Kodoku Island Tournament - Ji Ning vs Reinhard

[Arkenis]

Reinhard vs Ji Ning

Tournament
Round 2, High 6-C Bracket
Rules: Equal Speed, SBA

Ji Ning:

Attack Potency - 297 Gigatons

Reinhard:

Attack Potency - 101.8 Gigatons

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Soooooooooooooooo uhhhhhhhhhh

Starting moves and/or haxes

 

[Arkenis]

Alright hopefully this goes better.

Ji NIng's starting move from what I remember is his rainmaku. thousands of rain drops fall down attacking Reinhard for hours and hours all high 6-C and looking at the ap difference it won't matter much but Ji Ning does have AD that allows him to become more powerful. Has good senses being able to sense people from kilometers away. He also can do several things at once with his multiple selves so while the rainmaku is going on, He'll be able to think of another plan and or try another hax like his soul hax.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Ji NIng's starting move from what I remember is his rainmaku. thousands of rain drops fall down attacking Reinhard for hours and hours all high 6-C and looking at the ap difference it won't matter much but Ji Ning does have AD that allows him to become more powerful. Has good senses being able to sense people from kilometers away. He also can do several things at once with his multiple selves so while the rainmaku is going on, He'll be able to think of another plan and or try another hax like his soul hax.

Reinhard’s body would probably just react the best way it could for survival. Since these are literal raindrops. I have no idea if he can react to that level of danmaku so I won’t say he does for some bullshit reason, however I will say he will probably throw an Arial slash attack instinctively first which is a guaranteed hit attack. Infact I don’t see what stops Reinhard from just instinctively nuking the Battlefeild or the entire ******* world and fix it back with his matter manipulation like he did against puck to erase all traces of him from existence.

I HIGHLY DOUBT IT WILL GET TO THIS but If he is killed by the rain (or anything really) he can always resurrect as long as a person in the world needs help (I think Od Laguna just revived him regardless) and since he has seen the attack once he just keep getting faster and faster the more times he sees the attack till he can completely defend against it. (assuming these attacks aren’t already the speed raindrops fall at cuz Reinhard can just dodge everything at FTL speeds).

Reinhard resists soul manipulation so even if he doesn’t resist Jo’s soul manipulation for whatever odd reason then he should be able to instinctively acquire divine protection against soul based attacks he doesn’t resist since Soul resistance is within Od Laguna’s power.

Reinhard also has AD that would just eventually let him dodge any attack if seen enough times like I’ve said. Reinhard’s stealth mastery allows him sneak pass those with senses as acute as Ji.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Q: In a case where Subaru was seriously trying to kill Reinhard (even indirectly), could he defeat Reinhard after many tens of thousands of Return by Deaths? Or is killing Reinhard impossible for Subaru?

A: It's impossible, right?

Q: Can Reinhard walk while avoiding being hit by the rain?

A: He can.

Q: If you threw Reinhard into space, how would that turn out?

A: He'd adapt.
Reinhard Birthday Q&A

Didn't really know what to do with that years ago, but i guess it's just skill, makes sense since Elsa has "godlike" skill which lets her easily handle danmaku spam with dozens of attacks, Reinhard would be on another level.

 

[Arkenis]

Reinhard’s body would probably just react the best way it could for survival. Since these are literal raindrops. I have no idea if he can react to that level of danmaku so I won’t say he does for some bullshit reason, however I will say he will probably throw an Arial slash attack instinctively first which is a guaranteed hit attack. Infact I don’t see what stops Reinhard from just instinctively nuking the Battlefeild or the entire ******* world and fix it back with his matter manipulation like he did against puck to erase all traces of him from existence.

Nuking the battle field? The rainmaku can just come back.

I HIGHLY DOUBT IT WILL GET TO THIS but If he is killed by the rain (or anything really) he can always resurrect as long as a person in the world needs help (I think Od Laguna just revived him regardless) and since he has seen the attack once he just keep getting faster and faster the more times he sees the attack till he can completely defend against it. (assuming these attacks aren’t already the speed raindrops fall at cuz Reinhard can just dodge everything at FTL speeds).

Considering the attack is in essence Ji Ning's swordplay and he also can merge with the rain it should be faster than regular rain, I don't see him adapting to this very easily. And yeah Reinhard has RPL but Ji also has AD, which lets him create new abilities and techniques so even given Reinhard could gain faster speed, I don't see a problem with Ji Ning also being able to make the rain more difficult to avoid. Also regular rain storm raindrops easily fall in the thousands of a single cubic meter, and Ji Ning creates an entire tempest and does so for hours on end, so I find it very unlikely him getting faster will help him. Not to mention but this would also be like basically a bunch of Ji Ning's attacking while also being basically 2x stronger than Reinhard.

