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Actually I do plan on making one
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Saint Seiya Discussion Thread (IV)
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A detail on this.
Kiki's dialogue changed for the Final Edition (Volume 4).
Kiki: こ...この小宇宙だ
Kiki: 激震を起こしたのはこいつだな
Kiki: いけないムウ様!
Kiki: 間もなく追いつかれますよ
Mu: やむをえん話をつけよう
Mu: はい
In the new dialogue, Kiki does not give any measure of time, he only says that his opponent would soon catch up with them, and it seems that Misty arrived immediately at that place.
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Misty catching up to a gold Saint makes 0 sense anyways. Almost seemed like Mu wanted that to happen.
Hasty12345
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At this point in the story, Kurumada had not yet decided to make Mu a Gold Saint, nor had he decided to make a filler character (Aiolia) in Chapter 1 the Gold Saint of Leo (a detail that added another inconsistency to the anime).
Although in the Final Edition, Kurumada tried to correct these problems, and it seems that Mu did not want to intervene much in this, he only saved Seiya from certain death in the collapse of Mount Fuji, but that's all, even in the new version it seems that the illusion that confused the Silver Saints was not created by Mu and was an illusion of Marin.
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Someone else considers the defeat of Hades to be complete nonsense in TLC.
Athena, Tenma and Alone defeat Hades by throwing his soul into the Elyseon, the problem is that they only threw his soul into that place, a place that belongs to the god and who could return back to Earth at any time, especially when Athena, Tenma and Alone died at that time.
Hades just had to return from Elyseon and win the holy war, because no one could stop him.
Kurumada never explained in the classic manga how Athena defeated Hades in the past and how she sealed him or prevented Hades from returning until the next holy war (although in Next Dimension it seems that Hades' sword was inside a tower in the center of a magic circle, and Hades only began to take control of his avatar when Alone holds the sword, it is possible that the goddess created it in the past holy war to seal the god). But Shiori could create a seal or something to defeat this god and explain why the god didn't return until the next holy war, even made up that nonsense about Hades being weak to sunlight and Pegasus being a super-legendary saint who was reincarnated in multiple holy wars to fight Hades.
Speaking of the Elysion, it is interesting how Hades turned this place into a real paradise for humans in Dark Wing.
Hades even created tools so that humans could cultivate the land and live a peaceful life in that place, a detail that shows us that Hades can create tools and other things for humans in that place.
It's a pity that these gods never use any reality warping or creation powers for their fights, which are usually stupidly boring with mediocre skills on the part of the gods. Poseidon just attacks with his trident like an idiot, Hades just swings his sword like an idiot, Zeus just attacks with lightning like an idiot, Eris just attacks with her weapon like an idiot, etc. That's why Shaka (or the Virgo Saint) looks more like a god when it comes to combat skills.
An interesting detail, did you know that the gods in Kurumada's work have never shown the ability to fly or levitate, an ability that shows divinity by seeing that these beings do not touch the ground (and that's why most of the gods in the spin-offs are always flying) has never been used by Kurumada for these characters (even though some fans believe that flying is an exclusive ability of the gods in Kurumada's work).
Athena, Tenma and Alone defeat Hades by throwing his soul into the Elyseon, the problem is that they only threw his soul into that place, a place that belongs to the god and who could return back to Earth at any time, especially when Athena, Tenma and Alone died at that time.
Hades just had to return from Elyseon and win the holy war, because no one could stop him.
Kurumada never explained in the classic manga how Athena defeated Hades in the past and how she sealed him or prevented Hades from returning until the next holy war (although in Next Dimension it seems that Hades' sword was inside a tower in the center of a magic circle, and Hades only began to take control of his avatar when Alone holds the sword, it is possible that the goddess created it in the past holy war to seal the god). But Shiori could create a seal or something to defeat this god and explain why the god didn't return until the next holy war, even made up that nonsense about Hades being weak to sunlight and Pegasus being a super-legendary saint who was reincarnated in multiple holy wars to fight Hades.
Speaking of the Elysion, it is interesting how Hades turned this place into a real paradise for humans in Dark Wing.
It's a pity that these gods never use any reality warping or creation powers for their fights, which are usually stupidly boring with mediocre skills on the part of the gods. Poseidon just attacks with his trident like an idiot, Hades just swings his sword like an idiot, Zeus just attacks with lightning like an idiot, Eris just attacks with her weapon like an idiot, etc. That's why Shaka (or the Virgo Saint) looks more like a god when it comes to combat skills.
An interesting detail, did you know that the gods in Kurumada's work have never shown the ability to fly or levitate, an ability that shows divinity by seeing that these beings do not touch the ground (and that's why most of the gods in the spin-offs are always flying) has never been used by Kurumada for these characters (even though some fans believe that flying is an exclusive ability of the gods in Kurumada's work).
