Pokemon - Arceus and his Plate abilities?

[Sniper670]

You can ask to get the page unlocked here:

https://vsbattles.com/threads/all-purpose-request-thread-new-forum.107534/page-85

Why are you unlocking the page for him?

We've not even reached a conclusion here

 

[Sniper670]

Heres what Agnaa said

Some things would change, but I don't have the time to write out a list of every one.

It'd just be the stuff that comes from moves (probably still scaling to the strongest pokemon performing those moves) and stuff that Arceus needed the plates to do. And not have any random non-move hax.

It does not align with what Iamunanimousinthat proposed

 

[Hasty12345]

Why are you unlocking the page for him?

We've not even reached a conclusion here

We did 5 pages ago…

 

[Sniper670]

We didn't.

His page is not getting on Arceus profile. No one agreed to getting his page on any profiles

And again. You're still in tbe minority. As the vast majority still want Arceus to keep all moves.

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

Ironic as it may be, Arceus has been depicted with the ability "Omniscience" before, which basically functions as an auto-evade, much like the ability Instinct, as he knows the attacks will come ahead of time due to what I would assume to be, the name of the ability, omniscience.

Was boutta comment on the name of the ability, but then I saw the jp name of the ability on bulbapedia lol

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

Can someone (preferably one who doesn't have a bias conflict of interest) explain what the absolute conclusion of this CRT is? since I've seen at least 5 contracting replies in the last 3 pages from different sides.

 

[Sniper670]

Well, Agnaa is the one with the most credibility amongst the Admins here, as he has direct knowledge about the Japanese language and went through the translations and all

Conclusion from him

Arceus keeps all moves
Non move hax goes. I've been waiting for what that means for almost a week now.
He's supposed to comment on this as well.

Arceus' Plates

vsbattles.fandom.com

All in all, majority is in favor of Arceus keeping all his moves.

Although I will say, Agnaa made some bizarre comments that has me wondering what his stance even is anymore

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Can I ask what power he's sharing in the first Place?
I'd like to hear your thoughts

OP tried to use this argument, which I debunked. The plates give Arceus the power of the type he assumes

Pokémon manipulates fire energy to use fire

Arceus has the essence of Fire Type. Literally the meaning of essence, what makes something what it fundamentally is.

It's more than evident that God who gave powers to the multiverse can use such powers

This is a non argument. Porygon, a man made Pokémon is literally drawing power from psychic energy. And guess who has the Essence of Psychic Energy, God

He's sharing power to Pokemon

Show me this debunk

So what if they manipulate fire energy?

The japanese version of the plates just say it grants power of (their respective) type. Doesn't mention essence

Arceus didn't give all Pokemon all their power

This is a non argument. Porygon, a man made Pokémon is literally drawing power from psychic energy. And guess who has the Essence of Psychic Energy, God

Again essence isn't mentioned in the Japanese version and Arceus having all psychic power doesn't mean he can shape the psychic power into any move that any Pokemon can use

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Can someone (preferably one who doesn't have a bias conflict of interest) explain what the absolute conclusion of this CRT is? since I've seen at least 5 contracting replies in the last 3 pages from different sides.

The lore surrounding the plates does not justify Arceus having every single power of every single pokemon and non-pokemon in the franchise.

What has been decided is that Arceus type changes with each plate and he gets the general powers of each type for example, he becomes a water type with the splash plate and can use water manipulation, as he has shown in the anime. He can use the all the moves of each type.

He does not get the abilities of Pokémon or their specific non-move related powers such as pokedex entries. He does not get anything form non-pokemon.

Arceus Plate revision

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Sniper670]

He's sharing power to Pokemon

Show me this debunk

So what if they manipulate fire energy?

The japanese version of the plates just say it grants power of (their respective) type. Doesn't mention essence

Thank you. So it gives Arceus the power of the type

So why does this crt still exist and isn't closed, when the plates literally gives him the power of the type

. Also, I can never trust you. Drop the Japanese version right now

Arceus didn't give all Pokemon all their power

Says you?

Again essence isn't mentioned in the Japanese version and Arceus having all psychic power doesn't mean he can shape the psychic power into any move that any Pokemon can use

Give us the Japanese version right now..

The plates directly mentions that it has the power of all things. Agnaa went through and agrees, so what's your point

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

Conclusion from him

Arceus keeps all moves

What has been decided is that Arceus type changes with each plate and he gets the general powers of each type for example, he becomes a water type with the splash plate and can use water manipulation, as he has shown in the anime. He can use the all the moves of each type.

