My apologies to Vs battles and a Mario revision

[ArceusBowser44]

So, first of all, i would like to make my excuses to all of you guys, especially to Dark649, i acted like an idiot, and let's be honest, i was an asshole in the Sonic revision thread.

But anyway, this is a Mario revision thread. First of all, i would like to say two things: one, please, please and again please, don't close this thread. I know that you guys generally close every Mario thread, but this isn't like the others to be honest, and i would like to hear the opinion of the one that support me but also the people that disagree with me, just one thing however: if someone disagree wit this and leave a comment like this: "This is a wank, it can't be accepted" i will ask someone to remove their comments, not only because those type of comments are useless, but also because if someone disagree with this should have at least decent proof to debunk me. As i mentioned above, i was a true asshole in the Sonic thread, and my comment were non-sense, kind of, so please, if you disagree with this try to reply with smart arguments, don't simply say "nope we have already talked about this lol". With that being said, let's start with the revision

READ EVERYTHING CAREFULLY

Ok so, first of all, i want to debunk a few arguments:

"Mario has literally no reason to be Tier 2" ; "Mario has a loose continuity" ; "Mario is too inconsistent"

No, no and no. While you will understad the true potential of the Mario characters below, those statements are still very untrue (except for the loose continuity thing, which is anyway irrelevant, i'm going to explain why below).

As Myamoto said, Mario's cast is like a group of actors. They can chane any role, and think about it, this is the reason why Peach got kindnapped by Bowser. I'm not saying that she's stronger than him, but hell, she got kindnapped even by the weakest versions of Bowser. As a matter of a fact, she can kick Bowser's ass even harder than Mario, and she has also beated some of the strongest versions of Bowser...so yeah. Since the Mario cast is like a group of actors, the games are like theatre spectacles (and this is true, for example, Super Mario Bros 2 and Bros 3 were exactly 'theatre spectacles'). Those aren't exactly smart. Those are simply meant to be funny. About the loose continuity, while its true, it's irrelevant as hell. Why? Because techniqually, since there isn't a chronological order, the events happen casually, so in order to find a consistence (I'm going to see what are the most consistent feats in Mario below) we should take every feats into account (except the outliers). Think about it, it's not like we are talking about Sonic: if Sonic in base is going to have, like, 6 tier 3 feats, it's not like we can use those feats: those are a gap too big, especially since, chronologically speaking, Sonic has done during the Adventure Era and the Modern Era mostly and only Tier 5 feats. We have a chronological order and a consistence to follow, those tier 3 feats (sometimes not even Super Sonic sìis able to perform such strong feats, i'm not saying anything, i agree with tier 2 Super Sonic) those feats are simply impossible/useless to Base Sonic.

Mario is a completely different case.

"Mario has no reason to be Tier 2" Not really. A thing is that Mario has done those kind of feats since the NES era..Wow. We can compare the NES to the Sega Genesis. Yet, Classic Sonic is at best Tier 8....Now, you guys are probably wondering what kind of Tier 2 feats Mario has, right? First of all, i would like to say that Culex is still a possible Universal+ feat, especially since his profile says "Possibly Universal+". The 2 feats are, anyway, Wart and Tatanga. First of all Wart.

First, Subcon is an entire universe, as a Dream World. Wart conquered Subcon, and after his defeat, Subcon ceases to exist. Not oly this, but he put a curse ver the entire universe and its inhabitants, altering the entire Dream World

I know what ypu are going to say: Super Mario Bros 2 was just a dream. Yes, but BS Super Mario bros 2 wasn't, as there is nothing that imply that Mario is dreaming, especially because in the credits, Mario isn't sleeping neither dreaming. So yeah.

About Tatanga, he opened a dimensiona rift.

