but contradictions and plot holes in the Classic manga.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

This 8th sense stuff you keep talking about is not something that happens in any manga of this franchise. The 8th sense does not give any kind of regeneration, this comes from a very bad misinterpretation of events and leaves nothing but contradictions and plot holes in the Classic manga.

Literally Dohko describes that Athena and Shaka entered the Underworld alive, this means that they regenerated and healed their bodies thanks to this sense, at least in the canon, because the other manga have a different concept and this has to be made clear. And Asclepius/Odysseus has been characterized by having regeneration and escaping from the Underworld by walking. The only regeneration that has to be eliminated from the profiles is that of the gods, because these beings do not have this type of regeneration, it is an exclusive power of the 8th sense, which the gods do not possess.

 

[AlexZiggy]

Nothing is ever mentioned that places that version of Zeus as 2-A, he doesn't even have any really impressive feats in that story and his best feat is having killed all the motals (with the exception of Aiolos and Saga) on the world/planet of Aiolos. The 2-A level for Saint Seiya characters has no support and is simply a misinterpretation of a scene, probably the franchise will have to focus on 3-A or 2-C which are basically the best feats that exist for a manga in this franchise.

Yes there is. Hyoga states Zeus has the power to destroy everything. Everything would naturally include Okada's 2-A cosmology.
As for the rest of your post, I thought you were of the stance that G/GA/GR are non canon? Or non canon to classic/ND at least. So all this talk about Time Odyssey is irrelevant. And we know Time Odyssey is likely non canon to the G saga because the main big bad is Titan Cronus/Kronos who should be dead in Tartarus at this point in G. So none of what you said past what I quoted has any bearing on G scaling.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

Yes there is. Hyoga states Zeus has the power to destroy everything. Everything would naturally include Okada's 2-A cosmology.
As for the rest of your post, I thought you were of the stance that G/GA/GR are non canon? Or non canon to classic/ND at least. So all this talk about Time Odyssey is irrelevant. And we know Time Odyssey is likely non canon to the G saga because the main big bad is Titan Cronus/Kronos who should be dead in Tartarus at this point in G. So none of what you said past what I quoted has any bearing on G scaling.

Just as Shura says that excalibur can cut everything, this does not imply that it cuts the entire multiverse or even the universe and only indicates that it has the power to destroy all matter. Zeus' only feat in that manga is killing humanity in the world of Aiolos and he has no other really impressive feats. Yes, I am of the opinion that Episode.G is not part of the canon and does not scale to the feats of Kurumada's work, but some users insist with this crosscale, and as I said Episode.G has no feats of its own and its best feats are only on a planetary scale.

 

[AlexZiggy]

Just as Shura says that excalibur can cut everything, this does not imply that it cuts the entire multiverse or even the universe and only indicates that it has the power to destroy all matter. This only confirms that Episode.G is not canon and does not scale to the original manga and the feats of this manga are not really impressive.

False equivalence. Excalibur's limit was well established in GA, to the point where Shura had to use a new technique which was compared by Seiya to Hades' sword just to briefly contend with Aiolia-Zeus. GA also states Zeus is the Supreme god, and we know he scales above the Titan King.
No? G has some of the best feats and statements in the franchise what are you talking about. There is nothing classic could add that G lacks.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

False equivalence. Excalibur's limit was well established in GA, to the point where Shura had to use a new technique which was compared by Seiya to Hades' sword just to briefly contend with Aiolia-Zeus. GA also states Zeus is the Supreme god, and we know he scales above the Titan King.
No? G has some of the best feats and statements in the franchise what are you talking about. There is nothing classic could add that G lacks.

No, it is exactly the same equivalence, because it simply describes that it cuts everything, this is the basic description of Excalibur, and it only indicates that it cuts all matter, not that it cuts the entire universe. So you say it does not make sense, because it is simply an indication that it destroys all matter and its power annihilates all life, as it did in the world of Aiolos that only destroyed its surface and killed all humanity in this world, this is the only feat of Zeus in this manga, so the only feat of Zeus is on a planetary scale, because he doesn't even destroy the planet completely. No, this series doesn't have good feats, like almost everything in this franchise they are just some vague descriptions instead of feats, because cosmic scale feats in this franchise are rare, probably the series with the best feats is Omega.