Reinhard resists soul manipulation so even if he doesn’t resist Jo’s soul manipulation for whatever odd reason then he should be able to instinctively acquire divine protection against soul based attacks he doesn’t resist since Soul resistance is within Od Laguna’s power.

Not completely sure, but Ji Ning has several layers with it I think? So if Od Laguna's got more layers for resistance then its fine.

Reinhard also has AD that would just eventually let him dodge any attack if seen enough times like I’ve said. Reinhard’s stealth mastery allows him sneak pass those with senses as acute as Ji.

Don't think his stealths gonna matter. But what are those senses? Ji Ning can sense a lot, can sense from kilometers, can sense danger and how severe it is, can sense aura as well,

 

[Epiccheev]

Didn't really know what to do with that years ago, but i guess it's just skill, makes sense since Elsa has "godlike" skill which lets her easily handle danmaku spam with dozens of attacks, Reinhard would be on another level.

Classic Tappei wanking Reinhard moment

 

[Arkenis]

If the rain thing can just be easily avoided, What is stopping JI Ning also using TK to just hold him still?

 

[Arnoldstone18]

I mean whats stopping Reinhard from just straight up attacking him first if his rain shit can be easily dealt with

 

[Arkenis]

I mean whats stopping Reinhard from just straight up attacking him first if his rain shit can be easily dealt with

The Tk would.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Classic Tappei wanking Reinhard moment

I love how Reinhard is this op monster yet, even with his hyping up Reinhard, Tappei repeatedly says authorities>blessings, really made Reinhard more grounded than he seemed initially, cause that was NLF incarnate.

You could still really wank some stuff, like saying he will continuously get greater and greater layers of resistances to stuff, but a level headed analysis would say he at best, currently, would have like 2 layers of resistances to stuff.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Nuking the battle field?

I say that to express how massive his AOE is.

Not completely sure, but Ji Ning has several layers with it I think? So if Od Laguna's got more layers for resistance then its fine

Assuming he doesn’t just die to an attack from Reid. How many layers does Ji have?

Don't think his stealths gonna matter. But what are those senses? Ji Ning can sense a lot, can sense from kilometers, can sense danger and how severe it is, can sense aura as well,

Aside from the range of the senses. His senses are might similar to Fer’s ability to pick up tiny changes in the surroundings. Otherwise then I’ll concede on that point.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

The Tk would.

yeah but the matter manipulation attack is a flash of light that spreads across the battlefield. Since Reinhard has instinctive reactions and since Ji would most likely waste his first attack on him. Reinhard is more likely to just straight up erase him first before anything else.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Wait does Ji mana?

 

[Rikimarox2]

Wait does Ji mana?

No. He uses Qi.

he doesn’t just die to an attack from Reid. How many layers does Ji have?

Not really sure what key are we using. His second key? If so then then like, 3 to 4 layers, IIRC?

Aside from the range of the senses. His senses are might similar to Fer’s ability to pick up tiny changes in the surroundings. Otherwise then I’ll concede on that point.

That doesn't sound even remotely close to Ji Ning, who, in the state even weaker than even his first key, can easily spot a house fly 10 kilometers away, and by easily sensing the small tremors in the ground he easily detected where an army location was (20 kilometers).

There are many other senses feat, but these are like, the basic one.

Not interested in this tourney, just saw my Boi being mentioned so decided to give a reply.

 

[Arkenis]

Not really sure what key are we using. His second key? If so then then like, 3 to 4 layers, IIRC?

I'm unsure if its first or second. Planck69 has him in the tournament but I assumed first key for this so can just go with first key layers.

yeah but the matter manipulation attack is a flash of light that spreads across the battlefield. Since Reinhard has instinctive reactions and since Ji would most likely waste his first attack on him. Reinhard is more likely to just straight up erase him first before anything else.

What is the range for it and I think upon sensing the danger through precog it won't be hard for him to respond with his best abilities, i.e Soul manip, TK class M, summoning fire on you capable of turning people to ash though assuming Reinhard's jump was with re-entry heat then its not important,

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Range is tens of kilometers, he raises his hands, and everything gets nuked.