In the gameboy comics, tatange hypnotized the human Herman Smirch,causing the man to release Tatanga. While yes, techniqually the man released Tatange, the man in the comic was exactly just a owerless normal human, so Tatanga was the only one that could have opened the rift. Plus, in order t hypnotize someone from a different dimension, you should open a dimensional rift in order to hypnotize the man. Sure, this happened in the comic, however, the comics are just a rapresentation of the games (take for example Super Mario Kun) so the feat can still work.

And the possible Universal+Culex.

And, during times, Mario has done a great amount of tier 2 feats, so the "Mario has no reason to be tier 2 because he jumped in this tier with no reasons" is very untrue.

With that being said, i need to debunk one more thing "Mario is the same, so he souldn't have more than one key". Yes and No.

While it's true that Mario is always the same, different keys are simply too useful. For example, characters like Wiggler , Birdo or Bom Bom fought Mario only in the 2-D platformers...yet, Birdo is at least High 4-C for scaling to Mario's loe-emd....no, just no. The High 4-C feat come from the 3-D Platformers, The 2D Platformers are much weaker than the 3-D Platformers, yet, Birdo is scaled to a 3-D feat when she only fought 2-D Mario, so the scaling is simply IMPOSSIBLE. Same thing for the KOopalings: they scale to full power Mario, despite the fact that they haven't fought the strongest incarnations of Mario.... Overall, since Mario's power ranges greatly from era to era (since Wart and Tatanga are probably outliers, but they are still feats), we should have different keys.

Since we don't use Mario Party and the Sport games, the thee keys should be: 2-D games, 3-D games, RPGs

2-D PlatformersEdit
Now, unlike the other keys, we don't really need to see how many feats Mario has. Why? Because in this key, we should simply scale everyone to Bowser. Baby Bowser casually turned the planet in a book in Yoshi's Story, aka Planet level+. Adult Bowser is MUCH more powerful than his Baby form, aka Likely Large Planet level. Mario constantly beat him, aka Large Planet level. Peach, Luigi, Toad and Yoshi all scale to him. Same DK, since he fought Mario in a few 2-D games as wel. The Koopalings, Birdo and a few more important bosses are weaker than Mario, but not too far behind, so they are still Planet level+/Large Planet level.

Wart and Tatanga are probably outliers.

3-D Platformers
First of all, these are the games that are part of the 3-D patformers

• Super Mario 64
• Super Mario Sunshine
• Super Mario Galaxy
• Super Mario Galaxy 2
• Super Mario 3D Land
• Super Mario 3D World
• Super Mario Odyssey

Tier 4:Edit

• Mario is able to defeat characters empowered by the Power Stars, that can overpower Lumas, which can turn into stars
• the Power Stars can also create realms with constellations inside
• Power Stars can create Large Star level+ black holes

Tier 3

• The Power Stars can also create Galaxy sized realms
• Mario has fought characters that overpowered the Lumas, that can also turn into galaxies
• Mario has fought enemies empowered by the Grand Stars, aka objects that are FAR more powerful than the Power Stars

Tier 2 (Galaxy)

• Mario fought Bowser, who survived the destruction of the universe
• Defeated Grand Bowser, who is far more powerful than Galaxy Bowser, and was able to create a black hole that was going to consume Universe 6
• Shadow Mario
• Other Tier 2 feats that come from the Galaxy games, such as beating the Bowser Jr's machine, surviving the black hole in SMG and etc