 

[AlexZiggy]

No, it is exactly the same equivalence, because it simply describes that it cuts everything, this is the basic description of Excalibur, and it only indicates that it cuts all matter, not that it cuts the entire universe. So you say it does not make sense, because it is simply an indication that it destroys all matter and its power annihilates all life, as it did in the world of Aiolos that only destroyed its surface and killed all humanity in this world, this is the only feat of Zeus in this manga. No, he never had good feats, because this franchise has almost no cosmic scale feats, probably the series with the best feats is Omega.

Pontos erased the constellations in GR via Uranus's power who is currently 'dead'. This same Uranus gave Kido the power to withstand blows from a stronger Shura then the Shura who fought Aiolia-Zeus at the end of GA. Aiolia-Zeus himself is stronger than Aiolos based on his own comments on the matter, and 9th Sense Aiolos already overpowers Athena Exclamations performed by 3 Gold Saints noted to be stronger than they were prior to being brought back from the dead. In terms of speed, G has clear FTL and higher feats and statements. Hax? How about Ikki mind haxing Shun-Hades?
G doesn't need classic.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

Pontos erased the constellations in GR via Uranus's power who is currently 'dead'. This same Uranus gave Kido the power to withstand blows from a stronger Shura then the Shura who fought Aiolia-Zeus at the end of GA. Aiolia-Zeus himself is stronger than Aiolos based on his own comments on the matter, and 9th Sense Aiolos already overpowers Athena Exclamations performed by 3 Gold Saints noted to be stronger than they were prior to being brought back from the dead. In terms of speed, G has clear FTL and higher feats and statements. Hax? How about Ikki mind having Shun-Hades?
G doesn't need classic.

Okada represents the constellations as small spheres that are smaller than the Earth, so they are not real stars in any way and basically it is a less impressive feat than the planetary scale. When the Athena Exclamation is used in this universe there is never any mention of describing a power equivalent to a big bang, which is basically why that technique is considered impressive. The speed only has character statements, because it has no feats and they are rather vague descriptions because we assume the author knows something that he doesn't mention at the time. The hax I have no problem with that, in fact the series always introduces some interesting hax.

 

[AlexZiggy]

Okada represents the constellations as small spheres that are smaller than the Earth, so they are not real stars in any way and basically it is a less impressive feat than the planetary scale. When the Athena Exclamation is used in this universe there is never any mention of describing a power equivalent to a big bang, which is basically why that technique is considered impressive. The speed only has character statements, because it has no feats and they are rather vague descriptions because we assume the author knows something that he doesn't mention at the time. The hax I have no problem with that, in fact the series always introduces some interesting hax.

Okada represents the constellations as stars. Even the latest chapter confirms this, where Saori says that some stars have the power of rebirth, referring to the Pheonix Constellation. Prove they aren't stars.
It was said to 'rend the universe' iirc. It's just a different way of saying the same thing. Aiolos even says that the power of the Athena Exclamation is taboo, even though Saga is capable of destroying galaxies by himself.
Fair enough.

 

[AlexZiggy]

As for speed, it has both feats and statements. Aiolia has like 3 seperate FTL statements in G. Then Shura has an MFTL feat and an infinite speed feat in GR.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

Okada represents the constellations as stars. Even the latest chapter confirms this, where Saori says that some stars have the power of rebirth, referring to the Pheonix Constellation. Prove they aren't stars.
It was said to 'rend the universe' iirc. It's just a different way of saying the same thing. Aiolos even says that the power of the Athena Exclamation is taboo, even though Saga is capable of destroying galaxies by himself.
Fair enough.

No, when he shows us the scene of the constellations being destroyed, we can see that they are spheres smaller than the Earth, therefore they are not real stars and are just luminous objects in the sky. It only creates a small crack for them to escape from the Underworld, this is nothing impressive or comparable with a power equivalent to the creation of the universe. Saga has a different description of the Galaxian Explosion in Assassin, where he only says that his technique can destroy worlds/planets and shake the galaxy, this is not a description stating that he can destroy galaxies.

