[MCU] 2-C Nine Realms

[RoTt35]

The Art of Thor: The Dark World states that the Nine Realms are multi-dimensional:

It also states that from the observatory you can look out over universes:

The Art of Thor states that the Nine Realms are realms of reality:

The Movie Storybook of Avengers states that Asgard is a realm that exists alongside our universe:

A Deluxe Book/Guidebook of Thor states that Jane and Thor were separated by an entire universe:

With these statements we can conclude that each realm is its own universe, or rather that they have a universal size, since unfortunately, and sorry for the clickbait of the thread title but it is the only way to get some attention, the Nine Realms are spatio-temporally separated from each other for obvious reasons (They share the same time and physical travel, like through spaceships, between them is possible), so they doesn't qualify as different space-times as per our standards

• The only exception being Niflheim/Hel which was only shown to be able to leave and enter through dimensional portals, although I don't know if that's enough to consider it as a separate space-time

Therefore, assuming that Niflheim/Hel doesn't qualify as a separate space-time, this would just make the 3-A universe 9 times above the baseline (observable universe), and the MCU universe being larger than the observable is supported by other things:

• ‌The Gates of Eternity is located at the center of the universe instead of Earth
• ‌Ego is located outside the edge of the known universe, and we can observe nebulae and stars beyond it

This would just affect IG Thanos and Arishem, making them 9 times above baseline 3-A, as they scale from the universe via destroying it and the Big Bang respectively. And for Thanos, "The Road to Avengers: Infinity War - The Art of the Marvel Cinematic Universe" states that the combined power of the Infinity Stones can decimate the universe, which works as further evidence for his 3-A rating in addition to his own statement

 

[Hellbeast]

Isn't there also a statement about the power stone being Uni somewhere?

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

‌The Gates of Eternity is located at the center of the universe instead of Earth

Do you mean Vormir? Or...

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

W bait

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Isn't there also a statement about the power stone being Uni somewhere?

Dunno what the source is

As for the OP, it looks alright

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

Dunno what the source is

Is there a GotG novelization, since it talks about convicts/defenders answering the call against threats (Ronan and Thanos) to a galaxy that possess a power source (Power Stone) capable of destroying the universe?

 

[Dinobot1996]

Dunno what the source is

As for the OP, it looks alright

A Google search of the text led me to the Guardians of the Galaxy junior novel.

 

[Excellence616]

I agree with OP

 

[AStaticVoid]

I agree with the OP.

Dunno what the source is

This comes from "Marvel Guardians of the Galaxy: The Junior Novel, Chris Wyatt, 2014". Description says it's based on the movie.
Here I attach the full pages:

 

[ArkhamDC06]

So what would it mean in terms of tier? They would stay at 3-A or could this get them "At least 3-A"?

Personal question aside, I agree with the OP

 

[RoTt35]

So what would it mean in terms of tier? They would stay at 3-A or could this get them "At least 3-A"?

Assuming that Niflheim/Hel isn't accepted as a different space-time, they would only be 3-A, just 9 times above baseline, though IG Thanos is already "At least 3-A" due to the IG scaling much higher thanks to Infinity Ultron but we don't know if Thanos can do the same than him

 

[RoTt35]

Bump

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

Disagree, this CRT is gratuitous clickbait and should be rejected, deleted and forgotten in a snap!

Anyway I agree FRA that said I'm pretty sure by the end of phase 3 both Yggdrasil and The Odinforce aren't a thing anymore in the MCU (the writers forgot lol!).

 

[Qawsedf234]

I disagree. The movies themselves state the Nine Realms are galaxies (or at least they have hilariously tiny populations) and we have an equal amount of other WoG quotes calling them galaxies.

his would just make the 3-A universe 9 times above the baseline (observable universe),

It wouldn't. You would need to prove that all Nine Realms are physically equal in size for this to be true. Considering they're galaxies this would still just be a normal 3-A feat.

