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Kratos vs Darkrai

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Talking about that:

Why darkrai has a 2-C key? the feat from pokepark should not be counted if Darkrai demonstrated to fight 2-Bs, why using a lowball key who demonstrated a casual 2-C feat if you can only count his 2-B feat?
 
Milly Rocking Bandit said:
Kratos has infinite speed, too. The profile is there for a reason.
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Okay. I don't have experience with using characters with 'likely' keys and stats. So with standard assumptions we treat 'likely' statistics as being non-questionable keys that can be used?
 
Milly Rocking Bandit said:
Yes, it's that reason no one has made any arguments about blitzing one another.
Click to expand...
Okay, seems like very questionable logic (if it's only likely then isn't the rationale already questionable and thus not legal to use from a logician's perspective?) but I'll take it as site philosophy.

If Kratos deflected the Dark Void then couldn't Darkrai just turn intangible to dodge its own attack and then, with updated understanding of Kratos, simply spam mass Dark Void to get around it? Or do the anime variants of Dark Void not count? Using the 3D games (Revolution and XY) we can clearly see that Darkrai's Dark Void has been presented as either an energy field that the opponent sinks into (XY) or some sort of invisible wave of energy that infects the target (Revolution).

So we have a rapid fire Dark Void, a field Dark Void and an intangible Dark Void wave as existing variants/presentations of the attack.
 
I should also note after taking a close look that the mainline games seem to consistently depict Dark Void as a literal field that sucks the opponent into a nightmare. In SM and XY we clearly see Darkrai tosses the sphere into the ground which then manifests as a field of darkness underneath the opponent. How exactly would Kratos deflect this with an armlet? Is he capable of deflecting something that literally appears around his ankles?
 
Using the If [character] did this, then, [character] could do this to counter, then [character] could... it's an infinite loop, and makes it a novel, not a Vs Debate. If it's a projectile, it's getting deflected via Golden Fleece.

The "void" is what happens when the projectile hits, evidenced by the manga, the anime, and that 3D games. The Fleece has taken a hit from the Blade of Olympus, and Dark Void is just a status move. It does no damage. Kratos could deal with it, no matter how many times he spams it.
 
Milly Rocking Bandit said:
Using the If [character] did this, then, [character] could do this to counter, then [character] could... it's an infinite loop, and makes it a novel, not a Vs Debate. If it's a projectile, it's getting deflected via Golden Fleece.
The "void" is what happens when the projectile hits, evidenced by the manga, the anime, and that 3D games. The Fleece has taken a hit from the Blade of Olympus, and Dark Void is just a status move. It does no damage. Kratos could deal with it, no matter how many times he spams it.
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No, that's a Vs Debate. If Kratos is going to deflect the Dark Void and Darkrai can react to it (just as Kratos can react to it) then Darkrai is going to just turn intangible and shift its tactics with the understanding that Kratos can deflect projectiles. This is basic common sense and HIGHLY relevant to a literal what-if fight.

Yes and Darkrai can A. Make dozens if not hundreds of them from a singular attack (see movie Darkrai) or can B. literally throw the projectile underground and explode it underneath the opponent into the void (see the game animations).

Can Kratos deflect upwards to hundreds of projectiles from an equally fast opponent in one instance with a single armlet? Can Kratos deflect an energy sphere that travels underground and manifests beneath him?
 
Kratos deflects Dark Void and Darkrai goes to sleep. This canonically happened to a Darkrai on the manga. Trying to say he will turn intangible to dodge it goes against what is shown.
 
There's been dozens of instances where one person blocks a flurry of attacks with one hand, and or weapon (I.E Beginning of Goku vs Freeza). Considering they have equal speed, not anything Kratos couldn't do. Regardless, Dark Void only has one form of attack: A projectile. It's most commonly been seen as a projectile, and the only time it hasn't was during the 2D years of non-animated sprites.

In a majority of the new games, anime, and manga (a non-animated got of entertainment), it's a projectile in one way or another. You saying, "he goes intangible, and then fires more, or they go underground" isn't him tactically learning Kratos. Since they have infinite speed, he's more than capable of perceiving and recognizing the threat of it approaching him from the ground.
 
