Re:Upgrade ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[RM97]

Part 1 : Meteora's Stats:-

Summary:- Meteora is a character from the RPG game "Avalken of Reminiscence" who ends up in the Real World due to Altair's Summoning. She is one of the protagonists in the anime who helps the Creators and Creations in order to stop Altair's plan of destroying all the worlds.

Key: Base | Post Time-Skip

Attack Potency: Unknown (Has shown no offensive capabilities on her own), City Block+ Level Possibly Higher With Weapons (Stole and Used 6 ATM5 Anti-Tank Missiles, can likely store and use other weapons too) | City Level (Created the Birdcage, a fictional city separated from reality

Speed: Supersonic+ (Can React to Blitz and Aliceteria and dodged attacks from Aliceteria's summonings)|Supersonic+, Unknown (Was stated to be more powerful than before but to an unknown extent)

Durability: Small Town Level (Can survive attacks from Blitz and Aliceteria)| City Level, Unknown (Was stated to be more powerful than before but haven't shown any combat feats)

Striking Strength: Unknown

Intelligence: Extremely High (Was able to figure out and explain mostly everything in the series)

Weaknesses: Is not applicable for Combat

Abilities: Superhuman Characteristics, Flight, Magic, Forcefield Creation, Genius Intelligence | All Previous Abilities in Addition to Law Manipulation (Was stated to interfere with the Laws of this world and other worlds), Conceptual Manipulation & Pocket Reality Creation (Created the Concept of the Birdcage, a fictional city isolated from Reality where the effects of the Creations fighting won't affect the real world), Creation (Created Vogelchevalier and Sirius inside the Birdcage), Magnetism Manipulation (can generate magnetic field disturbances in the Birdcage which was used as a bait to bring Altair in it), Limited Plot Manipulation & Reality Warping (Gave Kanoya a Concept Cohesion Boost, Boosted Aliceteria's Powers to the Max, Gave Selesia an Anti-Illusion Pentagram boost in the Birdcage. Was able to Manipulate the Birdcage which was basically a live plot but needed acceptance from the Audience in order to do more complex things like changing the entire plot from the City to Setsuna's final memories in the train station or Creating Sirius, a perfect copy and reflection of Altair).

Meteora's Law Manipulation & Pocket Reality Manipulation: https://imgur.com/a/C4H8y

More Information About the Birdcage: https://imgur.com/a/YFeGO

Some More Info + Meteora's Role in the Birdcage: https://imgur.com/a/tq4Bs

Part 2:

Now, Since we are at it, Let's talk about the Laws of the Real Universe in the Verse. The Laws of the Universe are similar to ours and they consider anything that goes against them as contradictions i.e. possessing superpowers. Meteora explains this nicely in episode 2:-

https://imgur.com/a/Ve2mp

As Meteora explains, going up against them will cause a contradiction to the Universe and will cause a disturbance that would reset the entire the World along with the Multiverse in a chain reaction. However, the Laws of the Universe don't let any contradictions happen and in order to maintain rationality, they try to Nullify the Powers of the contradictory beings and turn them into humans. Atmost if they find that they are being stirred too much, they try to repel/throw out the being from the real world. As shown and explained in both Episode 5, 10, 22:-

https://imgur.com/a/Z7OiR

We can see from the above link, Altair was getting thrown out of the Universe if she tried to do more damage to the rationality of the Universe by opposing the laws with her Contradictory Existence. It also shows that just a few days after Elimination Chamber Festival, aka Altair's departure from the real universe, the laws of the Universe were getting stable and was slowly going to Nullify the Powers of the creations and turn them into human just like it did with Meteora who lost her powers and turned into a normal human immediately after the last of the Creations went back to their Universe. Furthermore, even Sota says to Magane that the Universe does not allow any contradictions and that her existence will become a contradiction implying that she will get her powers Nullified and turned into a normal human. Now here's the thing, Altair came into the Real Universe and was living there for nearly 3 months before she summoned another Creation to stir up the rationality of the Universe and destroying it overtime. Here's the order of events:-

https://imgur.com/a/0yWMO

As shown from above, Altair came alone into the real universe and stayed there for 3 months before other creations we're summoned. During that time period, she resisted the Laws of the Universe Nullifying her powers and turning her into a human. For reference, the Elimination Chamber Festival ended on July 23 and the Article says the interview shows that the interview made was on September 30. Assuming the Creations stayed 2 months after the events of the festival, they were slowly getting their powers nullified and turned into a human and just after the final creation left, Meteora's power vanished and she was turned into a normal human implying that the Laws of the Universe were powerful enough to Nullify a single creation and turn them into a normal human in just a couple of minutes.