 

[RoTt35]

The movies themselves state the Nine Realms are galaxies

I don't see anything in that clip that states that the Nine Realms are galaxies, am I missing something?

we have an equal amount of other WoG quotes calling them galaxies.

For example?

It wouldn't. You would need to prove that all Nine Realms are physically equal in size for this to be true.

This states that from the observatory you can look out over universes, they being called universes is already enough to consider them of a universal size according to our standards. These statements also say that Asgard is a realm separated from our universe. And there's also the fact that the Gates of Eternity is the center of the universe instead of Earth, which means that the universe is larger than the observable, plus Ego and other celestial bodies being located outside the edge of the known universe

 

[Qawsedf234]

For example?

Here

One of the more breathtaking scenes in Thor occurs when a representation of Ygdrassil, the Tree of Life, is revealed as a shimmering, crystalline ash tree, within whose branches the nine realms are realized. Rendered as pulsating galactic bodies integrated among the foliage, the tree and leaves were created using an l-system in Speedtree, and the spiral galaxies of the nine realms were produced using particle simulations in Maya and FumeFX fluids for the glowing nebulae. Using advanced depth cueing techniques Luma was able to bring it all together within a proper 3D volume, with the realms commingled within the leaves of the tree.

We also have this line from Thor 1

My father explained it to me like this, that your world is one of the Nine Realms of the Cosmos, linked to each other by the branches of Yggdrasil, the Worlds Tree. Now you see it every day without realizing. The images glimpsed through... What did you call it? This Hooble Telescope.

Hubble. Hubble Telescope.

Tell me more.

So, the Nine Realms. Now, there is Midgard, which is Earth. This is Alfheim. Vanaheim. Jotunheim. And Asgard. And that's where I come from. Thank you, Jane.

The Nine Realms can physically be seen by telescopes and physically humans have already mapped it out without understanding it.

they being called universes is already enough to consider them of a universal size according to our standards

Not to my knowledge. You would need to show a solid reasoning that they're independent universal sized areas occupying the same space.

And there's also the fact that the Gates of Eternity is the center of the universe instead of Earth

Earth isn't the center of the universe in Marvel or IRL. It's the center of the observable universe because all light we use to see bounces off or towards Earth.

Is it above baseline 3-A? Sure I guess. But there's not enough for 9x above baseline 3-A.

 

[RoTt35]

Here

That refers to this scene, which is only a representation of Yggdrasil and the Nine Realms, they being represented and having the shape of a galaxy doesn't mean that they have the same size, plus that would imply that the universe is much smaller

The Nine Realms can physically be seen by telescopes and physically humans have already mapped it out without understanding it.

In that part Thor is referring to Yggdrasil, not the Nine Realms, and Midgard is inside Yggdrasil so through the telescope you can see a part of it without necessarily being able to obverse the other realms

Not to my knowledge.

From the Universe page:

These are notes that the worlds are indeed universes; while they don't need all of these, at least one of them should indicate this.

• If they are outright called universes or stated to be the size of universes by a reliable source, they should be considered universes.

Earth isn't the center of the universe in Marvel or IRL. It's the center of the observable universe because all light we use to see bounces off or towards Earth.

I mentioned it because the baseline for a universal size is the observable universe

 

[Qawsedf234]

That refers to this scene, which is only a representation of Yggdrasil and the Nine Realms, they being represented and having the shape of a galaxy doesn't mean that they have the same size, plus that would imply that the universe is much smaller

The Nine Realms aren't all of reality, as your own sources state. They're the Nine Realms Asgardians have influence over.

In that part Thor is referring to Yggdrasil, not the Nine Realms, and Midgard is inside Yggdrasil so through the telescope you can see a part of it without necessarily being able to obverse the other realms

He's referring to both. All Nine Realms are linked and Humanity can view it with telescopes.

