KingNanaya
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Brother. Read. Please. I am giving you the information that is currently accepted. Please stop derailing this thread.
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Nasuverse - 8-D Earth
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I litteraly helped making this thread you know. The low 1-C feat of destroying avalon and reverse side is the feat alone without counting the scaling on moon cell. You know how scaling work no?
And one more time this thread should change it's premise since earth can't get straight 8D since the 8D feat is only enough for a possibly 8D.
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I really don't see why you can't understand. The feat accepted are if destroying avalon or reverse side you get straight 6D feat.
Moon cell feat give itself a possibly 8D feat.
By scaling earth>moon cell bcz arc/excalibur. So when couting the moon cell feat Earth is 6D possibly 8D
You don't make CRT for simple scaling.
Moon cell feat give itself a possibly 8D feat.
By scaling earth>moon cell bcz arc/excalibur. So when couting the moon cell feat Earth is 6D possibly 8D
You don't make CRT for simple scaling.
KingNanaya
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That's not the point of the thread. Avalon is 6D/low 1-C, we can agree on this, I hope. Destroying Gaia's reality marble and all that stuff currently scales to Avalon. We have Arcueid who is superior to Amaterasu in terms of strength. Amaterasu is 8D, due to mooncell scaling. And we know Arcueid's strength scales directly to the Earth, and this Arcueid is weaker due to not having Earths backup. It would not make sense for Arcued to be stronger than Amaterasu without also being 8D, and by extension, the Earth. @Marshadow29 wants all of the characters that have low 1-C or Low 1-C, possibly 1-C to have either possibly 1-C or just 1-C out right. I personally thing it should be possibly 1-C, and that there needs to be more evidence for a solid 1-C rating, but that's just me. Now please, comment based on what has been accepted and the OP. Saying that "there is no point to this thread" is false, and doesn't contribute anything. Please, contribute, or stop commenting.
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The thing is amataresu/BB (even moon cell) etc too have low 1-C possibly 1-C. And Arcueid is already low 1-C possibly 1-C.
You can't have just possibly 1-C.. like i tell the whole thread make no sense since the character you want to up is already in the same tier you want to up it.
KingNanaya
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Gilgamesh's servant key has only low 1-C. Same with child Gil. And with Angelica. There are probably others, but those are the ones I know off of the top of my head.
KingNanaya
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Also, it might be best to get other members involved in this thread. More diverse ideas never hurt.
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I feel like there's a great great deal of background information that isn't really being explained in the OP, because I've read it a few times and still don't understand how or why the conclusions are being reached.
I'm also with Qawsedf that we need explicit scans of the evidence, not just a link to a wiki page that has references.
How does that text support Arcueid being greater than Divine Spirits? Which of them are 8D and what is the evidence for that?
I'm also with Qawsedf that we need explicit scans of the evidence, not just a link to a wiki page that has references.
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Divine Spirits are Gods that deteriorated as the AOG came to a close.
Which makes them god/kami class spirits since they are weakened gods
BB and Amaterasu are examples of 8d spirits, BB for taking over the moon cell and Amaterasu for scaling above pretty much everything in extra
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You have to stop leaving so much to the imagination. I still don't understand your reasoning. Why is Arcueid above divine spirits? Because she's a planet, and she was "lowered to God" therefore planets > gods > spirits, therefore Arcueid > 8D BB?
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Yes, and the fact that a weakened arceuid could still stand a chance against amaterasu, when BB and the other extra characters could not
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I already tell you that servant gil should have been low 1-C possibly 1-C bcz he can damage tiamat with EA.
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I would have to see the actual scans detailing these assertions, rather than just references.
If that actually is the case, that is a far far far more straightforward argument, but I'd need to see the evidence for it.
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Arcueid is the archetype of planet which is the title of the strongest being of the planet. Now for the rest it's already on her profile in first...
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Does that mean she is automatically above divine spirits like BB?
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Yep
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Its from fate extra material, all of its entries are translated here : https://www.tmdict.com/book/#fate-extra-material
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Can you show me some scans that detail that?
I'm going to need you to be more specific. I don't know what I'm suppose to be getting out of this quote that supports your argument.
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Look at the last line, amaterasu is refered to as Golden White Face
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Yeah but it's like already on her profile tho.
