Rule Violation Reports (New forum)

[CloverDragon03]

Putting aside what Weekly for a moment, what you’re saying is problematic

If two users in a hypothetical scenario commit te same offences, but one gets banned while gets off with a slap on the wrist merely because they’ve “contributed lots to the wiki”, that’s plain and simple bias and it’s unjust

Please don’t use wiki activity as a shield

I'll even use myself as an example. I like to think I've contributed quite a bit to the wiki. Not the biggest contributor by any stretch, but I do my part. Not to mention, I've got autism and ADHD myself along with dealing with pretty hefty anxiety and depression for a year or so now.

And yet, I would be very perplexed if my contributions and/or my mental health were suddenly used as a shield against action being taken against me if I were to commit a serious, massively report-worthy offense.

 

[Lonkitt]

Also, you likely know that I have suffered from very serious psychosis, paranoia, and suicidal depression in the past that I have worked through and recovered from, but it is a long-term continuous effort that takes years, not something that can just be suddenly removed with the click of a button.

No one is saying mental health is easy to deal with. I myself know that it’s a very serious issue. At the same time, I know that the way in which some people use it as a defence is outright offensive to those suffering from the same issues. Fault has to be admitted to

 

[Deagonx]

To be fair if Weekly has issues that are that serious (and I agree he does) we should take the opposite approach. Removing him from the wiki would certainly be in his best interest.

 

[Antvasima]

Putting aside what Weekly did for a moment, what you’re saying is problematic

If two users in a hypothetical scenario commit the same offences, but one gets banned while gets off with a slap on the wrist merely because they’ve “contributed lots to the wiki”, that’s plain and simple bias and it’s unjust

Please don’t use wiki activity as a shield

If we had not taken into consideration whether or not somebody is a very productive contributor with a history of harmless behaviour, but who had a bad day over a long period of time, or is just a troll that just suddenly showed up here to cause problems, we would have ended up wiping out a lot of our valuable work force at this point.

 

[Antvasima]

Before yall drop the hammer would it be alright to get the contacts for the staff I was supposed to talk to squared away?

You can see our Human Resources group here:

VS Battles Staff

Antvasima AKM sama DontTalkDT DarkDragonMedeus Mr. Bambu Celestial Pegasus Andytrenom Wokistan Ultima Reality Elizhaa Qawsedf234 ByAsura Sir Ovens Damage3245 Starter Pack Abstractions LordGriffin1000 Colonel Krukov SamanPatou GyroNutz Firestorm808 Everything12 Maverick Zero X Crabwhale Just a...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Lonkitt]

If had not taken into consideration whether or not somebody is a very productive contributor with a history of harmless behaviour, but who had a bad day over a long period of time, or is just a troll that just showed up here to cause problems, we would have ended up wiping out a lot of our valuable work force.

But this isn’t just a case of “one bad day”. These have been multiple cases of this. And even then, we should be more concerned over someone’s toxic behaviour far more than losing a “member of the work force”

 

[Antvasima]

@Antvasima MANY people from off-site servers want this question to be answered, because it will be extremely problematic and there will be instances in future where someone will say “Oh, but weekly did it worse and gets 1 month, why I should get 1 year"?

So please answer this question, do we allow exceptions or not?

Because anyone who gets reported can use this case, can see the statistics I created, and will do an argument to defend his position, and none will really have an answer to it. Are we really going to allow this possibility because he has 100k edits?

Why everyone is forgetting that this person was under watchlist? This is even worse, it's not like the user was getting a normal report, he is under watchlist and being reported 6–7 times officially and multiple verbal warning and still continues?

I don't have issues with him, personally. But it amuses me his refusion to accept anything he did as a mistake and be sorry about it.

My last post in this matter. I am a bit worried about the future instances, where people will use this case to defend themselves. The case will be representative for future offenders.

Well, I think that he should be punished in this particular case, as it is considerably more serious than previous instances, but I do not consider his offences here significant, and his past reports mostly seemed to be about trivial issues to me, but I may misremember.