As for speed, it has both feats and statements. Aiolia has like 3 seperate FTL statements in G. Then Shura has an MFTL feat and an infinite speed feat in GR.

None of these are feats and are just character statements, and there is no infinite speed feat as explained before, even this was downvoted on this forum.

 

[AlexZiggy]

NO, when he shows us the scene of the constellations being destroyed, we can see that they are spheres smaller than the Earth, therefore they are not real stars and are just luminous objects in the sky. It only creates a small crack for them to escape from the Underworld, this is nothing impressive or comparable with a power equivalent to the creation of the universe. Saga has a different description of the Galaxian Explosion in Assassin, where he only says that his technique can destroy worlds/planets and shake the galaxy, this is not a description stating that he can destroy galaxies.

That's an L for you Lancelot. If you actually bothered to look at scans, you would notice blue dots in the background of the scan. What do you think those are? Stars. The planetoids can just be random planets in individual star systems, since you know, stars can have planets orbiting around them. Or it's just Okada showcasing cosmic scale destruction. Nevertheless, Saori says stars make up constellations. Case closed.
You prove you don't understand what a contradiction is. Saga saying he can destroys worlds first of all can mean alot of things, considering the Kanji used in the scan was 'sekai' which can mean more than just 'planets'. Even if it was, he doesnt state it can only destroy planets, nor does his attack fail against a character with below galaxy level durability, which would generate an actual contradiction. Failing that, the power of the Galaxian Explosion remains the same as it was in G, which is the 'galaxy falling apart'.

 

[AlexZiggy]

None of these are feats and are just character statements, and there is no infinite speed feat as explained before, even this was downvoted on this forum.

Surpassing a the speed of a light speed attack is not a feat?
Ok then.
It was down voted for reasons such as 'Okada didn't draw infinite fists'. I'll let everyone else reading this to be the judge on that one.
The reality is, the attack works by multiplying his fist by infinity then unleashing a sort of dunmaku on the opponent, which Shura matched. Seems clear cut to me.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

That's an L for you Lancelot. If you actually bothered to look at scans, you would notice blue dots in the background of the scan. What do you think those are? Stars. The planetoids can just be random planets in individual star systems, since you know, stars can have planets orbiting around them. Or it's just Okada showcasing cosmic scale destruction. Nevertheless, Saori says stars make up constellations. Case closed.
You prove you don't understand what a contradiction is. Saga saying he can destroys worlds first of all can mean alot of things, considering the Kanji used in the scan was 'sekai' which can mean more than just 'planets'. Even if it was, he doesnt state it can only destroy planets, nor does his attack fail against a character with below galaxy level durability, which would generate an actual contradiction. Failing that, the power of the Galaxian Explosion remains the same as it was in G, which is the 'galaxy falling apart'.

The scene shows that they are just small luminous objects in the space of the planet, therefore that is what the author is demonstrating and this is the feat in question, assuming something different is just a nonsense theory, because the manga clearly shows that they are not destroying real stars, and the feat in question is unimpressive. It is describing planets which is one of the definitions of the word "sekai" and then it says that it shakes the galaxy, the definition of this description is clear and it only shakes the galaxy and destroys planets, therefore the current description of this technique by part of this author does not indicate that it destroys galaxies in any way.

Surpassing a the speed of a light speed attack is not a feat?
Ok then.
It was down voted for reasons such as 'Okada didn't draw infinite fists'. I'll let everyone else reading this to be the judge on that one.
The reality is, the attack works by multiplying his fist by infinity then unleashing a sort of dunmaku on the opponent, which Shura matched. Seems clear cut to me.

There are no feats to back up that claim and we only have a statement or description.

And as I explained it there is nothing to back up that statement and it was just a misinterpretation of a vague description and it was basically downvoted on this forum.

 

[AlexZiggy]

The scene shows that they are just small luminous objects in the space of the planet, therefore that is what the author is demonstrating and this is the feat in question, assuming something different is just a nonsense theory, because the manga clearly shows that they are not destroying real stars. It is describing planets which is one of the definitions of the word "sekai" and then it says that it shakes the galaxy, the definition of this description is clear and it only shakes the galaxy and destroys planets, therefore the current description of this technique by part of this author does not indicate that it destroys galaxies in any way.

