Kid Icarus 6-C feat Downgrade

[Dragonmasterxyz]

An issue brought to my attention is the 6-C+ feat the cast scales to. They seemingly scale to blowing up the Aurum Hive, the issue however is that Pit did this via destroying the core. So I question whether he should scale to destroying the entire thing.

Do we have any lower other feats to fall back on?

 

[DatOneWeeb]

Can we see the realm itself?

 

[Dust_Collector]

I recall seeing a City level calc for Palutena on the OBD, I think it was for throwing her temple or something while she was possessed so that can be worth looking into. There's also Pyrrhon pushing the Aurum fortress away from Earth which can likely net some decent results, I know some people say that nobody scales to him at that point due to the gods freaking out over him fusing with the Aurum brain and him stating that the combined power of the gods can't stop him but given that Pit can still harm him I think they're mostly freaking out about him having control over the army they were already heavily struggling with as opposed to him getting any signifcant power boost.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

The issue I have however is assume these are in fact stars and not just fancy lights or decorations

Is... there anything suggesting this?

 

[Apeironaxim]

I really don't think you can just say "Nah not stars, just fancy lights" in these cases without some substantial proof to back it up

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I actually just cut out the 4-A bit here and instead choose to only bother with the 6-C calc.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Is... there anything suggesting this?

Forget I said anything about that. Dumb argument on my part.

 

[PuasLuisZX]

The thing surrounding Hades's dimensional heart with stars with it had the argument about being a separate dimension surrounding stars which also are around a spiral being more about visual that not comparing to different elements that Kid Icarus represents with light and the many statements surrounding the verse able to crush stars and Dyntos itself called the Great Sacred Treasure to be the ultimate weapon.

For the Aurum Hive, not only Pit took damage from the core which was able to mantain the Aurum Hive on float. But even after it was destroyed, characters like Pyrrhon pushed that fortress away and the Aurum Sios are comparable to Black Holes.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

For the Aurum Hive, not only Pit took damage from the core which was able to mantain the Aurum Hive on float. But even after it was destroyed, characters like Pyrrhon pushed that fortress away and the Aurum Sios are comparable to Black Holes.

For the last bit, care to elaborate on the Black Hole stuff? If legit, it could buff us past 6-C. Also, Pyron's feat needs to be calced.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I may need to come back to this.

 

[PuasLuisZX]

This is an enemy that is part from the Aurum Hive and main ability is to create black holes.
"An Aurum enemy that looks like nothing you've ever seen before. They rob their foes of sight and mobility with black-hole shots. Try to escape from these traps before they can hit you with their lasers and body blows!"

For what it seems, it looks similar to the own description of the power of KI, which is mostly up to debate if a black hole is an actual black hole via VS Battles Wiki.

 

[Cropfist]

I agree with this.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

If the Aurum Hive feat isn’t useable what would Pit’s first key be?

Pit can kill Captain Flares, which contain dimensions that are galactic in size /s

 

[Bobsican]

At worst Pit is going as low as uh... 8-C via fighting stuff that large.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Dyntos does have his starry sky dimension feats iirc, but he's the god tier thus it wouldn't really scale to anyone by him. The starry sky dimensions in Hades' belly seem rather iffy tbh. Or at least doesn't look like something that would scale to anything by Hades and Great Sacred Treasure. I don't recall if it was ever implied Pit shook that dimension. The Aurum Hive does seem like a chain reaction yes, and even if someone tanked it; inverse square law is important for feats like that. There was an old Low 5-B calculation for Pyrrhon moving a space station, but he moved it at Massively FTL+ speeds and we decided not to use the calc because GBE seems iffy for space stations.

Hades does have his extremely casual Country busting statements though.

 

[MrWarnerTheGreat]

Country busting is already established to be very casual among the gods. Poseidon did that once long ago:


I'm completely against 4-A stuff, but I'll leave that be for now as I don't plan to focus much on KI here

 

[Jackythejack]

Hades has country busting statements the only problem is that it took like the power of Viridi and Palutena for Pit to kill him so at most you can say people downscale off of him.

pit has more than 8-C feats I know that much.