From the Universe page:

From the Universe page

• The Worlds being different bodies of space is not enough to consider them universes, as that does not quite prove they have different timelines. Especially if they are afterlives. Afterlives often are different bodies of space, but are generally condensed in the same timeline unless there's more proof otherwise.
  
  
• Being "Different Worlds, Realms, or Dimensions" requires more elaborate context and even "Dreams, Imaginations and Ideas becoming reality" is not enough to say the "Worlds" are entire universes. "Becoming Reality" often simply refers more to "Becoming a piece of reality" as opposed to each and every Dream becoming an "Entire Reality".
• Saying that it "Mirrors your world" does not automatically equate to mirroring the entire universe you came from as World can also mean planet. And it can even refer to locations in between planet and Universe. And even if the realms are larger than planet sized, the "Your World" aspect often refers to specific sceneries rather than the entire Space-Time Continuum. And just because world frequently refers to universe doesn't mean everything larger than a planet that is called a world is a universe.

So as before I'm not seeing it as being Nine joint universe sized realms rather than nine spaces existing within a universe sized area

 

[RoTt35]

The Nine Realms aren't all of reality, as your own sources state.

Well yes, because according to my sources the Nine Realms are multi-dimensional universes/realities that are separate from our universe, not just galaxies

From the Universe page

I don't see why any of these points are relevant, my argument is based on the Nine Realms having a universal size because they are called universes, and as I have already pointed out that's enough to consider them of a universal size according to what the page establishes

 

[Qawsedf234]

Well yes, because according to my sources the Nine Realms are multi-dimensional universes/realities that are separate from our universe, not just galaxies

They can be seen by the Hubble Telescope and can be traveled to. They're within the same universal space.

argument is based on the Nine Realms having a universal size because they are called universes, and as I have already pointed out that's enough to consider them of a universal size according to what the page establishes

You haven't, because calling something a universe when it shares the same space as an actual universe isn't a 3-A justification. You need more to prove they aren't just weird seperate galaxies.

 

[RoTt35]

They can be seen by the Hubble Telescope

So the universe is just as big as the Hubble telescope can see (10-15 billion light-years) since Asgard is stated to be at the top of Yggdrasil, which is the entire universe?

You haven't, because calling something a universe when it shares the same space as an actual universe isn't a 3-A justification. You need more to prove they aren't just weird seperate galaxies.

I'm not arguing that the Nine Realms are separate space-times, as with the exception of possibly Niflheim they clearly aren't, besides the page has another section dedicated exclusively to that. I don't see why nine realms of universal size existing within the same space or structure (Yggdrasil) is contradictory, plus the page doesn't say anything against it, in fact it establishes that that is the assumption if they aren't separate space-times:

Universes must be separated by something other than 3 dimensional distance or physical barriers, otherwise they would be considered to both be part of one large universe for our tiering purposes.

 

[Qawsedf234]

So the universe is just as big as the Hubble telescope can see (10-15 billion light-years) since Asgard is stated to be at the top of Yggdrasil, which is the entire universe?

No.

The Hubble Telescope can see the 9 worlds and humanity just doesn't understand what they're looking at yet. But that doesn't mean it's only 15 billion lightyears across.

I'm not arguing that the Nine Realms are separate space-times, as with the exception of possibly Niflheim they clearly aren't, besides the page has another section dedicated exclusively to that. I don't see why nine realms of universal size existing within the same space or structure (Yggdrasil) is contradictory, plus the page doesn't say anything against it, in fact it establishes that that is the assumption if they aren't separate space-times:

We only see the realms as galaxies, Gamora stated that Thanos will kill trillions in the universe with the IG (which lines up with Heimdall) and we're given no indication that the other realms are anything more than a galaxy.

They're seperate regions, sure. But that doesn't mean they're 9 seperate universe sized regions.

 

[RoTt35]

No.

The Hubble Telescope can see the 9 worlds and humanity just doesn't understand what they're looking at yet. But that doesn't mean it's only 15 billion lightyears across.

