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Prohibiting the Silencing of FTL One Piece

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DarkDragonMedeus said:
I agree that there really should be open discussion for these types of things. At the end of the day, it should be whatever calculations are the most mathematically accurate are the ones that should be used in the scaling chains save for things that may or may not be considered outliers. But whether or not certain feats have the scientific backing to be legit lightspeed lasers and characters outpacing them enough to qualify for FTL is a different story and people should be welcome to discuss their honest opinions and give out their reasons for it.
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Kizaru has the Light Light Fruit. He becomes light. There's nothing more complicated than that, and there has been no showing to disprove it. Nothing has been shown to disprove the laser weaponry other characters use either. It's incredibly consistent.
 
Wait, since we're talking about verse speed, why aren't the USklaverei's relativistic calculations taken into account? they need to be rated?
 
How about this: "Any attempts to use Kizaru to downgrade the FTL ratings will be formally dismissed. This wiki accepts Kizaru's DF as natural light, he said that his attacks travel at the speed of light, a statement that has been confirmed by many guidelines, characters and Oda himself. Since we have confirmation that Kizaru's light travel at SOL, the Pacifista and Queen's laser beams are treated as SOL.
 
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RazumaHiroki said:
How about this: "Any attempts to use Kizaru to downplay the FTL ratings will be formally dismissed. This wiki accepts Kizaru's DF as natural light, he said that his attacks travel at the speed of light, a statement that has been confirmed by many guidelines, characters and Oda himself. Since we have confirmation that Kizaru's light travel at SOL, the Pacifista and Queen's laser beams are treated as SOL.
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This doesn't address the common argument for "Kizaru being SoL is a hard cap on him and the verse", which is ridiculous.
 
Make it more simple for users to comprehend. A simple "Do not try to downgrade the speed of the verse while using Kizaru as a basis. Several characters in the show are shown reacting to light speed attacks, in this same token don't attempt to downgrade the speed of the verse using the argument that only Kenbunshoku Haki users can react to light speed, this was proven to be a mistranslation."
 
GodlyCharmander said:
For narrative sakes, I do see Oda doing a 180 and saying Lightspeed is still fast for characters like Luffy
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12.png
13.png

Impossible. He is an outlier then
 
LordGinSama said:
Make it more simple for users to comprehend. A simple "Do not try to downgrade the speed of the verse while using Kizaru as a basis. Several characters in the show are shown reacting to light speed attacks, in this same token don't attempt to downgrade the speed of the verse using the argument that only Kenbunshoku Haki users can react to light speed, this was proven to be a mistranslation."
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Yeah, that sounds more plausible.
 
RazumaHiroki said:
How about this: "Any attempts to use Kizaru to downgrade the FTL ratings will be formally dismissed. This wiki accepts Kizaru's DF as natural light, he said that his attacks travel at the speed of light, a statement that has been confirmed by many guidelines, characters and Oda himself. Since we have confirmation that Kizaru's light travel at SOL, the Pacifista and Queen's laser beams are treated as SOL.
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I don't think we need a straight up verse rule.
 
  • Regarding the Speed: In the case of the speed ratings for the characters, it has been decided in this thread that characters of this verse have the potential to reach FTL speeds. It has been agreed on by staff and knowledgeable members alike that Kizaru should not gatekeep the FTL speed ratings of the verse, and all FTL calculations are valid if they match the consistency of the verse.
Or something like that. I wanted to format it like how we format our notes
 
Can I ask one question to set my opinion? In the One Piece Open World game. (In which Oda helped If Im not wrong) as well as other and the Anime. We saw that this "move" from Kizaru is indeed Lightspeed but it is in quotes, "predictable". It draws a path of light that tells you where he is going to go and which may tell why Rayleigh is looking at this "path" AND why Kizaru was still there before moving. Then, he starts to turn into light particles and move at the speed of light.

That doesn't make Rayleigh's feats any less impressive, but if there is some "path prediction" in there, it should maybe reduce the speed? (A bit like how Aim Dodging works?) Because, technically speaking, if he just interrupted Kizaru before he turned entirely in light particles when he sees the path he is going to take, it would take a huge chunk of speed.
0512-006.png
 
UeTa said:
Can I ask one question to set my opinion? In the One Piece Open World game. (In which Oda helped If Im not wrong) as well as other and the Anime. We saw that this "move" from Kizaru is indeed Lightspeed but it is in quotes, "predictable". It draws a path of light that tells you where he is going to go and which may tell why Rayleigh is looking at this "path" AND why Kizaru was still there before moving. Then, he starts to turn into light particles and move at the speed of light.

That doesn't make Rayleigh's feats any less impressive, but if there is some "path prediction" in there, it should maybe reduce the speed? (A bit like how Aim Dodging works?) Because, technically speaking, if he just interrupted Kizaru before he turned entirely in light particles when he sees the path he is going to take, it would take a huge chunk of speed.
0512-006.png
Click to expand...
Kizaru isn't light speed only with that technique... 🤔 not fully sure what you mean... Kizaru starts moving when he starts moving... Oh I see, still tho the path is also very fast and we see kizaru move first and then Rayleigh even tho he knows the path, he doesn't know when (if precog isn't used)
 
Honestly, why would Kizaru need a SoL fruit when it's FTL without it?