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Hasty12345
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Don’t think creating farming tools is an ability worth making a CRT about.
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No, but it is interesting that Hades can even create some technological objects such as a tractor.
Hasty12345
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interesting maybe, impressive? Not at all
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As I said it is interesting, not impressive.
Speaking of creation, the true god of this franchise should have some creation (or reality warping) ability in his profile.
Shaka created a lake or hell of blood (and in case you're wondering this is not an illusion, even Ikki and Shaka say it's real).
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In Next Dimension it is made clear that Athena committed suicide with the sword (the sword with which Athena herself pierced his throat). Even Ikki says that the Pope wants him to use that sword to kill Athena again.
Ikki: 教皇になりすましたサガがアテナを殺めようとし
Ikki: またアテナ自身も冥界に東り込む際に自ら喉を突いた剣だ
Ikki: その剣で今またアテナを殺せというのか...
This confirms that Athena died in the Hades Arc, and she only survived thanks to the magic of the 8th sense, a power that even allowed Athena to survive a weapon that can kill gods.
Athena's immortality with the 8th sense >>>>>>>>>> The immortality of the other gods (at least in the manga continuity).
The 8th Sense is probably the most hax ability of the entire franchise, because it is a power that transcends even the gods, granting those who awaken and master it (such as the Buddhas, Shaka, Golden Saints), the true eternity and the ability to exist even on a plane beyond everything as Nirvana (we can say that they are freed from the chains of the physical world as time, space, life and death or the cycle of reincarnation, etc., which is the description of Nirvana in Buddhist philosophy).
Question.
Souls in this franchise are not easy to destroy, even in the Underworld the souls of the dead withstand multiple punishments where they are destroyed in various ways and this does not make them disappear.
Souls are destroyed, frozen, burned, torn to pieces, etc.
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Even Lune (when he took Minos' place as the judge) tore a soul apart before sending it to its eternal punishment in the Underworld.
Could this grant any special resistance to souls in this franchise or is it just something that doesn't matter?.
Ikki: 教皇になりすましたサガがアテナを殺めようとし
Ikki: またアテナ自身も冥界に東り込む際に自ら喉を突いた剣だ
Ikki: その剣で今またアテナを殺せというのか...
Athena's immortality with the 8th sense >>>>>>>>>> The immortality of the other gods (at least in the manga continuity).
The 8th Sense is probably the most hax ability of the entire franchise, because it is a power that transcends even the gods, granting those who awaken and master it (such as the Buddhas, Shaka, Golden Saints), the true eternity and the ability to exist even on a plane beyond everything as Nirvana (we can say that they are freed from the chains of the physical world as time, space, life and death or the cycle of reincarnation, etc., which is the description of Nirvana in Buddhist philosophy).
Question.
Souls in this franchise are not easy to destroy, even in the Underworld the souls of the dead withstand multiple punishments where they are destroyed in various ways and this does not make them disappear.
Souls are destroyed, frozen, burned, torn to pieces, etc.
--------------------
Even Lune (when he took Minos' place as the judge) tore a soul apart before sending it to its eternal punishment in the Underworld.
Could this grant any special resistance to souls in this franchise or is it just something that doesn't matter?.
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Still working on 8th Sense revision.. looks like it'll be a big one.. ugh..
But it's haxy and broken asf.
Also, actually it is possible to scale layers of resistance for soul manipulation in such a way.
But it's haxy and broken asf.
Also, actually it is possible to scale layers of resistance for soul manipulation in such a way.
Hasty12345
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I was thinking the 8th sense may allow a user to be as strong as a soul as they were alive.
If correct, it would put the durability and AP of their soul the same as their alive self which would be pretty broken
If correct, it would put the durability and AP of their soul the same as their alive self which would be pretty broken
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Analyzing some of the characters' abilities in Saint Seiya Omega.
Tokisada's ability is absurdly hax even within this franchise.
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In theory, Tokisada could withstand all the techniques of this franchise, he could even withstand a supernova in his face without a scratch and he could even withstand the big bang itself, because he became completely indestructible and immortal, so there is literally no way to destroy him by conventional means or even by other means. The guy was only defeated by Hyoga with his stupid freeze which is colder than absolute zero and could even freeze Tokisada's time abilities, and was only trapped in ice prison which is theoretically indestructible.
Tokisada has some of the best feats and abilities in the franchise.
Also the resistance in Omega to the erasure of existence is absurdly impressive.
Hyperion's Chrono Destruction is a technique that destroys the space and time of his opponent.
Hyperion had another technique that was even more powerful, Chrono Catastrophe, a technique that in Hyperion's words can destroy the opponent's existence and he tried to use this technique to eliminate Subaru from existence. The protagonists with the Omega were able to withstand and stop this technique without any problems.