Hence, in conclusion, Not only did Altair Resist the Laws of the Universe, but she Resisted in getting her powers nullified and getting turned into human. Aka Resistance to Law Manipulation, Reality Warping & Power Nullification.

Now, here's some questions that can be asked regarding this topic:-

Q1) "If Altair is Resistance to Power Nullification, Law Manipulation, and Reality Warping, don't you think the other creations should scale to her as well? Because they too resisted the laws for nearly a year??"

A:- No they won't scale. Altair's nature of existence is different than the other creations and she said that herself in episode 20. Not only that but she was alone for three months in the real universe and survived it whereas the creations were without Altair for a month and were slowly getting their powers nullified and would turn into a human. Even Meteora, a Creation, couldn't last a few mins on her own even though there was also another Creation who stayed back in the real world aka Magane. Hence, Altair was essentially acting as an umbrella who was Resisting the Laws of the Universe and under whom, the creations were able to retain their powers.

Q2) "But let's say Altair was Resisting the Laws, but won't she get Nullified eventually even if takes years??"

A:- Again, nope. Altair's existence is unique and not similar to the other creations. There's no proof that she can be Nullified eventually as far as the series is concerned. Heck even her existence was able to Cracks in The Birdcage, a Pocket Reality Fictional City over which Meteora has complete control over. Even when she was erased by Sirius inside the Birdcage, the Birdcage was trying to Reconstruct itself due to the non Existence of Altair. "Cracks" in context means irreparable disturbances in the reality as explained by Meteora in episode 5 and as shown by Altair in episode 20 & 21 :- https://imgur.com/a/2DBNE . Her existence itself was warping the Trainstation plot in the Birdcage so yeah, you get the gist.

Q3) "Okay but if she was Resistant to the laws of the Universe and didn't get herself Nullified and was capable of causing cracks in the reality of the Birdcage, then wouldn't she be capable of doing that to the Universe?? If she was then why would she even summon the creations in the first place??"

A: Yes it's true that she was Resistant to the Laws of the Universe and it's also true that her existence was capable of opposing the laws of reality and deteriorating the Birdcage. However, the deterioration caused to the real world would take a very long time. She was capable of doing that to the Birdcage as it was a City sized reality against her Town lvl tiering. But against the Universe sized Reality, it would take a very long time. And about the Creations, she brought them to speed up the process of the deterioration but was careful to not speed up too much otherwise the Restorative Power of the Universe would throw her outside of the Universe.

Q4) "But won't this restorative power of the Universe capable of Nullifying her or repairing itself back if it's powerful enough to throw her out"?

A: Nope. The most it could do was throw her out as it was unable to Nullify her powers as shown above. And no it wasn't capable of repairing itself due to the very presence and existence of the Altair inside the universe who was slowly deteriorating the Universe by causing more and more contradictions.

Part 3

Sirius is a perfect copy of Altair and a Reflection of her. She was written to have the exact same powers as Altair and was written to serve as a secret weapon in case they needed her in the Birdcage. Here's some info regarding Sirius from Episode 20 :- https://imgur.com/a/8rOCD

Not only was she created in the same manner as Altair aka without any background or story, but she was created to have the same powers as Altair. Even Meteora comments that she is a perfect reflection of Altair and moreover Altair herself states that she is a good copy of her. Furthermore, Her Existence is synchronized with Altair's Existence Coefficient aka Both of them has the same type and nature of Existence. This proves that Sirius herself is Altair and she too her all her powers along with being an Acausal being herself. Now, Sirius lacked a Personality and was written hastily to be a secret weapon against Altair rather than being a Character with a Personality like Altair who was written to be serious. This was basically what caused her downfall as she was merely a doll without any emotions or reactions only built to eliminate Altair. Altair took advantage of that and used her Probability Manipulation to find a possibility for becoming Sirius and Possessed her while her Existence was almost changed into Sirius's. So this basically proves that Altair's Probability Manipulation can affect Acausal beings.

Here's some questions that people will likely ask:

Q1) "How can Sirius's be Acausal if Altair's Probability Manipulation worked on her??"

A: Sirius was stated multiple times to be a Perfect Reflection and Copy of Altair. Moreover Altair herself is Acausal and Sirius's Existence is Synchronized with Altair's Existence Coefficient. In short, Both are literally the same kind of beings with the same type and nature of existence and same kind of powers. The only difference is that Sirius lacks a personality and is basically a hollow emotionless doll unlike Altair.

