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BP was also easily overwhelming Bucky's arm. Not only that, Isaiah himself took out WS's arm in Goyang. Just shows that WS with his metal arm doesn't exactly have the best skill record other than Cap.
Could also be that the WS was holding back aganst BP and Spidey.
 
I personally don't believe Bucky held back against Spidey. He was surprised at his strength and wished that Sam called in Redwing earlier to drag Peter away
 
Wow, didn't know Cap's hits against Loki were of little to no consequence. Heck, with that gut punch you could almost argue that Loki straight up had invulnerability.
 
Wow, didn't know Cap's hits against Loki were of little to no consequence. Heck, with that gut punch you could almost argue that Loki straight up had invulnerability.
Exactly why I was reluctant to scale Iron Man to him, but I guess now it's more consistent with his suit in Civil War getting a weaker key.

Speaking of Loki, he needs to be downgraded to 8-B.
 
Now that the Mark 46 no longer scales to his full-power shit, we should probably get rid of the whole "Don't scale Iron Man to Cap" rule and we should prolly get rid of the "Quicksilver/Cap Punch= outlier" thing as well in tandem.
 
"Don't scale Iron Man to Cap" rule
We just clarify that he doesn't scale to other Iron Men.

Quicksilver/Cap Punch= outlier
I'm still iffy on using a KE feat as a main justification but it's whatever I guess.

Lifting strength still need reworks though. Not everyone who vaguel interacts with Cap is Class 50 or Class 100.
 
We just clarify that he doesn't scale to other Iron Men.
Ye.

I'm still iffy on using a KE feat as a main justification but it's whatever I guess.
Even if we were to disregard the KE feat (Which I honestly don't see any reason to do so) he'd still scale to Spidey in full for the reasons Spino just gave, given that he actually made Spidey groan in pain, whereas against Loki, nothing, even the kick and the shield throw at the edge wasn't enough. Either way, Cap isn't downscaling from Spidey in any manner whatsoever.
 
I'll start working on a LS list, but here's my thoughts

  • Captain America-Tier people: Scaling to Walker overpowering Falcon who has that armored car feat (maybe Class 10?)
  • Spider-Man: Class 25 to 50 and Class [whatever] with Webbings or going all out
  • Iron Man-Tier people: Class 50/100 for the tank stuff
Dunno what we're going to do about the GotG though. They almost all rely on AoS scaling.
 
Ehhhh then I argue Spider-Man doesn't have that much stronger of a standing either since he struggles with weaker feats in Homecoming too. I'm fine with it personally since he kinda only grabbed the bumper and didn't have a good hold in Age of Ultron but either way I feel like it would be wrong for them not to be in the same ballpark when it's outright stated in the next movie.
 
standing either since he struggles with weaker feats in Homecoming too.
But still, Spider-Man does have multiple showings that are greater than Class 5 or 10 in his movies. Cap has been in seven and he just doesn't have anything.

Its more consistent to just Cap to be his own thing, rather than scale him to a newb 15 year old that legitimately thought he would die from falling like 600 feet in the air.
 
Well he should downscale from Class 100 Bucky bionic arm, lifted that big metal beam albeit barely in TWS while severely injured which is unquantifiable but eyeballed by most to be Class 50, the wood ripping (funnily enough a better feat than car lifting) was quite casual, Captain Carter pushed back a room-sized monster on her own and I'm struggling to find a good clip but he lifted a big piece of rubble off himself in TWS, etc.

The anti-feats he struggle with are mostly the AoU car which he didn't have a good hold on and the cool helicopter curl which is honestly such a **** Isaac Newton moment I tend to disregard it.

If we were to talk about the lack of feats then for Class 50 feats Spider-Man only has the jet bridge as well and that's it.

We do tend to scale characters to the higher end of feats unless contradicted by struggling to perform low-end feats and while PIS exists consistency between characters matters too. It would be a bigger gripe not to scale Captain America to Spider-Man imo when it's literally spit out there by the writers in the dialogue and aren't far apart in AP either. Even if the latter did grow stronger over time it would be later on.
 
