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Well it looks like that most disagrements have been settled, from the looks of it. But yeah Highlighting it for some moar attention wouldn't be bad.
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Papyrus "Absolutely Normal Attack" KE calc
- Thread starter Saikou_The_Lewd_King
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Mmm. I've been wondering why we haven't settled this yet.Saikou The Lewd King said:
Alright, let's see what happens...
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As I may or may not have stated before (Too lazy to check), I agree with this.
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I believe we should only use the big bone, as well.
Also, bit of a quick question, how does stat scaling to basic monsters work? Wouldn't they just be City level and Massively Hypersonic through scaling to things like Tsunderplane and Vulkin and such, with Island/Large Island/whatever and Relativistic being the realm of bosses? Someone help me out here.
Also, bit of a quick question, how does stat scaling to basic monsters work? Wouldn't they just be City level and Massively Hypersonic through scaling to things like Tsunderplane and Vulkin and such, with Island/Large Island/whatever and Relativistic being the realm of bosses? Someone help me out here.
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- #85
Being a boss or a normal monster doesn't matter really. "Basics" monsters have has much worth as "main" and "bosses" monsters. That's the whole point of the game. Also, the Relativistic thing comes from a "basic" monster. We really only uses the stats based on their CHECK stats. Thus, most Snowdin enemies are weaker than Papyrus, while Waterfall enemies are around his level. Hotland and above are generally stronger than him.
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Okay so i've gotten rid of just about all of the comments that derailed this, i think we can continue on with discussing on weather we'll be able to implement this.
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- #87
Holy hell what happened?
Err, anyway, is there anyone disagreeing with this? Becausing simply waiting for things to happen isn't going to get this further.
Err, anyway, is there anyone disagreeing with this? Becausing simply waiting for things to happen isn't going to get this further.
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Basically, someone had to question how we've tiered the Undertale characters based on things like their STATS and whatnot.Saikou The Lewd King said:
Anyways, i'm in agreement with what DT said and use the Big Bone instead.
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- #89
Well it was, I updated the calc not long ago to reflect this. Big Bone at Minimum speed is Island Level, Big bone at Maximum speed is Large Island Level.
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Well alright. So your result by averaging out the low and high ends (is that correct?) results in Large Island level+, yes?
Will be interesting on how this will play out if we can accept this already...,.
Will be interesting on how this will play out if we can accept this already...,.
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Well my high ends of high ends used all the bones, so the actual Averga is merely Large Island Level.
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Good enough. I'm still in support for this, btw.Saikou The Lewd King said:
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Idk what are we waiting for actually, since according to Azza we have the right amount of supporters to do it, he just wanted to get DT's approval.
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Oh, so we need DT's approval? Oh s***.....Saikou The Lewd King said:
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Well since he is one of the calc member it would be a good thing to have it, and Azza just wanted to see if it was okay by DT's. Given that most of the matters that bothered him have been fixed, I don't think he would disagree,
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Just a thing or two I noticed...
"149.8/2= 74.5 cm."
This is incorrect. 149.8 divided by two is 74.9, not 74.5.
Secondly, we're assuming that a SOUL in Undertale is half as tall as Frisk, yet I'm playing it right now and it seems a good bit smaller. When I enter combat, and it flashes back in forth briefly, I went and did some pixel measurements on the SOUL immediately before it moved down to the bottom left of the screen in comparison (which I did not use full size for because, you know, it would take up too much space, click on the image if you want to see more clearly)...
So basically, this would make each pixel be 1/145th Frisk's height, making the SOUL about 46.5 or 47 centimeters high. Granted, Frisk's proportions on their sprite are sort of unrealistic, so one could argue that the SOUL being slightly larger than Frisk's torso would still be ~1/2 Frisk's height, or slightly less, just making observations...
"149.8/2= 74.5 cm."
This is incorrect. 149.8 divided by two is 74.9, not 74.5.
Secondly, we're assuming that a SOUL in Undertale is half as tall as Frisk, yet I'm playing it right now and it seems a good bit smaller. When I enter combat, and it flashes back in forth briefly, I went and did some pixel measurements on the SOUL immediately before it moved down to the bottom left of the screen in comparison (which I did not use full size for because, you know, it would take up too much space, click on the image if you want to see more clearly)...
So basically, this would make each pixel be 1/145th Frisk's height, making the SOUL about 46.5 or 47 centimeters high. Granted, Frisk's proportions on their sprite are sort of unrealistic, so one could argue that the SOUL being slightly larger than Frisk's torso would still be ~1/2 Frisk's height, or slightly less, just making observations...
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Gah, how did I screw that up. Must be that I once modified the values and didn't fix it up. Not that it matters since we uses only the big bone here.
Well I mainly compared it to the 6 Human SOULs that appears in Asgore's fight. Despite being in the background, they are quite similar in size to half of Frisk. Considering those actually appears in the overlord, it seems like it would be slightly more accurate.
Well I mainly compared it to the 6 Human SOULs that appears in Asgore's fight. Despite being in the background, they are quite similar in size to half of Frisk. Considering those actually appears in the overlord, it seems like it would be slightly more accurate.
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That is also true. I think I can find an image of those online somewhere, hold up.
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Alright, so measuring that...
70 px to 185 px, this time, whick would make a SOUL roughly 57 cm, if that is used.
70 px to 185 px, this time, whick would make a SOUL roughly 57 cm, if that is used.