Now, the scalings: So overall, Toad, the Koopalings, the strong bosses (Piranha Plant, King Bob-Omb) and a few more should be scaled to Large Mario. Why? Cause Toad lacks feats to be comparable to Peach or others, however Toad defeated Bowser during the events of 3-D World Kamek because he is weaker than Toad, and the strong bosses were able to fear Toad with their power alone, and the should be comparable to Low end Mario.Kamek should be MSS. Mainly because she damaged Mario in the Galaxy agmes, so while yes, she isn't as strong as Yoshi, Peach, Wario or oters, Kamek has showd much stronge feats than the likes of Toad and the other bosses. Wario, Peach and DK should be At least Galaxy level. Why? Because, Wario defeated characters empowered by the Power Stars in 64 DS. DK never appeared in a 3-D Platformer, however, he appeared in Super Mario Kun, a manga that resembles the games, and DK fought Mario in the volumes of the 3-D Platformer games. Plus, he is a star child, and was confirmed to basically be equal to every other Star Children, so he's automatically 3-C. Again, this doesn't mean that he is also equal to Galaxy Mario, cause Galaxy and Sunshine are too OP games compared to the other 3-D Platformers. Peach should also be Galaxy not only because she is a star child, but also because Miyamoto himself confirmed that Peach never feeled protected by Mario, and that she can perfectly holds her own in battle. Bowser Jr should also be At least Galaxy level, mainly because he was confirmed nearly as strong as his father, and he gave an hard time a few times to Yoshi and Peach. So, a lot imply that Bowser Jr's just as strong as the principal characters. Mario, Luigi, Yoshi and Bowser should be the same as Peach, Wario, DK and BJ. However, in addition, these 4 characters should be "Universe level+ in the SMG games (3-D key). Why? Because, the Tier 2 feats are the most consistent feats in the 3-D platformer, however, these feats only happened in the SMG games, so we should point out that these feats are only applicable in the SMG games. Basically: there are simply too many tier 2 feats to nt be considered, but those feats happened only in the SMG games, so we should point out that those feats come from the SMG games. So, Low 2-C Mario, Yoshi, Luigi, Bowser and Mega Hammer (Bowser Jr). Shadow Mario is much stronger than BJ, owever he desn't have a lot of feats in general, so he should be "At least 3-C, likely higher"

RPGs


Tier 4

• Defeating Exor, who is able to effect Star Road, the Planet, the moon and tens of stars
• Defeating Smithy, who is more powerful than Exor
• Antasma's low-end, aka, constellations manipulation lol

Tier 2 feats

• Defeating Antasma, who is able to manipulate the entirety of the Dream World. Entirety: including its space-time
• Possible Low 2-C Culex
• Defeated Bowser, who fought Antasma
• Defeated Mega Dragon Bowser, who merged 2 universes
• Also damaged beated Dark Fawful, who is just slighlty weaker than Dark Bowser, who fought Bowser
• Comparable to Paper Mario in Paper Jam, who created a realm with nebulas and galaxy clouds in the background, basically a universe-sized realm. Then, at the end, Paper Mario literally erases the universe realm, that is now just a white void. Destroying a universe sized-realm and leaving it in a white void is a Low 2-C feat.

So, as we can see, Mario's most consistent feats are Tier 2. And i didn't even included Dreamy Bowser and Antasma w/ Dark Stone, since i am using only consistency.

So overall, Mario is Low 2-C, likely 2-C, Luigi is as strong as Mario, Dark Bowser is as strong as Bowser, Bowser is Low 2-C, likely 2-C, Peach is Low 2-C, likely 2-C, (defeated Mega Dragon Bowser, and her magic can badly damage Bowser), Yoshi is Low 2-C likely 2-C as well since he was playable in Rabbid Kingdom and he defeated a 2-C enemy (Mega Dragon Bowser)

On the other hand, characters like Mallow, Geno, the Koopalings, and other strong bosses should be "At least Multi-Solar System level"

Why? Because they don't have enough feats in order to be considered as strong as Mario or Luigi, but Mallow and Geno have MSS feats, Birdo fought them, and she also fought Mario in Superstar saga as she was a mid-boss. the Koopalings got god-stomped by Mario from Paper Jam, who is Universe level, and they really can't scale to paper Jam Mario considering how hard they got beaten, but they should at least scale to Mario's low-end. Same Shy Guy, who fought Mallow and Geno in Legend of the Seven Stars.

King Boo should be Universe level+, because he bitch-slapped Paper Mario from Paper Jam, and because overall he gave Mario and Paper Mario an hard time.


OTHER SMALL REVISIONS

King Boo was able to open the Paranormal dimension, which was going to destroy the universe, aka Low 2-C. The Poltergust is comparable to King Boo.

