Kingdom Hearts Tier 11 Cosmology

[Bobsican]

It already does:

Characters or objects that demonstrate power equivalent to destroying/creating a 0-D level construct of any size, or three levels of infinity/degrees of reality/fiction transcendence or similar beneath a 3-D reality. This tier also includes characters who are vastly below this level, and all characters beneath this tier’s requirements in any significant way will still be at this tier.

 

[Elizhaa]

I guess it seems fine.

 

[Antvasima]

It already does:

Okay, so is tier 11-C the most appropriate solution then?

 

[Bobsican]

That was the proposal in the first place, yes.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[FinePoint]

Well idk

It doesn't. It ends with 0-D. You can't get smaller than zero. It would just mean it's some infinitesimal slice of 1-D assuming it's not just some weird dimensional imprisonment separation thing.

The problem with this approach is that anything is possible in fiction, and so this kind of traditional logic won't always apply, and would lend itself to us making simply inaccurate classifications by imposing a hard mathematical limit to characters who simply may not have one. We already make exceptions for characters who exceed dimensions entirely, so I don't see how the reverse isn't just as acceptable.
Characters sometimes freeze things below absolute zero, and a character can simply be stated to be qualitatively inferior to one who is 0-D.

Though, as mentioned, 11-C already includes any lower level, and this wouldn't create a new tier, but simply put the character very deep into 11-C, similar to how two characters can both be Tier 0 but at different levels.

 

[Antvasima]

So what are the conclusions here then?

 

[Bobsican]

It really seems that the thread is accepted at this point, several staff with mod-vote rights (@FinePoint, @Qawsedf234, @Elizhaa and @LordGriffin1000) have overall been fine with the proposed changes, Ultima hasn't provided proper input for weeks and it seems his concerns were already covered in a post that went over the JP version of KH3D overall being more explicit on this whole premise, and the before-mentioned staff evaluating all of that positively.

I've already discussed with @Nehz_XZX off-site to start implementing the CRT even, and I've even gone ahead updating the cosmology blog as well.

 

[Gasper]

Plenty of SCPs are currently accepted as being "minus" tier 0 levels of 11-C, even specifically below 0-D beings going by the pages.

SCP just built different.

 

[Antvasima]

It really seems that the thread is accepted at this point, several staff with mod-vote rights (@FinePoint, @Qawsedf234, @Elizhaa and @LordGriffin1000) have overall been fine with the proposed changes, Ultima hasn't provided proper input for weeks and it seems his concerns were already covered in a post that went over the JP version of KH3D overall being more explicit on this whole premise, and the before-mentioned staff evaluating all of that positively.

I've already discussed with @Nehz_XZX off-site to start implementing the CRT even, and I've even gone ahead updating the cosmology blog as well.

Okay, and can you summarise your intended changes please?

 

[Bobsican]

The main impact this'd have on profiles is listing Lower Dimensional Existence to the pages of characters in KH3D or Quadratum like Sora, Riku, Dream Eaters, Yozora and some Real Organization XIII members, I don't think AP downgrades should be applied in such states as much we have 3-D characters with 6-D AP here, and the UES would still apply as much even in qualitatively inferior spaces.

I guess there's also the inherent BFR on this scale as Quadratum is regarded as the afterlife in the verse as the blog also explains, although only characters that can manipulate KH hearts would have that (Keyblade and KH light/darkness users), as the criteria is described as the body and heart perishing.

Originally it was to just add Lower Dimensional Existence to several pages (Sora, Riku, Keyblade (Power of Waking section), Dream Eater Physiology, Ansem, Xemnas, Xigbar and Young Xehanort), but then it was found out when trying to implement it that such page doesn't exist, and so it was deemed best (off-site with @Nehz_XZX) to just list Immersion on a Small Size Type 9 for such pages instead, although Yozora would be listed with only the latter given he never enters lower realities than his own, instead already being like that.

Characters that can make the heart and body perish at the same time (aka, characters that can manipulate hearts, namely Keyblade and KH Darkness users), would also get the capability to BFR characters to such "-1-A" (11-C) space given it's regarded as the afterlife (with the first part being the criteria to end up there) as explained in the cosmology blog.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Originally it was to just add Lower Dimensional Existence to several pages (Sora, Riku, Keyblade (Power of Waking section), Dream Eater Physiology, Ansem, Xemnas, Xigbar and Young Xehanort), but then it was found out when trying to implement it that such page doesn't exist, and so it was deemed best (off-site with @Nehz_XZX) to just list Immersion on a Small Size Type 11 for such pages instead, although Yozora would be listed with only the latter given he never enters lower realities than his own, instead already being like that.

Immersion is fine though in the case of Small Size Type 11 it can be argued that Dream Eaters and characters in their KH3D appearances would have that by default.

 

[Bobsican]

Riku could go with the Dream Eaters to the baseline reality at the end of KH3D, and Sora could also get the Dream Eaters to the baseline reality in KHIII.
The first known species of Dream Eaters chronologically, the Chirithy, were also born and remained on the baseline reality, so I don't think they'd be in such condition by default.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Riku could go with the Dream Eaters to the baseline reality at the end of KH3D, and Sora could also get the Dream Eaters to the baseline reality in KHIII.
The first known species of Dream Eaters chronologically, the Chirithy, were also born and remained on the baseline reality, so I don't think they'd be in such condition by default.

That is indeed the case. I guess that's more a trait that most of them would have most of the time due to being native to the Sleeping Worlds which wouldn't quite apply with Chirithy.

 

[Bobsican]

Well, we do see the Chirithy transforming into the other species of Dream Eaters while still being in the baseline reality, so this'd apply to a reasonable amount of them.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Well, we do see the Chirithy transforming into the other species of Dream Eaters while still being in the baseline reality, so this'd apply to a reasonable amount of them.

That's under special circumstances and I'm not sure what sort of space that is really happening in though it's still a good point.

 

[Bobsican]

Ultimately there's Dream Eaters in both the baseline reality and lower layers (Aka, dreams), so I think it'd be best to just list this whole deal in their physiology page like "Potentially Small Size (Type 9, some Dream Eaters normally exist in the Sleeping Worlds)", and of course, Immersion.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Ultimately there's Dream Eaters in both the baseline reality and lower layers (Aka, dreams), so I think it'd be best to just list this whole deal in their physiology page like "Potentially Small Size (Type 11, some Dream Eaters normally exist in the Sleeping Worlds)", and of course, Immersion.

I think it's less some and more most though otherwise I agree.

 

[Bobsican]

Can I go ahead applying the stuff then?

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Can I go ahead applying the stuff then?

I wouldn't mind.

 

[Bobsican]

Okay, the stuff has been applied, this thread can be closed.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you to everybody who helped out here.