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One Piece Pre-Timeskip AP Scaling

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I already brought the issues with that calc and it was removed. The verse page doesn't mention that lava calc in the scaling for their tiers, not sure if the character profiles do.
 
LordGinSama said:
unless it's like Fairy Tails Dragon Force situation, which I doubt it is.
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Maybe it is, what is the situation with Dragon Force?

LordGinSama said:
For a man who likes to bring up strict rules it's pretty funny to see you supporting "Non stated multiplier."
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I would totally support this one as well as Asura's if they weren't in a completely different situation than Carnage boxes, but Asura isn't even stated to multiply something and Shadows are massive numbers and i doubt one random shadow is as strong as Luffy

Mr.Cinos15 said:
It still baffles me how KHR got to 6-B from a High 7-A calc via sheer multipliers.
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The non-stated multiplier was just a 2x so it didn't affect their tiers that much, there are a few tier jumps that are way more impressive in other verses btw (Ureapaddy Exica)
 
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Okay, let me try to argue in Moria's favor a bit.

Just like in the KHR thread, no author would say something is being multiplied by a small number like 1,2 and really treat it as a game changing power increase, so it is likely a 2x, Lola said it would multiply his power knowing that most only resist 2-3 shadows, if 2 shadows = 2x then Nighmare Luffy is 100x stronger, if 3 shadows = 2x then he is 66x stronger. If we go by the logic that every shadow adds to Luffy an amount equal to his base stats, 1 shadow would already be a 2x and thus it would end in a 101x, Moria can then be either a 1000x, 660x or 1010x.

Here it is, now i can agree with the multipliers, what about everyone else?
 
XDragnoir said:
Okay, let me try to argue in Moria's favor a bit.

Just like in the KHR thread, no author would say something is being multiplied by a small number like 1,2 and really treat it as a game changing power increase, so it is likely a 2x, Lola said it would multiply his power knowing that most only resist 2-3 shadows, if 2 shadows = 2x then Nighmare Luffy is 100x stronger, if 3 shadows = 2x then he is 66x stronger. If we go by the logic that every shadow adds to Luffy an amount equal to his base stats, 1 shadow would already be a 2x and thus it would end in a 101x, Moria can then be either a 1000x, 660x or 1010x.

Here it is, now i can agree with the multipliers, what about everyone else?
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Stephen Paul's translation says
Lola: We can use Moria's powers to make you several times as strong as you are now!!
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And they can only take 2 or 3.
Luffy took 100 shadows. Minimum it would be is 100 since several = at least 3. Most it would be is 150.
2 shadows for 3x means 1 shadow = 1.5x.
3 shadow for 3x means 1 shadow = 1x

x = number of shadows.

I'm advocating for the first one. Not because it has a higher value, but because the fact that even 2 rose people's powers is a lot. We see fodder people w/ strong shadows and their abilities are crazy. Lola wouldn't mention 2 if it didn't have much to do w/ the equation.
 
XDragnoir said:
Who is he?
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Viz translations were so bad that he decided to translate OP himself.
Did everything pre timeskip.
Translations extremely on point, explains the reasoning behind it occasionally, and they make logical sense.
Him w/ Doriki
(Note: The word "doriki," which is made by the combination of the characters for "way/path/road" and "strength," is not exactly a real Japanese word. The "do" is the same character as used in words like "aikido" or "kendo" or "budo." There have been a few (emphasis on few) uses of the word doriki by writers to describe a type of concept in Buddhism, the ability of a person in the pursuit of enlightenment to make use of their training and discipline. This concept is not so much a word that is part of the Japanese lexicon as something that can be CREATED with the pieces of Japanese language; something that you can possibly make sense of but won't ever find in a dictionary. Oda's usage here is unrelated because Number One, the pre-existing use of doriki is so obscure that any intentional references to it would almost have to be accompanied by a footnote; and Number Two, its "reading" furigana are in katakana, which, in this case, are clearly emphasizing that this is a "foreign" use to Japanese readers. All in all, what this rambling, tedious paragraph is stating is that the word Doriki in One Piece has little intrinstic meaning, and can be considered to be nothing more than just a "power level.")
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Yeah he's official
 
I think i never heard his name before, i will search for his translations, thanks.

Anyway, it seems we may possibly have a chance of this being accepted.
 