Reinhard is due to for a Class G lifting strength upgrade, and yes Reinhard jumped from the moon back to the planet, and was so hot upon landing, everything around got vaporized.

Not really interested in this match up, just providing info, cause the profiles are in need of some work, but Reinhard is mostly fine i guess, his stuff comes from later volumes, when I had both the interest and competency for powerscaling, it's the earlier stuff that's lacking, but who knows maybe i missed some good skill feats and or abilities for Wilhelm and Theresia from the Ex Novels, that will just add on to the Knight among Knights.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

No. He uses Qi.


Not really sure what key are we using. His second key? If so then then like, 3 to 4 layers, IIRC?

That doesn't sound even remotely close to Ji Ning, who, in the state even weaker than even his first key, can easily spot a house fly 10 kilometers away, and by easily sensing the small tremors in the ground he easily detected where an army location was (20 kilometers).

There are many other senses feat, but these are like, the basic one.

Not interested in this tourney, just saw my Boi being mentioned so decided to give a reply.

Noted. I’ll probably be more inquisitive about the hax layers as the debate goes on.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

What is the range for it and I think upon sensing the danger through precog it won't be hard for him to respond with his best abilities, i.e Soul manip, TK class M, summoning fire on you capable of turning people to ash though assuming Reinhard's jump was with re-entry heat then its not important,

Well you heard the man above. Class G is due. And his jump practically vaped everything in his immediate surrounding on impact. He is also resistant to fire manipulation.

 

[Planck69]

Huh, forgot about this. I'll be taking it to be Ning's second key since that's his best state that fits for this tournament.

Anyway, Ji Ning has a power advantage to a massive degree, considering he oneshots people who oneshot people who oneshot people that are on par with his Xiantian self, that the Attack Potency value scales to. His skill is also very apparent and can be seen from his Feats section, never mind that he can improve in skill and create new moves in battle over time.

His main moves are his Sword Dao Domain, an improvement from his Rainwater Sword Domain in that the sword ki blasts can manifest all over the domain at any point and covers his whole range, making dodging even more unfeasible, not to mention the fact that it can completely paralyze him via controlling the world around him with the Dao Paths he's mastered.

Worst comes to worst, he'd sense the danger from Reinhard's sword and likely use his Domain to paralyze him or pin him down with telekinesis and encase him in ice.

Voting for Ji for now, since idk what LN nonsense Rein can pull.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Anyway, Ji Ning has a power advantage to a massive degree, considering he oneshots people who oneshot people who oneshot people that are on par with his Xiantian self, that the Attack Potency value scales to. His skill is also very apparent and can be seen from his Feats section, never mind that he can improve in skill and create new moves in battle over time.

Reinhard possesses matter manipulation which he would definitely start with instinctively to remove every trace of Ji so that he can’t regenerate. Reinhard has a pretty sizeable skill chain but I don’t think he will need it in this match.
Also if Reinhard dies he just comes back to life via his immortality and gets faster each time till he can dodge everything and speed blitz Ji. I doubt it will get to that tho. I think Reinhard’s matter manipulation just does the job once he starts with it.

His main moves are his Sword Dao Domain, an improvement from his Rainwater Sword Domain in that the sword ki blasts can manifest all over the domain at any point and covers his whole range, making dodging even more unfeasible, not to mention the fact that it can completely paralyze him via controlling the world around him with the Dao Paths he's mastered

All the more reason why Reinhard’s body will instinctively sense and react to this threat by starting with tens of kilometers wide flash that erases all traces of Ji. Also Reinhard is supposed to be class G to resist the TK and he can probably resist paralysis inducement via his divine protection.

Worst comes to worst, he'd sense the danger from Reinhard's sword and likely use his Domain to paralyze him or pin him down with telekinesis and encase him in ice.

Reinhard is resistant to ice manipulation and can withstand AZ temperatures. The rest has been addressed

So I will be voting Reinhard for his Matter Manipulation and his ability to reach speed blitz levels via his immortality and RPL.

 

[Planck69]

Ning has his own instinctive reaction and precognition, and can just teleport out of that range immediately before the move is made, since it's a gesture against a thought.

The paralysis is done via manipulating a Type 2 concept and he uses it very liberally.

Other than that, good reasoning.

 

[Arkenis]

Leaning towards Ji NIng just due to teleporting, concept Paralysis, and soul manip having several layers and his Class T TK.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Ning has his own instinctive reaction and precognition, and can just teleport out of that range immediately before the move is made, since it's a gesture against a thought.