 

[MrWarnerTheGreat]

Pretty Sure Hades was threatening to destroy several continents. Even then, Pit fights lesser gods frequently who should be on par with Poseidon (Keep in mind Poseidon needed the help of Palutena to rid of Thanatos and his troops)

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Palutena threw islands with TK, so maybe that’s be a decent feat?

 

[QuasiYuri]

To defend 4-A: Palutena used constellations to hide the treasures, space pirate can compress constellations and I think the Kraken has a similar statement.

 

[MrWarnerTheGreat]

Those constellations are not the size of regular stars. Kid Icarus portrays stars as much smaller than regular stars throughout the games

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I recall the constellations being brought up and being rejected by Reppuzan, Kraken statement might hold weight if I can see it. But Poseidan's feat seems legit perhaps. The Island throwing feats should be calculated.

 

[Chariot190]

I can look through the game and lore to find some feats if nobody else does, assuming that this thread is still ongoing after im done with the current shit I'm doing.

Off the top of my head, there's definitely some basic city level shit, maybe a island level feat, the blacksmith god created a dimension if I recall or something along those lines if anybody wants to look into that.

 

[SamanPatou]

I agree about Hades' thing, I also thought it was weird and dubious.
Also, thanks to everyone who will gather some other feats.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

An issue brought to my attention is the 6-C+ feat the cast scales to. They seemingly scale to blowing up the Aurum Hive, the issue however is that Pit did this via destroying the core. So I question whether he should scale to destroying the entire thing.

Do we have any lower other feats to fall back on?

Actually yes, during the feat between Phosphora & Thanatos, they destroy a floating island, and Pit beat both.

Also, what’s the problem with 4-A? It was already accepted that Hades belly was a separate dimension with stars.

 

[Chariot190]

Actually yes, during the feat between Phosphora & Thanatos, they destroy a floating island, and Pit beat both.

Also, what’s the problem with 4-A? It was already accepted that Hades belly was a separate dimension with stars.

That's true, they do, though the island in question aint exactly island size as the wiki defines it.

I think it has more to do with stars in Kid Icarus being small as ****, and not millions of km, at least, as a default. Though if memory serves, it's more like Kid Icarus has both actual stars and tiny ass ones, it's just hard to tell which is which and when making it hard to quantify.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

That's true, they do, though the island in question aint exactly island size as the wiki defines it.

I think it has more to do with stars in Kid Icarus being small as ****, and not millions of km, at least, as a default. Though if memory serves, it's more like Kid Icarus has both actual stars and tiny ass ones, it's just hard to tell which is which and when making it hard to quantify.

I think the “small stars” is an outlier, or rather an inconsistency. Dyntos casually created space again for Pit to fight the Space Krakken, and that’s a 4-A feat.

Hades stomach has a starry background, and Pit was more inconvenienced by it running from him than actually fighting it. Not to mention it’s explosion hardly damaged him, or Hades.

 

[SamanPatou]

Do we have real evidences of the lights in Hades' stomach being actual stars and not shining stuff or simple graphic effects?

 

[Chariot190]

I think the “small stars” is an outlier, or rather an inconsistency. Dyntos casually created space again for Pit to fight the Space Krakken, and that’s a 4-A feat.

That's not what outlier means, and it isnt an inconsistency either. I brought that up, forgot his name tho, the feat even with tiny stars would still be like some sort of tier 7 dimensional space at least.
It's mostly the fact, both tiny stars and large stars exist in verse, we are explicitly shown as much in that space pirate chapter (which has the space krakken was well fyi). Though, it just hit me that I vaguely recall Palutena claiming the space pirates shrank the stars they gathered, if im not tripping that could justify the tiny stars they have (though, didnt pit fly by constellations they planned to steal and it was small too?), either way, if only the former is true and not the latter (it's been awhile since i played it), then we'd probably be good to go, if not then see below.

Same thing applies to that, I'd think.

The issue isn't the fact they didn't create stars, Dyntos for examply most certainly did, it's more like, how do we know how big they are and if it's enough to hit 4-A? We don't, if the only stars we see are tiny as a norm then we cant say stars in verse are like 4-A without further context. Unless my vague memory from above is right.

