Obito Vs Ji Ning

[speedster352]

How does it work? What's the strongest attack it has reflected?

Yep.

That's Kamui's intangibility not the one he uses to BFR others tho.

How much faster SP Juubidara is compared to Obito? Ning's amp in this key aren't massive but still.

All previous Sharingan abilities greatly[53]enhanced[63], plus: Spatial Manipulation, Durability Negation, Spatial Manipulation, BFR, Teleportation and Dimensional Travel (Obito's Kamui has two distinct, yet closely related, abilities. The first one allows the user to transport objects in close proximity into the Kamui dimension. The user can transport themselves into the dimension to escape attacks or perform instant teleportation[64], or suck other objects or people[65][66] into Kamui. They can also eject people or objects[65][67], such as weapons, from the Kamui dimension. The second ability allows the user to simulate "intangibility". Once activated, Kamui automatically[68] allows parts of their body to slip into the Kamui dimension, making them seemingly "phase" through physical objects and attacks[69])

Here

 

[AdNiBN002]

How does it work? What's the strongest attack it has reflected?

It creates a clone of whatever it sees that counter-attacks. It is also stated to that the clone has the same power of whatever it copies. Basically, if Ji Ning decides to use an attack, Yagura's mirror will create a clone of him, that will be just as strong, and will do the exact same attack.

How much faster SP Juubidara is compared to Obito? Ning's amp in this key aren't massive but still.

I don't have a specific scaling-chain but he's severly faster, they're completely incomparable in terms of power.

 

[theultimate5105]

That's Kamui's intangibility not the one he uses to BFR others tho.

they are technically the exact same Ability
and there is a huge gap between them where tiny parts of it are complete blitzs

 

[XDragnoir]

they are technically the exact same Ability

Yeah but they work differently regardless, Obito's chakra is inside his body which would be in the Kamui dimension in that scene, afaik that doesn't apply to the teleportation he uses offensively.

there is a huge gap between them where tiny parts of it are complete blitzs

What?

 

[XDragnoir]

creates a clone of whatever it sees that counter-attacks. It is also stated to that the clone has the same power of whatever it copies. Basically, if Ji Ning decides to use an attack, Yagura's mirror will create a clone of him, that will be just as strong, and will do the exact same attack.

No limits fallacy.

Unless that guy has created something way stronger than himself (like, even above one shot level) and with soul hax as strong as Ning's none of that will matter.

I don't have a specific scaling-chain but he's severly faster, they're completely incomparable in terms of power.

I mean, okay? Ning isn't relying just in his speed to dodge it, but his danger sense and his other perception powers.

 

[theultimate5105]

What?

Referring to the speed portion

 

[Tatsumi504]

What are the win cons for both characters please

 

[AdNiBN002]

No limits fallacy.

Unless that guy has created something way stronger than himself (like, even above one shot level) and with soul hax as strong as Ning's none of that will matter.

He copied KCM Naruto and Killer Bee at the same time, who are stronger than him.
Also, no limits fallacy would apply if the claim is that he could copy Cthulhu or something agregious. So unless there's some discernible reason why he wouldn't be able to copy Ning then no, NLF cannot not be applied.

I mean, okay? Ning isn't relying just in his speed to dodge it, but his danger sense and his other perception powers.

Edit: Also this doesn't disprove the original point of Ning's speed-amps not being a win-con.

 

[XDragnoir]

He copied KCM Naruto and Killer Bee at the same time, who are stronger than him.
Also, no limits fallacy would apply if the claim is that he could copy Cthulhu or something agregious. So unless there's some discernible reason why he wouldn't be able to copy Ning then no, NLF cannot not be applied.

That's not how NLF works so just stop, but:

No one in his entire verse has soul hax even close to Ning's so that's indeed a NLF.

And how strong Bee and KCM were when he did that? I bet that they weren't even close to Ning, nor would the clone be able to use Ning's powers as they come from understanding type 2 concepts and law hax so like, copying Ning is really beyond anything that fodder has ever done

 

[XDragnoir]

Edit: Also this doesn't disprove the original point of Ning's speed-amps not being a win-con.