 

[Antvasima]

But this isn’t just a case of “one bad day”. These have been multiple cases of this. And even then, we should be more concerned over someone’s toxic behaviour far more than losing a “member of the work force”

Well, as I said above, this is the first time that I recall that Weekly was reported for something non-trivial since he came back. Before that it mostly seemed like a continuous effort to get rid of him.

 

[M3X_2.0]

Well, he has helped out a lot in the past and is not remotely actually malicious.

Ant, with all due respect, what Weekly has done stays in the past. They ****** up. They constantly ***** up. Weekly may have a fuckton of contribuition, they ****** up.

Also, you likely know that I have suffered from very serious psychosis, paranoia, and suicidal depression in the past that I have worked through, but it is a long-term continuous effort that takes years, not something that can just be suddenly removed with the click of a button.

And this is still not a reason to shield your actions when they conflict against the site rules. You should still be responsible for your actions. You would have an intricate understanding that recovering and finding stability from such things takes years of work and requires not only a serious amount of personal responsibility (which Weekly has never once demonstrated) but help from institutions, as well as cutting off the root cause of those issues, the root being the battleboarding hobby.

Honestly, if there's ever a point where someone is so mentally unwell that they are no longer responsible for their own actions, they're institutionalized and removed from wider society.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I at least try to show some degree of compassion and tolerance regarding unstable non-malicious members unless they get out of control, and Weekly's offences are not particularly significant here, and he has tried to keep his behaviour under control despite being repeatedly antagonised. Why can't we wait and see if him staying away from versus debates is enough to help him maintain proper behaviour?

Quite a lot of other members have also still behaved behaved worse than Weekly towards me personally without being punished at all, and they do not even have Weekly's excuses as far as I am aware, so it isn't like I am being lenient to Weekly alone.

 

[ImmortalDread]

Forgot to post here for some reason.

I personally would keep an eye on Weekly but as long as the rest of the staff have agreed to give him a chance, so can I.

I'd personally keep a close eye. If anything bad happens, we can ban him for good this time. If he has improved, then that situation won't arise.

I've only waited until now because of the appeal for a ban removal, if he hadn't had that at all I would've posted it already. But if everyone's agreed to give him one last chance then I'll be fine with it so long as we keep a close eye on him.

I don't mind Weekly's return as long as we keep an eye open for eventual further misconduct, anyhow.

This was agreed upon that @WeeklyBattles is officially warned and kept a close eye on him as long as he behaves.

After one year, seven official warnings, multiple 10s pages of him never agreeing to be mistaken, hell? Should I really say this? There is no undeniable sign of improvement, specifically he never even admits for bribing/trying to bribe Bambu. And screenshot below indicates as well, "I am never wrong", same behaivour offsite.

We had even a similiar case days ago, where Vappour got banned perm for sockpuppet, but at least he was being extremely sorry and none actually gave a damn and banned him with no mercy, oh and by the way, he added 10 verses and has 3k edits.

1 month and perm ban on CRT and Vs thread.

 

[Deagonx]

Why can't we wait and see if him staying away from versus debates is enough to help him maintain proper behaviour?

I think there's just a great deal of frustration at how much special treatment and leeway Weekly has been given for his constant poor behavior. I understand it, but I agree that a short ban and versus thread ban is a good step in the right direction and I'd rather see that enacted than have the thread descend into a mess.

 

[Lonkitt]

Why can't we wait and see if him staying away from versus debates is enough to help him maintain proper behaviour?

Because that’s what we’ve always done with Weekly. Time after time it’s “why don’t we wait and see how he behaves?” and the answer is always the same

The term “second chance” has essentially lost its meaning here

 

[M3X_2.0]

Why can't we wait and see if him staying away from versus debates is enough to help him maintain proper behaviour?

A year long ban didn't help them to shape up their behavior, what's the point of a less effective ban, that only restricts one part of the forum? Besides that, Weekly was constantly reported throughtout the years and is still being reported.

You're defending the indefensible.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I think that we could at least try my suggested new approach here and see if it works. If it doesn't, and other members did not deliberately goad and antagonise Weekly, I suppose that we can be considerably harsher the next time.