Arceus Plate revision

vsbattles.fandom.com

I do vaguely remember a CRT that was approved that would give mons TMs (later TRs in SwSh) but never applied to most profiles. If Arceus still keeps ALL moves of each type then that blog is woefully barebones (I know it covers the plates but the moves are just as important too also there's some errors too).

 

[Sniper670]

The lore surrounding the plates does not justify Arceus having every single power of every single pokemon and non-pokemon in the franchise.

Are you sure about this?

What has been decided is that Arceus type changes with each plate and he gets the general powers of each type for example, he becomes a water type with the splash plate and can use water manipulation, as he has shown in the anime. He can use the all the moves of each type.

Looks good

He does not get the abilities of Pokémon or their specific non-move related powers such as pokedex entries. He does not get anything form non-pokemon.

What do you mean by non Pokémon. Humans use Psychic powers, ghost powers, everyone's power falls under a type.

Agnaa made this same comment and I'm not sure what that means

Arceus Plate revision

vsbattles.fandom.com

No. This is not what is going to be on his profile

This is is

Arceus' Plates

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

I do vaguely remember a CRT that was approved that would give mons TMs (later TRs in SwSh) but never applied to most profiles. If Arceus still keeps ALL moves of each type then that blog is woefully barebones (I know it covers the plates but the moves are just as important too also there's some errors too).

We don't need to list all the moves on the profile. Mew just has a note that it can use all the moves. What errors are there?

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Thank you. So it gives Arceus the power of the type

So why does this crt still exist and isn't closed, when the plates literally gives him the power of the type

. Also, I can never trust you. Drop the Japanese version right now

Says you?

Give us the Japanese version right now..

The plates directly mentions that it has the power of all things. Agnaa went through and agrees, so what's your point

Here's the japanese version. Giving someone power of the fire type isn't the same as having the power of every fire type Pokemon

Arceus using the power of all things can lose to the protagonist, so I doubt the plate has the power of every single move and ability in the entire Pokemon verse

 

[Vietthai96]

Can someone (preferably one who doesn't have a bias conflict of interest) explain what the absolute conclusion of this CRT is? since I've seen at least 5 contracting replies in the last 3 pages from different sides.

If i'm remember vaguely Arceus keep all the moves that he himself demonstrated or at least confirmed to have, others will be removed

 

[Sniper670]

Here's the japanese version. Giving someone power of the fire type isn't the same as having the power of every fire type Pokemon

エスパーのタイプの石盤。あるポケモンに使うとエスパーの力を得る。

Translation

Esper type slate.
When used on a certain Pokemon, it gains the power of Psychic.

So here it basically confirms what I said, that it allows Arceus to gain esper power

I didnt see any selective statements about it

Which falls in line with the legend plate allowing him to gain the power of every type there is, because, it has the power of everything

If you think going Japanese will help your argument, think again

レジェンドプレート
万物の力が宿った石盤。あるポケモンに使うと あらゆるタイプの力を得る。

Translation :

Legend Plate
A stone tablet in which the power of all things resides. When used on a Pokémon, it gains the power of all types of Pokémon

Arceus using the power of all things can lose to the protagonist, so I doubt the plate has the power of every single move and ability in the entire Pokemon verse

I can say the same for mew. Or literally any other legendary


And let's not go there, Arceus was testing the player. Volo was literally going to use Arceus to wipe out all universes

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

We don't need to list all the moves on the profile. Mew just has a note that it can use all the moves. What errors are there?

The issue is you have to go to another website and search for a move and then apply it in a VSBW format (E.g something as mudane as Rain dance would be weather manipulation right? until you realise it's has additional applications such increasing the power of water type attacks while also weakening fire type attacks and that's just one move in hundreds).

Well the Earth Manipulation resistances makes no sense since ground types resist rock type attacks but are neutral to themselves while rock types are weak to ground type attacks and are neutral to themselves but your blog says otherwise and that's just one error.

If i'm remember vaguely Arceus keep all the moves that he himself demonstrated or at least confirmed to have, others will be removed

That's not what both sides have said (yet more contradiction) plus I vaguely remember Pokémon are suppose to get TMs (TRs) and Arceus similar to Mew can learn them all (within reason).

 

[Vietthai96]

That's not what both sides have said (yet more contradiction) plus I vaguely remember Pokémon are suppose to get TMs (TRs) and Arceus similar to Mew can learn them all (within reason).