As we see in Super Mario Odyssey, Mario's moon is the same as ours. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MROmf0uNKYg

My friend Paleo made the new calc with our moon. http://character-stats-and-profiles.wikia.com/wiki/User_blogaleomario66/Donkey_Kong_Moon_Punch_Recalc

Now, Rosalina. This is easy. She nerfed by an IMMENSE AMOUNT Galaxy Mario, Grand Star Bowser and the others..i mean seriously, the characters in alaxy were powerless compared to Rosalina's reset. Heck , in the cutscene, Mario was literally shocked of how powerful Rosalina was. Not to mention that in Mario Golf, she literally wiped the universe just by opening her eye. I mean, seriously. Opening an eye is like using the 2% of a person energy. And lol, just by opening her eye, she literally wiped the universe...Overall, she did Low 2-C feats on AN EXTREMELY CASUAL way, and she even overpowered Galaxy Mario by an IMMENSE amount. She is definetely 2-C

Final Results
Mario: Large Planet level | At least Galaxy level. Universe level+ in the Galaxy games | Universe level+, likely Multi-Universe level

Luigi: Same | Universe level+ (Luigi's Mansion)

Peach: Large Planet level | At least Galaxy level | At least Universe level+, likely Multi-Universe level

Yoshi: Large Planet level | Multi-Solar System level (Yoshi Island games) | At least Galaxy level. Universe level+ in the Galaxy games / Universe level+, Likely Multi-Universe level

Bowser: same as Mario / At least Low 2-C (Grand Star Bowser) / Multiverse level (Dreamy Bowser)

Bowser Jr: At least Galaxy level | Universe level+ (Mega Hammer) | At least Galaxy level, likely higher

Toad: Large Planet level | At least Large Star level+

Birdo: Large Planet level |

Donkey Kong: Small Star level (DK games) | Large Planet level | At least Galaxy level

Wario: Planet level (GBA Wario games). | At least Galaxy level

Kamek: Large Planet level / Multi-Solar System level

Geno: At least MSS

Mallow: At least MSS

Cakletta: At least MSS

Queen Shrob: At least MSS

King Boo: Universe level+ (Luigi's Mansion games) | Universe level+

Rosalina: Multi-Universe level

Dark Bowser: Low 2-C, likely 2-C

Petey Piranha: At least Large Star level+

King Bob-Omb: at least Large Star level+


Now, about speed


2-D Platformer

In the 2-D games Mario has dodged MHS lightnings (New Super Mario Bros DS). Everyone scale to him
3-D Platformer

In a few levels of Super Mario 3D world, that are obstacles that include lasers an light speed attacks. Mario, Luigi, Peach and Toad can react and outspeed those lasers. So they are At least FTL. Wario, DK, Yoshi and Bowser Jr scale to them. SHadow Mario is faster than everyone, so Shadow Mario is likely FTL+
in The SMG games however, Mario, Luigi, Yoshi, Mega Hammer, Bowser and Grand Star Bowser are MFTL+

RPGs

In the RPGs, the most important characters (Luigi, Peach, Yoshi who appeared in Mario + Rabbids Kingdom as a protagonist, Bowser Jr, Bowser and a few more) all scale to Mario.

Mario is comparable to Dreamy Luigi and Antasma. These 2 can jump from the Earth's surface to a contellations in the center of the vast space in a second.

He scales to Dreamy Bowser, who scales to Dreamy Luigi, who jumped out into the Sun in 1 second. The distance between the Earth and the Sun is 92,960,000 miles. Crossing that distance in that time is 334,656,000,000mph, or 499.0272912069 speeds of light.

Mallow and Geno, while aren't as important as others, have a MFTL+ feat:

After his death, it is revealed that he'd effected the planet, Star Road, the moon, and even outer space coupled with tens of stars. Effecting outer space all the way out to dozens of stars is definitely 4-A

Mallow and Geno scale to him, since they fought him. Smithy scale to Mallow and Geno, same Culex.