If the Hubble telescope can see the Nine Realms, including Asgard which is located at the top of Yggdrasil (universe), that means that Asgard is less than 15 billion light years away from Earth

We only see the realms as galaxies

Correction, they are represented in the shape of a galaxy in a room of Asgard palace, which is different from how the Yggdrasil actually looks in Thor's credits. And as I said before, the Nine Realms having the shape of a galaxy, which in truth is just a representation, doesn't contradict them having a universal size

Gamora stated that Thanos will kill trillions in the universe with the IG (which lines up with Heimdall)

I don't see why the number of living beings matters in the size of the Nine Realms

and we're given no indication that the other realms are anything more than a galaxy.

Besides the statements in the OP, no, that's true

 

[Qawsedf234]

If the Hubble telescope can see the Nine Realms, including Asgard which is located at the top of Yggdrasil (universe), that means that Asgard is less than 15 billion light years away from Earth

But thay doesn't limit the universe the be 15 billion lightyears. Since that means there's at least 15 billion lightyears from Earth in the opposite direction and 15 billion light-years from Asgard in the opposite direction. So with just that you have 45 billion light-years, plus anything else.

It wouldn't limit the universe's size or anything.

galaxy, which in truth is just a representation, doesn't contradict them having a universal size

Or, they could just be galaxy sized because there's no indication they're universes onto themselves and they're included in generic threat to the universe statements.

I don't see why the number of living beings matters in the size of the Nine Realms

Gamora stayes the universe (singular) will be effected. The number she gives matches Heimdall's numbers.

 

[RoTt35]

Gamora stayes the universe (singular) will be effected. The number she gives matches Heimdall's numbers.

I still don't understand why the number of living beings living in the realms has relevance to their size

Or, they could just be galaxy sized because there's no indication they're universes onto themselves and they're included in generic threat to the universe statements.

So we are going to ignore all the scans that are in the OP and give more importance to how the Nine Realms look in a representation of the Yggdrasil that doesn't match to how it actually looks, if that's the case I guess that the thread can be closed

 

[Qawsedf234]

I still don't understand why the number of living beings living in the realms has relevance to their size

I'm saying that the numbers given by other aliens match with the hunters given by Heimdall, indicating that other aliens with better knowledge of the universe lumps them as the same thing.

So we are going to ignore all the scans that are in the OP and give more importance to how the Nine Realms look in a representation of the Yggdrasil that doesn't match to how it actually looks

My position is that we should take what is stated in the movies themselves over some guidebooks if they don't match.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

"The Road to Avengers: Infinity War - The Art of the Marvel Cinematic Universe" states that the combined power of the Infinity Stones can decimate the universe

This comes from "Marvel Guardians of the Galaxy: The Junior Novel, Chris Wyatt, 2014". Description says it's based on the movie.
Here I attach the full pages:

I know the main purpose of this thread was rejected, but could these still be applied to the profiles?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Yeah

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I'm unsure. I agree with Qawsed's points but I also don't like just ignoring some of the statements in the OP either.

 

[ArkhamDC06]

Maybe if someone is willing to make another CRT with all the informations, it will be more clear for everyone and we can make a proper move about it if that's so confusing

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

I'm unsure. I agree with Qawsed's points but I also don't like just ignoring some of the statements in the OP either.

What do you think about adding these, at the very least?

"The Road to Avengers: Infinity War - The Art of the Marvel Cinematic Universe" states that the combined power of the Infinity Stones can decimate the universe

This comes from "Marvel Guardians of the Galaxy: The Junior Novel, Chris Wyatt, 2014". Description says it's based on the movie.
Here I attach the full pages:

 

[LordGriffin1000]

What do you think about adding these, at the very least?

I think those are fine to add. Yes.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

I think those are fine to add. Yes.

Thank you. I'll apply these accepted changes then.

As for the OP, like Arkham said, a new CRT can be made with all the information about the nine Realms to be more clear, so this can likely be closed