Q2) "Ok but how can Probability Manipulation affect Acausal beings"?

A: While it is true that Abilities like Probability, Fate, Causality manip, some forms of Time manip and Precognition are useless against Acausal beings, however, it depends entirely on the nature of the Abilities. For example Precognition can be of two types. One that can see into the future and Two that can analyze an opponent and predict their next moves. While the first one is utterly useless against Acausal beings, the second one is very effective as it relies on analyzing the opponent's movements and behavior. Another example is that Fate Manipulation is useless against Acausal beings, but there are characters who can enforce the concept of fate in an Acausal being and manipulate them. Examples like that can be found in Saint Seiya verse. In case of Altair, her powers are completely Plot Based, and as such she can manipulate plot itself to achieve the desired results such as her Existence Erasure makes the plot disappear, or her Outline Origin removes the plot twists in a character and bring them back to their previous weakened self. So it's not exaggeration or far fetched to say her Probability Manipulation worked on Sirius.

Q3) "But does Altair even has Probability Manipulation?? It could just be Plain simple possession"

A: Altair has displayed Probability Manipulation Back in Episode 17 when Selesia created an Infinite Gated Space to BFR and Seal her up. It was extremely similar to the Concept of Infinity Mirror and was created to Seal Altair up. However, Altair used her Probility manipulation to find out a gate with an exit from those infinite Gates and not only that, but her gate's exit was into Selesia's Mecha. In simple words, Altair found a gate with an exit into Selesia's Mecha which was at the back of the Mecha and hence Altair was able to appear and grab Selesia from behind inside her Mecha. Furthermore, in Ep 20 Meteora stated that Altair slipped into "one of the possibilities" for Sirius. Surely if she was just using plain simple Possession the Meteora wouldn't have stated "One of the possibilities". Here's the relevant scans from Episode 17 and 20 :- https://imgur.com/a/1kR5W

Q4) "Okay but why didn't she use her Probability Manipulation to escape the Birdcage??"

A: That's because :- i) The Birdcage is a Live Plot which was manipulated by Meteora who would've prevented Altair from escaping the Birdcage. Altair even comments that Meteora was successful in pinning down her sphere of Influence which was in reference to the Birdcage. And ii) Altair was planning to use the Birdcage to boost her own acceptance and increase her powers which she was successful in achieving.

So in Conclusion, I did the following:

-Provided a page for Meteora

-Gave Proof and explained Altair's Resistance to Law Manipulation, Reality Warping and Power Nullification

-Gave Proof and explained Sirius being an Acausal and Altair having Probability Manipulation that works on Acausals

Some minor additions but Altair should also get the Following:-

-Existence Erasing Forcefields https://imgur.com/a/WAHgs

-Extrasensory Perceptions for detecting the Magnetic Fluctuations caused by Meteora inside the Birdcage

-Possible Resistance to Magic for surviving Aliceteria's Full Powered Magic Gauntlet that Warped a part of the Birdcage upon impact https://imgur.com/a/I8Kl3

 

[RM97]

BTW here's the age and height chart of the characters from the Guidebook https://www.google.co.in/amp/s/amp....reators_guidebook_first_impressions_comments/

PS:- Altair's age isn't stated and when I asked the OP about it, he replied that her age simple isn't given in the Guidebook.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Why is meteora city block level+? Are the weapons she stole city block level+? We don't use the plus sign unless it has a calc.

I have issue with the city level stats too, the birdcage was through prep, we have no idea how long it took, it could have taken a month, cause that's how long from my memory it took for all the plans to defeat altair to be finished. Also have issue with meteora who is fodder, somehow becoming stronger than altair and the others through no apparent powerup, albeit it was said her magic got stronger, still we have no timeframe on her feat.

Don't think she should have concept manipulation, nothing was ever said about her manipulating concepts, she did gave konoya a concept cohesion boosts, but we never got any details on what it can do. Overall her abilities aren't really combat applicable, which is why i didn't bother making her profile in the first place cause her feats are vague.

