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What do you think about this @Qawsedf234?
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Mcu Thor and friends upgrade to tier 3
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I wouldn't use FTL speeds, but the core justification is fine in my view.
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I mentioned it because the Celestial Body Feats page says that moving a star at FTL speed will be ranked as Star level. By the way, that could also be "possibly Stellar" LS?
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Yet he was mentioned for a team to fight gorr and his weapon was still relevant agianst the god butcher on top of being the highest authoritative power
pretty sure that was Loki that said that and he was being sarcastic besides this only applies to Asgardians since celestials(which are gods)
gee I wonder if there’s a statment that says otherwise
Oh ok, but the 3-c option should be fine
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Yeah I can't say I'm entirely opposed to it and I do think its actually way more viable compared to anyone who'd try a 4-B or 4-A option but I still think 5-A works better at least right now
DarlingAurora
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for me I'm neutral with 4-C, I just feel that solid 5-A is better but I can go either way
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Ok, I mean I think we should just do 3-c now. I’ve technically already put together the scaling chain for it
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Odin at most died after living for about 10,000 to 20,000 years. Since far younger than the Celestials 1 Billion+ year range. The quote doesn't work with Zeus, since he can't be the Oldest and Wisest when the Celestials are much older, unless they just aren't considered Gods.
I'm not seeing it at the moment. We should wait to see if anyone actually fights a Celestial first before we scale people to them.
DarlingAurora
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I definitely agree with this.
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@The_one_you_least_expect I think this is fine for now considering the door isn't being closed and the fact we're acknowledging it for later scaling if we get it and not completely dismissing it I think is a good start at the very least
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This. Celestials are probably considered "gods" the same way some people in-universe in DC consider Superman a god for his raw power (though the Celestials feat the description much better). Even then, the Celestials are their own very particular brand of beings with a very specific set of characteristics and very specific circumstances of creation no God has shown in any way in the setting so far so...
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- #132
We’re exactly are you getting that from? And agian the thousand year quote comes from a sarcastic Loki so I doubt it’s that valid besides there’s another quote of Odin beating surtur like a half a million years ago so he was clearly much older then what your trying to say. They are considering there in omnipotent city
why do we have to wait for someone else to fight a celestial just to upgrade Thor? Especially when celestials are already 3-c
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Here's the official Disney+ audio description attached to this scene (apologies in advance for the crappy quality):
"Glittering lights rise like fireworks from Frigga's body and spiral into the starry sky where they disperse to become one with the firmament."
The scene shows a new glowing constellation of stars that was not there when Heimdall first looked up.
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- #134
I got that but there’s no reason not to just do it now. Like why do we have to wait possibly years for a celestial or Thor to so up agian? We’ve had characters make massive jumps in power before and we didn’t have to wait chapters upon chapter or issue upon issue just to be safe(unless it was a clear outlier). Why not just upgrade him now and see what happens later just like ever other character
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That's the 4-B odin feat we've been mentioning it has a calc but it's not entirely relevant to scaling since its ED
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Odin was stated to have ruled Asgard for thousands of years in the Thor novel
From Thor in a hyperbolic manner. He even says "I thought my father killed you, like, half a million years ago."
If the Loki statement is invalid, then so is Thor's. Even in Thor's case, 500,000 years is much smaller than 1,000,000,000 years.
Because no one scales to the Celestials. Gorr doesn't and neither does anyone else.
Well besides Infinity Ultron I guess.
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For what it's worth, Eternals director Chloe Zhao seems to consider Celestials to be gods:
"We asked ourselves from the very beginning – that would affect costume design, production design, everything […] ‘why are they here?’ Is it military? Is it missionary? Y’know, ‘cause everything’s going to look different if it’s military or missionary. So we realized that they were missionaries from the celestials. Y’know, celestials that are gods. So everything does have that kind of holy undertone. We also look at sacred symbols throughout human history, backtracking and thinking ‘maybe because of who they were, they inspired these shapes and these symbols.’"
"We asked ourselves from the very beginning – that would affect costume design, production design, everything […] ‘why are they here?’ Is it military? Is it missionary? Y’know, ‘cause everything’s going to look different if it’s military or missionary. So we realized that they were missionaries from the celestials. Y’know, celestials that are gods. So everything does have that kind of holy undertone. We also look at sacred symbols throughout human history, backtracking and thinking ‘maybe because of who they were, they inspired these shapes and these symbols.’"