The other characters that appeared as minor bosses (Koopalings, Petey Piranha, King Bob-Omb, Birdo, Cakletta, Queen Shrob and a few more) are comparable to Mario's low-end in the RPGs. Mario's low-end is dodging several light-based attacks in RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars and dodging UFOs lasers in Partners in Time.

And so, Those minor characters are "At least FTL" via scaling to Mario.

Wario from the Wario Games has FTL reactions since he dodged lasers from the Jewel enemy.

Rosalina has Infinite speed. How? well, after that the entire universe was destroyed, she was the only one able to move she created the "bright light" as the manual says). But she was still moving in a timeless void. On the other hand, while Mario was there and was moving, that was because Rosalina protected him and then she bringed Mario in the bright light. So the feat is only applicable to Rosalina.

King Boo (in the Luigi's Mansion games) King Boo can catch Luigi's data, which was being transferred wirelessly at speeds capable of crossing two entirely separate universes in seconds, pull it back through the transfer at double the speed, create his own transfer, move Luigi's data with absolute ease, and pull the data into his illusion zone. This easily makes King Boo MFTL+, as he seemingly moves even faster than he himself can react

Final Result

Mario: Massively Hypesonic / At least FTL. Massively FTL+ in the SMG games / Massively FTL+

Luigi: same / Massively FTL+ (Luigi'S Mansion games)

Peach: same except the Galaxy speed

Yoshi: Same as Mario

Bowser: Same as Mario / Massively FTL+, Omnipresent in the Dream World (Dreamy Bowser)

Wario: Massively Hypersonic+ w/ FTL reactions (Wario games) / At least FTL

DK: Hypersonic. Likely Massively Hypersonic (DK games) / At least FTL

Geno: At least FTL

Mallow: Same as Geno

Cakletta: Same as Geno

Queen Shrob: Same as Geno

Bowser Jr: At least FTL / Likely FTL+ / Massively FTL+

Koopalings: Massively Hypersonic / At least FTL

Kamek: Massively Hypersonic / At least FTL.

Rosalina: Infinite

Petey Piranha: At least FTL

King Bob-Omb: At least FTL

King Boo: Massively FTL+ (Luigi's Mansion games) / Massively FTL+ (Paper Jam)

So, does this seem reasonable?

 

[ArceusBowser44]

If i remember correctly, Dino Ranger said in this thread that he also agree with tier 2 Mario, just that, if Mario get this treatment, other characters shoulf too.

 

[NotAMarioFan(lol)]

He's not saying mario characters everyone else in certain video games but I agree with some of this. Mostly rosalina's speed and most of these battles are outliers so they say, but I'm ok but everyone else has to agree too.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

So do you agree with the upgrades? Well, to be honest, considering the amount of tier2 battles, they can't be onsidered as outliers

 

[Withersoul_235]

I'm a supporter of the Wart / Tatanga feats as well as the King Boo one and a few others.

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

Lol the same thing happened to Sonic

 

[ArceusBowser44]

Lol the same thing happened to Sonic

? So, do you agree with this revision? (sorry for soundind rude)

 

[ArceusBowser44]

Also, i forgot the Kooplings's stats

Koopalings: Large Planet level / At least Multi-Solar System level (Paper Jam. They fought Mario in a RPG as mid-bosses, so they should be only slightly weaker than Cakletta or Queen Shrob)

Speed: Massively Hypersonic / At least FTL

 

[ArceusBowser44]

Also, i made another mistake: BJ isn't comparable to full speed Mario in the RPGs (MFTL+)

 

[Batman129]

i agree.

 

[Paleomario66]

I agree too. We did the same for Sonic, so there's no reason not to do it for Mario, a franchise that has no cano in the first place.

 

[NotAMarioFan(lol)]

Well until we hav admins agree or disagree this ia going nowhere

 

[ArceusBowser44]

True, i already informed the Mario experts.