In action calcs
1- Kizaru used his ability to travel riding a path.
2- In Queen the laser needs to recharge to attack, so they may have dodged before.
 
Otosaka said:
Honestly, why would Kizaru need a SoL fruit when it's FTL without it?

In action calcs
1- Kizaru used his ability to travel riding a path.
2- In Queen the laser needs to recharge to attack, so they may have dodged before.
Click to expand...
200.gif
 
Otosaka said:
Honestly, why would Kizaru need a SoL fruit when it's FTL without it?

In action calcs
1- Kizaru used his ability to travel riding a path.
2- In Queen the laser needs to recharge to attack, so they may have dodged before.
Click to expand...
Kizaru uses his fruit for evasive maneuvers and hypermobility. He's FTL in base but in terms of movement he's much more restricted than he is while utilizing his Light Fruit.


Also what kind of mememing is this?

1: Rayleigh tagged him as he was moving, so this is irrelevant.

2: Queen doesn't need to charge the laser, he just opens his mouth and fires it. Both Sanji and Zoro were right in front of him, and were in the middle of a 2v2 against King and Queen. Contextually it wouldn't make sense for them to aim dodge when they're up against comparable, if not stronger opponents.
 
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MonkeyOfLife said:
Kizaru isn't light speed only with that technique... 🤔 not fully sure what you mean... Kizaru starts moving when he starts moving...
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I know, But Rayleigh feat is based on this technique. And it seems that he intercepted Kizaru before he turned into light by predicting the path he was gonna take. (By cutting the light path that got drawn in front of his eyes.)

Also, did we ever directly saw Kizaru turning into a straight up laser? Without any "prep." before that? I don't remember seeing him to something like that. And for the kick moving at Lightspeed, it's only my opinion, but I think it's just the power of his kick enhanced by light. Just like how his sword doesn't move at Lightspeed. He materializes solid light. And everything made out of light is not always LS. This is one of the easiest lightspeed's feat rule to understand.

So that's basically what I'm asking for. In your prediction calculation, even the character Kizaru defeated with great ease has far better reaction time than his. (FTL+ vs. FTL). So it look very inconsistent, and If the Rayleigh feat is in fact just path prediction, lot of them will also drop I guess. (except the other beam dodging one of course)
 
I feel like saying "Kizaru's fruit is actually making him slower" is kind of dumb, but there's no evidences against FTL so far.

Regardless of what is kept, Kizaru's future interractions shows him blitzing the FTL characters (or at the opposite, show the FTL characters keeping up with him just fine) would settle this whole thing later on.

Neutral, but current stuff makes the evidences for the "anti FTL note" kinda weak.
 
He's FTL in base
Click to expand...

He ain't FTL yet, just saying.

And I don't buy any argument of "Kizaru could have trained his fruit to upgrade it from Lightspeed to Faster-than-light." As far as arguments go, that one is pure head canon just like limiting everyone else in the verse because of Kizaru's existence.
 
Otosaka said:
CRT literally has a part hinting at it being faster without the Pika Pika.
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Kizaru not using his fruit 100% of the time is not evidence that he is faster without his fruit active.

That is one part of the OP I disagree with.
 
UeTa said:
Can I ask one question to set my opinion? In the One Piece Open World game. (In which Oda helped If Im not wrong) as well as other and the Anime. We saw that this "move" from Kizaru is indeed Lightspeed but it is in quotes, "predictable". It draws a path of light that tells you where he is going to go and which may tell why Rayleigh is looking at this "path" AND why Kizaru was still there before moving. Then, he starts to turn into light particles and move at the speed of light.

That doesn't make Rayleigh's feats any less impressive, but if there is some "path prediction" in there, it should maybe reduce the speed? (A bit like how Aim Dodging works?) Because, technically speaking, if he just interrupted Kizaru before he turned entirely in light particles when he sees the path he is going to take, it would take a huge chunk of speed.
0512-006.png
Click to expand...
Kizaru's Yata no Kagami is just his "Light teleportion" similarly how Enel has his own way to teleport whenever, whoever and wherever he wants via transforming into their respective elemental logia forms. I repeat that the limit of Kizaru has never been stated as LS, Kizaru can most likely accelerate to a speed beyond light if we ever see him try, it just means he needs Yata no Kagami for travel speed since One piece travel speed is known for being ridiculously slow, while their combat speed is really fast.
(It's possible since DF are capable of evolving further beyond their initial limits)

Also Travel speed = / = Combat speed, the next thing anyone is going to tell me is that Enel's attacks doesn't travel at the speed of light?

This Databook explicitly states Kizaru's attack speed. This too, Kizaru's statement and Oda's confirmation.

IMG_20210722_212002.png

This scan proves that Kizaru doesn't need Yata no Kagami to move at the speed of light. Allow me to explain you this scan, G2 Luffy went through Kizaru, since his Elemental body wouldn't kill him. As you can see he's still in the mid-air and as soon as he raises his head he got blitzed by Kizaru.
 
UeTa said:
And for the kick moving at Lightspeed, it's only my opinion, but I think it's just the power of his kick enhanced by light.
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Its stated to be light speed in the databook and can move at the speed of light
 
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