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- #138
Ok cool is there anything stating Olympians live only a thousand years
my point was there both invalid or equally valid. Thor said odin was much older then you previously were trying to state
Zeus thinks otherwise
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She says this on camera in front of Kevin Feige (timestamp 3:43). He does not stop or contradict her. Kevin in fact nods in agreement at this instant. Doesn't WoG by default now make Celestials gods?
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Thor made a joke, the same one Loki made. If both are valid, then just go with the omniscient source, which implies they're life span is measured in the tens of thousands of years rather than the billions.
Zeus said Gorr can kill Gods, but Zeus also isn't older than the Celestials which means Thor wasn't including them in his statement.
This is going in circles though. I'm for the 5-B+ or 5-A upscaling but against any 3-C rating until we get something more.
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Why can't we just do 5-A possibly 3-C then if there's this much contention still
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Yes and ones a thousand and the other is a hundered thousand and regardless how is this relevant to Olympians exactly?
Zeus feared gorr would kill everyone in omnipotent city. That’s pretty clear cut.
and I’m all for 3-c right now
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Because 3-C is based on them killing Celestials based on Zeus being afraid that they can kill him, while also ignoring Gorr's plan was just to wish them all to be dead rather than invade and fight them all at once.
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- #144
Because it is way easier then hunting down ever god. It’s litterly never implied that couldn’t kill them when he was going about his plan
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Eh then can we just ping the other MCU staff to get their final opinions because this is ginna be circular sincr neither side will agree here or compromise
5-A possibly 4-C versus 3-C
5-A possibly 4-C versus 3-C
Lacku
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Lacku
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Honestly to me this seems like the most reasonable route we can go
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I'll make it easy @Propellus @Colonel_Krukov @Aguywhodoesthings @KingTempest @Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan @M3X 2.0
Can we ping them @Qawsedf234 these are all I got off the top of my head
We really only need 2 or 3 of them but still
Can we ping them @Qawsedf234 these are all I got off the top of my head
We really only need 2 or 3 of them but still
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@Colonel_Krukov @LordGriffin1000 @Sir_Ovens @GyroNutz @Emirp sumitpo @KLOL506 @Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan, @Propellus @Aguywhodoesthings @KingTempest @M3X 2.0
If you're able, could you weigh in on the proposed scaling. Right now the two sides are "5-A (Upscaling from Moon Knight), possibly/likely 4-C (Gorr moving a star)" or "5-A, possibly/likely 3-C (Scaling to Celestials)"
If you're able, could you weigh in on the proposed scaling. Right now the two sides are "5-A (Upscaling from Moon Knight), possibly/likely 4-C (Gorr moving a star)" or "5-A, possibly/likely 3-C (Scaling to Celestials)"
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The former is more sound to me.
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I'm not having a great time finding a version of the scene that isn't severely edited, but Zeus does say "he could kill us" in regards to Gorr having the Necrosword, so even if Gorr was never planning to directly hunt down and kill every god, Zeus seemed to believe he had the ability to do so.
Yeah, I see little reason why they wouldn't be. Between WoG and their presence in Omnipotence City, which isn't shown to be inhabited by anyone other than gods or their entourages (specifically around the Golden Temple, where "the most powerful creator gods in the universe hang out") they are clearly intended to be classified as gods in the MCU.
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I don't think anyone is denying them being gods or I haven't gotten that impression since they like blatantly are, thought this was just a scaling arguement
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If the Celestials are considered gods as well, scaling to them should fine. Are their any anti feats? Like, do they struggle with the tier 4 stuff?
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I think only was qaw to a degree with his werid age argument or whatever
No,Not from my memory
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No celestials casually create stars and galaxies and such
Lacku
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I was checking my sandbox for Love and Thunder Thor and I was just wondering should we merge Thors Post-Awakening and Endgame keys into one since they're both basically the same strength (even though Endgame Thor is a bit stronger), the only difference between the two is that the Endgame key has Mjolnir but even then he shouldn't have "higher" because of it since Mjolnir is only as strong as he is
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No they're 3C but we should
to wait next movies when
Thor or co fight the giants
I think 3C Thor is too high
for now.
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I'd prefer 5-A, likely 4-C, 3-C seems like a little too much
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