My Hero Academia: Final War Arc Revisions

[Gitagon]

Faux 100% could travel hundreds of meters before Nagant’s bullet could reach Overhaul. Imo this is already a solid support for the true pinnacle of travel speed in MHA, especially considering that it was compared to Prime All Might in speed

This feat just supports Faux 100% itself being fast.

But again, no single character apart from Deku has shown speed like that. The last time Deku used the Black Whip, Fa Jin, OFA combo, he blitzed AFO-Shigaraki twice, head on.

While Shigaraki gets a lot of Prime All Might comparisons, he hasn't actually shown a speed feat on par with Faux 100%.

And I'm not saying the verse's speed shouldn't be upgraded anyway. All I'm saying is that there should be enough evidence. Cause you may be celebrating today and tomorrow Hori tosses out that Deku or Shigaraki are only going Mach 3 like Gege did.

 

[TheRustyOne]

For travel speed, even supersonic is impressive for most verses let alone MHS considering how rare it is.

Travel/Movement speed is a different issue that'll be handled in another thread. At this point I think it deservers its own discussion free from anything else.

I can say lots of characters aren't going to have movement/travel speed anywhere close to this.

 

[BlackeJan]

“Can keep up with with Dynamight's Cluster speed” for Nejire speed

Um…that’s not a good justification. How do we even know that after Bakugou was done attacking then she came out of nowhere and finish the others? like the page doesn’t even show her with them. It seems like with her she was destroying her own set of enemies

 

[Mazdoesstuff]

IMO short burst movement being relativistic is not problematic. I don’t think characters like Endeavor and Hawks can actually fly long distances at that level of speed, but travel speed is such a screwed up thing on this wiki that I don’t have a huge problem with MHA having jt

Pretty much every verse has terrible travel speed listing. Like we have Ussop listed at Relativistic running speed, when he is depicted to be one of the slowest characters in OP. There’s just a lot of problems w it but if we were to do an overhaul of travel speed, a lot of verses would have to be affected

 

[TheRustyOne]

“Can keep up with with Dynamight's Cluster speed” for Nejire speed

Um…that’s not a good justification. How do we even know that after Bakugou was done attacking then she came out of nowhere and finish the others? like the page doesn’t even show her with them. It seems like with her she was destroying her own set of enemies

She's right next to him and the others on that page...?

He just saved Jeanist and they all arrived at the same time. His explosions are still there on the page as well and Bakugo still has the speed lines.

You need to provide reason against this, not me.

However I realize that's bad scaling since Bakugo's speed comes from the Near High-Ends.

There's no reason to mention him when she can already fight Near High-Ends.

 

[KingTempest]

Like we have Ussop listed at Relativistic running speed

No, we don't

 

[Mazdoesstuff]

No, we don't

Nvm shit got changed

On Perona’s old profile it used to say “Possibly Relativistic (Can keep up with Ussop running)” iirc

 

[TheRustyOne]

Moving on from that. I should start counting votes. I'm assuming that anyone who said my Sandboxes all looked good are agreeing with pretty much everything.

But please inform me as soon as possible if I'm wrong about any of that.

Anything for more specific such as a new characters scaling or whatever, please mention it separately so we can discuss it.

To anyone reading this, take your time and don't feel pressured into giving an answer as quickly as possible.

Read the above stuff or the OP, and make your choice after careful consideration. I'll add the votes to the OP once I'm certain what I have down here is correct.

Spoiler: Votes

High 6-C Upgrades​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up, Bruh,

Disagree:

Neutral:

Relativistic Upgrades​

Agree: Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up, Bruh,

Disagree:

Neutral: TheRustyOne,

Split Profiles For Shigaraki and Bakugo​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Shadowbokunohero, Mapl3Sy4up, Bruh,

Disagree:

Neutral:

Quintuple Fa Jin Energy Rating​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up, Bruh,

Disagree:

Neutral:

This Sandbox​

Not sure how else to phrase that. This is about Burnin getting a profile for herself along with the changes to Gentle and Koichi.

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up, Bruh,

Disagree:

Neutral:

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Moving on from that. I should start counting votes. I'm assuming that anyone who said my Sandboxes all looked good are agreeing with pretty much everything.