You're the one spouting nonsense theories to downplay GR.
The scene shows rocky planets being destroyed by red beams plus red beams targeting blue dots in the background. The Earth being seen is just a stylistic choice. You know. Like drawing blue lines connecting stars even though they are not actually there to help the reader make out the shape of whatever constellation is being showcased.
Saori refers to stars of the Pheonix Constellation, you haven't addressed this and it single handedly debunks your entire theory. The. Constellations. Are. Stars.
I've already explained how this is not a contradiction. At best it is a redundant statement. Nothing else.

 

[AlexZiggy]

There are no feats to back up that claim and we only have a statement or description.

And as I explained it there is nothing to back up that statement and it was just a misinterpretation of a vague description and it was basically downvoted on this forum.

And? Classic has no feats to back up Light Speed Gold Saints either. We use statements unless they are contradicted. And G's method ensures no real contradiction can take place because of how the 7th Sense and miracles work.
Prove any of it. You're just saying things without backing them up. It being downvoted here is irrelevant. I've already stated my piece on that portion of your argument. Appeal to popularity fallacy.
There's nothing vague about an attack being described and explained as infinite, another character acknowledging that Light Speed can't block all blows than speeding up to match infinite strikes.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

You're the one spouting nonsense theories to downplay GR.
The scene shows rocky planets being destroyed by red beams plus red beams targeting blue dots in the background. The Earth being seen is just a stylistic choice. You know. Like drawing blue lines connecting stars even though they are not actually there to help the reader make out the shape of whatever constellation is being showcased.
Saori refers to stars of the Pheonix Constellation, you haven't addressed this and it single handedly debunks your entire theory. The. Constellations. Are. Stars.
I've already explained how this is not a contradiction. At best it is a redundant statement. Nothing else.

This is not donwplay and it is not a theory either, and it is something that is clearly shown in the series, where the author himself draws this as luminous spheres smaller than the Earth that orbit the space around them, simply this is what the author shows and we clearly saw when these small spheres that were destroyed, so there is nothing to argue about in this.

And? Classic has no feats to back up Light Speed Gold Saints either. We use statements unless they are contradicted. And G's method ensures no real contradiction can take place because of how the 7th Sense and miracles work.
Prove any of it. You're just saying things without backing them up. It being downvoted here is irrelevant. I've already stated my piece on that portion of your argument. Appeal to popularity fallacy.
There's nothing vague about an attack being described and explained as infinite, another character acknowledging that Light Speed can't block all blows than speeding up to match infinite strikes.

At least you have the feat of Bronze Saints crossing light years or Thanatos attacking from light years, a true feat and not just a description, and other series like Saintia Sho have Ryuthos crossing the universe to save Erda, these are not descriptions and are feats that confirm the speed of these characters. Something that does not happen in this series where you only have a description or statement and no feat to confirm this.

I already explained it and this was even downvoted on this forum, it was even explained why it wasn't a real feat and why it didn't meet infinite speed standards.

 

[AlexZiggy]

I'll post the relevant scans tomorrow when I'm on the PC. I have already explained what those rocky objects could be. Stars have star systems. The proximity to Earth can be explained as a stylistic choice. In GA we get a shot of Earth's atmosphere and no trace of those so called 'rock constellations'.
At best, this would be something you yourself have tried to argue.
A retcon.


Bronzes with the blood of Athena lmao. Meanwhile every feat performed by Aiolia and Shura were done without any external help and in Shura's case, an application of miracles.

Yeah those are cool feats for Sho. None of that changes the fact that statements can be used as evidence. Might as well donwgrade classic Athena Exclamation too, a combined power of both which would grow into infinity didn't even destroy the planet.

 

[StekFence]

Could someone post the scan of the constellations getting destroyed? I’d like to judge it for myself

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

I'll post the relevant scans tomorrow when I'm on the PC. I have already explained what those rocky objects could be. Stars have star systems. The proximity to Earth can be explained as a stylistic choice. In GA we get a shot of Earth's atmosphere and no trace of those so called 'rock constellations'.
At best, this would be something you yourself have tried to argue.
A retcon.