The paralysis is done via manipulating a Type 2 concept and he uses it very liberally.

Other than that, good reasoning.

Fair enough.

any counters to sleep manipulation?

Reinhard is capable of just simply knocking people out in his surrounding. Probably with a gesture. Dunno.

 

[Arkenis]

Fair enough.

any counters to sleep manipulation?

Does it work on souls? Can it affect several minds at a time?

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Does it work on souls? Can it affect several minds at a time?

It doesn’t need to work on souls if it works on the body. It renders the body limp so I don’t see why multiple minds matter either? Multiple minds don’t grant resistance to sleep manipulation.

 

[Arkenis]

It doesn’t need to work on souls if it works on the body. It renders the body limp so I don’t see why multiple minds matter either? Multiple minds don’t grant resistance to sleep manipulation.

He can do things by splitting his soul. And creates two minds. So you’d need to target both at the same time with it.

• Photographic Memory and Multiple Selves(The Nuwa Visualisation technique granted him photographic memory as well as the ability to split his mind into two and focus on completely different tasks at the same time)[6]
• Duplication (His soul has entered every part of him and fused with his Divine Body, allowing him to split it off into mobile clones made from a small part of his body such as his hair.[55] In addition, he refined a Primaltwin, which is a clone of himself made from splitting his soul into two that has its own cultivation and can act independently, while still being him. Even if his true body dies, he'll continue on through his Primaltwin)[56][57]

 

[Planck69]

It doesn’t need to work on souls if it works on the body. It renders the body limp so I don’t see why multiple minds matter either? Multiple minds don’t grant resistance to sleep manipulation.

Is it biological or mental? The former is handled by Ning's cellular level command of his body and the fact that he's made of Lunar Truewater and Solar Truefire and the latter his handled by his dual minds and layered mental resistances.

 

[Arkenis]

Voting Ji Ning for now

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Is it biological or mental? The former is handled by Ning's cellular level command of his body and the fact that he's made of Lunar Truewater and Solar Truefire and the latter his handled by his dual minds and layered mental resistances.

Weird how he can do these things while unconcious.

---

Anyway I’ve been busy all day but during my free time I’ve been able to do a little bit of research so things go more smoothly.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Is it biological or mental? The former is handled by Ning's cellular level command of his body and the fact that he's made of Lunar Truewater and Solar Truefire and the latter his handled by his dual minds and layered mental resistances.

Can Ji kill with his soul manipulation?

 

[Planck69]

Can Ji kill with his soul manipulation?

Yeah, he shatters souls with it.

And all else aside, the sleep manipulation suffers from the same issue as Rein in that Ning can escape its range faster than it can be cast. Which he'll do with his IA and precognition.

 

[Arkenis]

Just gonna reintroduce, TK is still a viable option for stopping Reinhard as in second key its class T

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Ning has his own instinctive reaction and precognition, and can just teleport out of that range immediately before the move is made, since it's a gesture against a thought.

Yeah but one of his divine blessings enables him to always land his first attack and also ranged attacks. So idk if simply trying to dodge will be enough.

What is his instinctive reactions based on? can't find it on his page and his precognition is limited to vague senses of danger. Reinhard has superior analytical predictions due to his cracked superhuman intuition and/or one of his divine blessings. He always foresees and knows the source of danger.

The paralysis is done via manipulating a Type 2 concept and he uses it very liberally.

Reinhard has blessings that give him supernatural luck that just lets threats not happen like a nuke not going off around him (unknown blessing). Otherwise, I think reinhard should be fine with his immortality and RPL (speed based) especially since the paralysis inducement is temporary according to the page.

Yeah, he shatters souls with it.

And all else aside, the sleep manipulation suffers from the same issue as Rein in that Ning can escape its range faster than it can be cast. Which he'll do with his IA and precognition.

Doesn't he only shatter weaker souls that can't handle the paralysis inducement?

 

[Planck69]

Yeah but one of his divine blessings enables him to always land his first attack and also ranged attacks. So idk if simply trying to dodge will be enough.

Perfect aim means little to someone who can completely leave your range of attack tens of times over with a thought.

What is his instinctive reactions based on? can't find it on his page and his precognition is limited to vague senses of danger. Reinhard has superior analytical predictions due to his cracked superhuman intuition and/or one of his divine blessings. He always foresees and knows the source of danger.