Oh yeah, i forgot about Mew from Battle something, seriously this thread have 9 pages and i can't keep track with anything. Sorry

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

Oh yeah, i forgot about Mew from Battle something, seriously this thread have 9 pages and i can't keep track with anything. Sorry

No need to apologise, it's not your fault this CRT has been nothing but one major pain in the ass to read and comprehend.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Well the Earth Manipulation resistances makes no sense since ground types resist rock type attacks but are neutral to themselves while rock types are weak to ground type attacks and are neutral to themselves but your blog says otherwise and that's just one error.

Fixed. What other errors are there?

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

Fixed. What other errors are there?

Spoiler

To save you the trouble here's a type MU chart.

The only thing I would argue is the dread plate could possibly grant Unholy Manipulation since the dark type is considered the "evil" type in Japan and Arceus himself should have Holy Manipulation for self explanatory reasons.

I don't want to drag this already messy CRT any further but I don't one of most consistently viewed profiles on the Wiki to have any noticeable errors or misinformation since it will make both the Pokémon supporters and Wiki look bad.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Translation

So here it basically confirms what I said, that it allows Arceus to gain esper power

I didnt see any selective statements about it

Which falls in line with the legend plate allowing him to gain the power of every type there is, because, it has the power of everything

If you think going Japanese will help your argument, think again

Translation :



I can say the same for mew. Or literally any other legendary


And let's not go there, Arceus was testing the player. Volo was literally going to use Arceus to wipe out all universes

Literally all it says is he gains psychic type power, not every move

Yeah he gains all types, not all moves

I can say the same for mew. Or literally any other legendary

So?

Arceus was testing the player but still using the power of all things

 

[Sniper670]

Literally all it says is he gains psychic type power, not every move

He gains the power of Psychic.

Legend plates encompasses all plates. He has the power of everything.

So yes, everything is everything

You're free to give me another meaning for everything. I'll wait

Yeah he gains all types, not all moves

That line of reasoning is what @Iamunanimousinthat was trying to pull

Won't work. Arceus has been shown to transform and use the power of the type he assumes.

He's not simply changing and using Judgment lol. Game mechanics

So?

Arceus was testing the player but still using the power of all things

Are you fr?

He could've simply negated all attacks if he wanted to

Be serious

 

[Sniper670]

@XXKINGXX69 Fr, you're back and I don't have time to play silly games with you. It's why you were banned.

I'll wait to hear what Agnaa has to say. He understands Japanese and the context of it

 

[XXKINGXX69]

He gains the power of Psychic.

Legend plates encompasses all plates. He has the power of everything.

So yes, everything is everything

You're free to give me another meaning for everything. I'll wait


That line of reasoning is what @Iamunanimousinthat was trying to pull

Won't work. Arceus has been shown to transform and use the power of the type he assumes.

He's not simply changing and using Judgment lol. Game mechanics

Are you fr?

He could've simply negated all attacks if he wanted to

Be serious

I just responded to it

That line of reasoning is what @Iamunanimousinthat was trying to pull

Won't work. Arceus has been shown to transform and use the power of the type he assumes.

And?

Are you fr?

Prove it

 

[Sniper670]

I just responded to it

And?

And?

So your argument that he can only change type and nothing more is imvalid

Prove it

No. I'm not going to play this game with you.

Read the manga, where no one could scratch him, in the absence of all his plates. Watch the Jewel of Life. There's just one pis, but that gets completely negated by his showings thereafter. It's also where it was mentioned he can negate every attack..Heck, Causality didn't proceed until Arceus was like "I'm fine with these changes"

if he'd wanted to kill the player, he'd have done it in the intro. lol. He brought you there to solve a problem, and to test the player.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

And?

So your argument that he can only change type and nothing more is imvalid

No. I'm not going to play this game with you.

Read the manga, where no one could scratch him, in the absence of all his plates. Watch the Jewel of Life. There's just one pis, but that gets completely negated by his showings thereafter. It's also where it was mentioned he can negate every attack..Heck, Causality didn't proceed until Arceus was like "I'm fine with these changes"

if he'd wanted to kill the player, he'd have done it in the intro. lol. He brought you there to solve a problem, and to test the player.

Why is it invalid?

Then the protagonist scales above those people who couldn't scratch him. Arceus wasn't trying to kill but was still using the power of all creation

 

[Sniper670]

This is why I'm telling you to go read it

Arceus was trying to test humans, but humans were greedy asf and he meant to teach them a lesson,referring to manga Arceus. And boi he stomped them hard.