But please inform me as soon as possible if I'm wrong about any of that.

Anything for more specific such as a new characters scaling or whatever, please mention it separately so we can discuss it.

To anyone reading this, take your time and don't feel pressured into giving an answer as quickly as possible.

Read the above stuff or the OP, and make your choice after careful consideration. I'll add the votes to the OP once I'm certain what I have down here is correct.

Spoiler: Votes

High 6-C Upgrades​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso,

Disagree:

Neutral:

Relativistic Upgrades​

Agree: Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso,

Disagree:

Neutral: TheRustyOne,

Split Profiles For Shigaraki and Bakugo​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Shadowbokunohero,

Disagree:

Neutral:

Quintuple Fa Jin Energy Rating​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso,

Disagree:

Neutral:

This Sandbox​

Not sure how else to phrase that. This is about Burnin getting a profile for herself along with the changes to Gentle and Koichi.

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso,

Disagree:

Neutral:

I agree with all of it
But isn't (6.96 megatons / 12) 580 Kiltons or High 7-C+?

 

[TheRustyOne]

But isn't (6.96 megatons / 12) 580 Kiltons or High 7-C+?

Gentle is 24X weaker, not 12X. Dozens of times weaker.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Gentle is 24X weaker, not 12X. Dozens of times weaker.

OH ok
Makes sense

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Gentle is 24X weaker, not 12X. Dozens of times weaker.

I want to Ask, but is your Howitzer Impact: Cluster Calc still not usable?
and also what would happen if you use the bullet speed instead of the speed of sound

 

[TheRustyOne]

I want to Ask, but is your Howitzer Impact: Cluster Calc still not usable?
and also what would happen if you use the bullet speed instead of the speed of sound

The assumptions used in the calc were deemed incorrect at the moment. Maybe the anime will shed light, but for now it's unusable.

It wasn't dropped because it was an outlier. It use to be part of this discussion in the past but was removed before this thread could be made.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

The assumptions used in the calc were deemed incorrect at the moment. Maybe the anime will shed light, but for now it's unusable.

It wasn't dropped because it was an outlier. It use to be part of this discussion in the past but was removed before this thread could be made.

Sad

 

[Bruh]

Moving on from that. I should start counting votes. I'm assuming that anyone who said my Sandboxes all looked good are agreeing with pretty much everything.

But please inform me as soon as possible if I'm wrong about any of that.

Anything for more specific such as a new characters scaling or whatever, please mention it separately so we can discuss it.

To anyone reading this, take your time and don't feel pressured into giving an answer as quickly as possible.

Read the above stuff or the OP, and make your choice after careful consideration. I'll add the votes to the OP once I'm certain what I have down here is correct.

Spoiler: Votes

High 6-C Upgrades​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up,

Disagree:

Neutral:

Relativistic Upgrades​

Agree: Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up,

Disagree:

Neutral: TheRustyOne,

Split Profiles For Shigaraki and Bakugo​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Shadowbokunohero, Mapl3Sy4up,

Disagree:

Neutral:

Quintuple Fa Jin Energy Rating​

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up,

Disagree:

Neutral:

This Sandbox​

Not sure how else to phrase that. This is about Burnin getting a profile for herself along with the changes to Gentle and Koichi.

Agree: TheRustyOne, Dalesean027, Therefir, Kingofwolves999, SuperStar, CloverDragon03, Eseseso, Mapl3Sy4up,

Disagree:

Neutral:

Put me at agree on all of these pls

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

0.13c (Massively Hypersonic+ to Relativistic)

This is weird

Take the distance Deku crossed in the anime, divide it by the speed of sound, and get a timeframe, why are you doing all this snail speed thing?

"Timeframe = 0.00275/343 = 0.00000801 seconds" does not make any sense, you're dividing snail speed by the true speed of the black whip, this doesn't get you a timeframe, what this formula tells us is that Deku crosses 0.00275 meters in 8.01x10^-6 seconds, but there is no reason to assume he moved this infinitely small distance in the manga, and the anime very cleary shows Deku crossing a tangible distance that is greater than 0.00275m. Yet, the low end also uses the assumption that Deku moving 0.00275 meters

3.57m/343m/s = 0.0104081633s

That's 323.2/0.0104081633 = Mach 90

How did no one caught this weird assumption? This is beyond me. Fortunately, I have no problems with the country distance shot, although I have no idea if the context works or not to say the movement is constant there. Is there an anime version of that?