More upgrades for altair again i see, also pretty long post you have here. So for the resistance to law manipuation etc, altair said if she tried to do anything she would be the one thrown out of the world or whatever, now if she was resistant to law manipulation etc, she shouldn't have to worry about that in the first place. Second while she was there for 3 months, doesn't mean she was resisting her powers being nulled, the other creations were there for at least a month and nothing happened to their powers, altair is a contradiction to the world sure, and the world wants to solve that contradiction, however as i said before, the world was clearly having an effect on her, as she would have ejected out of it if she tried to do anything back in ep 10, altair basically wanted all the creations to fight and cause a massive contradiction which would cause everything to reset, instead of just herself doing something on her own and getting ejected.

Altair's probability manipulation can effect acausal beings that have no personality or anything, in short useless against true acausals. She wouldn't have found a possibility to slip into if sirius had a personality.

 

[RM97]

Yes it was through preptime but shouldn't that be added? Hence why I also added Unknown.

Regarding the concept manipulation it's due to this:-

Altair was there for 3 months alone and nothing happened to her. Whereas if you look at the screenshots, just a month after Altair's departure the powers of the Creations were slowly fading away. And when Meteora was the last one to stay behind, her powers got nulled with a couple of mins. Altair was worrying about the BFR because even if the Universe couldn't null her powers, it would still throw her out.

Aren't True Acausals beings who are like 1-A tier?? Well if you look at it, the reason it was successful against Sirius was that Sirius didn't fight back while she was getting possessed due to not having any personality thereby making her emotions, reactions,etc null. She just followed orders to eliminate Altair 1v1 and once she the existence change was done she didn't do anything. Plus Altair's Probability Manipulation found out a gate among those infinite Gates whose exit leads inside Selesia's Mecha. The Infinite gate was made to BFR and Seal her inside so there is no way she should've escaped, but she did. Hence why I think Locality Tracking and 'limited' Probability Manipulation should be removed and replaced with just Probability Manipulation.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

A unknown, city level with prep time could work for meteora.

Hmm guess concept manipulation is ok then.

Hmm wasn't it an entire month before the chamber festival? Then another month passed after altair left? So 2 i guess, still not the same as altair. But think of it like this, the reason the world was gonna be destroyed was cause of the creations right? They aren't supposed to be there, and the more of them altair brought the closer the world got to being destroyed cause that was how it would fix the contradictions.

Now when it was altair there alone, it was a contradiction yes but certainty not as massive as altair plus everyone else, my point? While altair may have been there longer, it certainly isn't as massive a contradiction as everyone else, the world eventually fixed the contradictions by their powers being nulled, and by that time altair was already not in that universe anymore.

In short i think we need some sort of proof of her powers being nulled and her resisting it, we can't make the assumption that she did cause even the other characters it took months to do, and we got no indications of there powers weakening in that time, and it could be that the world simply took a while to fix the contradictions and it wasn't actively nulling their powers before.

No idea where you got the idea true acausals are 1-A, although yes a 1-A acausal would be superior to anything below it, by true acausal i meant, an acausal being who has a personality, not a blank slate like sirius was. It was stated that she was able to slip into one of sirius's possibilities because she was a blank slate, meaning if she wasn't it wouldn't have happened, after all both of them have the same powers, and sirius is stronger.

It's just an assumption that it was cause of probability manipulation why she was able to get out of the infinite gates, we already went over that it's locality tracking, plus altair can travel between universes anyway, don't think bfr should hold her in the first place.

 

[RM97]

Well Altair came to the Universe on August. She was alone untill she summoned the other creations in November, the same time when Sota met with the other members. After that it was on July that the Festival happened on July next year and the Article for the interview says August aka a month after the Festival. https://imgur.com/a/0yWMO

Let's assume that the Contradictions are caused only when they fight. So,

Altair alone lived for 3 months = No Power Null

Altair + Other Creations lived for 8 months = Still no Power Null

Other Creations lived for a month = Suddenly everyone and Especially Meteora was getting her Powers weakened.

All the Creations left sans Meteora = Meteora gets her powers Nullified completely and gets turned into a normal human in a couple of mins

What I'm trying to Say is Altair was alone for 3 months compared to Meteora's two min without causing any fights to harm the rationality of the Universe and yet she didn't get her powers Nullified. Moreover just after Altair left from the Universe, Meteora states that the tremors from the collision were converging and that her magic was shrinking day after day which was due to the Restorative power of the Universe which was the same power that was going to throw off Altair from the Universe if she acted hastily to stir up the Yoke. https://imgur.com/a/0yWMO


And yes I get what you're saying regarding Sirius. If Sirius had a personality, she would've countered Altair's attempts with her own Probability Manipulation. My point is that instead of Locality Tracking and 'Limited' Probability Manipulation, only Probility Manipulation should be just mentioned.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

You just sort of proved my point no? It's only after all the creations are gathered and all the fighting has taken place that the power null happens, we have no indication of that happening before. And once it has happened altair was already in a different universe.

