Potential Upgrade to Arceus' Power Null (Or a mountain of new resistances)

[Xerkser500]

Hmm I guess thats fair then.

But that still shouldn't mean First Law cannot null/resist anything under Arceus's standing anyway. At worst, it means First Law can only null stuff 4-D and under.

 

[NeoZex6399]

Another one:

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Destiny_Bond_(move)

 

[Zeifyl]

4-D TCG powers Arceus passively null are as follows: Mind Manipulation, Sleep, Durability Negation, Memory Manipulation (from Uxie), Confusio (from Azelf), Time Manipulation (from Dialga), Spatial Manipulation (from Palkia), BFR, Power Nullification (from Giratina), Precognition (from Cresselia), whichever of OHK, Fate Manipulation, or Causality Manipulation "If your opponent's Active Pokémon is afflicted with a Special Condition, it is knocked out." sounds most like (from Darkrai).

Perhaps a few others as well that were either missed, or accidentally brushed aside as game mechanics.

 

[Antvasima]

So what are the conclusions here?

 

[Xerkser500]

I still think that First Law should be able to null all of the TCG + game moves (and nothing more than this).

Just because 3-D abilities already wouldn't work on a 4-D level via superior dimensionality doesn't take away from what First Law on its lonesome would be capable of actually doing.

 

[Zeifyl]

So what are the conclusions here?

Well, something is getting accepted, that much we've discovered. What is still the question, though.

At a bare minimum, the stuff in my last post.

 

[Antvasima]

@Zeifyl

Okay.

 

[Xerkser500]

I still think that First Law should be able to null all of the TCG + game moves (and nothing more than this).

Just because 3-D abilities already wouldn't work on a 4-D level via superior dimensionality doesn't take away from what First Law on its lonesome would be capable of actually doing.

 

[Elizhaa]

Just check, we already accept TGC abilities on Arceus' profile.

Power Nullification (Should possess Dialga's Time Crystal TCG ability, and Giratina's Renegade Force and Devour Light TCG abilities)

 

[Zeifyl]

Just check, we already accept TGC abilities on Arceus' profile.
Power Nullification (Should possess Dialga's Time Crystal TCG ability, and Giratina's Renegade Force and Devour Light TCG abilities)

Yup! And that is one of the main reasons I went for this in the first place.

 

[Kaltias]

@Xerser

There is no point in specifying that because Arceus is flat out immune to literally every 3-D power simply by virtue of being 4-D.

First Law nullifying that isn't a more relevant feat than Arceus stomping a Bibarel is

 

[Zeifyl]

@Kaltias

Are there any 4D Pokémon I missed? The list of currently checked ones are: Uxie, Mesprit, Azelf, Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, Cresselia, Darkrai

 

[Kaltias]

Not to my knowledge, unless there are tier 2 people post Gen V, i'm only familiar with Pokemon up to that point

 

[Zeifyl]

Not to my knowledge, unless there are tier 2 people post Gen V, i'm only familiar with Pokemon up to that point

The only candidate I can think of is Hoopa, who might be a smurf.

 

[Xerkser500]

@Kaltias

Fair then I guess

@Zeifyl

Hoopa's hax should count since its blatantly proven to work on the CT but not Hoopa himself

And what about Lucario 7, PMD Dusknoir and the Unown?

 

[Zeifyl]

@Kaltias
Fair then I guess

@Zeifyl

Hoopa's hax should count since its blatantly proven to work on the CT but not Hoopa himself

And what about Lucario 7, PMD Dusknoir and the Unown?

Then I'll add Hoopa as well.

Lucario 7, and the PMD 'mons aren't relevant to the subject, and Unown has nothing to add.

 

[Zeifyl]

We all agreeing on this, then?

Powers Arceus passively nulls via First Law are as follows: Mind Manipulation, Sleep, Durability Negation, Memory Manipulation (from Uxie), Confusio (from Azelf), Time Manipulation (from Dialga), Spatial Manipulation (from Palkia), BFR, Power Nullification, Paralysis (from Giratina), Precognition (from Cresselia), OHK (from Darkrai), Resistance Negation (from Hoopa).

 

[NeoZex6399]

Would First Law nullify Giratina's Destiny Bond?

 

[Zeifyl]

Would First Law nullify Giratina's Destiny Bond?

Oh yeah, that too.

 

[Xerkser500]

And those aren't the God tiers TCG abilities right?

 

[Zeifyl]

And those aren't the God tiers TCG abilities right?

All of it is from attacks.

 

[NeoZex6399]

Unown counts as 4-D?

 

[Zeifyl]

Attack Potency: Unknow (A single Unown possesses a very small amount of 4-D energy)

 

[Xerkser500]

The Unown were used by Arceus to create more of the CT.

And if they possess 4-D energy then I would imagine their abilities are also 4-D?

 

[Zeifyl]

The Unown were used by Arceus to create more of the CT.
And if they possess 4-D energy then I would imagine their abilities are also 4-D?

Yeah, but they don't get anything that's both valid for the subject matter, that isn't already on the list.

Anyway, would you guys consider this "If your opponent's Active Pokémon is afflicted with a Special Condition, it is knocked out." to be OHK, Fate Manip, or Causality Manip?

 

[NeoZex6399]

OHK

 

[Xerkser500]

Is OHK an actual power here?

 

[Zeifyl]

Is OHK an actual power here?

Yep.

 

[Xerkser500]

Kay then. Then yeah I agree its OHK.

 

[Zeifyl]

We all in agreement about everything then?

 

[Antvasima]

Is somebody experienced willing to carry out the accepted changes?

 

[Xerkser500]

Maybe Zeifyl? Or I could if no one else will first.

 

[Zeifyl]

I was hoping Kaltias would do it. But I can do it, if necessary.

 

[Elizhaa]

Is somebody experienced willing to carry out the accepted changes?

I could add them.

 

[Elizhaa]

Are these changes right?

We all agreeing on this, then?
Powers Arceus passively nulls via First Law are as follows: Mind Manipulation, Sleep, Durability Negation, Memory Manipulation (from Uxie), Confusio (from Azelf), Time Manipulation (from Dialga), Spatial Manipulation (from Palkia), BFR, Power Nullification, Paralysis (from Giratina), Precognition (from Cresselia), OHK (from Darkrai), Resistance Negation (from Hoopa).

 

[Zeifyl]

Was the ones I saw on their cards.

Note that allowing Arceus to null itself wouldn't change the list.

 

[Everything12]

Is precognition based of Creselia's future sight? Cause if so moves that effect the player or the player's deck aren't nulled by Arceus' First Law.

 

[Zeifyl]

Is precognition based of Creselia's future sight?

Correct. Although also redundant, considering we're dealing with a temporally omnipresent character.

 

[Elizhaa]

Is precognition based of Creselia's future sight?

Correct. Although also redundant, considering we're dealing with a temporally omnipresent character.

Ironically, it is not on her Profile.

 

[Zeifyl]

Is precognition based of Creselia's future sight?

Correct. Although also redundant, considering we're dealing with a temporally omnipresent character.

Ironically, it is not on her Profile.

Most TCG powers aren't. And that's where Xerk comes in, once this thread is closed.