 

[TheRustyOne]

This is weird

Izuku's cape "stops moving" when her bullet is fired. That's why I'm doing the frozen time thing.

Look at the frame by frame I uploaded.

There is no anime version of Lady Nagant's other feat. The anime is before the Star and Stripe arc.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Probably should make that clearer.

Izuku's cape despite being in motion, "stops moving" when Lady Nagant's bullet is fired. It didn't literally stop since that makes no sense. Her bullet was so fast that his cape appeared to stop moving in comparison, which is what I'm calculating. We use snail speed for feats like this.

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

Izuku's cape stops moving when her bullet is fired.

If look at the frame by frame I uploaded.

But we see him moving at a very decent pace during those same frames, so Deku himself is definitely not frozen there!! You're using him as a frame of reference of speed, so the same should be done for timeframe, not the cape!

Am I missing some key context or is the cape really the only reason why you assumed Deku moved 0.00275m? Because one thing has nothing to do with the other, really!
I have no reason to disagree with anything else, I'm just a bit worried about the country feat because of a lack of context, can you tell me which chapters this occurs to I can evaluate with my own judgement?

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

which is what I'm calculating. We use snail speed for feats like this.

Well, whose speed did you use? Is the cape the thing moving 343m/s? If not, it doesn't really matter how it's visually portrayed!
You take the distance that is calculable, divide by the assumed speed, and get a timeframe! You don't involve a needless assumed speed, which is actually an assumed distance, into the mix!

 

[TheRustyOne]

Snip

No we don't...? It literally doesn't move. Despite being in motion from before (343 m/s), meaning her bullet is that fast in comparison.

What are you talking about, I think someone is missing something here. Your the only person I've seen bring this up and I don't get what you're saying.

Lady Nagant's long distance feat takes place at the end of Chapter 378 and the beginning of Chapter 379.

You can see the panels here. She shoots three times, that is her last shot.

Her distance isn't shown however, only in the volume release with this map.

 

[Damage3245]

Well, whose speed did you use? Is the cape the thing moving 343m/s? If not, it doesn't really matter how it's visually portrayed!
You take the distance that is calculable, divide by the assumed speed, and get a timeframe! You don't involve a needless assumed speed, which is actually an assumed distance, into the mix!

Are you trying to say that there's not enough evidence that Deku's cape is moving at 343 m/s in that scene, so we shouldn't assume it is moving that fast?

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

No we don't...? It literally doesn't move. Despite being in motion from before, meaning her bullet is that fast in comparison.

What are you talking about, I think someone is missing something here. Your the only person I've seen bring this up and I don't get what you're saying.

You have stated that the blackwhip has moved 3.57m in your low end, yet, it uses the same snail formula that states it moved 0.00275m.
I'm confused, what is moving at 343m/s, Blackwhip or the cape itself?

It does move, and while not really significant, it's way more than 0.00275m, hold on while I do the thing

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

Are you trying to say that there's not enough evidence that Deku's cape is moving at 343 m/s in that scene, so we shouldn't assume it is moving that fast?

Why is the cape being assumed to be as fast as Blackwhip itself? Even then, the cape moved, the original calc says that the cape moved 0.00275m when we can see it didn't.
Again, this calc is very keen on assuming how much the Blackwhip/Cape moved even though we can calc it.

 

[TheRustyOne]

You have stated that the blackwhip has moved 3.57m in your low end, yet, it uses the same snail formula that states it moved 0.00275m.
I'm confused, what is moving at 343m/s, Blackwhip or the cape itself?

Izuku's cape is being pushed by his Blackwhip.

The cape does moves a certain distance before she fires.

For the Low-End I take that distance and find his speed from the anime. Which is 8.58 m/s.

When Lady Nagant fires her bullet, Izuku's cape doesn't get a chance to move anymore before it hits it. Despite the fact it was moving at a certain speed.

Which I calculated before as being 8.58 m/s for my Low-End or 343 m/s for my High-End.