In short:
Omega Saints >>>> Destruction of Existence (Chrono Catastrophe) >>>> Time and Space Destruction (Chrono Destruction)
Tokisada's ability is absurdly hax even within this franchise.
----------------
----------------
In theory, Tokisada could withstand all the techniques of this franchise, he could even withstand a supernova in his face without a scratch and he could even withstand the big bang itself, because he became completely indestructible and immortal, so there is literally no way to destroy him by conventional means or even by other means. The guy was only defeated by Hyoga with his stupid freeze which is colder than absolute zero and could even freeze Tokisada's time abilities, and was only trapped in ice prison which is theoretically indestructible.
Tokisada has some of the best feats and abilities in the franchise.
Also the resistance in Omega to the erasure of existence is absurdly impressive.
Hyperion's Chrono Destruction is a technique that destroys the space and time of his opponent.
Hyperion had another technique that was even more powerful, Chrono Catastrophe, a technique that in Hyperion's words can destroy the opponent's existence and he tried to use this technique to eliminate Subaru from existence. The protagonists with the Omega were able to withstand and stop this technique without any problems.
In short:
Omega Saints >>>> Destruction of Existence (Chrono Catastrophe) >>>> Time and Space Destruction (Chrono Destruction)
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Which was bull, but yeah
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he was beyond the concept of time. So Hyoga can freeze things beyond the a concept 
Hasty12345
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Hyoga's ice just built different
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Are there any notable changes made in the final edition? Can you summarize the changes?A detail on this.
Kiki's dialogue changed for the Final Edition (Volume 4).
Kiki: こ...この小宇宙だ
Kiki: 激震を起こしたのはこいつだな
Kiki: いけないムウ様!
Kiki: 間もなく追いつかれますよ
Mu: やむをえん話をつけよう
Mu: はい
In the new dialogue, Kiki does not give any measure of time, he only says that his opponent would soon catch up with them, and it seems that Misty arrived immediately at that place.
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I have explained some changes that this version has in some of my older posts.
Kurumada continues his work to adjust the dialogues of the original manga with the new ideas and concepts introduced in Zero, Origin, Destiny and Next Dimension.
Now Kurumada introduces the name of the Sword of Chrysus (クリューソスの剣) in the original manga.
An interesting fact about the Final Edition, Kurumada removed the date from the newspaper, so the new canon date is 1990 (as described at the beginning of Next Dimension), and this is the year in which the story of Saint Seiya takes place.
The new canon date for the Sanctuary Arc, Poseidon Arc and Hades Arc is 1990. The story of Saint Seiya takes place in a few months (probably 2 to 4 months) of the same year, not three years.
The battle against Poseidon and his army in the Poseidon Arc takes place on April 4, 1990, according to the dates in the original manga.
The Poseidon Arc begins with Julian's birthday.
Julian's birthday is March 21.
Three days later [March 24, 1990], floods occur around the world.
Ten days later [April 3, 1990] and the flooding has not stopped. The doctor says that Seiya and the others have been in a coma for a month, since the Battle of the Twelve Temples.
The next day [April 4, 1990], Aldebaran and Sorrento fight in the hospital, and Tethys appeared in Lushan to challenge the Saints. The battle against Poseidon and his army begins.
In the epilogue of the Poseidon Arc, Julian finds the corpse of Tethys in her fish form and says that she died several days ago.
The Hades Arc begins a few days or weeks after the Poseidon Arc. Nachi mentions that the battle against Poseidon has left Athena exhausted, this indicates that not much time has passed. In addition, Wolf Saint says that it is a peaceful spring night, so this is consistent with the dates (spring in the northern hemisphere extends from March 21 to June 21).
If Kurumada does not change some dialogue in the Final Edition, the Poseidon Arc begins on March 21, 1990 and ends on April 4, 1990.
The official date of the Hades Arc is sometime between April 4, 1990 and June 21, 1990.
The battle against the Gold Saints in the Sanctuary takes place one month before the battle against Poseidon and his army.
Kurumada changed the description of Shaina's attack in the Final Edition.
(ま->ま...)まるで全身を(なん万->百万)ボ ルトもの電撃でえぐられたみたいだあ (〜〜〜〜->…)
É... É como se um choque elétrico de (dezenas de milhares -> milhões) de volts tivesse atingido meu corpo...
Now Seiya indicates that it is millions of volts, not tens of thousands of volts as he described in the original manga.
An interesting detail in the Final Edition Vol.4, Kurumada changed almost all the dialogue in this scene.
Page 74
Kiki: ムウ様何人かの聖闘士は自力で脱出したようですが
Kiki: あのまま生き埋めになった者もいるようです
Mu: 仕方ないわたしたちでさえ星矢ひとりを救うので精一杯でしたから
Mu: しかも追手がきます
Kiki: ェ!?