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

Yes

 

[ScarletFirefly]

[Waiting for Ryu intensifies]

 

[Dust_Collector]

I'm not going to say whether or not I agree with this (I'd rather wait for imput from DRB and others), but I do want to point some things out.

About Tatanga, he opened a dimensiona rift.

In the gameboy comics, tatange hypnotized the human Herman Smirch,causing the man to release Tatanga. While yes, techniqually the man released Tatange, the man in the comic was exactly just a owerless normal human, so Tatanga was the only one that could have opened the rift. Plus, in order t hypnotize someone from a different dimension, you should open a dimensional rift in order to hypnotize the man. Sure, this happened in the comic, however, the comics are just a rapresentation of the games (take for example Super Mario Kun) so the feat can still work.

Opening a dimensional rift is spatial manipulation, and is in no way a tier 2 feat.

Baby Bowser casually turned the planet in a book in Yoshi's Story, aka Planet level+. Adult Bowser is MUCH more powerful than his Baby form, aka Likely Large Planet level.

Iirc Baby Bowser only turned Yoshis Island into a book, and even if it was the entire planet that would be baseline, not planet level+.

Overall, she did Low 2-C feats on AN EXTREMELY CASUAL way, and she even overpowered Galaxy Mario by an IMMENSE amount. She is definetely 2-C

No, that would make her a very strong Low 2-C

After his death, it is revealed that he'd effected the planet, Star Road, the moon, and even outer space coupled with tens of stars. Effecting outer space all the way out to dozens of stars is definitely 4-A

All it shows is the red clouds around Bowsers castle disappearing, I don't see anything that reveals he affected stars.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I won't comment on the concept of Mario outliers and how it relates to their AP as a whole yet, as that opens a whole can of worms that I don't want to deal with yet. However, I will comment on speed and other non controversial feats. Also, opening rifts aren't feats.

I'm also vehemently against separating the profiles of Mario and co. by types of games, if you were suggesting that.

For Rosie, I actually agree, given that she's able to casually waste time giving Mario a speech before causally finishing the reset, which does indeed take place in a void. AP on the other hand... Low 2-C heartbeats don't get you 2-C, and even then, we can't say how much energy Rosalina used. I do agree that she's much higher than baseline though.

King Boo's speed feat is not the case. Wormholes don't have a set speed, which this clearly is. However, if you're saying it right, he did interrupt data transfer, which is FTL.

I don't see anything to suggest that Dreamy Luigi's feat, nor Smithy's feat, happened at all. I see Luigi being the sun, and I see Smithy's control over the sky, with the Crystal Stars doing something completely un-AP-related in space.

For quite a few things, lasers aren't automatically lightspeed. However, every important Mario character can temporarily outpace a black hole in Black Hole Boogie, so real+ is more than acceptable.

Mega Dragon Bowser seems legit.

The moon has shown to vary quite often in the Mario series. Unless we're saying the moon in Yoshi's Island was full sized. Besides, we clearly see it's not full sized during the infamous cutscene, and it wouldn't make sense for it to be anyway.

Destroying a pocket dimension is not tier 2, in the case of Paper Jam. I don't feel like having another Vegeta vs the "Hyperbolic Time Chamber" situation again.

I do agree with all of the tier 4 and 3 feats you mentioned, with the latter being a bit out of context.

I don't see what makes Dreamy Bowser omnipresent in said Realm, but then again, I don't have context for that one.

What tier 2 feats do Shadow Mario and Bowser Jr's machines (even in galaxy) have? I recall none.

If I missed any, lmk.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

@Dust Collector

About the dimensional rift thing: Ok, didn't know about that.

About Baby Bowser: It's still a feat that he did with his magic. In Super Mario Bros Bowser used his magic to put a curse that damaged the entire kingdom. Mario wasn't effected by that curse and he overpowered the curse. Luigi is equal to him. Peach's magc not noly is more powerful than Bowser's, but with time, she also became phisically equal to Mario. Same Toad and the ones that fought Mario.

