Nasuverse - 8-D Earth

[KingNanaya]

The space where the outer gods are is currently accepted as 7/9d

that's not high 1-C

true magic is linked to the root, it doesnt have to reach it

the person has to reach the Root is what I'm trying to say. but that itself doesn't grant them anything tiering wise. Essentially all other True Magic users die to the red shadow, except Aoko, so she's the only one that would scale. and even then, she's only scaling to the red shadow/the Earth's defenses, not acquiring True Magic itself. You know what I mean?

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

that's not high 1-C

Well considering the root is at least qualitatively above that, its at least 8d/10d by current wiki standards.

the person has to reach the Root is what I'm trying to say. but that itself doesn't grant them anything tiering wise. Essentially all other True Magic users die to the red shadow, except Aoko, so she's the only one that would scale.

The red shadow targets people who are about to learn true magic, not people who have already acquired it, as people who have acquired it would have enough power to repel it off

and even then, she's only scaling to the red shadow/the Earth's defenses, not acquiring True Magic itself. You know what I mean?

It does say she's acquired it however, you could make an argument that she hasnt fully mastered it ( she hasnt), but even then, its not diluted, like illyas dilluted third magic, and goetia's diluted fifth

 

[Paul_Frank]

At least 1-C,Possibly at least High 1-C ( To gain access to True Magic, the user must bypass both Alaya and Gaia's defenses. True Magic is connected directly to the root, however the power gained from this connection is unknown)

Few issues with it, first, scrap the high 1-C entirely, it'd be low 1-C possibly 1-C like every other tier 1 thing in the verse, no "okay but the outer gods are 7/9d and so the root is that plus 1", it doesn't scale to the root at all

Second, that first point about bypassing Alaya and Gaia isn't directly related to power, in fact it's practically the opposite, the goal is to bypass them by not being noticed, this is the reason for stuff like Araya's bounded fields and plans in KnK and stuff, to try to find a path to the Root without the counter force noticing and having him dealt with

For Aoko in specific I assume you're going with "well they say she's fighting the laws of the universe, and also that the world was acting against it and she did it anyway", but there's a few issues with that. First, we see how it acted against her, the shadow unironically just tried to get her to not use it, by the end literally just begging her to stop and not cast it. Secondly uhh, you do know that all reality marbles are like that too right? Hell, general magecraft is at times

The World tries to crush them, they overturn the laws of the world and produce their own world instead, etc, using just that as a justification would be implying that all reality marbles are also tier 1.

Finally, the level of force the World uses to stop things isn't always tier 1. See: counter guardians, Shiki (non void) being sent to stop Araya, etc.

Additionally, Aoko's Magic already is considered tier 1, in hax. Because it doesn't actually have anything you'd list in the tiering or AP section, the Magic itself isn't directly hitting anyone, it's just time manip and stuff with how it's been used, this was discussed before. Also I don't think I need to say it, but Aoko herself absolutely is not tier 1 physically or anything if that was the goal.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Few issues with it, first, scrap the high 1-C entirely, it'd be low 1-C possibly 1-C like every other tier 1 thing in the verse, no "okay but the outer gods are 7/9d and so the root is that plus 1", it doesn't scale to the root at all

Second, that first point about bypassing Alaya and Gaia isn't directly related to power, in fact it's practically the opposite, the goal is to bypass them by not being noticed, this is the reason for stuff like Araya's bounded fields and plans in KnK and stuff, to try to find a path to the Root without the counter force noticing and having him dealt with

True magic is stated to get its power directly from the root, how does it not scale?
The “World” thought that Aoko was capable of destroying it.

For Aoko in specific I assume you're going with "well they say she's fighting the laws of the universe, and also that the world was acting against it and she did it anyway", but there's a few issues with that. First, we see how it acted against her, the shadow unironically just tried to get her to not use it, by the end literally just begging her to stop and not cast it. Secondly uhh, you do know that all reality marbles are like that too right? Hell, general magecraft is at times

The difference is that reality marbles are dealt with by the world, they are not permanent, it’s only a matter of time before the world discovers it/the user’s mana runs out and it’s dealt with. Also the scan implies the shadow was ready to atttack, as it was preparing to sink its fangs

The World tries to crush them, they overturn the laws of the world and produce their own world instead, etc, using just that as a justification would be implyin

Finally, the level of force the World uses to stop things isn't always tier 1. See: counter guardians, Shiki (non void) being sent to stop Araya, etc

The world itself is being mobilized, not a counter guardian.

Additionally, Aoko's Magic already is considered tier 1, in hax. Because it doesn't actually have anything you'd list in the tiering or AP section, the Magic itself isn't directly hitting anyone, it's just time manip and stuff with how it's been used, this was discussed before. Also I don't think I need to say it, but Aoko herself absolutely is not tier 1 physically or anything if that was the goal.

Characters can scale to non physical abilities/magic, happens all the time.

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Also, where the hell did you pull High 1-C from? that's 10-11D. We're still at 8D. Plus we don't scale a person's ability to reach the Root and gain True Magic. And seeing as Aoko is the only current True Magic user with a profile (except Zelretch) that might scale, it's better to just argue points for just Aoko.

This man stays 200 steps ahead when the most important aspect of the crt he makes is about to be concluded and a consensus is reached he pulls yet another thing

The space where the outer gods are is currently accepted as 7/9d

Aoko doesn't scale to it tho

Well considering the root is at least qualitatively above that, its at least 8d/10d by current wiki standards.