Also, again, I usually try to be understanding in general towards productive and established members, not just Weekly.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

You can see our Human Resources group here:

VS Battles Staff

Antvasima AKM sama DontTalkDT DarkDragonMedeus Mr. Bambu Celestial Pegasus Andytrenom Wokistan Ultima Reality Elizhaa Qawsedf234 ByAsura Sir Ovens Damage3245 Starter Pack Abstractions LordGriffin1000 Colonel Krukov SamanPatou GyroNutz Firestorm808 Everything12 Maverick Zero X Crabwhale Just a...

vsbattles.fandom.com

I meant in terms of Grath, he wanted to talk to me but I dont know whe re that would be

 

[Crabwhale]

This is the first time since Weekly's return that the report was not over very trivial issues as far as I can recall.

So you've already forgotten the January fiasco that blew up the staff DM?

Ant, my guy, love ya, but you're being absolutely unreasonably dismissive here. There is no Weekly agenda. It doesn't exist. I have been in every conceivable server, talked to a great number of people, seen a gigantic number of people speak over the years. Even during Weekly's tenure as admin, there was no such thing as it. It's a complete, utter fallacy, a fabrication that irks me to my core every time it's brought up and perpetuated.

For the love of everything that is holy, drop it. Drop this nonsense.

 

[CloverDragon03]

This is exactly what I was talking about earlier. How many "second chances" are we gonna give Weekly, after he's demonstrably broken every single one? See Dread's post above, how many "let's wait and see" comments have been made each time he's done something report-worthy?

We can't keep "waiting and seeing." We need to actually do something.

 

[Antvasima]

So you've already forgotten the January fiasco that blew up the staff DM?

Ant, my guy, love ya, but you're being absolutely unreasonably dismissive here. There is no Weekly agenda. It doesn't exist. I have been in every conceivable server, talked to a great number of people, seen a gigantic number of people speak over the years. Even during Weekly's tenure as admin, there was no such thing as it. It's a complete, utter fallacy, a fabrication that irks me to my core every time it's brought up and perpetuated.

For the love of everything that is holy, drop it. Drop this nonsense.

Well, I at least try to show some degree of compassion and tolerance regarding unstable non-malicious members unless they get out of control, and Weekly's offences are not particularly significant here, and he has tried to keep his behaviour under control despite being repeatedly antagonised. Why can't we wait and see if him staying away from versus debates is enough to help him maintain proper behaviour?

Quite a lot of other members have also still behaved behaved worse than Weekly towards me personally without being punished at all, and they do not even have Weekly's excuses as far as I am aware, so it isn't like I am being lenient to Weekly alone.

Well, I think that we could at least try my suggested new approach here and see if it works. If it doesn't, and other members did not deliberately goad and antagonise Weekly, I suppose that we can be considerably harsher the next time.

Also, again, I usually try to be understanding in general towards productive and established members, not just Weekly.

What about the above-mentioned sentiments then?

 

[ImmortalDread]

Either impose a 1-month temporary ban with a permanent ban on both CRT and Versus threads or, as I suggested previously, a permanent ban with the possibility of appeal after 2 years.

This approach ensures justice for everyone, including new users who are observing this thread and known users.

We really need to rethink our choices, as they will have a significant impact on the future. This case could become an example for offenders to use in their own defense.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Okay seriously...? I got stressed out and called Glass stupid a few times and then apologized and am taking some time away from the wiki, why are yall pushing for a multi-year/permaban...?

 

[Antvasima]

Okay seriously...? I got stressed out and called Glass stupid a few times and then apologized and am taking some time away from the wiki, why are yall pushing for a multi-year/permaban...?

Yes, it seems like an overreaction, but Crabwhale referred to a previous incident in January as well.

 

[M3X_2.0]

Okay seriously...? I got stressed out and called Glass stupid a few times and then apologized and am taking some time away from the wiki, why are yall pushing for a multi-year/permaban...?

Let's not play dumb here, Weekly. Everyone know about your agressive and toxic behavior from years ago. The discussion isn't only about this specific case, it's a combination of everytime you ****** up.

Yes, it seems like an overreaction

It's definitely not an overreaction. This is something that should've happened years ago. Weekly being permabanned was something they had it coming. It's not out of nowhere and neither a surprise.

Everyone saw it coming.

 

[Antvasima]

Strym just made an appeal to lift their ban here:

Antvasima

community.fandom.com

Do any of you remember that incident well?