I don't think that, tbh. I mean, Rosalina wiped the universe just by opening her eye. As a matter of a fact, the lowest end of Multi-Universal isn't infinetely superior to Universe level+, as a fact is only slightly superior to Universal+. Rosalina on the other hand nefred Low 2-C beings ny an IMMENSE amount. So, maybe not "2-C", but "Likely 2-C"

About Exor: After his death, the color red disappear and the sky is now sky-blue. Same the stars and the moon. We can see that the color was red, but then, a sky-blue explosion caused by Exor's death effected tens of stars and the moon.

 

[Kaltias]

Low 2-C vs 2-C isn't infinite, but it's definitely huge. People who are Low 2-C by existing are still weaker than the weakest 2-C. Rosalina is a super strong Low 2-C, but that's about it

 

[Dark649]

There is nothing to upgrade from here since Dyno Black told me that they are not reliable, mainly the Infinite Speed 2-C was also debunked.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

@The real cal howard

I never mentioned Dreamy Luigi, neither Tier 2 Shadow Mario.

For Rosie, read my comment above.

For Exor's feat, again, read above.

But anyway, Mario is still able to slightly outrun black holes in galaxy. So the characters in the 3-D games are still FTL.

True, but we should always change the stats of something during time. What i mean here is that the last game confirmed that Mario's moon is still as big as ours. Same in Super Mario Land 2. Also, Nintendo generally makes big things small due to graphic or etc. Example, the castle in 3-D world obviously isn't small city sized, but appearently it is.

You missed the big point here: a pocket dimension size. The pocket dimension is still universe sized. Paper Mario didn't destroy the pocket dimension via the Trio Hammer, instead, after the attack, he himself destroys the pocket dimension. So, it's not like Paper Mario is using the same weapon that he used for create the pocket dimension, he literally destroys the pocket dimension.It's still a valid feat.

Dreamy Bowser absorbed the Dream Stone, and he is the embodiment of the Dream stone, aka a multiverse full of possibilities and timelines. He is literally the embodiment of a multiverse. Sounds omnipresent to me.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

Low 2-C vs 2-C isn't infinite, but it's definitely huge. People who are Low 2-C by existing are still weaker than the weakest 2-C. Rosalina is a super strong Low 2-C, but that's about it

Oh, Ok. Well, maybe an "At least Low 2-C, possibly 2-C"?

 

[Dark649]

Escaping a black hole speed varies depending on how you escape and in most occasions like in Galaxy Mario is normally portrayed of unable to escape a Black Hole, resulting in game over.

The pocket dimension was not universal sized and Dreamy Bowser was not omnipresent, nor Infinite.

 

[Kaltias]

Simply "at least Low 2-C" would be enough. That's how we always rated people who are hilariously casual Low 2-C (Lavos, just to name one)

 

[ArceusBowser44]

There is nothing to upgrade from here since Dyno Black told me that they are not reliable, mainly the Infinite Speed 2-C was also debunked.

Where he said that? Again, if Dyno Black has a problem with this, since he is the Mario expert, he should comment in this thread telling me why i am wrong, otherwise this comment is irrelevant to the thread..

 

[ArceusBowser44]

I don't want to sound rude, but please, read my thread. I said that comments that don't show that i am wrong are useless here, since this is a revision thread

 

[Dark649]

Also because this thread is similar to this one, which was debunked. Even the Culex things were debunked along with the 2-C Rosalina, all this stuff was discussed and debunked before.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

Escaping a black hole speed varies depending on how you escape and in most occasions like in Galaxy Mario is normally portrayed of unable to escape a Black Hole, resulting in game over.
The pocket dimension was not universal sized and Dreamy Bowser was not omnipresent, nor Infinite.

About the black hole: Ok

About the pocket dimension and Dreamy Bowser: *sigh* did you read CAREFULLY the entire thread? I said that if someone is going to comment in this should at least bring decent arguments. The pocket dimension was universe sized as it has nebulas and galaxy clouds in the background

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wz0o1i5xDfI

 

[ArceusBowser44]

Also because this thread is similar to this one, which was debunked.