Bronzes with the blood of Athena lmao. Meanwhile every feat performed by Aiolia and Shura were done without any external help and in Shura's case, an application of miracles.

Yeah those are cool feats for Sho. None of that changes the fact that statements can be used as evidence. Might as well donwgrade classic Athena Exclamation too, a combined power of both which would grow into infinity didn't even destroy the planet.

Literally the word used is "hoshi" which means celestial body and depending on the context it can mean planet, star or even just a meteorite or comet, so this does not indicate anything and as I explained in the scene we can only see what are small luminous objects that they orbit Earth's space, so there is nothing impressive about this and it's just not a good feat, because the author himself shows that they are not real stars in that scene.

That doesn't change that it's a feat and confirms the speed of these characters, therefore it's not just a description or statement like what you mention, because basically there is no feat that confirms that speed.

For something I have never used that description of infinity or even I have always said that this franchise has a serious problem with the feats, because the scenes where we can really see the power of these characters are really few.

 

[StekFence]

because basically there is no feat that confirms that speed.

You can take statements if they come from credible sources tho, it doesn’t need feats yknow? Feats are nice, but you can trust when an elite saint or some anicient monster starts talking , that they generally know what they are saying

 

[Hasty12345]

Literally Dohko describes that Athena and Shaka entered the Underworld alive, this means that they regenerated and healed their bodies thanks to this sense, at least in the canon, because the other manga have a different concept and this has to be made clear. And Asclepius/Odysseus has been characterized by having regeneration and escaping from the Underworld by walking. The only regeneration that has to be eliminated from the profiles is that of the gods, because these beings do not have this type of regeneration, it is an exclusive power of the 8th sense, which the gods do not possess.

My crt will go in-depth as to why this is the wrong interpretation and why the 8th sense doesn’t grant any abilities and is the worst sense in this franchise.

 

[sanicspood]

are universes in saint seiya infinite?

 

[Hasty12345]

Just as Shura says that excalibur can cut everything, this does not imply that it cuts the entire multiverse or even the universe and only indicates that it has the power to destroy all matter. Zeus' only feat in that manga is killing humanity in the world of Aiolos and he has no other really impressive feats. Yes, I am of the opinion that Episode.G is not part of the canon and does not scale to the feats of Kurumada's work, but some users insist with this crosscale, and as I said Episode.G has no feats of its own and its best feats are only on a planetary scale.

The best feat in all of Classic is literally Hades moving planets.

the 8th sense as described in Kurumada’s manga does not yield any abilities worth noting as these regeneration feats you speak of don’t exist and are a misinterpretation of the classic manga.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

You can take statements if they come from credible sources tho, it doesn’t need feats yknow? Feats are nice, but you can trust when an elite saint or some anicient monster starts talking , that they generally know what they are saying

I never said that they couldn't take character statements into account, because it's something that is used on this forum (although feats are generally preferred), just comment that that series doesn't have really impressive feats.

 

[Hasty12345]

No, when he shows us the scene of the constellations being destroyed, we can see that they are spheres smaller than the Earth, therefore they are not real stars and are just luminous objects in the sky. It only creates a small crack for them to escape from the Underworld, this is nothing impressive or comparable with a power equivalent to the creation of the universe. Saga has a different description of the Galaxian Explosion in Assassin, where he only says that his technique can destroy worlds/planets and shake the galaxy, this is not a description stating that he can destroy galaxies.

None of these are feats and are just character statements, and there is no infinite speed feat as explained before, even this was downvoted on this forum.

Tell me you haven’t read G without telling me you haven’t read G.

 

[Hasty12345]

I never said that they couldn't take character statements into account, because it's something that is used on this forum (although feats are generally preferred), just comment that that series doesn't have really impressive feats.

Especially Kurumada’s 8th sense which doesn’t even grant a power up and only allows for travel to the underworld. Something only the spectres and the dead can do in this franchise.

 

[Lancelot_de_Cancer]

Tell me you haven’t read G without telling me you haven’t read G.

Unlike you, if I have read all this manga.

 

[sanicspood]

are universes in saint seiya infinite?