Only limited probability manipulation you mean? No pretty sure you mean just probability manipulation, but don't agree with just that since it's a piss poor probability manipulation which was only possible due to the other person being a blank slate, it's not gonna be applicable in combat.

 

[RM97]

BTW I think Altair and Sirius should be 7-C instead of Low 7-C via Scaling. Kal's calc put Episode 6 Aliceteria at High end Small Town lvl and all the other Creators scale off from that feat. However, Altair > Revised Aliceteria using his most powerful attack > Aliceteria from Episode 6. Or even, Altair >> Selesia with Vogelchevalier >> Pre-Timeskip Selesia. Considering the Difference between High end Small Town to High end Town lvl is 17.5x, it's not far fetched to say Altair should be in Tier 7-C considering how she bodied multiple low 7-Cs easily even though those Low 7-Cs were much stronger than before due to revisions.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

The gap for small town level is actually 5.8x not 17.5x.

But you do have a point yes, with this sort of scaling "Altair >> Selesia with Vogelchevalier >> Pre-Timeskip Selesia", Town level could be reasonable, depends on the calc, have no idea what this number reads as "2.924.991.757.606,840352475 J ", is that in the 2.9x10^12 range if so that would be multi-city block level, don't know kal's numbers are throwing me off with the dots and commas.

If the calc is like in the middle of small town level or something like that, town level for altair would be reasonable.

 

[RM97]

Yes but what I meant was that the Restorative Power of the Universe was always in effect. It's the laws of the Universe that tries to make sense and tries to fix any contradictions. Like Meteora stated in episode 2:- https://imgur.com/a/Ve2mp . Yes I know that you're saying that the cracks started happening due to the presence of other creations fighting each other, but that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that the Restorative Power of the Universe was trying to resolve the contradictions from the beginning. Against Altair it could not do anything but throw her out of the Universe, but against the other Creations it was able to weaken them and power nulled Meteora at the end.

And yes, but a Probability Manipulation against Acausal is not a piss poor ability tho and she was able to do it while nearly getting her existence changed.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

The resorative power of the universe makes sense of the contradictions by translating the 2-D characters which are the creations into 3-D characters, nothing was stated there about their powers being nulled. It again happens after all the creations are gathered and massive fights have taken place.

It's a piss poor ability cause it only worked on an acausal who had no personality, literally any other acausal with a personality and it wouldn't have worked.

 

[RM97]

Well Kal did state that the pulverization force yield was small town lvl and the violent fragmentation was multi city block https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Kaltias/Re:_Creators_Aleceteria_calc


The Restorative powers were responsible for nulling the abilities of Meteora. She herself says that here in episode 22 and she states back in episode 5 that the Restorative Power will throw Altair out of the Universe if she were to damage the world on her own which was proven true in episode 10 https://imgur.com/a/Ve2mp

Bruh you gotta give some credit to that ability considering it's plot based and worked on an Acausal being even tho she lacks a personality. But still it worked on an Acausal whereas Probability Manipulation were not even supposed to work on Acausals in the first place whether they have a personality or not.

Also, what about the other upgrades I stated at the end of my Tl;Dr post????

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

I know it's small town level, but i wanna know how far into it it is.

Altair wanted all the creations to fight which would have caused so much damage to the world that it would be destroyed, this is why the birdcage was necessary in the first place, as to not cause damage to the world.

And yes it's the world correcting the contradictions, but the point is those contradictions cause damage to the world which is why it needs to be restored in the first place, when the characters come into the world it tries to resolve those contradictions by making them 3-D, but when the characters uses too much of their powers which defy the laws of physics and what not, it causes further contradictions, the world erases their powers at the end of the series due to there being too many contradictions, unless you can show that the world tried to null altair's powers before the final battle of the series, don't think she should power null resistance.

Plot based powers work on acausal's regardless though just not causality powers, and probability powers also work i think depending on what sort of acausality the character has, but could be wrong. But regardless of that, the ability won't work on any regular acausal since they have personalities, so still not impressive.

Your post was so long i missed those. Existence Erasing Forcefields- Ok

Extrasensory Perceptions-Ok

Possible Resistance to Magic- No, she survived that due to reversing causality, and redirecting the damage to aliceteria.