I use that speed for the Low-end and use the time frozen method. Please read this page.

I truly apologize for the confusion. Maybe I'm missing something here, so please don't hesitate to explain yourself.

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

Izuku's cape is being pushed by his Blackwhip.

The cape does moves a certain distance before she fires.

For the Low-End I take that distance and find his speed from the anime. Which is 8.58 m/s.

When Lady Nagant fires her bullet, Izuku's cape doesn't get a chance to move anymore before it hits it. Despite the fact it was moving at a certain speed.

Which I calculated before as being 8.58 m/s for my Low-End or 343 m/s for my High-End.

I use that speed for the Low-end and use the time frozen method. Please read this page.

I truly apologize for the confusion. Maybe I'm missing something here, so please don't hesitate to explain yourself.

I'll reiterate again that your calculation says, dictates, states that the cape moved a quarter of a centimeter. That's what the snail formula did!

This is what the time frozen method is for, when everything is moving so slow you can't even tell how much it moved so you assume 0.00275m were moved!

This doesn't work for this scenario! Because again, the cape moved very significantly so, and I'm sure it's about 3-5 centimeters of movement judging by frame by frame analysis alone!

I hope I made my point clearer now, your calculation assumes a minimum distance crossed for a time frozen visual, but there are ways to calculate a distance with the frames you provided, meaning the method used will not suffice

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

I'll reiterate again that your calculation says, dictates, states that the cape moved a quarter of a centimeter. That's what the snail formula did!

This is what the time frozen method is for, when everything is moving so slow you can't even tell how much it moved so you assume 0.00275m were moved!

This doesn't work for this scenario! Because again, the cape moved very significantly so, and I'm sure it's about 3-5 centimeters of movement judging by frame by frame analysis alone!

I hope I made my point clearer now, your calculation assumes a minimum distance crossed for a time frozen visual, but there are ways to calculate a distance with the frames you provided, meaning the method used will not suffice

Very significant when overlapped, Blackwhip itself moves a little to the side in these same two frames, several centimeters in fact! The snail method doesn't work, this should be used instead.

Pixelscale the scarf
Pixelscale the distance crossed in frozen time
Divide that distance by an assumed speed (343m/s)
Get a speed for the bullet

 

[Metalballrun]

snip

Maybe I'm wrong with the number of people scaling from Geten but other people still scale to Dabi. And the rest of my points still stand.

Never denied Mt. Lady scaling from Machia to an extent, but when Machia actually paid attention to her, he overpowered her just as easily as he did Geten and Dabi. Same thing in the Final Arc when even a graze put Lady down. Lady herself barely scales from Machia.

And as of right now, even Shigaraki who is constantly compared to Prime All Might actually has no speed feats of his own that put him in the same level as Deku.

Well, our other alternative is assuming that all the statements comparing him to Prime All Might is wrong, but we don't really have a concrete reason to do that.
At the very least, we know Completed Shigaraki is better than Incomplete Shigaraki who himself is compared to a Weakened All Might so the powerup sorta tracks.
Then we have Shigaraki fighting Deku who is above Prime All Might at the moment so there's basically no one to directly scale Shigaraki with via feats.

So we will have to wait until we get back to Shiggy vs Deku to see that.

I do have problems with speed ratings in general in the context of the story, but I acknowledge the sheer bullshitry of the topic due to the dissonance in speed portrayals, so I'm just glossing over the topic until we get a thread that focuses on speed discussions.
Sometimes there are just undeniable feats that sort of breaks the story but it's still there.

Also, Iida's a bit of a bad metric despite being a speedster, because there's almost always someone faster than him consistently, and these are characters without any speed-enhancing Quirks too.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Snip

There is not a way to measure the distance. I'm looking at the frames right now and it doesn't move until Nagant's bullet blows through it.

Frame 1, Frame 2, Frame 3, Frame 4, Frame 5, and Frame 6.

Blackwhip doesn't move until the bullet is already hitting it and causing it to expand. Even then it's not moving forward.

Your movement is "incorrect", that's not the movement I'm measuring. That's also not significant movement.

The movement/speed I'm using is the movement of Blackwhip moving across the ground as it stretches out of the smoke.