Rein's superior intuition... doesn't matter. The fact that Ning can always sense danger and its degree means he pulls off the above move. Surprised IA isn't on the page, I was sure I added it. Oh well, not like it matters.

Reinhard has blessings that give him supernatural luck that just lets threats not happen like a nuke not going off around him (unknown blessing). Otherwise, I think reinhard should be fine with his immortality and RPL (speed based) especially since the paralysis inducement is temporary according to the page.

Unless his luck has negated a universal concept controlling the world around him then Ning will just lock him in place. Also, the Dao Path use isn't a temporary thing, only the soul attacks are.

Doesn't he only shatter weaker souls that can't handle the paralysis inducement?

That's his Zifu key. In his Wanxiang key he just destroys souls immediately. With 5-6 layers on his of soul potency.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Perfect aim means little to someone who can completely leave your range of attack tens of times over with a thought.

That is fine but it’s sounds more akin to probability manipulation than just “perfect aim”.

Moreover, how will Ji know what type of danger it is or where it’s from or how wide Reinhard's range is? He can only sense the threat level and stay at an unknown distance. He has 0 knowledge on Reinhard or his abilities nor is his precognition potent enough to know the dimension or size of attack.

We can't just assume he teleports over kilometers of range to evade attacks simply because he can, especially when he is mainly a close-range fighter and his first moves are typical to close the distance between himself and the opponent and/or the raindrops stuff. And his opponent's body is capable of moving on its own to deliver the most suitable counter which in this case will be the matter manipulation attack. So if Ji only senses high danger all he can do is prepare to block, or dodge. But he will not just teleport many tens of kilometers range based on shit he has no idea about y’know.

Rein's superior intuition... doesn't matter. The fact that Ning can always sense danger and its degree means he pulls off the above move. Surprised IA isn't on the page, I was sure I added it. Oh well, not like it matters.

Actually it does matter because Reinhard can sense danger, know where it’s coming from. Then he uses his bullshit level intuition to accurately know what the danger is. Additionally his body reacts instinctively as well by doing what’s best for Reinhard’s surviverability which includes attacking.

With 5-6 layers on his of soul potency.

Where do these layers stem from?

 

[Arkenis]

We can't just assume he teleports over kilometers of range to evade attacks simply because he can, especially when he is mainly a close-range fighter and his first moves are typical to close the distance between himself and the opponent and/or the raindrops stuff.

His rainmaku is creating a whole storm, those span for hundreds of meters, his soul shaker ability is him effecting an entire city of 50,000 thousand people so no he's not mainly a close fighter. And he can sense danger from kilometers away, sba is 4km I believe so I don't see why he wouldn't sense the danger of it or the disturbance

and in second key he's: Thousands of kilometers (His Divine Sense can now go out to a range of a thousand kilometres.[41][149] His breath can create hurricanes that sweep out for a thousand kilometer and even his Waterflame Lotuses can reach a size of 3 kilometers.[150])

 

[Arnoldstone18]

His rainmaku is creating a whole storm, those span for hundreds of meters, his soul shaker ability is him effecting an entire city of 50,000 thousand people so no he's not mainly a close fighter. And he can sense danger from kilometers away, sba is 4km I believe so I don't see why he wouldn't sense the danger of it or the disturbance

What does this have to do with what I said??

Also projectiles can’t hit Reinhard due to one of his blessings. I forgot to mention earlier. So the raindrop stop won’t work.

 

[Arkenis]

What does this have to do with what I said??

U said Ji Ning is a close range bruh, his standard tactics list he will do more powerful things on powerful opponents so I brought them up.

Standard Tactics: Ji Ning prefers to engage his opponents in close combat with his sword arts whenever possible, though he will usually employ his Soulshaker Art against powerful or unknown opponents to daze them then attack with speed. He also has his Lesser Thousand Sword Formation and elemental abilities for long distance attacks and will almost always employ the former, due to it amplifying his attack power. His Dao Domains first manifest when he fights a formidable opponent, which he promptly puts to use.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

U said Ji Ning is a close range bruh, his standard tactics list he will do more powerful things on powerful opponents so I brought them up.

Yeah but you said this

so I don't see why he wouldn't sense the danger of it or the disturbance

Which is confusing cuz I never said he wouldn’t sense danger from that far out. I didn’t even question his range. I even acknowledged them. I simply said Ji will either use raindrop techniques like you’ve said twice now, or close the distance and begin fighting since that’s his preferred tactic.

I also said that he will not decide to use teleportation if he doesn’t even know what danger is coming.