 

[M3X_2.0]

I am also fine with a 2 months ban for Strym.

Here.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Thank you.

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

I got permission to speak this time like a good girl

I'm not a dm exposer, but Ant said something like "impression he has to walk on eggshells" Well its more than an impression because its actually true

I too think being reported more than others is a problem. It proves favoritism. However. How many of us have actual "enemies"? Multiple people admitted that he has people out to get him. I don't think glass is one of them but i do find it weird i rarely see Lonkitt in a rvr unless it involves weekly. Im not saying you are out to get him, but it is strange. If he really does have people out to get him, i can understand how it makes him mad. Not only that, but being reported more than anyone on the wiki only is relevant when enemies aren't taken into consideration. Consider dread. She has a lot of people that dislike her and she too has been reported a lot. Granted Dread handles things better than weekly does.


@Crabwhale There is hate agendas actually. I was part of the biggest one that Bleach discord from 2018. Weekly was in fact someone we had a hate agenda for. Same with Matthew Shroeder, Kepekley23, and honestly even ant. We would like constantly shit talk them and if we could find anything at all to report them over we would do it. Alot of them members are gone, but im sure some has socks. But even if they were all gone, it doesn't change the fact hate agendas do indeed exist. I was infamous user so im connected. I know who hates who.

Im not excusing weekly spazzing out and getting mad, But being reported more than anyone loses its meaning once enemies are factored. Plus it makes it that much harder to remain calm if you feel like everyone is out to get you. From a former banned user to a another, i just wanna see if his issue was also mine. Vs threads and crts. Granted i had 5 years to shape up so it could have been more than just me avoiding those type of threads. But it doesn't hurt to try imo. I think versus threads he should be perma banned until proven he has shaped up

 

[Theglassman12]

@WeeklyBattles Insulting my intelligence, being needlessly aggressive to those who disagree with you and being in flat out denial of any of your past actions is not something I’d chalk up to “I called Glass stupid a few times”. Me and so many folks on this site gave you a second chance when you came back from your year long ban to show that you’ve improved but you clearly haven’t. Stop dumbing down the situation because the fact you and Ant does this every single report just shows you have not changed these past 5+ years.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

This approach ensures justice for everyone, including new users who are observing this thread and known users.

This is not justice for “everyone” if weekly is not included.

We can not keep letting the bullying go on. Nobody is going to change if they are going to be kept riled up by people constantly bringing up his past or engaging in constant Ad hominem and poisoning the arguments over and over again. It’s sickening to watch.

I don’t care wether Weekly is banned for a few months a few years or permanently with appeal. Mental health or contributions should never be used as a shield against consequences. But do not pretend that this is justice for everyone. If there is no justice for Weekly there is no justice for everyone.

I’m sorry but reading all this had a strong effect on me, because I know how it feels to struggle to remain calm while being bullied for my mistakes.

 

[M3X_2.0]

This is not justice for “everyone” if weekly is not included.

We can not keep letting the bullying go on. Nobody is going to change if they are going to kept riled up by people constantly bringing up his past or engaging in constant Ad hominem and poisoning the arguments over and over again. It’s sickening to watch.

I don’t care wether Weekly is banned for a few months a few years or permanently with appeal. Mental health or contributions should never be used as a shield against consequences. But do not pretend that this is justice for everyone. If there is no justice for Weekly there is no justice for everyone.

I’m sorry but reading all this had a strong effect on me, because I know how it feels to struggle to remain calm while being bullied for my mistakes.

Then you clearly don't know how Weekly behaves, for how long it's happening and what they did. It's not about not changing because we're assholes and won't let them change. Weekly had a lot, and when I mean a lot, it's really a **** lot of chances to shape up their behavior. It didn't happen.

 

[Crabwhale]

I got permission to speak this time like a good girl

I'm not a dm exposer, but Ant said something like "impression he has to walk on eggshells" Well its more than an impression because its actually true

I too think being reported more than others is a problem. It proves favoritism. However. How many of us have actual "enemies"? Multiple people admitted that he has people out to get him. I don't think glass is one of them but i do find it weird i rarely see Lonkitt in a rvr unless it involves weekly. Im not saying you are out to get him, but it is strange. If he really does have people out to get him, i can understand how it makes him mad. Not only that, but being reported more than anyone on the wiki only is relevant when enemies aren't taken into consider. Consider dread. She has a lot of people that dislike her and she too has been reported a lot. Granted Dread handles things better than weekly does.