Never said it was a wincon, it will allow Ning to dodge Kamui and that's it, Ning will not even need to get close after Izanagi ends (which someone said that wouldn't last for 10 minutes so idk how useful it would even be here).

 

[AdNiBN002]

That's not how NLF works so just stop.

On the contrary, NFL would dictate that the ability is overplayed far above anything that it has been shown to do.
Yagura copying someone that noticeably overpower him has literally been shown.

No one in his entire verse has soul hax even close to Ning's so that's indeed a NLF.

Saying he can't copy Soul-Hax is fine (Although the Naruto-clone he made did have Kurama's cloak attached so it's not like he can just copy convential properties)

And how strong Bee and KCM were when he did that? I bet that they weren't even close to Ning

AP-difference doesn't cancel out hax in the Naruto-verse in that way. If that was the case then Yagura's water-mirror would just outright not have worked on Naruto nor Bee.

 

[XDragnoir]

AP-difference doesn't cancel out hax in the Naruto-verse

I am not talking about the verse in general, i am talking about what Yagura can do, again, how strong Naruto and Bee were when Yagura cloned them? If they were weaker than Ning, Ning's clone will be weaker than him, and regardless of that the clone will not have Ning's AOE so it's not protecting anyone.

 

[mal]

i thought ji ning have thought based hax n passive.

 

[AdNiBN002]

I am not talking about the verse in general, i am talking about what Yagura can do, again, how strong Naruto and Bee were when Yagura cloned them?

LM+ to Island level

If they were weaker than Ning, Ning's clone will be weaker than him

That is literally not how Yagura's ability works. Yagura's hax is not indicative of scaling. His Water-Mirror being used as an AP feat was not accepted as such.

regardless of that the clone will not have Ning's AOE so it's not protecting anyone.

The clone literally uses the same attack with the same AP, why would it not have the same AoE

Never said it was a wincon, it will allow Ning to dodge Kamui and that's it, Ning will not even need to get close after Izanagi ends (which someone said that wouldn't last for 10 minutes so idk how useful it would even be here).

Unless it allows him to keep up with someone at a completely incomparable level of power, then no.

 

[speedster352]

LM+ to Island level


That is literally not how Yagura's ability works. Yagura's hax is not indicative of scaling. His Water-Mirror being used as an AP feat was not accepted as such.


The clone literally uses the same attack with the same AP, why would it not have the same AoE

This is not going anyway can you list all the win cons for obito?

I am not talking about the verse in general, i am talking about what Yagura can do, again, how strong Naruto and Bee were when Yagura cloned them? If they were weaker than Ning, Ning's clone will be weaker than him, and regardless of that the clone will not have Ning's AOE so it's not protecting anyone.

Can you list all the win cons for JI?

i thought ji ning have thought based hax n passive.

There is a range limit and Obito has kamui and izagni and the biju don't have souls

 

[AdNiBN002]

This is not going anyway can you list all the win cons for obito?

There's no discernible counter for Kamui and in return Kamui counters a handful of abilities. Worst case scenario, Izanagi

 

[speedster352]

There's no discernible counter for Kamui and in return Kamui counters a handful of abilities. Worst case scenario, Izanagi

Exactly Obito has a higher chance of bfr JI with kamui and hax Ji so I vote obito fra

 

[mal]

There is a range limit and Obito has kamui and izagni and the biju don't have souls

ya but the op said

Starting 5 Meters apart

that mean theres no range limit. exceot if his hax have less than 5meter range

basically ji ning freezing a of then n kill obito.

n about yagura ability are useless if u can freeze him before he use the technique

n he only can use izanagi once.

 

[XDragnoir]

The clone literally uses the same attack with the same AP, why would it not have the same AoE

Cause it will not have the same attacks, Ning's attacks rely on type 2 concepts to be used, the clone will not have that for the same reasons it will not have his soul hax.

Unless it allows him to keep up with someone at a completely incomparable level of power, then no.