 

[RM97]

Hmm. Aight so untill the full guidebook gets translated, I'll have to wait more. Only a couple of staff interviews and the characters age and height chart were given.

 

[RM97]

https://www.google.co.in/amp/s/amp....reators_guidebook_first_impressions_comments/ Altair's age isn't given and when I asked him he said that the Guidebook didn't give info on Altair's age

 

[Sharkafterdark]

Altair has no age given

 

[RM97]

Okay so:-

Meteora Profile will be Added

Altair gets Extrasensory Perceptions

Durability Negation via 9th movement which makes the plot disappear

Her Forcefields will get elborated with "(Said Forcefields are invisible and can resist gravity manipulation on top of Erasing Beings coming in contact with them)"

Should locality Tracking removed? I don't think she even needs it. Instead her Probability Manipulation should get elborated to "(Affected Sirius and was able to Possess her but was able to do that because Sirius lacked a personality)"

Aliceteria should get Magic

Kanoya gets Forcefields due to his Reflector Fields

And Altair should Possibly be upgraded into Tier 7-C due to scaling along with her speed Hypersonic? Because she reacted and blocked Selesia's Mecha's Machine Gun attacks

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Meteora Profile will be Added- You can do that yes, i have no interest in it

Altair gets Extrasensory Perceptions- Yes

Durability Negation via 9th movement which makes the plot disappear- Pretty obvious

Her Forcefields will get elborated with "(Said Forcefields are invisible and can resist gravity manipulation on top of Erasing Beings coming in contact with them)"- Yes

Should locality Tracking removed? I don't think she even needs it. Instead her Probability Manipulation should get elborated to "(Affected Sirius and was able to Possess her but was able to do that because Sirius lacked a personality)"- Her being able to travel between universes does make locality tracking irrelevant, but as for probability manipulation it would still just be limited, again it's not that good of an ability she has only used it to slip into the possibility of another person due to them not having a personality, just saying probability manipulation will give ppl the idea she can make things with 0% probability of happening happen or some hax stuff like that, which she can't.

Aliceteria should get Magic- I guess.

Kanoya gets Forcefields due to his Reflector Fields- Yea

And Altair should Possibly be upgraded into Tier 7-C due to scaling along with her speed Hypersonic? Because she reacted and blocked Selesia's Mecha's Machine Gun attacks- Ap upgrade possibly depends how far into low 7-C the calc puts aliceteria, speed upgrade no, she is already faster than everyone else being supersonic+ compared to everyone else who are supersonic, and nothing puts her further.

 

[Duhhhhhh1]

I'm late in this thread but here's some of my opinions regarding the thread and the comments:-

1) I disagree on Meteora's Law Manipulation as she didn't show any proof of having it but just a single statement. Furthermore she couldn't manipulate the laws of the Universe so that Creations can exist in the universe. Moreover she had her powers Nullified in the end due to the very same laws of the Universe. So that totally debunks her having Law Manipulation.

2) I read the thread and I agree with RM97 on Altair's Probability Manipulation affecting Acausal beings due to the ability being a plot based power. Probability Manipulation itself can have different natures for example in Torikoverse Food Luck is also a type of Probability Manipulation but it is the energy of the primordial Gourmet Gods that lived in the universe 13.7 billion years ago. Also, I don't see how having a personality simply makes you a True Acausal. Infact I don't see how Personality Is even connected to Acausality. Acausality is the Characteristic feature due to being Unbound by the laws of Causality. From what I understand in the Acausality revision page, True Acausals are beings who are above the Dimensional concept i.e. tier 1-A. So saying Altair's Probability Manipulation only worked because Sirius lacked a personality and it won't work on other Acausal beings is dumb because not only is there no relation between personality and Acausality. Plus there's a crapton of statements where Holopsicon is stated to be having Infinite Abilities and even the 4Koma ReCreators strips by the Author Rei Hiroe himself states that Holopsicon is all of Creation https://imgur.com/a/fCrGx . So it's not far fetched to say Altair has Probability Manipulation. Also, I do agree that "Limited" should be removed because we have many characters in the Wiki who have Probability Manipulation listed in their profiles but didn't show stuffs like bringing the probability of an event occuring to 0% or 100%. A fine example would be Torikoverse where foodluck has shown to defend and deflect attacks but no good probability manipulation feat was shown.

