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Possibly this wikis longest CRT (Gravity Falls)

So what are the conclusions here?
 
he can also apparently kill people on the mindscape (watch the fight, he was going to kill soos and mabel) so there is that and he doesn't need a deal to go in the mindscape
 
Also, in the deleted scenes of "Dreamscaperers" Bill appears in Dipper's mindscape via a void-like structure so there is that as well
 
I still think that it should only be with precognition and that entire episode could just be written off as CIS since I believe Alex did say bill would have won had it not been for the need of a happy ending
 
yes

Even Alex recognizes that Bill not being able to tell the Stan brothers apart(something that he DID in his first appearence) and getting bodied by the memory gun is bullshit
 
I think that Ryukama knows Gravity Falls well. You can ask him and other staff members listed in the verse page to comment here.
 
I think these are the general agreements

Mabe;

Regular Key

  1. She has been constantly depicted as physically superior to Dipper as shown through her constantly bullying him physically and beating him in fights most of the time, and in the game Rumbles revenge, she has been stated to being stronger than dipper but slower (and let's face it, we all know the game is canon i mean, it was the first time bill was introduced to us.)
  2. she should be stated to be able to "nearly keep up with dipper" since like i said above, she is a bit slower than him.
  3. her intelligence should be explained more since she has been shown to be a good problem solver, is a quick thinker, and has a good deal of experience throughout her entire summer
  4. she should have in her weaknesses "easily falls in love and gets a bit obsessive with many things"
Soos

He should get two keys his regular key and his zombie

Regular key

  1. It should be stated that he is stronger than dipper and mabel as he was able to hold them off in "Not what he seems" with little to no effort and they were not able to get through him
  2. he should be stated to be nearly comparable to stan since he was able to temporarily hold him back in the same episode (in a no-gravity room)
His intelligence should be expanded on and explain how he is a good mechanic and was able to fix the laptop in season 2 but how he is also pretty naive and ditzy

  1. It should be stated in the weaknesses that he becomes discouraged when his past is mentioned (not going to spoil it) but he overcomes this by season 2
  2. The weakness should also say that he is ditzy and if you pull a blanket over his eyes he falls asleep immediately (This is in the journal 3)
Zombie key

  1. He should have corruption as a new ability
Gremloblin

  1. His reasoning for AP should say how it is above Stan and Ford
Dipper

  1. it should also be noted that he is inexperienced in the dreamscape
  2. he should have summoning (zombies) but this can backfire on him
Wendy

  1. Her intelligence should be expanded on saying how she is a skilled survivalist and hand to hand fighter
  2. her being lazy should be a weakness but she overcomes this when serious
Stan

  1. His intelligence should be "At least gifted" and then it talks about him being able to repair the portal, is a skilled con artist, and is an excellent fighter
  2. he should get weapon mastery (has been shown to be proficient with many different weapons)
Bill's friends

They should get two keys, normal/restricted and full power

reasoning:

  1. When on their own (except for a size amplification from bill), they weren't able to defeat the shackatron and the main reason for their infamous status in the nightmare realm is for their weirdness, their evilness, and their association under Bill, not really "power" per say
  2. However at their peak when the barrier was broken they have been shown to easily play with planets like toys
AP

  1. Their first key should be whatever the shackatron was (I don't have any feats but it looks at least high 8-C)
  2. Full power should be at least 5-A (have been shown to play with planets like toys with Xanthar being able to burrow himself and mess around with a planet far larger than normal https://youtu.be/E-uBuVQOulA?t=108) possibly 3-C (Galaxies are considered prizes to them from bill and bill offered to give stan and ford this amount of power should they help him, and so presumably would have given his minions this level of power for their loyalty)
Powers

  1. Superhuman physical characteristics (self explanatory)
  2. resistance to madness manipulation/mind manipulation (has the same reasoning as bill)
  3. Large size (Type 1 for first key, types 5 or 6 up to 7 in second key)
  4. They should get Low-Godly regen since Ford used the gun thingy on them and they regened and helped Bill when the portal opened (would this actually be Mid-Godly? Maybe)
Intelligence

  1. It should go more in depth explaining their age and the amount of experience they have such as pacifier killing millions on countless moons
Speed

  1. Their speed should be "Massively Faster than Light" since they should be somewhat comparable to Bill who has been shown to fly at these speeds in this clip https://youtu.be/E-uBuVQOulA?t=108
Ford