Ah yes the old "joke" excuse for the bribe attempt. I'm not even going to grace that one with a response. Mr. Bambu can tell you all about it.

@Crabwhale There is hate agendas actually. I was part of the biggest one that Bleach discord from 2018. Weekly was in fact someone we had a hate agenda for. Same with Matthew Shroeder, Kepekley23, and honestly even ant. We would like constantly shit talk them and if we could find anything at all to report them over we would do it. Alot of them members are gone, but im sure some has socks. But even if they were all gone, it doesn't change the fact hate agendas do indeed exist. I was infamous user so im connected. I know who hates who.

Im not excusing weekly spazzing out and getting mad, But being reported more than anyone loses its meaning once enemies are factored. Plus it makes it that much harder to remain calm if you feel like everyone is out to get you. From a former banned user to a another, i just wanna see if his issue was also mine. Vs threads and crts. Granted i had 5 years to shape up so it could have been more than just me avoiding those type of threads. But it doesn't hurt to try imo. I think versus threads he should be perma banned until proven he has shaped up

How many people from the Bleach server are here today, though? Gin's gone, Aizen's gone, iMade's gone, pretty much all the old Bleach people are gone. That was all 5 years ago, and as you said, you had hate agendas for a lot of people, not just Weekly. I can tell you there ain't agendas fuelling what's being said right now.

 

[Twisted_Little_Raven]

Ah yes the old "joke" excuse for the bribe attempt. I'm not even going to grace that one with a response. Mr. Bambu can tell you all about it.

How many people from the Bleach server are here today, though? Gin's gone, Aizen's gone, iMade's gone, pretty much all the old Bleach people are gone. That was all 5 years ago, and as you said, you had hate agendas for a lot of people, not just Weekly. I can tell you there ain't agendas fuelling what's being said right now.

I dont think them being here is relevant why would us alone be the only hate groups?

 

[ImmortalDread]

Jul 20, 2023 and he still refuses to accept that he tried to bribe someone. He still thinks he got banned falsely till now.

At some point, I am still asking if there are any actual indisputable evidence of improvement in this table. No, no, he still said right now that it was “Eh, I called him stupid multiple times” to @Theglassman12

@Antvasima I am sorry for derailing this thread, but I wanted to highlight some aspects that are definitely worth to be looked and not simply dismissed. If you believe that there are any areas of improvement in his behavior, kindly present them. I have prepared a comprehensive statistical post to demonstrate a proportional misbehavior since his unbanning. However, we have pointed out that he has not acknowledged his mistakes (and even now, he continues to deny any involvement in bribery)

• There is no evidence of betterment in terms of mental stability.
• He never admits to his mistakes (his actions never even prove it)
  • Still refuses that bribery is a thing and got him demoted, instead it was agenda
• He still thinks till now (after all staff members labelled it as serious offense) that it was "I called him multiple times stupid"
• He is officially under watchlist, and it will be taken any action if there is proof of significant non-improvement.

Furthermore, I am surprised that you are excluding the past activity of the user for the first time, considering that we usually include them if they are relevant, which they are, considering we are examining whether or not the validity of his pledge to improve is valid.

I am not even purposing for perm-ban, but we need evidence for improvement that he promised us, till then perm topic ban on CRT and VS. thread is fair.

 

[Crabwhale]

I dont think them being here is relevant why would us alone be the only hate groups?

You're the only one I've seen that qualifies. If there's others, I don't know about them. And I know a lot of people in a lot of places that are willing to tell.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, it isn't like I am advocating for no punishment here, just to try a new approach with our punishments to see if it works, and then apply a much longer ban later if it doesn't, but I suppose that I am likely outvoted.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Then you clearly don't know how Weekly behaves, for how long it's happening and what they did. It's not about not changing because we're assholes and won't let them change. Weekly had a lot, and when I mean a lot, it's really a **** lot of chances to shape up their behavior. It didn't happen.