3) Okay so regarding the Resistence to Power Null, Law Manipulation & Reality Warping, this one is tough. Altair was being Thrown out of the Universe in ep10 but the reason was that she was being hasty and causing the tremors quickly as opposed to taking time and slowly causing them. An Analogy here would be imagining the Real Universe as Human body and the Creations as Pathogens/Virus/Poison elements. When these pathogens are injected into our body, the body starts to produce antibodies to fight these pathogens. It's easy to fight if these pathogens are in small number or are weak. The body is then able to easily destroy them. Similarly the creations present after the festival are the pathogens who were getting their powers nullified by the Antibodies aka the Restorative Power of the universe and when all the Creations left, and Meteora was only there, she had her powers nullified and turned into a human easily just like how a single pathogen gets stomped by Antibodies in our body. However, Poison Elements cannot be cured via mere Antibodies and their presence in the body can damage the body overtime. Moreover, if the poison is too much in the body, the body will throw up, cause blood to flow from wounds or openings to eliminate the poison but if the Poison gets accumulated over time slowly, it'll cause the death of the body. Similarly, Altair is the Poison element here. She was present in the real universe for months alone without getting her powers nullified. What Celestial says is valid that she wasn't causing the tremors alone but needed the creations to slowly damage the universe and if she tried to act hastily she would be thrown out. Does that mean that Altair needed other Creations to Cause the destruction of the Universe?? Yes. Does that mean that the Restorative Power of the Universe wasn't active till the Tremors began after the Creations collided??? Not at all. The Restorative Power was always active. It was unable to Nullify Altair's powers and was only going to BFR her if she hastily caused tremors. But let's say the Restorative Powers were active since the Tremors were caused back in November according to RM97's link. The Restorative Power would've nullified the powers of the creations like it did in the end and it was at that point powerful enough to BFR Altair should she hastily act. The Restorative Power is what causes Contradictions to end in the Universe as per Meteora's statements Episode 4. However, the restorative power was unable to do anything due to Altair's presence. Altair was essentially acting as an Umbrella for the creations so that all their powers would not get nullified. So does that mean Altair was resisting the laws of the universe and it's attempt to nullify her powers and turning her into a human?? Yes and moreover her presence was acting as an umbrella to protect the other creations powers being nullified. And when she departed from the universe, the restorative power started to slowly nullify the powers of the 9 creations and when they all departed for their own universes, it quickly nullified Meteora's powers and turned her into a human from a creation. There's also the fact that she has the Holopsicon which can give her the ability to Resist Power Nullification, Law Manipulation. And also, she was born without a universe, so it won't be farfetched to say she isn't Bound by the Laws and Concepts of Space, Time, Causality.

 

[Xantospoc]

I agree with the Op and Mr Duh1

 

[Tman766]

I agree with RM97 and Duhhhhhh1's reasonings. They seem valid plus her Holopsicon was stated to be Omnipotent which is not literally meant to be taken at face value but still denotes that it's all powerful and possibly has countless/infinite abilities. So it won't be wank or exaggeration to say that Altair has Probability Manipulation, resistances to power null, law manip, and reality warping.

 

[Lancer45Man]

Recently finished the Series (man what a ride) and I just wanna say that the post is very detailed and I agree with it and especially with Duhhhhhh 1's reasonings.

 

[Lancer45Man]

I want to give some contributions. I think Altair should have Resistance to Plot Manipulation, Reality Warping for this:-










People might say that Reality Warping is why the Story Worlds and Creations including Altair were born. But I think it's more than that. This is exactly similar to Vertigo Comics's Lucifer where The Presence says that he is shaped by external forces

and the Author Mike Carrey says it's a reference to the Sandman storyline "Dream of a Thousand Cats in Dream Country" where dream and the Cat Goddess discuss how Gods are powered by the beliefs and wishes of the Humans and how the Humans turned the reality from their beliefs http://68.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l57z8mFuCV1qag189.jpg . Obviously The Presence and Other top tier beings have Resistence to Reality Warping but still they were shaped by the beliefs and faiths of the humans.

Anyways, Altair was also born without a Universe and as such she should get Resistence to Space-time Manipulation as she isn't bound by it and furthermore, even the Guidebook shows that Altair has no age meaning she isn't bound by Time. Also I think Information manipulation and Matter manipulation should be added via her Representation Exposition which is essentially revising plot/reformatting existence, but it has shown to change Selesia's sword and zombies into flowers and she used it to change back into herself after possessing Sirius.

 

[RM97]

@Duhhhhhh1 well Meteora did state that she can interfere with the laws of the real world and the story worlds but what you said makes sense.