It doesn't move anymore in the direction I measure due to it being frozen in comparison to her bullet.

 

[The_Yellow_Topaz]

Your movement is incorrect, that's not even the movement I'm measuring. That's also not significant movement.

It's greater than 0.00275m, and that's all that matters to this discussion.

Is the cape NOT being the very subject and argument being frozen time?

The movement is the movement of Blackwhip moving across the ground as it stretches out.

I'm well aware, it's also greater than 0.00275m, that expansion is still movement


You should simply use the method recommended, the one you used has weird assumptions you couldn't even begin to explain to me! You can't just claim it's "the method" because you don't seem to know where the method even applies!

Please try to understand this, for the snail speed to be used, something has to be assumed to have moved 0.00275m, something, anything, and it has to be the same thing that is being used for speed to get the timeframe! That's easy to understand, it's basic

Now inform me, because I might be really bad at interpreting, or this might be convoluted

but what is assumed to be moving at 343m/s for the purposes of the calc? The Blackwhip, or the cape? Please inform me

 

[TheRustyOne]

Snip

OH!

I just noticed this! How does this look to you? Is there still something wrong?

The Blackwhip does move forward an incredibly tiny bit I didn't notice before! My god I didn't noticed that. Seriously thank you for bringing this up!

The 343 m/s is Blackwhip moving forward for my High-End.

If this is true then Relativistic isn't happening boys.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

OH!

I just noticed this! How does this look to you? Is there still something wrong?

The Blackwhip does move forward an incredibly tiny bit I didn't notice before! My god I didn't noticed that. Seriously thank you for bringing this up!

The 343 m/s is Blackwhip moving forward for my High-End.

If this is true then Relativistic isn't happening boys.

Ok?
I mean we're still upgrading so far so idc
but I'll let the people yell over it themselves, see y'all in 10 hours or something

 

[TheRustyOne]

I'm kind of iffy right now due to how embarrassed I am for this mistake, so I can't take this as anything other than me sounding like an idiot.

Something must be wrong with me today. I'll get back and continue this so don't mind me, please continue the discussion. I'll catch up when I come back.

My apologize for any problems I've caused by my actions. I just want to do something right.

 

[Mazdoesstuff]

Ok?
I mean we're still upgrading so far so idc
but I'll let the people yell over it themselves, see y'all in 10 hours or something

We also still have one of the Sub-Relativistic calcs, so idrc if Rela gets nuked

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

I'm kind of iffy right now due to how embarrassed I am for this mistake, so I can't take this as anything other than me sounding like an idiot.

Something must be wrong with me today. I'll get back and continue this so don't mind me, please continue the discussion. I'll catch up when I come back.

My apologize for any problems I've caused by my actions. I just want to do something right.

It's ok Rusty, you've seen alot more embarrassing mistakes in our general thread.
I'll say that I do like the first one more because I feel like it just fits more and it could just be the shifting energy of blackwhip and not actual meaningful movement.
But either way it's all good =)

 

[SuperStar]

I'm kind of iffy right now due to how embarrassed I am for this mistake, so I can't take this as anything other than me sounding like an idiot.

Something must be wrong with me today. I'll get back and continue this so don't mind me, please continue the discussion. I'll catch up when I come back.

My apologize for any problems I've caused by my actions. I just want to do something right.

We all make mistakes bro don’t worry.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

wait, so are we going to talk about the Jet Laser speed? Cause the US Military already does have SoL/photon based laser tech
I can find another rel calc if we accept it as SoL

 

[SuperStar]

wait, so are we going to talk about the Jet Laser speed? Cause the US Military already does have SoL/photon based laser tech
I can find another rel calc if we accept it as SoL

We should do that in another thread.

 

[Damage3245]

I'm kind of iffy right now due to how embarrassed I am for this mistake, so I can't take this as anything other than me sounding like an idiot.

Something must be wrong with me today. I'll get back and continue this so don't mind me, please continue the discussion. I'll catch up when I come back.

My apologize for any problems I've caused by my actions. I just want to do something right.

Anyone can make mistakes.

I'm one of the more criticial people here for calcs, and I didn't look as closely into it as Topaz did.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

We should do that in another thread.

fair enough