0482-009.png


Let me guess...fodder statements arent valid?
 
unworthy said:
0482-009.png


Let me guess...fodder statements arent valid?
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"A thousand men" isn't impressive.
The rokushiki doofuses (CP9) had the power of 100 men. Saying that he's 10x stronger would just put him to Small City level, where he already scales right now.

This is why I'm tryna do as many calcs as possible, so when we need to upscale like this, we upscale off of a large value.
 
KingTempest said:
"A thousand men" isn't impressive.
The rokushiki doofuses (CP9) had the power of 100 men. Saying that he's 10x stronger would just put him to Small City level, where he already scales right now.

This is why I'm tryna do as many calcs as possible, so when we need to upscale like this, we upscale off of a large value.
Click to expand...

It is his base level + 1000 men (Among those 1000, the shadows of the mugiwaras, every stats from the mugiwaras can scale to moriah)
 
unworthy said:
It is his base level + 1000 men (Among those 1000, the shadows of the mugiwaras, every stats from the mugiwaras can scale to moriah)
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Again, 1000 men is not impressive.
And the shadows don't bring the AP of the owner, only their skills. If it did, Luffy wouldn't have decked Moria multiple times in only Gear Second
 
KingTempest said:
Again, 1000 men is not impressive.
And the shadows don't bring the AP of the owner, only their skills. If it did, Luffy wouldn't have decked Moria multiple times in only Gear Second
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Oars was fast as Luffy, it is perfectly understood that the stats / abilities of the shadow owner are added the corpse, if is not like that, Luffy, nor moriah would "multiply" their strength when they power up themselves with more shadows.

Is not like that Oda has to tell us everything as we were elementary school children, it is understood that we are readers with a minimum capacity for analysis.
 
unworthy said:
Oars was fast as Luffy, it is perfectly understood that the stats / abilities of the shadow owner are added the corpse, if is not like that, Luffy, nor moriah would "multiply" their strength when they power up themselves with more shadows.
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If we give Luffy Whitebeard's, Oden's, Akainu's, Shanks's, Roger's, Kaido's, and Linlin's Shadows, is it gonna be a 7 or 8x multiplier? With the scaling that me and @XDragnoir found, yes. With yours, no, it'd probably be like 20,000, then we would have to scrap everything we just pulled off because of false technicalities, then we'll drop another multiplier and stick to being fodder.

unworthy said:
Is not like that Oda has to tell us everything as we were elementary school children, it is understood that we are readers with a minimum capacity for analysis.
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Oda doesn't need to tell us everything, but we don't need to assume the absolute highest. Assuming the highest is what got Bleach lower than they were before.
Don't ask for a mile if Oda gives us an inch.

100x or 150x multiplier would put Luffy from Large Town to City level. With your scaling he would go up to probably mountain, then get downgraded to small building, then we have tier 8 god tiers.

Let's slowly climb up so we have something to rest on.
 
Hey Tempest, I know it might be annoying, but would you be willing to gather all of the striking strength/ap feats throughout Pre-Timeskip in a blog to make it easier for scaling? If you don't want to that's perfectly fine.
 
Mr.Cinos15 said:
Hey Tempest, I know it might be annoying, but would you be willing to gather all of the striking strength/ap feats throughout Pre-Timeskip in a blog to make it easier for scaling? If you don't want to that's perfectly fine.
Click to expand...
Wait, striking and AP or just striking feats?
 
Hmm, so we are back to no multipliers (no shadows, no doriki), which tiers we have then? Low Tier 7 from Skypiea onwards?
 
XDragnoir said:
So we are around 7A for Shadow users?
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Nightmare Luffy would be 7-B if not 7-A, Asgard Moria would be 7-A or High 7-A. Nobody scales.

Luffy would scale to destroying the black box, Low 7-B, off of Moria's Low 7-B punches, but his full yield via the multipliers wouldn't scale to anyone except maybe Kaido and Whitebeard (for being superior to Moria and for being the strongest man). It would not scale to Jinbe since the Moria that fought him barely had any shadows.
 
Before this thread dies.

We need to work on Thriller Bark scaling. With the asura removal and the Kuma calc removal, we need new placements for the characters that scale.
 
Hmm... Enel's tier (7C) isn't going to change, right? Can't we just downgrade "everyone" post-skypiea to something like "at least 7C (should be stronger than Enel)" until we have something better?
 
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