Her fgo profile text below
月姫の伝奇世界観において、その天体で最強の存在をアルテミット・ワン（原初の一）と呼ぶが、覚醒時のアルクェイドはその位置に該当する。
ただし、同規模の“天体を成すもの”であるアルトルージュとの決着をつけるまで、彼女が『ＯＮＥ』と呼ばれる事はない。
In the world of Tsukihime, the strongest existence of a celestial body is known as the Ultimate One (Original One), a position that the awakened Arcueid is applicable for. However, until things are settled with Altrouge, a being 'that forms the celestial' on the same scale, she cannot be referred to as the 'ONE'.
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So this scan says that in the world of EXTRA, where digital world takes precedence, Berserker is no longer the strongest, because the digital info becomes reality, and "Gods" can have more power than the original existence as natural phenomenon.
But Berserker would be cheat-tier because she can reduce targets down to 1/6th of their usual power, which is an inevitable reduction due to concept manipulation, even BB would be affected.
It concludes that Berserker is the only one that could bring Amaterasu down to a level where it's possible to defeat her.
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Now that I've somewhat digested that, I don't think your conclusion is sound. It doesn't say that Arcueid would personally have a chance, rather, her power within EXTRA is the only thing capable of bringing Amaterasu down to anything resembling a defeatable level, because it is impossible to avoid having your power greatly reduced.
I'd also say that the text implies that BB is above Arcueid, as it specifically emphasizes that "even BB would be limited by it" which phrases it like something pretty outstanding. If Arcueid were just generally above BB by virtue of being a Planet vs a Divine Spirit, I do not believe they would have singled her out.
But Berserker would be cheat-tier because she can reduce targets down to 1/6th of their usual power, which is an inevitable reduction due to concept manipulation, even BB would be affected.
It concludes that Berserker is the only one that could bring Amaterasu down to a level where it's possible to defeat her.
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Now that I've somewhat digested that, I don't think your conclusion is sound. It doesn't say that Arcueid would personally have a chance, rather, her power within EXTRA is the only thing capable of bringing Amaterasu down to anything resembling a defeatable level, because it is impossible to avoid having your power greatly reduced.
I'd also say that the text implies that BB is above Arcueid, as it specifically emphasizes that "even BB would be limited by it" which phrases it like something pretty outstanding. If Arcueid were just generally above BB by virtue of being a Planet vs a Divine Spirit, I do not believe they would have singled her out.
What part of that is meant to be interpreted as "planets are always stronger than divine spirits?"
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Bcz divine spirit are litteraly part of the planet and that it's litteraly tell she the stringest existence of the celestial body.
You try to think to much.
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Look. You can't just hit me with conjecture like this and not back it up with scans. The info you provided doesn't appear to establish planet archetypes as being strong than all divine spirits by default, and the guidebook referenced above seems to think BB is stronger than Arcueid.
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It's litteraly write? What conjucture you tell. You can't read the strongest existence of a celestial body?
The strongest existence of a celestial body is known as the Ultimate One (Original One), a position that the awakened Arcueid is applicable for.
There this too
Gatou Monji & Berserker.
彼は様々な宗教観を持つ人物で、話が通じない。バーサー カーは本来"真祖"という地球の精霊だが、臥藤の"彼女＝神"という勘違いにより星から神へと格を貶められ 、能力を上手く発揮できない。戦闘では重力で攻撃する宝具を使い、大ダメージを発生させる。
Berserker was originally an spirit from the Earth called "True Ancestor" but, due to Gatou's misconceptions that say "she = God" her status downgraded from Planet to God, making her unable to properly display her abilities.
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The guidebook litteraly state that she weakened in the moon cell because of her summoning...
And like i tell it's tell too, in their actual profile here in vsb.
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And here it doesn't tell even BB, but even the moon cell transformed by BB. Which mean the whole structure get afected by it too. And it's considered a feat toaffect the whole moon cell for her bcz she weakened in a state she can't use fully her ability.(and in first the fact that her authority affect moon cell authority is enough to show her supperiority)
And anyways she was considered as one of the strongest character in the serie and as you see no divine spirit here.("Ryougi shiki" is void shiki and primordial demon are being we don't know about). It's quite old but it doesn't change that divine spirit were never part of the strongest thing.