True magic users aren't specified to get root tier magic anywhere in the nasuverse, we only know that they get magic from the root, like uhh we know everything comes directly from the root so I'm assuming with the same line of logic even when not specified everything is root tier now? Even regular mage craft?

and goetia's diluted fifth

Since when does blud have 5th magic

True magic is stated to get its power directly from the root, how does it not scale?
The “World” thought that Aoko was capable of destroying it

Ye... And like everything comes directly from the root too...

Additionally, Aoko's Magic already is considered tier 1, in hax. Because it doesn't actually have anything you'd list in the tiering or AP section, the Magic itself isn't directly hitting anyone, it's just time manip and stuff with how it's been used, this was discussed before.

Pretty sure it was implied in mahoyo that Aoko is a threat that can destroy the world, unless for some reason Time Manipulation can destroy the world

 

[KingNanaya]

This man stays 200 steps ahead when the most important aspect of the crt he makes is about to be concluded and a consensus is reached he pulls yet another thing

can't argue with that. gotta respect the determination though

Ye... And like everything comes directly from the root too...

High 1-C Shinji????
But seriously, if that is the logic we went to, things would go bad fast.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

This man stays 200 steps ahead when the most important aspect of the crt he makes is about to be concluded and a consensus is reached he pulls yet another thing

Aoko doesn't scale to it tho

True magic users aren't specified to get root tier magic anywhere in the nasuverse, we only know that they get magic from the root, like uhh we know everything comes directly from the root so I'm assuming with the same line of logic even when not specified everything is root tier now? Even regular mage craft?

Magecraft is different from magic, this is explained multiple times

Nickname of people who can turn mysteries that are not magecraft, things that are impossible, possible. In the past when civilization was less developed, most magi were magicians. As civilization developed, the impossible became possible, and many magic devalued into magecraft. Mysteries, in the face of reality, tasted great defeat. ———However, even among those, there still exists miracles unreachable by humans. Magi who can realize those mysteries are called “magicians,” bearing with them fear and respect, admiration and jealousy. In the world of Kara no Kyoukai, there are only five magicians.

Since when does blud have 5th magic

Nasu: Yes. Goetia’s choice to “recreate everything with a better foundation” is an act close to being True Magic. That PV was perhaps some sort of reverse foreshadowing where knowing what Goetia is lets you see Aoko’s tracks, as well as a glimpse of the Fifth Magic’s identity. Think of it as fanservice from me. (laughs)

Ye... And like everything comes directly from the root too...

They dont draw power from it like true magic. Magic is gained by reaching the root,without touching it, and being the first to use that pathway

Pretty sure it was implied in mahoyo that Aoko is a threat that can destroy the world, unless for some reason Time Manipulation can destroy the world

Time manip isnt even the fifth magics true ability,as the second can do the same

 

[KingNanaya]

Pretty sure it was implied in mahoyo that Aoko is a threat that can destroy the world, unless for some reason Time Manipulation can destroy the world

It kind of can. Me and my friends have this thing where we roll abilities on the wiki. whenever one of us get time manipulation, one of us says "I rewind time before the Earth existed and switch which timeline I'm in so I don't die in the vacuum of space" or "I change history so that X event never happened, or X person never existed/did X thing". So it is very possible

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

It kind of can. Me and my friends have this thing where we roll abilities on the wiki. whenever one of us get time manipulation, one of us says "I rewind time before the Earth existed and switch which timeline I'm in so I don't die in the vacuum of space" or "I change history so that X event never happened, or X person never existed/did X thing". So it is very possible

The fifth magic is implied to be heat manipulation but thats a discussion for another time
think: akiha's vermillion state but massively buffed

 

[KingNanaya]

The fifth magic is implied to be heat manipulation but thats a discussion for another time
think: akiha's vermillion state but massively buffed

guys, I think I have a type for girls who's hair turns red from magic.
but really though, Aoko already has energy manipulation, which includes thermal energy.

 

[Paul_Frank]

I'll maybe respond to this thread later more but first

Pretty sure it was implied in mahoyo that Aoko is a threat that can destroy the world, unless for some reason Time Manipulation can destroy the world

Yeah, but not because of her own power necessarily, its because of the side effects of the 5th, it speeds up the heat death of the universe, so ED

 

[Theoretical_Toxic19]

Yeah, but not because of her own power necessarily, its because of the side effects of the 5th, it speeds up the heat death of the universe, so ED

Oh ye I know this I did mention in it in another thread

It kind of can. Me and my friends have this thing where we roll abilities on the wiki. whenever one of us get time manipulation, one of us says "I rewind time before the Earth existed and switch which timeline I'm in so I don't die in the vacuum of space" or "I change history so that X event never happened, or X person never existed/did X thing". So it is very possible

I'm convinced now

Outside of that Aoko has that one feat of destroying flat snark which was said to be a 5th dimensional plane

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

Bump.

 

[KingNanaya]

Bump.

We're waiting for the 8D Mooncell staff thread to conclude before coming back to this.

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

We're waiting for the 8D Mooncell staff thread to conclude before coming back to this.

It's finished now: https://vsbattles.com/threads/nasuverse-moon-cell-cosmology-re-evaluation-part-1.152965/.

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

Bump.

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

Bump.

 

[KingNanaya]

Bump.

from what I can remember from this thread, this has been rejected by most of the knowledgeable members, and the OP is topic banned from Nasuverse threads. What do you think we should do with this thread moving forward?

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

from what I can remember from this thread, this has been rejected by most of the knowledgeable members, and the OP is topic banned from Nasuverse threads. What do you think we should do with this thread moving forward?

@Deagonx

 

[Deagonx]

I agree with what Nanaya said, we should likely close this thread.

 

[IdiosyncraticLawyer]

I agree with what Nanaya said, we should likely close this thread.

Okay, do that, then.