Also, yes. That's what I was trying to say regarding Altair's Probability Manipulation and Resistances to Law Manipulation, Power Null, and Reality Warping which is backed up by Lancer45Man's comment.

@Lancer45Man, Idk how I missed those but your point seems valid especially the elaboration of how Beliefs and faiths of humans can shape Gods and top tier beings in DC/Vertigo comics. However I'm a bit iffy on the Resistence to Space-time Manipulation but it makes sense considering she was born without a Universe and a background story.

 

[Duhhhhhh1]

@RM97 if Meteora did have Law Manipulation she'd have prevented getting nullified and turned into a human by the Restorative Power of the Universe. And also she displayed no feats of Law Manipulation, so that statement of hers is not credible and should not be taken at face value. It's kinda like going to the gym and getting pumped after working out on heavy weights and saying you feel strong enough to lift tons of weight.

But I digress since everyone here seems to agree on the fact that Altair has Probability Manipulation, Resistances to Law Manipulation and Power Nullification and even Reality Warping which is additionally provided by @Lancer45Man's scans and reasoning that seems good.

 

[Peter1129]

So uhh kinda late but looking back on the Aliceteria's calc isn't the pulverization Multi-City Block Level as well? Since Kal uses , as .

2.924.991.757.606,840352475 J = 2,924,991,757,606.840352475 J which is only 0.6990898082234323 Kilotons. Which according to the Attack Potency chart is only Multi-City Block Level.

So unless I missed something the Re:Creators characters need to be downgraded to 8-A Possibly/Likely Low 7-C if the time skip made them stronger than they were before.

 

[RM97]

Well Multi-City Block caps out at 4.814x10^12 J and Small Town at 2.42672x10^13 J. Kal's Calc shows that Violent Fragmentation yields 9.415x10^12 J and Pulverization yields 2.924x10^13 J.

Also, let's say the Calc shows 0.699 Kiloton for pulverization which is Multi-City Block lvl. The Upper End of Multi-City Block is 1 Kiloton and that of small town is 5.8 Kilotons and above that is Town lvl. So even if Aliceteria and the gangs were boosted to, say, 2-3x during the Timeskip, that still falls under Small Town level and Altair was still way above them. The scaling goes something like this:- Altair Reborn > Sirius > Altair >> Aliceteria Using Maximum Power of Her Gauntlet > Aliceteria Base > Pre-Timeskip Aliceteria. Or even, Altair Reborn > Sirius > Altair >> Selesia With Vogelchevalier After Revisions and Timeskip > Selesia With Vogelchevalier Pre-Timeskip > Selesia in Base Pre-Timeskip.

Small-Town to Town level is where majority of the cast is in.

 

[RM97]

Best Case Scenario Everyone of the Cast Gets Upgraded to Town Lvl

Worst Case Scenario, Everyone sans Altair and Sirius Pre-Timeskip gets Downgraded to Multi-City Block and Post-Timeskip they get Small Town lvl.

 

[Peter1129]

To be honest I'd rather have either 8-A Altair or 7-C Altair. She might actually be able to take title of strongest if she's in one of these two tiers. Low 7-C is impossible due to SCP-1440.

 

[Duhhhhhh1]

To be honest I'd rather have either 8-A Altair or 7-C Altair. She might actually be able to take title of strongest if she's in one of these two tiers. Low 7-C is impossible due to SCP-1440.

Well what RM97 said, by Calcs and Powerscalling she would be in 7-C easily especially after becoming Sirius 2.0/Altair Reborn. And yeah she'd be the strongest 7-C. 8-A seems to be lowballing her if we go by Kal's Calc.

 

[RM97]

Well what RM97 said, by Calcs and Powerscalling she would be in 7-C easily especially after becoming Sirius 2.0/Altair Reborn. And yeah she'd be the strongest 7-C. 8-A seems to be lowballing her if we go by Kal's Calc.

^

Also, peeps here seem to agree with many of my stuffs and even Lancer45Man brought up some interesting things that I overlooked. So another upgrade might be plausible if people agree.

 

[Duhhhhhh1]

I'm actually trying to gather more info regarding the verse from the series, the ongoing manga, the guidebook and interviews. So a CRT is likely to happen in the future and I'll address and include the upgrades brought here and some more if I find.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

So......anyone want to create Meteora profile?

 

[Duhhhhhh1]

So......anyone want to create Meteora profile?

I might do it soon if nobody else creates it

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Looking forward for that.

 

[AKM sama]

Those are some pretty large walls of text. I haven't read all the responses but points in the OP look promising.