Do we have real evidences of the lights in Hades' stomach being actual stars and not shining stuff or simple graphic effects?

If it looks the exact same as every other star lit background and skybox in the game, chances are it's probably meant to be exactly that.

Edit: Some of that weather shit may be tier 6, look into that, like some of that shit looks ******* ridiculous.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Do we have real evidences of the lights in Hades' stomach being actual stars and not shining stuff or simple graphic effects?

It’s said Hades’s stomach is a different dimension, I don’t know why one specific part of his body is a dimension when Pit casually travels through the rest of it.

 

[SamanPatou]

I know that it's another dimension, but I believe we need actual evidences/statements of the shining lights being stars and not just visual similarities, especially if it has to be used to upgrade characters to a higher tier.

 

[Chariot190]

I know that it's another dimension, but I believe we need actual evidences/statements of the shining lights being stars and not just visual similarities, especially if it has to be used to upgrade characters to a higher tier.

Case by case basis depending on context, verse, similar feats in verse, etc.
If they look like stars, it has a justification (it being some sort of pocket reality dimension thing would work in this case), and if there's other feats similar (Dyntos explicitly created a dimension filled with stars). There's very little reason to assume they aint stars, occam's razer comes into play here, it'd take less to assume they're just stars in some sort of alternate dimension like Dyntos' then they're some sort of ambiguous magical lights.

Now is this tier 4? idk, as said Kid Icarus has some sort of star size discrepancy that needs to be worked out first,

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

This went from a downgrade to a feat compilation thread, which is A-OK.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Dyntos, is clearly 4-A; that much is solid. But he's the literal god tier in which even Hades is nothing to him. Unless Pit has been shown to shake or destroy some of those dimensions, I'm unsure about his 4-A feats. And Hades could be 4-A if he does have a legit starry sky dimension inside his belly, but I'm not sure if Pit can shake it. And I'm still iffy on that.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Pit killed the heart, which resulted in an explosion that destroyed all of it.

 

[Ionliosite]

This went from a downgrade to a feat compilation thread, which is A-OK.

Most downgrade threads end up like that.

 

[Dust_Collector]

In regards to Pyrrhon pushing the Aurum fortress we can get RKE from him rotating it, problem is finding a good size for the thing. There's statements about the Aurum ships being continent sized or something but I'm not sure how seriously we can take that, but I think we have a decent shot of Pit compared to a hole in the fortress when he escapes from it so maybe that can help with finding its size. We could also get some decent results from the Lunar Sanctum being opened up when Pit flies there since Arlons power is the reason for everything it does, but I'm not sure of any good ways to get a workable size for the Lunar Sanctum.

 

[Chariot190]

I think we have a decent shot of Pit compared to a hole in the fortress when he escapes from it so maybe that can help with finding its size.

Eh, it's a 3ds game, you could very well run into hardware limitations, if they're intended to be continent size then we should probably just take the size of the smallest continent. I could be wrong but in a case like this it'd probably be statement>visual due to hardware, kinda like Majora's Moon or the entirety of Pokemon's overworld in literally every game.

Unless we can scale it off the planet when he pushes it away via some sort of angsizing shit?

 

[Armorchompy]

Pit killed the heart, which resulted in an explosion that destroyed all of it.

Wouldn't that actually imply the opposite? My KIU knowledge is rusty but if the heart was what the entire dimension was based on, then destroying it wouldn't require 4-A AP, just enough to destroy the heart itself.

 

[Chariot190]

Wouldn't that actually imply the opposite? My KIU knowledge is rusty but if the heart was what the entire dimension was based on, then destroying it wouldn't require 4-A AP, just enough to destroy the heart itself.

I think he's implying that the heart was stabilizing or powering the dimension and thus, when he died the dimension went with him as it could no longer function or exist with its power. We sometimes give ap and durability off characters dying and shit going with if they were the reason why that place or feat happened (zelda has a few good ones like Volvagia dying and taking out the storm or Gyorg's existence warming up the ocean waters), think that, but like, dimension. (FF has some dimension ones if i recall).