Kepekley23 said:
Kratos deflects Dark Void and Darkrai goes to sleep. This canonically happened to a Darkrai on the manga. Trying to say he will turn intangible to dodge it goes against what is shown.
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That was one Darkrai in a singular manga that has very little relevance regarding the various game versions of Darkrai or the anime version of Darkrai. I would appreciate a scan of the Dark Void being deflected so I can see the actual context (whether it was posted here or if it can be posted here, either would be nice to be pointed to)

@the real cal howard

You mean the Darkrai that could put an on-guard Palkia to sleep with no physical/visual effect? How the hell is Kratos meant to deflect Dark Void from PMD?

@Millly Rocking Bandit

Completely different franchises. Frieza was only holding back for the sheer sport of it but could have easily have just powered up briefly to handle it. You are essentially implying that Kratos can deflect dozens of projectiles from an equally fast opponent when said projectiles are made by the energy of that equally fast opponent, meaning the projectiles should be at least as fast as Darkrai himself.

@DragonEmperor23

Can you show me the feat so I can see the context?
 
Kepekley23 said:
Just to note, the Golden Fleece isn't restricted to only projectiles. It also needed to be canonically used in a part where you reflect a petrifying energy beam. There is also an instance where Kratos used it to absorb an omnidirectional burst of light in his fight with Lahkesis.
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^
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
Kepekley23 said:
Just to note, the Golden Fleece isn't restricted to only projectiles. It also needed to be canonically used in a part where you reflect a petrifying energy beam. There is also an instance where Kratos used it to absorb an omnidirectional burst of light in his fight with Lahkesis.
Click to expand...
^
Click to expand...
I have tried to find the scene in question but I can't seem to see it anywhere in the YouTube videos I look at. I would appreciate a timestamp to a video of it occurring so I can properly see whether or not it counters my point (that Darkrai's Dark Void would likely attack below Kratos if based on the games)
 
It is from the God of War 2 novel. Lahkesis releases an intense burst of light from her staff, the narration describes Kratos as just barely pulling out the Golden Fleece in time to absorb and reflect it.

Even the extremely vague and hard to gauge in-game attack animation wouldn't help Darkrai anyway, considering all we can make of that is that Dark Void's projectile can home in beneath the ground.
 
Kepekley23 said:
It is from the God of War 2 novel. Lahkesis releases an intense burst of light from her staff, the narration describes Kratos as just barely pulling out the Golden Fleece in time to absorb and reflect it.
Even the extremely vague and hard to gauge in-game attack animation wouldn't help Darkrai anyway, considering all we can make of that is that Dark Void's projectile can home in beneath the ground.
Click to expand...
Which is an extremely powerful advantage. The animation explicitly has Darkrai conjure the sphere, blast it somewhere downwards and then it explodes beneath the opponent. If Kratos can't deflect or absorb something beneath him then Darkrai wins.

Cal said that this was PMD Darkrai as well who has multiple feats of putting his target to sleep with no sign of it. Palkia was put to sleep with no indication of it occurring and Darkrai even put the protagonist and his partner into a nightmare the very instant they entered his cavern.

IIRC the only reason why Darkrai could even be stopped was all thanks to Cresselia. Palkia, The protagonist and the partner would have all completely been lost if not for her being a hard counter to Darkrai.

So we have Game Darkrai using Dark Void as a projectile beneath the opponent, Anime Darkrai using Dark Void as a scattered rapid fire variant and PMD Darkrai who can do it effortlessly with zero indicator of it even occurring.
 
If this is PMD Darkrai we can then safely discard absolutely all the skill feats he showed outside of PMD. Unless it will suddenly become Composite again.
 
Is for things like this that I think some pokemon should have multiple profiles instead of what is basically a composite profile.
 
Wasn't the ONLY reason that Darkrai could even be seriously fought was a result of Cresselia helping the party? Darkrai has multiple feats in PMD of putting people in a nightmare with zero visual or tangible effect to even react to. The party literally just walks into his cavern and they instantly enter a nightmare and Palkia literally just freeezes in place and falls into a nightmare.

PMD Darkrai's 'Dark Void', or whatever his sleep hax even is, seems to be much harder to stop than any other variant. Am I wrong?
 
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