Meh, again, it makes him noticeably faster but iirc it's not to the point of a blitz in this key.

Tho, can i get a scan for Obito hitting SP Madara with Kamui?

 

[XDragnoir]

That is literally not how Yagura's ability works. Yagura's hax is not indicative of scaling. His Water-Mirror being used as an AP feat was not accepted as such.

Also, what do you mean? Why would water mirror be an AP feat? Isn't it a clone of his opponent?

 

[mal]

It creates a clone of whatever it sees that counter-attacks. It is also stated to that the clone has the same power of whatever it copies. Basically, if Ji Ning decides to use an attack, Yagura's mirror will create a clone of him, that will be just as strong, and will do the exact same attack.

I don't have a specific scaling-chain but he's severly faster, they're completely incomparable in terms of power.

that technique it useless if u didnt get reflected by the mirror.even if it reflected the clone will be gone after u avoid from being reflected by it or just step aside .

 

[speedster352]

So both are 6-c
ALL 6-B Restricted.
Speed is =
Starting 5 Meters apart

Member of a dead clan - 0
Chinese Dude - 0
Incon - 0

Why are they 5 meters apart? Use SBA

 

[speedster352]

that technique it useless if u didnt get reflected by the mirror.even if it reflected the clone will be gone after u avoid from being reflected by it or just step aside .

Then Obito bfr Ji and that's the end of the fight since he always starts off intangible

 

[AdNiBN002]

Also, what do you mean? Why would water mirror be an AP feat? Isn't it a clone of his opponent?

It is a clone, I mean that Yagura's own AP does not effect the AP of the clone.

 

[Arkenis]

Also, can't Ning just destroy that Gedo thing? What's its dura like?

fought off Choza and Choji

 

[AdNiBN002]

Tho, can i get a scan for Obito hitting SP Madara with Kamui?

 

[Arkenis]

He kamuied sakura not Madera.

 

[AdNiBN002]

He Kamui'd Sakura before Madara's attack hit. It was never said that Obito Kamui'd Madara directly (or indirectly for that matter)

 

[XDragnoir]

He Kamui'd Sakura before Madara's attack hit. It was never said that Obito Kamui'd Madara directly (or indirectly for that matter)

How far away was Madara?

 

[AdNiBN002]

How far away was Madara?

 

[XDragnoir]

Ehhhh

Nice feat yeah but like, Sakura is much closer to him than to Madara, he shouldn't be scaling to Madara via that.

 

[XDragnoir]

Also, what is Kamui's range limit?

 

[Arkenis]

up close

 

[Arkenis]

he can't really do it from range like tens or hundreds

 

[AdNiBN002]

Ehhhh

Nice feat yeah but like, Sakura is much closer to him than to Madara, he shouldn't be scaling to Madara via that.

Well Obito could also deflect attacks from SP Madara outright, so Obito reacting to opponents who heavily overpower him is generally quite consistent.

 

[Arkenis]

Well Obito could also deflect attacks from SP Madara outright, so Obito reacting to opponents who heavily overpower him is generally quite consistent.

With a tso staff while being amped by sage chakra. Not white mask obito. Why is this being talked about

 

[Arkenis]

Juubidara’s tso have also be reacted to by base guy and kakashi

 

[Arkenis]

The clones Yagura make don’t last long so is this really an argument?

 

[Arkenis]

Ji Ning soul hax stomp the jins. And stomp Obito. Please don’t let this go on for more pages.

 

[AdNiBN002]

With a tso staff while being amped by sage chakra. Not white mask obito. Why is this being talked about

The minor 1 tail and 8 tail Chakra isn't particularly significant considering that WM Obito basically bullied Killer Bee when they fought. If anything this Obito might be outright weaker than fully fit WM Obito.

Juubidara’s tso have also be reacted to by base guy and kakashi

That supports the idea of Obito being able to react to attacks that significantly outrank him even further.

The clones Yagura make don’t last long so is this really an argument?

The attacks cancel eachother out when used, so yes, it would be a potent counter