Kiki: うっ?
Kiki: こ...この小宇宙だ
Kiki: 激震を起こしたのはこいつだな
Page 75
Kiki: いけないムウ様!
Kiki: 間もなく追いつかれますよ
Mu: やむをえん話をつけよう
Kiki: はい
Mu does not teleport the Bronze Saints in this scene and only saved Seiya, therefore, the Bronze Saints escaped the collapse on Mount Fuji with their own power.
This scene is not teleportation, and the Bronze Saints are using that pseudo-flight when they travel like shooting stars.
In short, warriors of the level of a Bronze Saint get pseudo-flight.
Only the dialogue I described changed in that scene, Misty still shook Mount Fuji.
A change in this scene.
Kiki or Mu says that the sea is split, not just a portion of seawater, and Mu's surprised face changed (the power of a Silver Saint is not impressive to Mu).
K/M: ひえっ
K/M: 巨大な潮柱が!!
K/M: し...しかも海が割て...
K/M: 底から誰かやってくる!!
K/M: あ...ああ!?
K/M: あいつは...っ!?
A minor change for Asterion's Million Ghost Attack.
Now it is mach 3.
Asterion: だがオレのMG(ミリオン・ゴースト)アタックはマッハ3だ到底オレの動きには追いつけぬ
Medusa Shield was always impressive, soul stealing and petrification is very hax.
Algol: フッフフフ このメドゥサの盾と目が合って生き延びた看はいない
Algol: 誰もがことごとく魂を抜き取られ石になるのだ!
The Vol.5 of the Final Edition ends with the image of June and Shun. The Volume has several changes in the dialogues, but nothing important.
The Vol.6 will probably be published in July 2022 and this Volume will start with the fight in the Sanctuary.
In general, most of the changes in the Final Edition are not so important, only some dialogues are simplified, the spelling of some words is changed, the drawing in some scenes is retouched, the new chapters that it publishes (Zero, Origin and Destiny) are added, etc. It is definitely not worth making a complete summary of the changes.
One change that seems important and I forgot to mention.
Kurumada changed the dialogue in this part and the Bronze Saints no longer destroy stars.
Old dialogue:
そして大地を割り星を砕くのさ
そして空を裂き大地を割るのさ
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That's stupid broken the ****?
Man and I'm still only on Classic
Imma go back to reading now
My off day and got plenty of time now lmao
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Found a very interesting phrase in the ND raws. Currently have very reliable unbiased translators looking at it.
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Wait so if this was actually 50,000,000 volts instead of 50,000
Then is it the same for these?
These being mistranslations I mean?
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Mistranslation are so common in the series yikes.. gimme a raw and I can translate them.
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So the final edition made it 50 million volts?
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Believe so
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scan please
Trying to fill my Saint Seiya Scans server properly lmao
And knowing how many mistranslations there are I want to be thorough
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Unfortunately even the Spanish, French. And BR Portuguese versions have some mistranslations. Some even even had words in to make them more impressive. Like "Transcending the concept of all time and space." The raws just say "transcending time and space." That's just 1 example.scan please
Trying to fill my Saint Seiya Scans server properly lmao
And knowing how many mistranslations there are I want to be thorough
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It is only millions of volts, they do not give a precise number in this scene. This is a change from the new version of the manga, Final Edition, in the original it did say tens of thousands of volts.
In the original it does say ten thousand volts, but in the Final Edition there is a small change in this dialogue and now it says that the Andromeda Chain has a discharge of tens of thousands of volts (no precise number is given).
敵が触れば「何万ボルト」にも値する衝撃を発するのだ!
何万ボルト = Tens of thousands of volts
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I seeIt is only millions of volts, they do not give a precise number in this scene. This is a change from the new version of the manga, Final Edition, in the original it did say tens of thousands of volts.
In the original it does say ten thousand volts, but in the Final Edition there is a small change in this dialogue and now it says that the Andromeda Chain has a discharge of tens of thousands of volts (no precise number is given).
敵が触れば「何万ボルト」にも値する衝撃を発するのだ!
何万ボルト = Tens of thousands of volts
Thanks man
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Well, that’s like, at least double the number technicallyIt is only millions of volts, they do not give a precise number in this scene. This is a change from the new version of the manga, Final Edition, in the original it did say tens of thousands of volts.
In the original it does say ten thousand volts, but in the Final Edition there is a small change in this dialogue and now it says that the Andromeda Chain has a discharge of tens of thousands of volts (no precise number is given).
敵が触れば「何万ボルト」にも値する衝撃を発するのだ!
何万ボルト = Tens of thousands of volts
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were all on the same page that Macrocosmo = the multiverse right?