Well he should downscale from Class 100 Bucky bionic arm,
The bionic arm's feat has issues
  • Its weird scaling wise, as you yourself point out
  • You're using material made from his early combat inclined armors and then scaling it to his explicitly noncombat suit that was designed align with the Accords
  • I watched the feat and the frame where the glass cracks the armor itself does not. Bucky did not deform the metal part of the suit, but applied enough pressure that the repulsor glass was cracked. The calc assumed he applied pressure that deformed the suit like Thor, when it didn't happen
So even if it is a Class 100 feat (which I don't think it is), it scaling to anyone is questionable
but he lifted a big piece of rubble off himself in TWS
Sure, but that's still not more than Class 10, let alone Class 50
He didn't lift it though, just moved it enough for WS to crawl out of. That doesn't require nearly the same amount of force as lifting the entire object.
If we were to talk about the lack of feats then for Class 50 feats Spider-Man only has the jet bridge as well and that's it.
He has other Class 50 feats along with his Class K/100 showings from other movies.
aren't far apart in AP either.
AP and lifting strength have never scaled 1:1. Wonder Woman scales to Superman's AP but not his lifting strength, because he consistently outmuscles her.
 
He didn't overhead lift the beam yes but he still had to overcome its weight off the ground for a bit as he was pulling up the middle and he was severely injured at that point. The weaker feats I included are more so to support that the difference isn't that big. Superman does consistently outmatch Wonder Woman but that is not the case here as they do match in LS and the scaling between characters matters when the character's own feats aren't egregiously bad.

For Spider-Man I thought it was agreed his webbing feats don't necessarily scale otherwise he'll be Class K/M. Although I do admittedly find that a bit weird.
 
He didn't overhead lift the beam yes but he still had to overcome its weight off the ground for a bit as he was pulling up the middle and he was severely injured at that point.
But he doesn't need to be Class 50 to do so, just lift enough of that single section for WS to crawl out of. Which someone that's Class 5 to 10 can do. Its why people that can't lift a car or truck can still tilt it if they push against it hard enough.
they do match in LS and the scaling between characters matters when the character's own feats aren't egregiously bad.
Sure, but its also a really bad Spider-Man. He's barely a hero and literally every movie until FFH and NWH calls him a greenhorn who doesn't know what he's doing. Scaling Cap overpowering him, one of which was because Spider-Man stumbled, just doesn't seem right. For the same reason why don't scale Spider-Man to Cul or Captain America to Thanos.
For Spider-Man I thought it was agreed his webbing feats don't necessarily scale otherwise he'll be Class K/M. Although I do admittedly find that a bit weird.
How I took it was his webbing supporting stuff. There it was just him tugging on it.
 
It's really difficult to lift a car clean off the ground even for a few inches though. In the metal feat Cap was lifting it up at the middle not spinning it on a pivot or something.

Experience is a thing with regards to skill but does it really matter in cases like this though?

Spider-Man and Cull's fight is like a standout case of a massive outlier though, they weren't just matching in LS but straight-up trading blows and it completely ***** up the scaling chain to scale them. Captain America and Thanos isn't the best example as Thanos's attack looked more like a casual grab towards him rather than a hit intended for harm and he was struggling to take like Thanos's fingers with his entire body's might and then subsequently got one-shot.
 
For Spider-Man I thought it was agreed his webbing feats don't necessarily scale otherwise he'll be Class K/M. Although I do admittedly find that a bit weird.
For the crane pull thing it's not as if his webbing is holding on to it, he's only using the webbing as a rope tether to pull it down, kinna similar to if you were to pull down a crane or a ship using a strong ass rope already attached to it. So this is completely Spidey's own strength, something that people don't often notice.

I wonder tho, how much that crane thing will yield.
 
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I believe it was a crawler crane, which look pretty heavy if nothing else.
Apparently according to this it can easily range from 80 US ton to 110 US ton, which is approximately 72.6 to 99.8 metric tons. Wikipedia states crawler cranes can weigh from anywhere between 40 to 4000 long tons (40.642 to 4064.2 metric tons). I believe the 72.6 to 99.8 metric tons version is more accurate, given the crane Spidey pulls looks similar to the 80-110 US ton versions.
 
Apparently according to this it can easily range from 80 US ton to 110 US ton, which is approximately 72.6 to 99.8 metric tons. Wikipedia states crawler cranes can weigh from anywhere between 40 to 4000 long tons (40.642 to 4064.2 metric tons). I believe the 72.6 to 99.8 metric tons version is more accurate, given the crane Spidey pulls looks similar to the 80-110 US ton versions.
Damn that's Class K then?
 
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