Except that it's totally different. First of all, i'm not using Paper Mario here. 2nd, Dyno disagree with Low 2-C Chakron. I didn't even mentioned Chakron. 3rd, people only disagreed about High 1-C Paper Mario.

$th, many of the feats that Metal mentioned i said in this thread that are outliers (Wart is an example), and i also disagree with a few of Metal tier 2 feats.

The reason why i put Dark Bowser tier 2 isn't because of the fact taht he overpowered Chakron, but because he is comaprable to Bowser

 

[Dark649]

In the first thread i linked the 3-A feat was present along with the other feats, which Dynoblack rejected and closed [He could have said that one of the feats mentioned was acceptable, but he didn't which means they cannot be used].

 

[ArceusBowser44]

This. You showed me that you are simply against me. I NEVER SAID THAT CULEX IS a feat, i only said that it's a POSSIBLE feat, since in the profile there is still a possibly much higher. Rosalina is at least Low 2-C, i was wrong

 

[ArceusBowser44]

In the first thread i linked the 3-A feat was present along with the other feats, which Dynoblack rejected and closed.

Dynoblack once said that he actually has no problem with tier 2 Mario at all. All that he said in the Metal's thread was simply that there was a lot wrong in that.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

And my feats aren't un-biased.

Antasma was still able to manipulate the Dream World

Paper Mario still created a universe sized realm.

Mega Bowser still merged 2 universes.

Culex is still a possible feat.

Mario has still dozens of Tier 2 feats in SMG

 

[ArceusBowser44]

and my feats are un-biased*

 

[Paleomario66]

In the first thread i linked the 3-A feat was present along with the other feats, which Dynoblack rejected and closed [He could have said that one of the feats mentioned was acceptable, but he didn't which means they cannot be used].

He closed it because I was proposing that Mario would scale to Dreamy Bowser and Zeekeeper, not because of the other feats.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

So overall, just a summary:

Mario's loose continuity and inconsistence is debunked, meaning that now we can look at all the Mario feats to find a consistence. Mario should DEFINETELY have more keys. Mario has a lot of tier 2 feats: ranging from defeating enemies that merged universe, to guys that can manipulate the universe, from erasing a universal realm, to defeating dozens of characters empowered by Low 2-C weapons (Grand Star), to damaging Bowser who survived the destruction of the universe, to defeating a dark copy of fawful who is equal to Dark Bowser who fought Bowser and many more tier 2 feats

 

[ArceusBowser44]

Just one thing that i want to say to Dark: Before you block me like you did the other time, remember that i have nothing against you. I don't want to sound a cocky guy that think that my work is perfect and that everyone should agree with this. As a matter of a fact, now i disagree with 2-C Rosalina because i realized i was wrong.

 

[Dark649]

We should wait for Dynoranger, who previously closed a thread containing a blog with all these feats on it.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

@The real cal howard

Wait, now i've just seen that i put Shadow Mario in Tier 2 for no reasons...

I made a mistake everyone, Shadow Mario isn't a tier 2 feat.

Also, one question about why Mario shouldn't have different keys: why shouldn't he? I mean, again, don't want to sound rude, but characters like Birdo simply cannot scale to High 4-C mario considering that she never matched Mario in an era where he has done Tier 4 feats. It's just a wrong scaling. And Birdo is just an example. So having multiple keys is simply good for Mario, so that we can use a great scaling system to qualify how powerful the characters are.

 

[ArceusBowser44]

We should wait for Dynoranger, who previously closed a thread containing a blog with all these feats on it.

True. However, he simply closed the thread because the thread wasn't going anywhere, considering that everyone were talking about how stupid is String theory soup or about how stupid is Low 2-C Chakron (that i didn't even mentioned) or just other comments made by someone who was trying to offend Metal.