Comptiq 2007-05 issue - Fate Dojo Q & A:
Q: Who's the top three strongest characters?
Q: In Nasu's work (Kara no Kyoukai, Tsukihime, Fate, DDD) Who's the top three strongest characters?
A: Magical Amber, Neco Arc, and Tiger. Well, not really.
Seriously, it's Arcueid, "Ryougi Shiki", and primordial demons
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Since I was pinged here
Yes, Arcueid is stronger than BB, she's one of if not the strongest in Extra and CCC, with the statement of being the only one who has a chance at bringing Konjiki Hakumen to a state where she can be beaten
This is all cool, but it doesn't lead into the conclusion of this thread. You see, earth is already possibly 8d. Arc being stronger than BB wouldn't make the earth solidly 8d, it's still just possibly 8d, but you can argue its higher in the scaling chain than BB, who is nearly the bottom of it, I'm very confused as to what this thread is trying to prove. At best this would be an argument for earth to be possibly 8d if it wasn't already, but it is, and so this thread has no point
Yes, Arcueid is stronger than BB, she's one of if not the strongest in Extra and CCC, with the statement of being the only one who has a chance at bringing Konjiki Hakumen to a state where she can be beaten
This means that Konjiki Hakumen can't be defeated by anyone else in Extra and CCC (including BB and Kiara), and only this weakened Arc can do it
This is all cool, but it doesn't lead into the conclusion of this thread. You see, earth is already possibly 8d. Arc being stronger than BB wouldn't make the earth solidly 8d, it's still just possibly 8d, but you can argue its higher in the scaling chain than BB, who is nearly the bottom of it, I'm very confused as to what this thread is trying to prove. At best this would be an argument for earth to be possibly 8d if it wasn't already, but it is, and so this thread has no point
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Hmm, I think the statement doesn't really imply that Arc is capable of it. This was in the link the OP provided:
As far as EXTRA and CCC go, she‘s about the only one who can bring Golden White Face [Konjiki Hakumen] down to a level where “it’s possible to defeat her no matter how slim the possibility.”
So Arc is the only one that can bring KH down to a level where it's possible to defeat her, because Arc has the "1/6th of your power" ability. But it doesn't say that Arc herself will do the defeating, just that shes the only one that can reduce KH's power.
But if Arc > KH scaling isn't supportive of the point OP is making, I suppose it's moot.
Noted.
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People who can destroy the earth ( such as servant gil,f/sn with ea), and child gil only have a low 1-c key
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Yes this has been mentioned to me before, Gil's being like that seems to be because Ea's profile is, for some reason only low 1-C
The solution is just, add the possibly 1-C, since the World being possibly 1-C has already been accepted, since like, the higher d was added to begin with. This is why it was mentioned on some threads trying to upgrade certain characters that they're actually low 1-C possibly 1-C for stuff related to blowing up the World
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Gatou Monji & Berserker
Gatou Monji is an strange Master that worships Berserker as a God. He is a man that carries various religions so his speech can't be understood. Berserker was originally an spirit from the Earth called "True Ancestor" but, due to Gatou's misconceptions that say "she = God" her status downgraded from Planet to God, making her unable to properly display her abilities. During battle her Noble Phantasm uses gravity as means of attack, causing great damage.
Ye
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The thing im confused about is why its possibly instead of a concrete rating
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well anyway, there are technically 2 parts to this crt, the second part is to upgrade true magic users, all the scans are hyperlinked under Aoko
KingNanaya
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There are only 2 True Magic users with profiles. One of which already has low 1-C, possibly 1-C. So it's really just Aoko that the second part is arguing for.
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KingNanaya
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Zelretch already scales roughly to Crimson Moon, so he stays the same. Plus I'm pretty sure he's just on the moon.
Also, where the hell did you pull High 1-C from? that's 10-11D. We're still at 8D. Plus we don't scale a person's ability to reach the Root and gain True Magic. And seeing as Aoko is the only current True Magic user with a profile (except Zelretch) that might scale, it's better to just argue points for just Aoko.
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The space where the outer gods are is currently accepted as 7/9d
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Angra has outerversal range because of it, but thats not the point im trying to make. true magic is linked to the root, it doesnt have to reach it
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