I completely understand, infact I vehemently think he deserves to be punished.

I am just letting everyone know that it is very difficult for him to stay out of trouble if he constantly feels bullied and antagonized over the years. We give punishments based on the expectations that the punished will shape up right? So if the punished struggles to shape up due to circumstances that pertains to the wiki I believe should address them too.

This is my final comment. Thank you for hearing me out.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Let's not play dumb here, Weekly. Everyone know about your agressive and toxic behavior from years ago. The discussion isn't only about this specific case, it's a combination of everytime you ****** up.

It's definitely not an overreaction. This is something that should've happened years ago. Weekly being permabanned was something they had it coming. It's not out of nowhere and neither a surprise.

Everyone saw it coming.

Key words being 'years ago'. I'm not going to act like I wasnt a shitty person back then, I absolutely was, but I have been making an active effort to try to get better. I dont blow up nearly every day like I used to, and even in the unfortunate instance when I do, it's nowhere near as volatile, and I admit I was wrong every time and take responsibility for it.It's just hard when every time someone ends up pushing me, people just assume that nothing has changed and just continue to treat me like I am who i was all thos e years ago.

 

[CloverDragon03]

I completely understand, infact I vehemently think he deserves to be punished.

I am just letting everyone know that it is very difficult for him to stay out of trouble if he constantly feels bullied and antagonized over the years. We give punishments based on the expectations that the punished will shape up right? So if the punished struggles to shape up due to circumstances that pertains to the wiki I believe should address them too.

This is my final comment. Thank you for hearing me out.

I do share this sentiment. I'm obviously in full support for a ban for Weekly, but I also must stress that the constant harassment needs to be looked into and nipped in the bud

 

[DarkGrath]

This is not justice for “everyone” if weekly is not included.

We can not keep letting the bullying go on. Nobody is going to change if they are going to be kept riled up by people constantly bringing up his past or engaging in constant Ad hominem and poisoning the arguments over and over again. It’s sickening to watch.

I don’t care wether Weekly is banned for a few months a few years or permanently with appeal. Mental health or contributions should never be used as a shield against consequences. But do not pretend that this is justice for everyone. If there is no justice for Weekly there is no justice for everyone.

I’m sorry but reading all this had a strong effect on me, because I know how it feels to struggle to remain calm while being bullied for my mistakes.

Simply put, I cannot afford at this moment to keep track of this thread for much longer at the moment. But I would like to speak in passing on this matter, and to assert my firm verdict on this.

Weekly is a problem. He has been, he is now, and if not addressed, he will continue to be. I find arguments attempting to excuse his behaviour, whether via "being a productive member" or "having mental health issues" to be genuinely repulsive. He is ultimately the root cause of his own behaviour, behaviour that is unacceptable, no matter how far down the levels of explanation you go.

In spite of everything, however, what I ultimately want is the best possible outcome. And I believe the best possible outcome is the best outcome for everyone - I don't believe in any notion of a just outcome in which we excuse ourselves to devalue the experience of any individual involved in it. I believe the best outcome here is one in which Weekly leaves the community for a time and comes back as someone genuinely ready to be a member of the community again.

And I do not believe we will achieve that with the way this discussion has progressed. I don't, and can't, know for sure where the root of all of this will be found - whether there really is some grand hate agenda, whether it's a few bad apples making the batch rotten, or I dunno, maybe it's all in Weekly's head. I just don't know. But it is true to him, and without listening to him, and without showing him empathy, we won't see why. And if we don't, we won't address the problems with Weekly's conduct. And if we don't address the problems with Weekly's conduct, we won't achieve a just outcome.

I don't, and can't, expect everyone to agree with my extremely specific moral theses. But this is what I legitimately believe, and I will stand by it. I want Weekly to receive a temporary ban so that he can be separated from the community for a time - to prevent further immediate issues, to set a precedent regarding treatment of this conduct, and to deter future offenses in other users. And in this time, I intend to do my part to ensure Weekly gets the help he needs. I will not apologise for insisting that the best resolution will also be the best for Weekly.

 

[Antvasima]

DarkGrath mostly makes sense to me above.