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One last thing: if you want a bit more precision in measuring the Big Bone, multiply by 15.68 for each dimension (533/34, as per your own pixel measurements comes out to this), not 15.5.
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- #102
Mmh I see. I would re-do the calc but I'm busy right now, so, later.
Also there was yet another way to calc the height, using the in-game Annoying Dog in the fight and the Annoying Dog in the overworld.
Also there was yet another way to calc the height, using the in-game Annoying Dog in the fight and the Annoying Dog in the overworld.
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Actually, one more thing I noticed:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Femur This says that a person's femur bone, I.e. the one you're scaling to, is on average 26.74% of someone's height. Now that I'm thinking on it, my own femur bone is a lot longer than 14 cm, so if we're to take this seriously...
Average Human Male (just assuming since Papyrus is himself male, plus what else have we to work with?) = 69.7 inches, about, last I checked. Which would mean:
69.7 X .2674 =18.63778 inches, or about 47.3 centimeters.
Now, finding the weight of a bone is hard, but based on some research I've done...
Thickness of Femur: 29/411 = 7.06%
0.473 m x .0706 = ~0.0334 m, or 3.34 cm
Which means that, given the density of hard bone equaling 1900 kg/cubic meter....
1900 X .473 X .0334 X .0334 = ~1.0026 kg. The extra mass on the head and lower extremity should be able to counterbalance any hollowness, dryness, marrow, etc., and I'm pretty sure that a little over 2.2 lbs. sounds reasonable, so here we go.
So, if we are to use this:
Big Bone Height: 0.57 m X 15.68 (times taller than it) = ~8.94 m, or 894 cm
Scaling to In Real Life Bones: 8.94 m / 0.473 m = 18.901 times taller than an IRL femur.
Squared, is 6752.34 times more massive in each dimension...
6752.341 X 1.0026 = Just about 6769.9 kg.
Times ~1.46 for mass-increase... 9884.05 kg.
Which would only come out to about 1/4th the KE yield... :/
Granted, if we're going to say that this sunlight is natural sunlight, moving at the speed of light, using the high-end (90% SoL) seems reasonable, but even if I do that the KE comes out to ~3.60x10^20 joules, almost Large Island... but not quite. Granted, anyone above Papyrus to a significant degree likely makes it to Large Island, just still.
So, err, here you go. If anyone sees any hiccups in my math, please point them out?
Bone measurements
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Femur This says that a person's femur bone, I.e. the one you're scaling to, is on average 26.74% of someone's height. Now that I'm thinking on it, my own femur bone is a lot longer than 14 cm, so if we're to take this seriously...
Average Human Male (just assuming since Papyrus is himself male, plus what else have we to work with?) = 69.7 inches, about, last I checked. Which would mean:
69.7 X .2674 =18.63778 inches, or about 47.3 centimeters.
Now, finding the weight of a bone is hard, but based on some research I've done...
Thickness of Femur: 29/411 = 7.06%
0.473 m x .0706 = ~0.0334 m, or 3.34 cm
Which means that, given the density of hard bone equaling 1900 kg/cubic meter....
1900 X .473 X .0334 X .0334 = ~1.0026 kg. The extra mass on the head and lower extremity should be able to counterbalance any hollowness, dryness, marrow, etc., and I'm pretty sure that a little over 2.2 lbs. sounds reasonable, so here we go.
So, if we are to use this:
Big Bone Height: 0.57 m X 15.68 (times taller than it) = ~8.94 m, or 894 cm
Scaling to In Real Life Bones: 8.94 m / 0.473 m = 18.901 times taller than an IRL femur.
Squared, is 6752.34 times more massive in each dimension...
6752.341 X 1.0026 = Just about 6769.9 kg.
Times ~1.46 for mass-increase... 9884.05 kg.
Which would only come out to about 1/4th the KE yield... :/
Granted, if we're going to say that this sunlight is natural sunlight, moving at the speed of light, using the high-end (90% SoL) seems reasonable, but even if I do that the KE comes out to ~3.60x10^20 joules, almost Large Island... but not quite. Granted, anyone above Papyrus to a significant degree likely makes it to Large Island, just still.
So, err, here you go. If anyone sees any hiccups in my math, please point them out?
Bone measurements
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- #104
Mmh, I must have used a value for a child or something for my old calc.
As for the new one, I think it works.
As for the new one, I think it works.
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So if Papyrus is Island to likelier Island+, saying people who are 25+ or 30+ or so are Large Island, and Toriel/Asgore being Small Country, isn't entirely unresonable?
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- #106
It does for me. We may needs approval of others for this tho.
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So anything so far? @Saikou
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I mean, DT could check the new math (again), and if it's agreed to use the mid-end then I suppose that's it.CrossverseCrisis said:
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I see03:25, February 8, 2016 (UTC)~Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
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Could a gentleman please do it for me? I don't want to feel like a dick or something for constantly bugging DT about it
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Done.
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- #112
Thanks bruh
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No problem.
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Alright. Thank you, DontTalk. I will wait for a few more OKs before any changes occur.DontTalk said:
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Large Island level is fine with me here.
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Alright, so if everything is fine with this, I can make the upgrades relatively soon. However, it would be best if the OP is edited to reflect the final calculation/a new post is made with the final calculation so there's something to link to for the reasoning.
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Alright. Saikou can make a finalized new post when he gets online.DontTalk said:
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