In the game, he's just testing the player, literally one of the reasons why he isekaied you to that universe .

No way the player scales above a pissed off Arceus, even if the manga Arceus had no plates

 

[Pikaman]

Idek what the current status of this is but I do have issues with the page by @Iamunanimousinthat, it’s pretty barren and doesn’t index the types correctly in a few instances

However, given this thread has gone on so ridiculously long past it’s expiration date, and the changes I want are fairly minor, I might argue for them in a separate thread later down the road

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

No way the player scales above a pissed off Arceus, even if the manga Arceus had no plates

Ehhhh…Pokemon is a JRPG. Godkilling (or in this case god beating) is common. True Arceus is another story but protags and co. can and do scale above an avatar.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Idek what the current status of this is but I do have issues with the page by @Iamunanimousinthat, it’s pretty barren and doesn’t index the types correctly in a few instances

However, given this thread has gone on so ridiculously long past it’s expiration date, and the changes I want are fairly minor, I might argue for them in a separate thread later down the road

What are your suggestions?

 

[Pikaman]

What are your suggestions?

As said in my post I need to compile them and I’d rather not hold this thread up much longer, so I’ll likely discuss this in another thread

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

If there are no more suggestions or fixes then I shall make the changes when they open the page.

 

[Sniper670]

As said in my post I need to compile them and I’d rather not hold this thread up much longer, so I’ll likely discuss this in another thread

I'm not sure why we're going with his page. No one agreed to that, and it's barebones and lacks a log of things. There's no need to list all moves in there, as some moves are simply rehashes

I went through all powers on the wiki and fit the moves into them.

Arceus' Plates

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

I'm not sure why we're going with his page. No one agreed to that, and it's barebones and lacks a log of things. There's no need to list all moves in there, as some moves are simply rehashes

I went through all powers on the wiki and fit the moves into them.

Arceus' Plates

vsbattles.fandom.com

No one is using your page. This thread completely null and voids it. You literally have arceus getting abilities from a human. It's been denied. Take the L.

 

[Sniper670]

No one is using your page. This thread completely null and voids it. You literally have arceus getting abilities from a human. It's been denied. Take the L.

My page has all the moves fit into powers on the wiki vs yours lacks everything that Pikaman is even going to plan another CRT as a result


Are you fr?

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

My page has all the moves fit into powers on the wiki vs yours lacks everything that Pikaman is even going to plan another CRT as a result


Are you fr?

You're also trying to sneak in abilities, and non-pokemon powers, and pokedex entries in there that, the thread has concluded that the plates do not give Arceus access too.

If you were actually being forthright you'd actually just have the moves but you don't. I'm not using your blog. Enough is enough.

 

[Sniper670]

You're also trying to sneak in abilities, and non-pokemon powers, and pokedex entries in there that, the thread has concluded that the plates do not give Arceus access too.

I'm not. Agnaa was supposed to go through all of them to voice his thoughts.

And I'm still waiting for the non Pokémon powers you can squabbling about.

Why shouldn't Arceus keep Pokedex entry stuff? Cryogonals ability to melt is literally one of his moveset, Liquid Armor, which can melt Slugma into lava, Vaporeon into water and Cryogonal into vapor. I've seen that being brought up several times

I'd like you to explain why Arceus will lose pokedex entry stuff.

All physiology stuff is found in their moves. Starmie's ability to regen as mentioned in Pokedex? Recover, a move that restores cells. So nah, he's not losing pokedex stuff

If he's getting all moves, then he's getting all these as well, as the things mentioned in Pokedex entries are things the Pokémon do with their powers.

If you were actually being forthright you'd actually just have the moves but you don't. I'm not using your blog. Enough is enough.

Well, your blog is pretty barebones, and all they have to do with mine is go through and remove some things

Which, like I said, was something Agnaa was going to handle

 

[Antvasima]

It seems like five staff members have currently accepted or almost accepted this revision and none are opposed to it, so I am afraid that you need to stop stonewalling here. It will likely not lead anywhere.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

The revision has been accepted and the change has been made.

Arceus no longer has all the abilities, powers, and moves of every pokemon and non-pokemon based on justification from the plates.

What has been changed is that Arceus can change his type with the plates, and has the general abilities of each type such as water manipulation from the splash plate or fire manipulation from the flame plates as he has shown in the anime and manga.
It has also been added that Arceus has access to all moves of each type.