  1. his intelligence should explain his experience, fighting ability etcetera
  2. He should have magic and cursing (as shown in the journal)
  3. Limited invisibility (Via cloak of occasional invisbility)
  4. Weapon mastery (is an expert on many weapons and even shows to be highly familiar with swords since he "doesn't recommend double edged swords")
  5. He can also summon zombies
  6. Possession via tie of possession (the person he wants to possess must be wearing it)
  7. Whatever the truth telling teeth give him
  8. can trap certain ghosts in silver mirrors
  9. Limited resistance to radiation manip (he has radiation resistant gloves)
  10. probability manipulation with infinity sided die
  11. he has a dimensional translator
  12. mind reading with mind reader (non combat applicable unless opponent is asleep)
  13. Portal Creation
Old Man McGucket

  1. He should be extroardinary genius (can build giant robots, helped make the portal, was stated to be a better mechanic than ford, and him where he didn't go crazy helped make the quantam destabilizer)
  2. His stats should be updated to fit all the other characters
  3. He should get memory Manipulation from the gun he made
  4. The weaknesses should better explain that he is unstable from his insanity
Giffany

  1. She should get immersion for going inside different video games
  2. She should get Immortality types 1 and 6 (She is a robot who can't age and when her game dies she just oes to a different game to survive)
  3. It should be a weakness that she ges jealous easily
And the big one here, Bill Cipher

He should get his restricted key for the barrier and his full power key again

Reasoning:

  1. His "at most 2-A" thing should be removed and changed to "possibly 2-A" as it isn't bill at his upper limits and rather reasoning that isn't clear enough so the possibly is needed
  2. He should also be 4-D (again, finally) since Ford could summon an interdimensional being which according to wikipedia means being in a dimension beyond our own (essentially at least 4-D) and Ford didn't even think to use him against Bill which implies bill is just above him (I know it could backfire with the other monster, but wouldn't it still be worth it since this is an "unimaginable beast" that would likely try to hurt bill so it still works) and since everything in GF was caused either directly or indirectly by bill (meaning he gets any of the powers or of the such as the monsters in GF, this was how he got technological manipulation and stuff like that) and when the two ghosts "the eternal key" and "the petrifying rock" they unleash KRXSKXL the unpercievable who should be below Bill (since this guy was technically caused by Bill indirectly) and if he is "unpercievable" this implies that he is beyond 3-D
  3. And in "Rumbles Revenge" he says this, "your reality is a game to me. and i like gAmes…." which heavily implies he is above the main GF reality in the same sort of way Mxy is with the main D.C. universe
  4. And so, I think Bill could get his 4-D stature and Hax back with this


  1. His intelligence should be explained more, Nigh-Omniscient with precognition (just listen to the argument)
Reasoning:

  1. He made the blue prints for the portal, was able to bring up calculations for ford nearly instantly shown here https://youtu.be/cxru6oxVafQ?t=83, when Ford was fatigued Bill offered to help him while he slept through the night and when Ford accepted Bill put him ahead of schedule while also using his cipher to put messages in ford's journal in one night, all of these implying that Bill is just smarter than Ford (even if he was just extraordinary genius) also supported by the fact that Bill has made fun of Ford's intelligence before
  2. He also was said somewhere (can't find the scan but if someone can it would be appreciated) to think of hundreds of ways to kill you the second he meets you which shows how fast his mental capabilites are
  3. For the precog, stick with me here, Bill claimed that he had this precognition that allowed him to see infite possibilities or something like that (I honestly don't remember the whole thing) and it was concluded that this was just either hyperbole or was a one off power (I think, again i don't remember everything) but wouldn't it just make more sense for plot that he didn't use it out of cockiness and arrogance rather than it being a one off ability? Or it being non cannon (why would the creators of the show, presumabely Alex, even do this if it isn't cannon)? So I think it makes more sense to the plot that he was just too confident or arrogant which honestly makes sense, since if anybody was in bills position they would likely have made the same mistake, rather than just ignoring it all together and it is in character especially since alex claims that bill knows the answers of the universe here https://youtu.be/5Q5cO_eGjjE?t=116 which just supports this more
  4. There is also a thread where this is being discussed but so far I think this argument makes sense and the rating covers everything
Powers

TBA
 
I think the reasons that I posted why restricted Bill is 4-D make more sense because dimension, pandimensional, intermension tends to be misused to mean from another universe. The dimensional term by itself looks to be use accurately.
 
Totallynotchewbacca said:
oh, should i remove my argument for 4-D bill then?
Click to expand...
No, I would advise not using term like interdimensional because in numerous cases in the show from the Gravity Falls episode transcript it was to mean one is from another universe.
 
but that isn't our arguments we know he originated from the 2nd dimension

we are saying he transcended into higher dimensions

by this logic him being 3-D would be complete wank
 
Bill interacting with Ford in the Nightmere Realm proves that Bill was at least 3-D without a physical form

Bill calls his "make-over" multi-dimensional, impling transcendence
 
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